606 caller

[Sufyellow 224]

2 minutes ago, king canary said:

If we can find a head coach that can galvanise the River End he should probably be knighted on the spot.

To be fair the ref did it yesterday when we didn't get the penalty,  I was in shock . 

[Google Bot 3,329]

1 hour ago, Creedence Clearwater Couto said:

I’m not sure you’ll get much support for Wagner being a good attacking manager. 

Let's judge him with fit players eh?  Going by start of the season whereby he had attacking players fit (Other than Sainz), we were pretty relentless in sustained periods of attack.  It was outside of those periods that concerned me more as a coach.

[Conrad 179]

20 minutes ago, Sufyellow said:

I don't believe anyone will replace them.  

It will be interesting to see the attendance this coming Saturday. All those that are supposedly out there wanting to attend a match, but cannot currently due to the amount of ST holders, have an opportunity. Anyone wishing to attend and sit with their friends can and the reasonable ticket pricing means that attendance is affordable to all. Let's see if the great number of people, who purport to support the club but cannot usually get a ticket turn up. I think not. 

[Capt. Pants 4,294]

A good point made by Lakey - it wasn't Man City!

Remember that game when we an injury hit team matched and beat one of the best in the league? Where every throw in was cheered? What on earth have we become to be ****-scared of a relegated team who had one of the worst defences ever.

I made a comment 2nd half that Hwang was our furthest player forward literally 10 yards from the penalty area D. Yes it was an enthralling game but in 45 years of watching NCFC home games I've never seen us sit so deep. 

It's really difficult to get behind that and it has absolutely nothing to do with entitlement.

Edited January 2 by Capt. Pants

[Capt. Pants 4,294]

9 minutes ago, Conrad said:

It will be interesting to see the attendance this coming Saturday. All those that are supposedly out there wanting to attend a match, but cannot currently due to the amount of ST holders, have an opportunity. Anyone wishing to attend and sit with their friends can and the reasonable ticket pricing means that attendance is affordable to all. Let's see if the great number of people, who purport to support the club but cannot usually get a ticket turn up. I think not. 

Superb point. A lot of comments on here probably from people who don't even go. 'Let's be 'aving you".

Turn for yourself and make a difference and stop blaming everyone else.

[Mr.Carrow 380]

12 minutes ago, Conrad said:

It will be interesting to see the attendance this coming Saturday. All those that are supposedly out there wanting to attend a match, but cannot currently due to the amount of ST holders, have an opportunity. Anyone wishing to attend and sit with their friends can and the reasonable ticket pricing means that attendance is affordable to all. Let's see if the great number of people, who purport to support the club but cannot usually get a ticket turn up. I think not. 

Doesn't really work like that though. Football is addictive and in many respects clubs have to cultivate support with ticket deals etc as we did 20 years ago and 1p5wich have done recently. People drift away and find other things to do, especially when every time they try to get a good bunch of seats together it's utterly impossible. 

[hogesar 9,761]

I think it's worth noting that the overall tactic vs what actually happened or our intentions aren't necessarily the same.

For me, the general principle of 5 at the back was effective. I think it potentially is a longer-term option for us because it does not have to be defensive. We also have a lot of championship-standard CB's in my opinion, with Kenny now added to the list.

I don't believe we set out to sit as deep as we did in those first 25 minutes. Certainly the coaches on the touchline seemed to be gesturing for us to be a bit higher up the pitch. I understand that's difficult when you've gone out with a defensive mentality though, which we certainly did.

I also have zero interest in watching that every home game of the season. But after two narrow losses away from home facing a team unbeaten in 17 with one of the best squads, I can handle it. Those saying they'd rather lose 3-1 but attack are quite simply lying because i've seen what those individuals posted after we naively threw away a 2 goal lead vs Leeds.

 

[shefcanary 2,468]

28 minutes ago, Mr.Carrow said:

Doesn't really work like that though. Football is addictive and in many respects clubs have to cultivate support with ticket deals etc as we did 20 years ago and 1p5wich have done recently. People drift away and find other things to do, especially when every time they try to get a good bunch of seats together it's utterly impossible. 

Spot on. The club has let its marketing team concentrate on peripheral stuff for too long, whilst taking for granted the match day product. There is a lot of work to catch up with what the Binners are doing (on the back of some of staff who used to deliver at the Carra - just saying). Once the concord between Attanasio and Smith & Jones comes to an end, I expect you will start to see a real difference in this aspect of the club. The current complacency needs to end.

[king canary 7,680]

36 minutes ago, hogesar said:

For me, the general principle of 5 at the back was effective. I think it potentially is a longer-term option for us because it does not have to be defensive. We also have a lot of championship-standard CB's in my opinion, with Kenny now added to the list.

Agree- if we're looking at this formation longer term then we need to see Stacey/McCallum or Dimi licence to get forward and McLean licence to step out of defence with the ball.

A formation like this can end up playing 5-4-1 or it can end up being very attacking if the leash is taken off certain players. 

[Conrad 179]

49 minutes ago, Mr.Carrow said:

Doesn't really work like that though. Football is addictive and in many respects clubs have to cultivate support with ticket deals etc as we did 20 years ago and 1p5wich have done recently. People drift away and find other things to do, especially when every time they try to get a good bunch of seats together it's utterly impossible. 

So there is no point in a ground expansion then? If people are not interested in going to a cup match, with cheap tickets and all, why on earth would they be willing to attend league matches on a regular basis especially given our performances currently. A lot of posters on here have said that they (and others) would like the opportunity to attend a match. Well here it is. Put up or shut up. Show the demand is there. 

[hogesar 9,761]

15 minutes ago, king canary said:

Agree- if we're looking at this formation longer term then we need to see Stacey/McCallum or Dimi licence to get forward and McLean licence to step out of defence with the ball.

A formation like this can end up playing 5-4-1 or it can end up being very attacking if the leash is taken off certain players. 

Yep, I'm not sure we are looking at it longer term, even though I'd like us to. Considering we didn't really move away from Wagner's base structure even when we had all those injuries that made it basically impossible to play it, I'd be surprised if he did now. Pleasantly surprised, but surprised all the same.

 

[sonyc 5,541]

21 minutes ago, shefcanary said:

Spot on. The club has let its marketing team concentrate on peripheral stuff for too long, whilst taking for granted the match day product. There is a lot of work to catch up with what the Binners are doing (on the back of some of staff who used to deliver at the Carra - just saying). Once the concord between Attanasio and Smith & Jones comes to an end, I expect you will start to see a real difference in this aspect of the club. The current complacency needs to end.

Spot on. The marketing team have all the hallmarks of a certain faddish mentality. I think we've shared similar views for a while on this. And at the expense of the bread and butter. Any management consultant would say something like "sticking to the knitting" or similar anyway. Make sure your main purpose is first class. 

There is a dysfunctional aspect still in Ncfc. I moved houses over a year ago. Yet the shareholding department hadn't been advised by the Supporter Relations department (claiming in email that they are separate entities! ....even though they email each other. Providing a customer's change of address is not something they do obviously....one has to email oneself separately). Meanwhile you don't receive the stuff like reports, votes etc).

To then be told that some fans are complainers adds insult to injury. And I should point out I'm a quiet 80%er (probably?) who thinks well of the noisy 20%. I support the Snake Pit divorcees too😃 

Actually, scrub that. I dislike the 80/20 thing!

Mrs S thinks we (as fans) live in a kind of our own soap opera and she is definitely right isn't she?

Roll on 2024.

[Jim Smith 2,345]

3 hours ago, Worthy Nigelton said:

No. Its like Hoggy says, we've just become entitled at this level. Any time we're not performing excellently and beating teams easily, then it's poor. Well I don't agree. I've seen us look poor (Roeder, Peter Grant, Bryan Gunn, Bryan Hamilton) and we are/were a million miles away from that level. Disappointing, yes, but nobody appreciates that football is cyclical and we're going through an underwhelming cycle right now, but it's nowhere near as bad as you are suggesting and the style being served up could be infinitely worse. Watch us under Chris Hughton and then tell me that Wagner is not an attacking, good-footballing manager. His instincts are to try and score goals and to pass the ball out from the back, we just don't have good enough players.

If you want to criticise his team selection or his tactics or whether he's getting the best out of the players, fine, Id agree with you on much of that, but to suggest the football is awful is not correct.

It’s not entitlement. It’s partly that we’ve seen how it can be done so much better on probably more limited resources. But for me it’s also that I can see huge tactical flaws with how we are playing that are just not being addressed. That is just so hugely frustrating.

Add to that the lack of hope because we’ve seen so many wasted opportunities and how joyless being in the prem is under this ownership. And you get apathy. 

 

[essex canary 508]

1 hour ago, sonyc said:

 

There is a dysfunctional aspect still in Ncfc. I moved houses over a year ago. Yet the shareholding department hadn't been advised by the Supporter Relations department (claiming in email that they are separate entities! ....even though they email each other. Providing a customer's change of address is not something they do obviously....one has to email oneself separately). Meanwhile you don't receive the stuff like reports, votes etc).

To then be told that some fans are complainers adds insult to injury. 

@GMF

Yet we will still get even fans representatives claiming this kind of performance is OK. 

[repman 635]

2 hours ago, hogesar said:

I think it's worth noting that the overall tactic vs what actually happened or our intentions aren't necessarily the same.

For me, the general principle of 5 at the back was effective. I think it potentially is a longer-term option for us because it does not have to be defensive. We also have a lot of championship-standard CB's in my opinion, with Kenny now added to the list.

I don't believe we set out to sit as deep as we did in those first 25 minutes. Certainly the coaches on the touchline seemed to be gesturing for us to be a bit higher up the pitch. I understand that's difficult when you've gone out with a defensive mentality though, which we certainly did.

I also have zero interest in watching that every home game of the season. But after two narrow losses away from home facing a team unbeaten in 17 with one of the best squads, I can handle it. Those saying they'd rather lose 3-1 but attack are quite simply lying because i've seen what those individuals posted after we naively threw away a 2 goal lead vs Leeds.

 

Have to say it was very amusing watching Andy Hughes shout at the players to press when Southampton had a goal kick, only for them to play through us with ease right away. 

I also think it's important to point out that even though we set up 'defensively' we weren't all that effective at stopping chances. The xGA against was the 7th worst for us all season. Obviously there's in game factors at play there but I don't think even doing this once in a while is a smart tactic.

[Midlands Yellow 4,101]

12 minutes ago, Jim Smith said:

It’s not entitlement. It’s partly that we’ve seen how it can be done so much better on probably more limited resources. But for me it’s also that I can see huge tactical flaws with how we are playing that are just not being addressed. That is just so hugely frustrating.

Add to that the lack of hope because we’ve seen so many wasted opportunities and how joyless being in the prem is under this ownership. And you get apathy. 

 

Exactly, Norwich fans are not the entitled sort. Boring football, safety first tactics with one of the biggest wage bills in the league equates to fans negativity . Add to that the damage Webber did and two co owners who hang around for the sake of it.  Fans are not going to arrive at matches with huge grins doing cartwheels 

[debbie does norwich 13]

3 hours ago, lake district canary said:

I would agree it was an enthralling match the way it turned out, but my biggest complaint was that we kicked of at the beginning of the match and literally shrank back into eleven behind the ball from the first second. It was bizarre and not what you expect to see from a home team, whoever we are playing.

I know people say we are not a good side, but are we really that insecure as a team we have to set up like that? I remember a few years ago we had to play a great in posession Swansalona team at CR.  Yes, they had a lot of posession, but we played well, taking the fight to them, weathered the storm and won 2-0.  That is what you are supposed to do as a home team - not surrender posession from the kick off like we did.

People can argue the ends justify the means, because we got a point and could have won it, but the fact remains we had 28% posession, with little to offer in the way of getting and keeping the ball because we had 11 players behind the ball most of the match. It was Southampton, not Man City! 

 

Not sure if the "Swansalona" was a typo or even the auto correct going mad but it did remind me of the last time Russ came back to CR with his in-form Swansea side (not actually fact checked that- I think it was his last return). We pressed much higher, went toe to toe and ended on the wrong side of a 3-0 result and 10 men. 

Agreed that it was Southampton, not man City. But I would also say the relative difference between those 2 teams is probably  the same as the relative difference between the 2 NCFC sides that played those games.

[GMF 757]

33 minutes ago, essex canary said:

@GMF

Yet we will still get even fans representatives claiming this kind of performance is OK. 

Who are you waving this stick at? 

[shefcanary 2,468]

36 minutes ago, repman said:

I also think it's important to point out that even though we set up 'defensively' we weren't all that effective at stopping chances. The xGA against was the 7th worst for us all season.

That's pretty damning. In effect if Southampton were half as good as the respect given them by Wagner we would have got thrashed. But they really aren't that good, if we had gone at them we could have won that match. But Wagner's confused thinking once again ...

Time he went.

[Creedence Clearwater Couto 1,297]

2 hours ago, Conrad said:

So there is no point in a ground expansion then? If people are not interested in going to a cup match, with cheap tickets and all, why on earth would they be willing to attend league matches on a regular basis especially given our performances currently. A lot of posters on here have said that they (and others) would like the opportunity to attend a match. Well here it is. Put up or shut up. Show the demand is there. 

Perhaps they’re only interested when the team is playing well? Currently (well not currently), when we’re performing well, we can’t maximise ticket sales. Ground expansion is 💯 still necessary. The key is to get the increase right. 

Edited January 2 by Creedence Clearwater Couto

[Mr.Carrow 380]

2 hours ago, Conrad said:

So there is no point in a ground expansion then? If people are not interested in going to a cup match, with cheap tickets and all, why on earth would they be willing to attend league matches on a regular basis especially given our performances currently. A lot of posters on here have said that they (and others) would like the opportunity to attend a match. Well here it is. Put up or shut up. Show the demand is there. 

We have already proven your point wrong many times. Against non league Luton in the cup we had a 26521 sell out. Many of our early round cup games have been over 20k and often amongst  the highest in the country. Saturday won't be that but I guarantee it will be better than many clubs supposedly bigger than us.

[Conrad 179]

11 minutes ago, Mr.Carrow said:

We have already proven your point wrong many times. Against non league Luton in the cup we had a 26521 sell out. Many of our early round cup games have been over 20k and often amongst  the highest in the country. Saturday won't be that but I guarantee it will be better than many clubs supposedly bigger than us.

Let's wait and see what happens in the current climate, shall we. The figures you quote prove nothing. The cheap ticket prices for cup games helps, but does not guarantee a good attendance. The question really is, how many ST holders attend a cup game, so how many casuals also attend. 

[Mr.Carrow 380]

3 minutes ago, Conrad said:

Let's wait and see what happens in the current climate, shall we. The figures you quote prove nothing. The cheap ticket prices for cup games helps, but does not guarantee a good attendance. The question really is, how many ST holders attend a cup game, so how many casuals also attend. 

Well given that we can't know the breakdown between season ticket holders and casuals for Cup games, neither of us can prove our point. And all clubs do ticket offers for the early rounds and even big clubs struggle to hit 10k. We've had early round cup games kick off delayed due to the queues trying to get in in recent years. Our attendances have been astonishing for that level of game. 

[Google Bot 3,329]

39 minutes ago, shefcanary said:

if we had gone at them we could have won that match.

I've not watched highlights back yet, but I felt that when Sarge come on we started to step it up and were looking raise our attack - and it was at that point where they scored.

So i'm not so sure about going at them.  In that scenario, we could've lost 0-4, we could've won 4-0, or anything else between.

If we deal only with the facts of the game and the outcome, that was a decent point against a team most would have said would walk over us. 

In fact, I see this is as one of our better results this season, as part of the process we've also managed to get decent minutes into the legs of Hanley and Sarge - that will pay dividends this month.

I think the Millwall match is what hurts the most and sours this point as being our only point in three games.  Playing this way against Saints isn't an issue for me, but resting players and not going at Millwall is far more of an issue and it's still hanging in the air somewhat, it's verging on the inexcusable that result.

[Mason 47 1,403]

49 minutes ago, Google Bot said:

I've not watched highlights back yet, but I felt that when Sarge come on we started to step it up and were looking raise our attack - and it was at that point where they scored.

So i'm not so sure about going at them.  In that scenario, we could've lost 0-4, we could've won 4-0, or anything else between.

If we deal only with the facts of the game and the outcome, that was a decent point against a team most would have said would walk over us. 

In fact, I see this is as one of our better results this season, as part of the process we've also managed to get decent minutes into the legs of Hanley and Sarge - that will pay dividends this month.

I think the Millwall match is what hurts the most and sours this point as being our only point in three games.  Playing this way against Saints isn't an issue for me, but resting players and not going at Millwall is far more of an issue and it's still hanging in the air somewhat, it's verging on the inexcusable that result.

I feel much the same. We've gone at a lot of teams from the start then tailed off after 20 minutes. Wagner did in isolation what he felt he needed to to combat Soton. And, on the balance of clear chances we could just as easily have won 3-2. 

I understand though that the other side of the fence can't understand what is being said as anything other than a pathetic cope for how much I love Delia and playing 10 in defence until 2053.

[Mr.Carrow 380]

On 02/01/2024 at 17:05, Conrad said:

Let's wait and see what happens in the current climate, shall we. The figures you quote prove nothing. The cheap ticket prices for cup games helps, but does not guarantee a good attendance. The question really is, how many ST holders attend a cup game, so how many casuals also attend. 

16,000 sold as per official site. Club expecting 19-20,000.

[Robert N. LiM 4,540]

1 minute ago, Mr.Carrow said:

16,000 sold as per official site. Club expecting 19-20,000.

That sounds pretty decent for a third round game against lower league opposition. Hope we put a decent team out. Feels like the perfect season to give the Cup a good go.

[Big Vince 323]

I like the idea of parking the bus then developing a sharp, counter attacking style of play, as this is what would be required in the EPL if you want to stay there longer term.

Best to start perfecting it in this league first.

[The Raptor 1,246]

2 hours ago, Mr.Carrow said:

16,000 sold as per official site. Club expecting 19-20,000.

16,003 now. See you all there!

[Big Vince 323]

2 hours ago, Robert N. LiM said:

That sounds pretty decent for a third round game against lower league opposition. Hope we put a decent team out. Feels like the perfect season to give the Cup a good go.

Delia doesn't do cups. Check the stats.