"Onel Hernández has no end product"

[Ulfotto 634]

Let’s be honest if Onel had an end product he wouldn’t be playing for Norwich.

[Coneys Knee 954]

6 hours ago, Capt. Pants said:

Played well 2nd half and seems to have progressed from being a headless chicken. He may thrive under Wagner.

I think that the way Wagner likes his teams to play: high energy, tempo, the press, Hernandez is exactly the kinda guy you want in the team. He may just well reach new levels under Wagner. He’s mental and I love it when he’s just being Onel on the pitch. Who knows what might happen but that’s what I go to football games for. 
 

You gotta love him regardless.  

[mrD66M 99]

2 hours ago, Creedence Clearwater Couto said:

I love Hernandez. He positively affects games, and constantly makes things happen - sometimes by design, or sometimes not, but he gets us in the right areas and is a constant threat. 

Rashica, Tzolis, Cantwell, Placheta…. 100 % Hernandez every time. Criminally underused and underrated since 2019. Farke should’ve put more trust in him. He’s a weapon, a cannon. A loose one, but still a weapon!

Tzolis needs a chance. And we need him. Wagner will work him out.

[TheGunnShow 5,940]

3 hours ago, hogesar said:

Onel though, has significantly more natural ability than Placheta. Placheta can't really beat a player for example, but Onel can for fun.

I dont expect Placheta to play for us again. 

As for Onel, he doesn't have much end product but we offer him simple options now and he's far better for it. If he did have significant end product he would probably have had a hattrick but he also wouldn't be playing for Norwich.

Agree that Onel's got more natural attacking ability, but we're talking about pressing opposition into faults. Placheta's got more top speed, more stamina and has a bit more workrate off the ball. His problems are when defences sit deep, not when a ball's turned over high against a disorganised defence.

Onel's the better dribbler, especially in tight spaces and he's much more aggressive with the ball at his feet whilst also being one of our fastest players. I'm simply saying the arguments that apply to Onel potentially coming good under Wagner could very easily apply to Placheta with a different set of favourable outcomes as with the exception of brute strength, what Hernandez has physically, Placheta has as well and a little more.

Edited January 21, 2023 by TheGunnShow

[Nuff Said 5,141]

7 minutes ago, TheGunnShow said:

Agree that Onel's got more natural attacking ability, but we're talking about pressing opposition into faults. Placheta's got more top speed, more stamina and has a bit more workrate off the ball. His problems are when defences sit deep, not when a ball's turned over high against a disorganised defence.

Onel's the better dribbler, especially in tight spaces and he's much more aggressive with the ball at his feet whilst also being one of our fastest players. I'm simply saying the arguments that apply to Onel potentially coming good under Wagner could very easily apply to Placheta with a different set of favourable outcomes as with the exception of brute strength, what Hernandez has physically, Placheta has as well and a little more.

I admire your dedication to the cause of Placheta but I’m pretty sure you are the only person who works for or supports Norwich other than Placheta himself, his family and his agent who doesn’t think that he’s a bit pony. We were told how quick he was when he joined but the sad truth is that he’s only fast in a straight line without a ball at his feet. 
 

Farke couldn’t get a tune out of him, Smith had a brief look and wasn’t interested and Wagner would have to be a miracle worker to transform him into a half-decent player. Let it go.

[TheGunnShow 5,940]

2 minutes ago, Nuff Said said:

I admire your dedication to the cause of Placheta but I’m pretty sure you are the only person who works for or supports Norwich other than Placheta himself, his family and his agent who doesn’t think that he’s a bit pony. We were told how quick he was when he joined but the sad truth is that he’s only fast in a straight line without a ball at his feet. 
 

Farke couldn’t get a tune out of him, Smith had a brief look and wasn’t interested and Wagner would have to be a miracle worker to transform him into a half-decent player. Let it go.

The bit in bold is pretty much what pressing is about. 

Placheta didn't suit Farke's plan A game - as said, his skillset's no good against low defensive blocks, which was pretty much Farke's second Championship-winning season.

I'm not saying he's done well with us at all. I'm simply saying his attributes might fit Wagner's pressing game far better than Farke's Guardiola-lite style and Smith's slow possession game.

[Branston Pickle 3,659]

I’m kind-of with GunnShow, to an extent - I don’t think Placheta has really had that much of a run in the side to properly show us what he can do, mostly being bits-and-bobs substitute appearances. I’d not necessarily want to write him off.

[hogesar 9,674]

20 minutes ago, TheGunnShow said:

Agree that Onel's got more natural attacking ability, but we're talking about pressing opposition into faults. Placheta's got more top speed, more stamina and has a bit more workrate off the ball. His problems are when defences sit deep, not when a ball's turned over high against a disorganised defence.

Onel's the better dribbler, especially in tight spaces and he's much more aggressive with the ball at his feet whilst also being one of our fastest players. I'm simply saying the arguments that apply to Onel potentially coming good under Wagner could very easily apply to Placheta with a different set of favourable outcomes as with the exception of brute strength, what Hernandez has physically, Placheta has as well and a little more.

Yes. Maybe. I'll be honest, I've not seen Placheta do enough of anything often enough to really offer an opinion but his base attributes do lean towards being better suited under a Wagner side.

[ron obvious 1,502]

Placheta's shown flashes of real ability & I think, with proper coaching & an injection of self confidence, he may yet come good. Wagner looks like he could be the man for the job.

[Canary Wundaboy 1,359]

Onel’s greatest asset is not his pace, his strength or his work rate, all of which he has in spades. It’s his chaos. When the ball’s at his feet defenders have no idea what he’ll do because Onel himself doesn’t really know either, he just makes a snap decision and goes for it. It doesn’t always happen right and sometimes it makes him incredibly frustrating to watch but defenders hate playing against him and that draws attention from other defenders which creates space for everyone else. If we keep attacking at pace and keeping Onel off the leash, not every attack will end up in a goal but we’ll continue to create lots of attacking opportunities and we’ll score a lot more goals as a result.

But Placheta? Can’t see it. Bloke doesn’t have a footballing brain and despite being super quick hasn’t beaten a man in the entire time he’s been here. Total waste of a squad place and needs to be shipped out asap.

[Coneys Knee 954]

I can’t believe people are actually suggesting placeta could be a better choice than Hernandez. Serious case of a player being perceived to be better than they are, the longer it’s been since they've played for us.

[Commonsense 624]

14 hours ago, hogesar said:

Dunno, when Farke had him playing a full season he got 8 league goals and 9 league assists from him.

Getting 10x out of him than Smith did, though.

Absolutely. Another ridiculous post from Birdie so that he can continue his inane and inaccurate campaign against Farke. He has become a troll.

[FenwayFrank 2,459]

3 hours ago, Coneys Knee said:

I can’t believe people are actually suggesting placeta could be a better choice than Hernandez. Serious case of a player being perceived to be better than they are, the longer it’s been since they've played for us.

Wait until Bechio gets on, I can’t understand how Pukki is stopping him from getting a game 

[Capt. Pants 4,234]

Just reading another post on out of contract players; Onel is on that list.

Had Smith still been here I think we would have released him because he was seldom in the first XI and for an impact player didn't really have much, in terms of goals and assists.

I'd be surprised if we weren't to offer him a new deal now, but we also need an upgrade to play out wide. That in itself might be the end of Placheta and Tzolis as we'll need to trim the squad and/or add more quality in wide areas.

Onel has timed his resurgence perfectly!

[Mason 47 1,379]

I can see the arguments for Placheta, in the sense that Wagner has seemingly simplified Onel's game and he looks like a new player. Personally, I don't think Placheta will have the playing time to prove either way, but I understand the perspective.

On Onel, it can be said Coventry gave him acres of space too many times yesterday, but therein lies one of the great things so far under Wagner. The front four are all a viable threat now; opposition can't pay too much attention to any one player as the other three are just as damaging. Having players up and around Pukki allows him to remind us what a quality attacker he is, too, with 4 goal contributions in 2 games.

Only two games into Season 2.0 of course, but you can't deny a clear fortnight of Wagner training before a home game against nigh-unstoppable Burnley is a fascinating prospect.

[littleyellowbirdie 2,550]

1 hour ago, Commonsense said:

Absolutely. Another ridiculous post from Birdie so that he can continue his inane and inaccurate campaign against Farke. He has become a troll.

I'll freely admit it was tongue in cheek given two games is a ridiculously small sample size to compare to a whole season, but given such absurd approaches to statistics are actually used by some posters on here on a regular basis to argue points, it's hard to fathom why I'm being singled out for accusations of trolling here.

Trolling is purely to wind people up; your offense to my obviously flawed statistical comparison here on a forum where flawed statistics are used weekly by people making nonsense points they seem to actually believe has actually reinforced the genuine and valid point I intended.

[king canary 7,606]

Placheta is gash, can't believe people still argue against this. Such a limited player, Onel offers 10 times what he does.

[Worthy Nigelton 1,048]

This has always been a false accusation of Onel. Yes he doesn't have the quality of Buendia, Dowell, Cantwell etc but that first promotion season with Farke he changed loads of games. He's a decent winger, not a world beater, but definitely decent and I'm glad he's in our team.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[mrD66M 99]

3 hours ago, king canary said:

Placheta is gash, can't believe people still argue against this. Such a limited player, Onel offers 10 times what he does.

Few months back, folk were saying the same, or worse, about Sargent. 

Does Przemek deserve an opportunity under Wagner?

[norfolkngood 1,087]

i think Placheta in the right side a lesser side  maybe League one would be a Great Striker 

either on the shoulder of last defender or his pace to get to ball if more direct 

[TeemuVanBasten 3,327]

23 hours ago, TheGunnShow said:

Just nailed why I think Placheta could come good under wagner

If he can succeed where Farke failed then I agree with the 50 year contract.

[TeemuVanBasten 3,327]

31 minutes ago, norfolkngood said:

i think Placheta in the right side a lesser side  maybe League one would be a Great Striker 

either on the shoulder of last defender or his pace to get to ball if more direct 

I've got this little nagging curiosity about better Tsoliz would make a decent striker, he just looks like he is built like one and can finish.

[Canary Wundaboy 1,359]

It would be absolutely criminal not to offer Onel and Dowell new contracts IMHO. Pukki’s got one on the table already. Couldn’t give a monkeys about the others.

[Mella Yella 40]

Canaries always fly better with wings. I watched wingers at Norwich, since the great Kenny Foggo, we certainly had some exciting ones! playing in some of the best teams. You need a good midfielder who can ping a long ball to get the best out of them. Ian Crook springs to mind.

Edited January 22, 2023 by Mella Yella

[wcorkcanary 4,334]

25 minutes ago, Mella Yella said:

Canaries always fly better with wings. I watched wingers at Norwich, since the great Kenny Foggo, we certainly had some exciting ones! playing in some of the best teams. You need a good midfielder who can ping a long ball to get the best out of them. Ian Crook springs to mind.

Watching Leeds Brentford  , Gnonto reminds me of Ruel Fox.

[norfolkngood 1,087]

4 hours ago, TeemuVanBasten said:

I've got this little nagging curiosity about better Tsoliz would make a decent striker, he just looks like he is built like one and can finish.

Yes i know what you mean you see a player and think that 

i think with looks Placheta the less time he has to do something the better he is ,

Not saying being a striker is easy far from it but if you are first to the ball it makes it so much easier 

[East Rider 551]

Personally, I feel we missed Onel when he wasn't here. As someone else said, he causes the opposition problems whenever he is on the pitch with his pace and desire. 

Long may that continue with us

[lake district canary 4,531]

5 hours ago, Worthy Nigelton said:

This has always been a false accusation of Onel. Yes he doesn't have the quality of Buendia, Dowell, Cantwell etc but that first promotion season with Farke he changed loads of games. He's a decent winger, not a world beater, but definitely decent and I'm glad he's in our team.

This^^

He's a real handful for opposition players and he was a key player for Farke in the championship. He runs at and pulls defenders out of position, making space for others - and it's a myth he doesn't finish - he can and has scored some very important goals...who can ever forget that goal in the last minute against Forest in the 3-3 match. 

It's no wonder Wagner put hom straight in the team - he is exciting to watch and you just sense he has it in him to either score or set someone else up. A bit hit and miss, yes, but at least he has a go - and that fits the methodology under DW, perfectly.

[king canary 7,606]

19 hours ago, mrD66M said:

Few months back, folk were saying the same, or worse, about Sargent. 

Does Przemek deserve an opportunity under Wagner?

Not for me.

If you look back quite a few people were saying while Sargent was poor in the Premier League he had some elements the suggested he could be good at this level, particularly his work rate and physicality.

I'm yet to see anyone make any case for Placheta beyond 'doesn't he deserve a shot?' He's fast but that is it, no real skill or trickery. There was one cup game vs Coventry where he looked a threat but outside of that I've never seen a game from him where he looks like he's got the fullback worried. I compare him other wingers we've had who aren't anything special (Josh Murphy, Yanic Wildschut etc) and each of those had a few games where they panicked their opposite number.  

[king canary 7,606]

19 hours ago, Worthy Nigelton said:

This has always been a false accusation of Onel.

It really hasn't been a false accusation, he's a menace but his final ball has often been awful and his finishing is woeful at times. He's great as a bit of an agent of chaos but the lack of end product has always been a fair one.