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There is no "technically" about it. It's not an English anthem. You might think it's fine. I think it's an uninspiring dirge.

Thank god he didn’t end up in jail.

This is a really enjoyable watch, seemed that he really liked the area and the club treated him very well. I've seen his twitter/x name mentioned on here with certain posts that cc has linked to in the past, so thought it was relevant to share: Is it me, or would he also make a great Russ Martin lookalike? 🙂

You could stay and post about the football rather than your selfish hate fuelled agenda. Just an option.

That’s a nice little video. Impressed with how well the club looked after him and I’m glad he had a great day. Pleasant change from all the usual nonsense on here.

"Billionaire black man steals coat off freezing, disabled child!!" Daily Mail.🤬🤬

Foden and Bellingham. Jackets aside, what a time for English football to have these two.

Given that the final league positions are based onall the 46 games, then you could point to any lose of points as being the ones that cost them automatic place. The semi final at CR in 2015 saw the binners travelling more in hope than expectaion. Something that was not the case in 1985. They were favourites and th 2nd leg at CR was a to be a mere formality, Similarly in 2011 they felt they had a chance of beating us when we were heading to the PL. It was the humiliating scoreline that hit home. Conceding 5 in your own backyards, not a good thing. Best thing is to leave the shouting to those down the A140. Games between us have always meant more to them than us. Witness the pantomime there in December. Can you really see our lot getting that worked up about them coming here ? For me it is a bit like the racist uncle at Xmas, or the pssed aunt at a wedding. Something you tolerate as it is not for long We have eight games in which to get as many points as possible, this is just one of them.

This is spot on. A National Anthem should inspire the people in the Country, not be a paean to an outdated and very divisive and class ridden institution like a monarchy. There is a very good reason that many National Anthems are about the struggle for freedom and independence.

I couldn’t give a flying **** about what he’s said about sections of our fans in the past. I like him as a SD. He took us up twice. The fact that we came back down again immediately says more about the state of the game than it does about Stuart Webber. Absolutely, he should move on - ultimately his City career has ended in failure, but it’s been a pretty ****ing good career, and we’ve seen some of the best football played at Carrow Road ever (by us, not by the opposition) under his tenure. But none of that matters. What he said was undoubtedly prejudiced. It was taking a stereotype that in many cases is true, and applying it to individuals where it was not true, based on the colour of their skin. He judged those players and their background by the colour of their skin. Whether he meant to do it is actually a massive red herring. The fact that he didn’t mean to do it and STILL did it is proof positive that actually there is still an undercurrent of prejudice in this country - the fact that you’re defending him because he didn’t mean to is yet more evidence of it. Understanding the issues and how they affect different populations as a whole is fine. In fact, it’s laudable. Applying those generalisations to specific individuals is the very definition of prejudice. The fact that you think it’s OK is actually just evidence of your own prejudice. It’s horrifying, but sadly not surprising, to me that you not only don’t see it but won’t even listen to it.

“All right, but apart from pigeon ****, gifted shares, support for other teams, soft share deals by Chicken Mickey, accusations of insider dealings, Trustees not bundling up the shares for sale, accusations of misogyny, lengthy emails, huge directors bonuses and Independent Football Ombudsman complaints, what have the AD’s ever done for us?”

I may have it wrong, but from what i've gathered: Essex and a friend bought 1000 shares making them Associate Directors (AD) with the added incentive that they would be provided a free 'seat for life' in the AD section each season - which over the course of a few decades could mean they break even and still retain share value at the end. Sadly, Essex's friend passed away and the 'seat for life' was not passed down to his daughter who did inherit 1000 shares, which he feels is unfair. Essex then traded his posh AD seat for two normal seats - I presume the other seat being for his friend daughter?. Somewhere along the line he lodged a complaint with an external body who investigated the case and was told that no wrong-doings occurred and he should move on. As a result, he's here critical of management and how we're ran, with the intent (I think) to imply that the cost of passing on that 'seat of life' is minimal compared to the money wasted. Furthermore his 1000 shares which he purchased for £25 a pop 20+ years back are now hard to sell in bulk, and has the quandary that if he sold 1 share it would take him below 1000 shares causing him to lose AD status, and thus the 2 free season tickets each year which puts him at a loss. So seeing individual sales of shares being advertised at £60-80 a pop, i believe, is another cause of frustration, as potentially sitting on £80k of shares but unable to shift them at that rate. I appreciate that's 2 paragraphs, but it's the basic background as i've understood it. There's a few other additions such as claiming that the club should have refunded him on the 'seat for life' when we were unable to attend games due to covid, and also how AD's weren't given priority when crowds returned in limited numbers. Hopefully I get a 7 out of 10 for effort, as I don't think i'm too far off now. 🙂

That was Lakey, Hoggy and LYB spoon feeding Stu.

Just an idea for a thread. This week, I saw Declan McKenna at the LCR on Sunday and the The Longest Johns at the Waterfront last night. Both were excellent but the crowds were very different. One was primarily student age and the other attracted a more mature audience! Any other music fans care to share your recent gig experiences?

So easy nowadays to get addicted sadly. Back in the day you had to physically go into a ladbrokes. Now there are thousands of bookies at your fingertips all offering free bets when you sign up. Talk sport have more gambling adverts than ever. I'd imagine the true level of the amount of addicts is kept well and truly brushed under the carpet.

Thames. Let them fail - wipe out the shareholders. They treated it like a normal company and cash cow. May cause some difficulties for the shareholders (pension schemes) but at least it will put the fear of God into the other water companies and utilities. The tax payer will not bail you out. Should be a salutory lesson to all and a hard lesson about the failure of the ideological driven privatizations of the natural monopolies like rail too.

Welcome back Essex.

Sorry if some of you think this should be on the dark side of the forum but with the Euros coming up I think it matters. Here is a link to a video of the Polish players singing their national anthem after the game in Wales. The Wales fans singing their anthem before the game was amazing. Do these people really have more national pride than the English? I think England needs a patriotic anthem about the country and not the Royals. Football matches are sometimes won by the narrowest of margins and it might just help to unite behind a song.

They should put icing on in the shape of a snowflake.

I've obviously been posting on here too long! 😉

That 3-1 defeat in the Play-Off Semi Final in 2015 wasworse.

Lovely to watch, thought how lucky he was to visit Colney rather than Yarco 😀..............

Too much money, too much free time. I do find it distasteful that instead of helping them, especially working in an industry rife with association and advertisements for gambling they just ban them.

Except it’s the other way round. God save the King is the U.K. National Anthem, England doesn’t have one and that’s why it’s used for most sporting events when England are represented.

Agree with this. Whats technically true isn’t necessarily helpful in helping us move forward as a society, labelling a person racist isn’t particularly helpful as the connotations of that word are so much worse than the technical language definition. Humans learn through trial an error, making mistakes is absolutely paramount for learning and growing. We all have prejudices, many of which are unconscious, condemn what people say and point out why so they can grow but without a consistent pattern of ignorance to that opportunity I don’t feel labelling them as such is helpful. It doesn’t promote the environment for people to improve themselves and their understanding.

Wagner really is just a decent, nice guy

You clearly haven't taken in a single word of Abu Kamara's statement have you Hogesar.

Off to see Hawkwind next Thursday. Probably my last opportunity considering Dave Brock is in his eighties.

Congratulations on being one of the few British people to know about one of the most important battles ever to be fought on European soil😊 Yes, Poland's anthem does reflect its history but like France, Germany and Italy it's also very rousing and nationalistic. At the last World Cup 2 Mexican players cried openly during their anthem. I really can't see our anthem creating that sort of emotion but I don't believe that is because others are any more patriotic than us. Our anthem is just carp and leaves me completely uninspired. Even Jack Grealish playing air guitar to Bohemian Rhapsody would be an improvement.

I understand that and completely take the point, especially about the notion of trying to be aware of and control your subconscious prejudices. While I'm here I might as well say that I think your comments on this thread have been absolutely excellent and I've agreed with pretty much all of them. I'm just thinking in terms of what works. Presumably the goal for all of us is that our society should continue to become less racist. And I think you and I agree that becoming more aware of our subconscious biases is an important part of that. I just also feel that labelling a person as 'racist' (rather than focussing on the specific comments they used) runs the risk of seeming like it's an accusation about their whole character, which is likely to provoke an understandably defensive reaction - and make it less likely that they reflect on their behaviour. Whereas if you focus on the specific comment or incident, and especially if you note that subconscious biases are something that we all have, you are more likely to prompt an honest reflection. But I am quite prepared to accept I might be wrong about this, and that I'm being overly generous. I'm white and don't have to absorb this kind of shıt on a daily basis. So that might be one of my unconscious prejudices.

Good comment, Hoggy. Sounds like quite a sensible middle ground to me. The only bit I'd slightly take issue with is this: I think that's all true in theory, but the reaction of the specific players and their families really undermines that defence in practice. I think their reaction is far more relevant than Troy Deeney's. And I agree with your conclusion: I think your last line is really important and perhaps where those arguing on this thread could reach some kind of accord. I think it's really important to acknowledge that we are all capable of prejudice, making inaccurate stereotyped assumptions, etc. To do so doesn't mean that you are a secret Klansman. We should definitely be making a distinction between 'that statement was racist' (or 'contained racist assumptions', if you prefer) and 'that person is a racist'. I think it should be possible to condemn such comments, make it clear that they are completely inappropriate for someone in a position of such power and authority - SW had a great deal of influence on the careers of the four NCFC players mentioned - and, yes, to say that the comments were racist, without completely condemning the person who made them, not allowing them to apologise, not allowing them to learn from the experience and be better. This goes back to the principle of charity that @Mr Carrow was talking about. But if you're going to apply that charitable principle, you have to apply it to the families too, to take their objections seriously and not brush them off.

Southgate looks like one of those managers who is better suited to international management as opposed to club management as they are almost polar opposites. Both essentially mean crafting a team to a vision, but one means you can shape a team to it, whereas the other means coming up with a vision that best reflects the talent at your disposal limited by nationality. I don't think a lot of Southgate's critics realise just how imbalanced this current crop of players is, and I think some observers are infected by the lunatic mentality that just having a litany of good players inevitably means a good squad. Scholes, Gerrard, Lampard, Beckham, anyone? (And they actually had some quality at centre-half behind them). This current crop have Harry Maguire, who's a very serviceable centre-half by Premier League standards, but isn't a top-drawer one. They've got Jordan Pickford in goal, who's a fair bit short of previous England goalies like Seaman or even Martyn and to be fair to him, has rarely let England down in a tournament, but is not top-drawer either. There's not been a left-back in Ashley Cole's class for years. Apart from Kane, what is there really up top? Southgate's clearly very good at getting a camp to play for him. He has to, he's not got the defence to play the open, attacking game he could produce with some of the attacking talent in there, but you can't have a lot of attacking talent on shaky foundations. I would say I am surprised this has to be said to some Ingurlend fans, but actually, no, I'm not.

I think everyone's accepted he shouldn't have said or worded things as he did....unless I'm wrong on that. I also think it's completely fair to take what Webber said as a racist comment, particularly if it's someone you don't know. I also think it's fair to see another side where it could not be racist. It's almost subjective. Troy Deeney didn't think it was racist, but there's a caveat that him and Simon Jordan made. It depends what Webber's knowledge, or what he was told by the players, was their childhood growing up etc. Did he base it on nothing or did he base it on what he was told? If it was 5 players picked based on a history he'd been told about then he's not being racist, he's relating to real-life information and history. I completely understand that no parent would want that said, not least as it doesn't exactly look good on them. And certainly no parent tends to think their kid is one that's going to end up going down the wrong path until it happens. Certainly Sterling had a really difficult upbringing with his father being killed so young, moving to the UK for a better life, Mum having to work so much she was never around and he was living in a difficult place in London. I suppose when we signed the other players mentioned, what did he say about his upbringing etc? Ultimately though, if those named feel offended then Webber is in the wrong irrespective of any of the above - hence him apologising. Equally if they feel racially profiled then they were and that's also on Webber. The above however, does not make Webber a racist himself.

So, non-religious, non-nationalistic and something that doesn’t glorify our colonial past but with a catchy, memorable and uplifting tune. Just off the top of my head, how about this: Ingerland, Ingerland, Ingerland. Ingerland, Ingerland, Ingerla-and. Ingerland, Ingerland, Ingerland. Ingerla-and, Ingerland. The second verse could be along similar lines to the first.

It's about 1 minute 30 into this. Basically, Rowe is "back on the grass" but no return date given. Wagner wasn't too happy with the Webber questions!

On February 14, Wagner said: "Unfortunately, it is a serious hamstring injury. I can't give a serious timeframe, but we speak more about a couple of months rather than weeks … We have to wait and see for the first four weeks how he progresses in his rehab to give a clearer picture of his timeframe. We strongly hope that we will get him back at the end of the season and that he will play for us. Hopefully, the season will not be finished at the beginning of May." A couple of months from February 14 takes us to April 14, so if he's slightly ahead of schedule it's not beyond the realms of possibility that he could feature against the scummers. Obviously if he is ready to play them, Wagner would be daft to announce it in advance and keep them guessing. Preston seems a more realistic target based on Wagner's comments above, I'd say.

National Anthems aren't there to inspire football players. It makes no difference to narrow margins. The Welsh bettered out their 'amazing' anthem prior to the penalty shoot out, and lost, because their last penalty was sh1te.

I personally think it's less down to the anthem itself, and more to do with the fact it's generally looked down upon to have a strong English national identity these days, especially following Brexit. When some people, some of the media and/or politicians, generally consider flying the Cross of St George to be an indicator of someone being a bigot or worse it's hardly surprising some people no longer feel a particular sense of pride at being English?

Two 'contenders' for England's national anthem are 'Jerusalem' and 'I Vow To Thee My Country'. As the latter speaks mostly of peace and love rather than routing enemies, winning battles or swearing eternal loyalty to the monarch, I'd go for that one.

You missed off “…but despite that, is still an annoying pain in the ….” 😉😘

They'll find a way of running Bellingham down Herman, of that we can be certain. Probably with around 48 hours or so to go before our first Euro 2024 match. It could be that he has an 'EXPENSIVE CAR' or a 'JEWEL ENCRUSTED WATCH' but, as sure as night follows day ( 'Bellingham Lives In A Ten Bedroomed MANSION that was once owned by a BANKER'), the Daily Mail will find a way...

Good point, it'd give the forum credence if we had someone discussing football, too.

People have been betting and wagering for centuries. It's in our blood. Betting on a potentially fixed outcome is a bit more serious though.

This will do….

I'll be watching from warmer climes, a poorly scheduled holiday without looking at the fixtures 🤬. I put two tickets on buyback this morning as no interest from our usual family and fiends, but nothing immediately showed as available on the ticketing website. Decent seats in the front rows of the Upper River.

Read the words of the Polish anthem if you've not already, it's clear why they feel passionate. We should appreciate how lucky it is that we've not got the same story to tell, or the relevance of how they're currently one border away from a war right now. I think it's wrong to be envious of that, personally. Furthermore, Any anthem would need to be as inclusive as possible to represent how much more diverse our society is today. What you'd be left with would likely be less patriotic, generic, and deliberate avoidance of significant historical events or religious elements. This whole process would likely cause yet more rifts among society as s result. I think we're best just leaving as is personally, for me it's less about the song, but rather about having an identity that we're familiar with. There's just too much division going on already to even contemplate going down this rabbits hole.

I love the idea of a Schrodinger's Banana Skin which simultaneously does and doesn't exist. As for the game, here's my guess: Bali Mumba scores a first-half hat-trick (against the run of play). Stuart Webber is force to march around the pitch naked at half time while Ben Knapper follows behind shouting "shame" repeatedly. Mark Attanasio's takeover is confirmed with the club being rebranded as The Anglia Phoenix. Sargent is subbed off after 60 minutes to resounding cheers and chants of "you do know what you're doing". McLean scores a stoppage time equaliser to make it 6-6.

Of course it does. Pre season friendlies are never quoted in a winning or losing streak for club level managers / head coaches, so why should they count internationally? And what is a top ten side? Fifa world rankings? We're currently 3rd... can't be doing that badly? We lost to Brazil with a very different team that was put out and drew with Belgium. Brazil are 5th and Belgium 4th. The team we put out against Brazil was more experimental - in terms of having a look at players that didn't have many caps and were young, and we drew. It says everything though. Friendlies are a chance to get players to practice playing with each other and deploying the tactics etc of the manager. It's not going to be perfect, it's the place where it doesn't have to be. Like a rehearsal. Equally, when we beat Italy 3-1 in October last year, they were ranked 9th in the world, as they are now. And that was a competitive fixture. For those 26 games, does that take us back to the start of Southgate's England managerial tenure? If so, that's 8yrs. A lot has changed in that time... his first England team was: Hart, Walker, Stones, Cahill, Bertrand, Henderson, Alli, Rooney, Walcott, Lingard, Sturridge. It underlines what he had to start off with, and what he has had to try and develop over that time. If we're honest, outside of Kane, we probably lack someone of Sturridges quality. Toney is a poorer version of him, is Watkins as good? Rooney was fading by then, but we've not seen his quality since really. Bertrand wasn't really England Material, Walcott and Lingard never lived up to their hype, Alli has sadly had off the pitch struggles. Young Stones, Walker and Henderson are still going, two very much into their 30's now. I think you have to be kind, and realise that England are actually punching their weight, if not well beyond it IMHO.