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I didn't see what he said but if we'd taken one of our gilt edged chances nobody would be complaining about the performance.

It's not just the fact that anyone watching could see that it doesn't seem to work well, the numbers back it up too. We have 34 points from games where 2 or more strikers started, and 27 from when we only started 1. Nearly a 50/50 split in terms of points, however we've started with 2 or more strikers in 29 games compared to just 12 with only 1 up top. The points per game with 2 strikers would have us 18th on 48 points, the points per game with 1 striker would have us top with 92 points. Obviously the sample size for the 1 striker games may still be too small to accurately judge, but I'd counter that we've seen plenty enough of what it's like with more than 1. Even when looking at the xG numbers we both create more and concede less chances in games with only 1 up top. At the current moment we are going through an injury crisis where we're struggling to get players in that midfield but I think there's just about enough options worth trying. I'd even rather see Tzolis playing in that no10 position over making one of the strikers attempt to do it.

It was fairly pelting down when I got up this morning and so was not looking forward to the ride down to CR, but fortunately my daughter texted to say she would take us down and pick us up. By lunchtime the sun was out in any event but the lift saved my legs a bit. Home form has been pretty poor this season but we usually beat Rotherham so I was fully expecting three points as we kicked off towards the River End and it was quite a lively start with City getting staright on to the front foot. Hernandez got a roar out of the crowd as he spun away from his marker and made ground before picking out Pukki on the edge of the box. He was a split second too late in pulling the trigger however as the ball was blocked away for a corner. After some neat passing across the face of the visitors penalty area the ball fell to McCallum, who fizzed an effort goalwards that brought a fine diving save from Vickers in the Rotherham goal. From the resulting corner Sargent had the glimpse of an opening and his on target shot rebounded off the keeper and was hooked away before Pukki could pounce. Chances continued to come thick and fast as the visitors reeled under constant pressure and Pukki was again close when trying a first time effort as the ball came in from the City left. Once again a Rotherham defender got a vital block and the ball was scrambled away. A minute later Sara banged a low shot from about twenty five yards but it was a yard or two off target. It was very encouraging stuff with the home side creating more chances early doors than in the entirety of many recent home performances. Just before the quarter hour Pukki really should have opened the City account as a neat chip from Gabby Sara beat the offside trap and put him yards clear of the Rotherham defence. Once again vital split seconds were lost as he brought the ball under control and a defenders toe was enough to deflect the shot off target. He almost redeemed himself a couple of minutes later but having worked space he could only fire a cross shot a foot over the bar. We had seen little positive from the visitors but from about midway through the half they had managed to slow the pace of the game down and get some joy of their own with a series of throw ins and free kicks from their right wing and City were lucky to survive when a sharp low cross was fired well over from the centre of the goal and only six yards out. From my end it looked harder to miss than score. The game became much more of a midfield battle from then on although McCallum was unlucky to see his well struck effort from twenty yards, deflect just wide off a defenders head. When ref Simpson blew for halftime it felt like a satisfactory performance with just the deserved lead lacking. Looking at the other halftime scores around the country it seemed that a decent three points today would put us in a fairly strong position in the playoff race. From the off City continued to look dangerous although good chances were now harder to come by although Hernandez ought to have done better when put through by Sargent just before the hour mark. It appeared to me that a zig and a zag should have been enough to work a shooting opportunity but after further zigs and zags the door closed and a deflected ball was hoofed clear not far from the line. Then Marquinhos who had been fairly quiet up to now, zipped in a low effort that Vickers got a hand to and for all the world it looked like McCallum only had to make a connection to score but fell over his own feet and again the ball was scrambled for a corner. From this one Pukki had a clear opportunity as the ball came back to him near the edge of the box but somehow his shot beat everyone including the far post. To me this latest bout of play signalled that it wasn't going to be our day and the game became exceedingly tedious as the visitors milked the clock and the home side frustratingly couldn't put anything together. We had Idah for Pukki, Tzolis for Marquihos and Gianoullis for McCallum but it didn't look like making a difference. The crowd got annoyed with the time wasting but in Rotherham's position a point here is worth its weight in gold so who can blame them. The longer the game went on the less likely we looked like scoring but as we entered the last knockings, Tzolis burst into the box from the left and while a quick pass back to hiim from Idah might have served better, the City striker couldn't sort his feet out and the chance was gone. It pretty much summed up the whole experiencefor me today, lots of promise but no end product. There is still a possibility of a glorious end but in all honesty it would be totally undeserved in what has been a disappointing season. I really did expect more, perhaps recent seasons have spoiled me and I should get used to the brand of mediocrity that we can all see in front of us. Omo my MOM today, I thought he looked commanding throughout and Hugill never got a look in. The best thing about the day was that I got a lift home and my daughter had baked some nice sausage rolls for me. I was so hungry I ate one in the car and won the prize for the worlds messiest eater.

The lad could do with more than 8 minutes a game. Marquinhos isn’t setting the world alight, must be worth letting one of our own have a go.

Yep, and it's why, despite my natural proclivities pushing me more towards the LibDems, I'm not going for them. Only thing that matters is getting this set of imbeciles, cretins and shysters OUT.

Cannot fathom the pearl clutching over these ads. I don't think they are great but seeing people like Tobias Ellwood lamenting negative campagining as if this isn't something the Tory party has driven for years just gets a massive eye roll from me. A good summation of how I feel here...

What was really disappointing for me was the lack of urgency towards the end. Only Gunny drove us forwards. We missed Kenny today much more than either centre back. Sara needs to have possession a lot higher up the pitch where he can hurt teams. Same with Gibbs really. The whole midfield was compromised.

Great post and terrifying stats. I can just sense @Parma Ham's gone mouldyflexing his typing fingers to use the word plusvalenza and make the point that playing more strikers doesn't make your line-up more attacking.

I think we can all come up with an idea that will sort all three out in one fell swoop.

It’s amazing how differently people see things. If there was nothing to get excited about you just arrived 20 minutes in, because there were plenty of positive moves and good chances. If their keeper hadn’t had a great game then we would’ve won at a canter. As the game ticked on by the chances dried up, which happens at 0-0. The assertion that there is s lack of effort when we are still do close to actually qualifying for play offs is odd. I think you’re just a miserable fan. Friday is big for our prospects. Time is definitely running out, but that wasn’t ‘woeful’

My take on Smith as a manager is that he has more of a hands-off approach, wanting to teach the players but for the players to then take the lead on the field. Whereas Farke wanted to drill them intensively on how to play and control every aspect of what they'd be doing (in possession at least). Hence Smith was a bad fit for us after Farke. So if we assume Leicester have a squad that is genuinely capable of surviving (after all, I think they've finished top 5 last 2 seasons) then if the players have lost faith in Rodgers and just need a fresh face to get them remotivated, they are only 2 points off safety which is entirely achievable. It's a very different setup from when Smith was with us, realistically our squad was one of the 3 worst in the Prem and his hands off approach meant we found our natural level. Whereas if he can get the Leicester players playing with some freedom they're probably one of the favourites to stay up from the clubs at the bottom. I can see the appointment making sense in this light. And he's only been signed till the end of the season so if they stay up, they can decide whether to keep him on or not, and if they go down, it will depend how he's done if they decide to give him a chance to get them back up. If he does keep them up, it certainly won't change my thoughts about Smith's (awful) time with us - wrong manager at the wrong time.

Yep, and I'd argue our play-style looks far more defined when we have one striker and the extra midfielder.

This is why Norwich City are so small time with their fans attitudes like this "I wouldn't want him anywhere near our club, glad we didn't get him" What, a proven winner? Yeah so glad we didn't get him on the staff 🙄

Too true. This is politics, not a debating society. Starmer has (or has) a mountain to climb to overturn Labour's worst electoral defeat since the thirties. To do that he needs to make Labour as small a target as possible for the Mail, Express, Torygraph, GBeebies and TalkTV in order to get voters who voted Conservative in 2019 to vote Labour. There are no votes in laying out your policies now so they can be misrepresented or stolen. Most people arn't interested in politics. A third don't vote at all, many have fixed opinions either way but elections are often won by voters making their minds up in the last six weeks of a campaign. They won't remember the furore over these ads, but it might remind them of how this country has been governed over the last 13 years and which Party is responsible.

You're not wrong. Pukki in form possibly scores a hattrick yesterday and everyone is praising the performance and mentality of the squad, the entertainment value and everything else. Instead we're ripping the team, manager, board apart whilst shouting at Idah and calling him a c*nt for signing a 5 year contract. Oh the joy's of football fans. 🙂

Wonder who is behind the Tories campaigning like this though? Our local Green Party literature is almost the same! There are nearly 200 Tory MPs that have not even mentioned they belong to the Tory party. Assume some bright spark came up with the idea to try and fool (some) people. Imagine being so ashamed of what you stand for that you cannot even promote it....or...deviousness? And wanting people to 'buy' your product. I cannot think of any other reason or motivation for this change in campaigning than a kind of deviousness. Is it 13 years too long? Is it Brexit association? Or pollution? Anyway, Carol Vorderman... raising my hat to her continued calling out of this lot.

I think we can acknowledge that Wagners best performances have been better than Smiths best performances with this squad, which is something. But I think Wagners worst performances are on par with Smiths worst too. Smith had the pre-season and involvement in signings though - Wagner hasn't had that. He deserves a stab at it next season. I would say that I spent most of Farke's first season defending him because it was a really clear footballing blueprint he was trying to achieve with us - and there would be these small periods of play where I saw it click and it made sense to me. I have to be honest and say I've not really seen that from Wagner yet but he's had to contend with a lot of injuries in different positions etc - and middle of a season is hard to lay-down foundations.

Agreed, I haven't checked, but I suspect every team who has gone up in the past few seasons has been at least partly reliant on loan players. It is also a damning indictment on Webber, as the loan market appears to be such an easy thing to use to improve your squad as team challenging for promotion do it successfully every single season. As has been said, Webber's use of it has been absolutely diabolical whilst his peers smash it. 2022-23 Hayden - Useless Ramsey - Poor start, started to come good, got injured Marquinhos - Useless and is currently starving our own player of chances to improve 2021-22 Gilmour - Words cannot do justice to how poor this one was Williams - Not too bad, but given he was occasionally benched for Giannoulis, didn't significantly improve us Kabak - Useless Normann- Useless but for a few matches 2020-21 Skipp, Quintilla, Giannoulis and Gibson, all good to great loan signings and we get promoted 2019-20 Roberts - Useless Duda - Useless Fahrmann - Waste of a loan Amadou - Useless but for one good game 2018-19 Passlack - Bit of a waste of a loan Rhodes - Great loan signing and made a significant contribution 2017-18 Gunn, Reed and Leitner all decent loan signings Edwards - A punt, but ultimately a poor loan Three of those seasons represent a catastrophic failure to maximise the loan market to our benefit. And for clubs on a budget, maximising the loan market it crucial. Webber just can't manage it. The one season he properly did a good job with it we got promoted.

Sorry, I posted elsewhere but: Hanley Gibson Omobamidele Sorensen Byram. Even taking into account Byram injury history that doesn't seem like we could really do another. Tomkinson is also not setting the world alight for Stevenage so arguably the club didn't see him as adequate cover. The reality is it's the injuries to Hanley and Gibson in one game alongside the longer term injury to Byram, followed by the injuries to Mclean, Hayden, Dowell and Nunez that's caused the problem we saw yesterday. That's a pretty difficult injury situation and would completely destroy any chance of picking up points for 95% of this league

Yes, Tzolis's last shot was so bad that it was almost comical. But in the short time he was on the pitch he set up Idah for a decent chance (the latter couldn't sort his feet out - quelle surprise) and had a shot cleared off the line. That's as much as Marquinhos managed in 90 minutes.

You really are stupid.

Absolutely terrible. The squad is a massive downgrade and probably the poorest it has ever been. Apart from when it was worse. But that was more than a bit ago. I tell you what though, was invigorating being amongst the City Elite. The support was blinding. Apart from for Idah (****), Tzolis (****), Kamara (****), Sargent (****)… jeering playing the ball backwards, quitting with ten to go when we probably needed more than anything, moaning that a 1-1 was better than a nil-nil as “why can’t we just score a ****ing goal”… Elite my ****. 🙄

Here are the updated totals... Now the stats which are really good again... 22/28 79% Winning PUPs 17/23 74% Winning picks Most profitable pick was from our final six winning PUP @littleyellowbirdie with Northampton at 1.02 which sees him second in this months POTM table. With four weeks left... @Parma Ham's gone mouldy is now clear leader of our PUPs league after @Hammond1612 was let down in Wales. @Inch High aka Inchy...leads the profitability version but @Hector Brockelbank closed the gap a little in second. After 2 weeks there are 17 PUPs still in with a chance of POTM led by @Inch High aka Inchy.. Here are the tables... PUP Wins Picks Win% Profit Parma 32 35 91% -0.55 Hammond1612 31 35 89% 1.1 PurpleCanary 30 35 86% 0.24 NWC 29 35 83% 4.26 Cosmic Twin 29 35 83% 0.93 Gregt 28 35 80% 6.71 Til1010 28 35 80% 0.51 Indy 25 32 78% 4.23 Hector Brockelbank 27 35 77% 8.95 Diane 27 35 77% 3.38 Feedthewolf 27 35 77% 3 Hissing Sid 26 35 74% 2.45 Kathy 26 35 74% 0.02 Diesel Doris 25 34 74% 0.14 Sonyc 23 33 70% 2.3 Mr Angry 24 35 69% -0.73 Inchy 19 28 68% 16.1 Leedscanary 21 31 68% 5.66 Twidio 22 33 67% 1.58 TheBaldOne66 23 35 66% -1.15 Nutty Nigel 23 35 66% -1.6 DJ11 23 35 66% -5.69 NFN FC 22 35 63% 6.2 Jellytot 11 18 61% -1.8 WWIAFTM 20 33 61% -6.01 Mr Apples 21 35 60% -3.4 First Wazzock 19 32 59% -2.53 ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- PUP Wins Picks Win% Profit Inchy 19 28 68% 16.1 Hector Brockelbank 27 35 77% 8.95 Gregt 28 35 80% 6.71 NFN FC 22 35 63% 6.2 Leedscanary 21 31 68% 5.66 NWC 29 35 83% 4.26 Indy 25 32 78% 4.23 Diane 27 35 77% 3.38 Feedthewolf 27 35 77% 3 Hissing Sid 26 35 74% 2.45 Sonyc 23 33 70% 2.3 Twidio 22 33 67% 1.58 Hammond1612 31 35 89% 1.1 Cosmic Twin 29 35 83% 0.93 Til1010 28 35 80% 0.51 PurpleCanary 30 35 86% 0.24 Diesel Doris 25 34 74% 0.14 Kathy 26 35 74% 0.02 ----------------------------------------------------------- PUP Wins Picks Win% Profit Inchy 2 2 100% 3.13 Littleyellowbirdie 2 2 100% 2.16 Hector Brockelbank 2 2 100% 1.08 Kiwiscot 2 2 100% 0.95 NWC 2 2 100% 0.84 Gregt 2 2 100% 0.72 Diesel Doris 2 2 100% 0.68 Hissing Sid 2 2 100% 0.58 Diane 2 2 100% 0.54 Feedthewolf 2 2 100% 0.54 Indy 2 2 100% 0.5 Nutty Nigel 2 2 100% 0.47 Cosmic Twin 2 2 100% 0.28 PurpleCanary 2 2 100% 0.28 Kathy 2 2 100% 0.25 Til1010 2 2 100% 0.23 Parma 2 2 100% 0.09

I feel sorry for Hanley but I have this nagging feeling it could be the best thing to happen for us. He's not the worst CB I've seen & he does have useful attributes - speed & strength among them - but like Gibson he is guilty of appalling errors which doesn't help team morale. And morale is the biggest problem; I think he's the wrong sort of character to lead a team. He's a dour Scottish pessimist at bottom, & I doubt the previous 2 PL adventures have done much to improve his outlook. Nothing wrong with being dour & Scottish, but you need a true fighting spirit to go with it, & to me he looks defeated before he starts, unable to galvanise those around him or inspire any belief other than in inevitable doom. Compare him to Christoph, a quiet, thoughtful chap who could nevertheless become a chest-beating leader when the going got tough. I may be overstating the case but I just don't see Hanley as the man to grab the team by the scruff of the neck & force the issue. Too much Private Fraser in his make-up. We need a leader. We haven't got one. Whoever replaces Hanley in the long term has to have that quality, they have to care, to have belief & not settle for second best. And if that makes them unpopular in the dressing room? Well ...

Webber has a lot to answer for these last two seasons transfer windows.

I thought the urgency was there, but the precision wasn't. Everything was half-a-yard off being very fluid for players to run on at more speed that might have unhinged Rotherham's defence. Pukki got onto that through ball from Sara and then it got stuck under his feet a bit. Idah had a similar problem later on with a ball that stuck under his feet too. Think we're being a bit slow to praise the Rotherham rearguard action, to be fair. Vickers made a couple of very decent saves, two got cleared off the line and they threw themselves at a heck of a lot of shots. On another day we'd have had a relatively comfortable 2-0 win and probably mentioned wastefulness or lack of precision just in passing (in more ways than one!) but considering the state of play this season and the potential of getting into the play-off placings this late on, we're collectively focusing on the downsides a bit more. I'd have taken 4 from the last two games. Just wouldn't have expected it in the sequence we got them. It happens, we move on and try again.

Our strikers don't appear to play well together, so please can we just have one striker on the pitch for the start of games? Two strikers or even three in the line up isn't working. Far better imo to have a really decent midfield set up to supply the lone striker or perhaps score themselves. For me, Sargent and Idah on the pitch together is pointless. Neither of them does enough to help the other score, they don't seem to have that great a touch to supply Pukki either. Put Idah on his own up front and he would look a better player. Likewise Sargent. Likewise Pukki, who would have the benefit of midfielders able to supply him. In short we have three strikers who don't compliment each other, each better on their own with more possibility of decent supply from midfield. Do you agree, or should we persevere with two, or as in one match three strikers, in the line up?

That could be because the government takes notice of the forecast and acts accordingly, Jeremy Hunt's budget being a case in point. That's what the forecasts are for, after all. Jeremy Hunt has been quick to point out that, compared with the IMF estimate in October 2022, the UK's growth forecast is the most improved in the G7. That is true, but he fails to mention that it's because the October estimate was based on the Truss/Kwarteng budget.

Decent cover

Keeps it Hayden, so to speak

Good post. There is definitely a player there. Going to be a good test of Wagner's coaching attributes next season. And @hogesar's posting attributes. 😉

The Tzolis chance at the end was the best chance on xG, if you mean the one that he put over the top not the one which was blocked. I think with a lot of chances it can be easy to overlook certain factors, the Pukki chance that he puts wide, there are so many bodies between him and the goal, although practically only covering the left side. Even so that already makes it a much harder chance. Similarly with the late Tzolis chance, I know some data companies can recreate the shot to show what the view was from the player when hitting it. I would bet that the tight angle + keeper rushing out makes it look a tougher chance than it does on the highlights.

Bali really has done fantastically well - loans out to lower divisions are rarely so impressive. I know people question his defensive work, but I wish he was playing with us now on the wing in front of Max rather than Marquinhos.

Think I've got all of Wagners Championship Games above. Some thoughts: 1) We really should have beaten Rotherham, even if we didn't create absolute clear-cut chances (although some of that was down to poor touches / control from the likes of Pukki & Sargent, making a great chance only a good one). 2) We were fortunate against Blackburn with 2 fantastic finishes that are pretty low-probability goals. Conversely Blackburn created one *really* good chance they should have scored. 3) Not a huge amount in the Sheffield United game, they just created one very good chance and that was enough. Defensively we were pretty sound against a top 2 side. 4) You can understand Alex Neil's frustration at not beating us. 5) We done enough to beat Huddersfield but didn't get the points. 6) We were unfortunate to lose at home to Sunderland. 7) We were fortunate to beat Millwall away, although note how nearly all the goals were scored from *relatively* low probability chances. A game of clinical finishing. Finally, our xG has taken a bit of a hit with Dowell out of the side in a Wagner team. It deteriorated further with the loss of Nunez.

It has been a good week for reminding myself how out of touch a lot of twitter commentators are on this sort of thing too. See the reaction to Labour unveilng a policy designed to help crack down on scam phone calls. Loads of wailing from people who love to call Starmer 'Keith' that this isn't a priority ignoring two major things... A political party can tackle more than one issue at a time Just because something isn't an issue to you doesn't mean it isn't to other people. Far too many people who are political on social media are massively detached from how most people consume their political news, generate their opinions and decide their priorities. For many people bin collections trump things like transgender rights or Israel/Palestine but you wouldn't know it from a lot of online political discussion, especially on the left.

Both CB'S injured i thought we had signed John Terry on a free then for a minute !

I think we saw what a long term manager did with us? Farke was here for over 4 years which is pretty long term by most managerial standards and we saw what it got us- lovely, scintillating football in the 2nd tier, humiliation in the top tier. I'm also not sure I see 'having a set way of playing' as always a positive. Farke's biggest weakness as a head coach is an inability to adapt his playing style. It cost him here and I wouldn't be shocked if it costs him at Gladbach too.

Another thing that strikes me about the relative lack of a "style" coming through is the difference between a Farke team and the Wagner one at Huddersfield.... Farke teams kept the ball but weren't particularly active out of possession, Wagner's Huddersfield teams ran like heck out of possession as he's a Klopp acolyte. They both like keeping hold of it, which is the thing in common, but a Wagner side chases harder. So, for a Wagner to come in mid-season, he can't really do the major fitness work needed for his style to click in the middle of the season, so he has to fiddle around a bit with what he has. I think we'll start seeing shoots of what Wagner's really wanting after a few games of next season.

The same with Sorenson. Gifted all round footballers often get moved around to their detriment. Having said that I'd like to see Sorenson and Andrew O against a better side to see how good they are defensively. They are so much better with the ball at their feet than the other 2.

I think we're confusing urgency with tempo. The latter was way too slow so Rotheram looked relatively comfortable. We had no one in midfield to pick a pass, Pukki and Sargent should maybe have swapped, 2 games in 4 days has sunk Onel, Marquinhos doesn't have the pace to get beyond defenders etc etc.

This. We played well enough from box-to-box to win the game easily. Our strikers were just totally off it. It is a big concern.

He is a thug. Glad he never came here

This is a bit lazy though. We have no idea how good Warner is, or if he's ready. Fans always call for "just shove in some academy lads, whats the worst that can happen" but the fact that every club up and down the country avoids doing this until they believe the players are ready probably tells you something.

She can maybe dedicate more time to answering your e-mails.

Are you being 'complimentary'?.....

That’s just not correct - there’s next-to-no successful sides these days who don’t have loans in key positions - just this season, Burnley have 4, 3 of whom have played every game they can; Sheff U have 4, including two of their main players McAtee and Doyle from Man C. I could go on. If anything, we’ve underused the loan market this season - just because we’ve not ended up with players you like, doesn’t mean it isn’t something we should use; that’s just naive in the extreme.

If we went up we would be cementing the claim that we are wasting a place in the Prem. Let Millwall or Preston - or especially Luton, have their time in the Big Boys' League. Let them realise that it isn't all it's cracked up to be.

Ramsey was one of our best players when he was here, and if we didn't play Marquinhos, what other options do we have right now? Possibly Tzolis with Hernandez moving to the right, or maybe Idah or Sargent out there, which hasn't worked all season?

Not impressed with the team selection today. Why can’t he see that playing Sargent anywhere other than up front alone doesn’t work. Lungi should have been kept in midfield, Gibbs further forward and Warner brought in alongside Omo. Pukki needs to be on the bench until the end of the season as trying to fit him in to this 11 doesn’t work. As to both Hayden and Byram on the bench but not really fit???? Surely we have some players in the Academy that are at least fit if called upon?