Alex matos

[Graham Paddons Beard 2,431]

On 25/03/2023 at 09:33, FenwayFrank said:

So if one of our youth players leaves for another club it’s bad, but when we nick players like Gibbs off the Binners it’s good ? 

Exactly FF. Liam came to us as the whole package is miles above the Binners. We also were lucky enough to be near to his home base  to appeal to him - my understanding is that Brighton were interested too. 
 

A young player being offered the facilities, support and surroundings of Chelsea  really is a no brainer. You don’t get left to rot in the reserves these days , you have very well thought out pathways including loans . 
 

There are plenty of ex Chelsea players doing well in different parts of the football world . 

[king canary 7,607]

4 hours ago, BigFish said:

Because these days if you want to get to very top getting into a big club is the best way to do it. Better facilities, train with better players, better coaching etc etc. If you not good enough you still get more money, good contacts & a better experience. Professional football is a job, not a hobby.

Not sure that is strictly true.

Look at the England team yesterday and where they started their careers

Pickford- Sunderland

Walker- Sheffield United

Maguire- Sheffield United

Stones- Barnsley

Chillwell- Leicester

Rice- West Ham

Phillips- Leeds

Maddison- Coventry

Bellingham- Birmingham

Saka- Arsenal

Kane- Spurs

So a couple of big club academy grads but plenty who came through the systems of smaller teams.

[king canary 7,607]

27 minutes ago, king canary said:

Not sure that is strictly true.

Look at the England team yesterday and where they started their careers

Pickford- Sunderland

Walker- Sheffield United

Maguire- Sheffield United

Stones- Barnsley

Chillwell- Leicester

Rice- West Ham

Phillips- Leeds

Maddison- Coventry

Bellingham- Birmingham

Saka- Arsenal

Kane- Spurs

So a couple of big club academy grads but plenty who came through the systems of smaller teams.

Just to add to this it's interesting to look at the last players the big clubs have brought through as regular first teamers

Man U haven't had an academy player become a regular since Rashford.

Chelsea haven't blooded anyone since that spell under Lampard and a transfer embargo, and the recent spending spree probably pushes players like Gallagher further from the first team.

Tottenham have Skipp but he's not a regular and then you're looking at Kane!

Liverpool do OK- Harvey Elliot and Bajcetic have broken through in recent years.

Man City have Foden and Rico Lewis but nothing much else.

Arsenal seem to do the best- Saka, Nketiah, Smith-Rowe and Nelson have all come through in recent years.

But I'm not sure there is much evidence that going to a big clubs academy really gives you much more chance of success.

[shefcanary 2,409]

My daughter's school friend (Alex Kiwomya, who also had the benefit of a father and uncle who were pro-footballers) was at Chelsea from 14 to 21. A forward / winger, despite representing England up to U19 level (3 goals in 17 appearances), he never made a first team appearance for Chelsea. He was loaned to Barnsley & Fleetwood (both League 1) and Crewe (League 2), but was then released by Chelsea and signed for Doncaster (League 1). They in turn loaned him to Chesterfield & Chorley, before transferring him to Chesterfield.  Before long he was at Kings Lynn briefly, but on their relegation was released. He then briefly played in Gibraltar, before joining Savage's Macclesfield. He is currently at Stafford Rangers in the Northern Premier League (Seventh Tier of the pyramid). He is 26.

He had a lot going for him, but Chelsea's academy didn't secure him a golden future. Given his inheritance of footballing genes big things were expected of him, but for whatever reason he has not had a significant league career, with 8 goals in 67 league appearances. 

Matsos could perhaps look at Alex's story as a lesson on what can become of signing for an EPL academy. From EPL to Tier 7 in less than 5 seasons.

[sgncfc 1,228]

1 hour ago, king canary said:

Not sure that is strictly true.

Look at the England team yesterday and where they started their careers

Pickford- Sunderland

Walker- Sheffield United

Maguire- Sheffield United

Stones- Barnsley

Chillwell- Leicester

Rice- West Ham

Phillips- Leeds

Maddison- Coventry

Bellingham- Birmingham

Saka- Arsenal

Kane- Spurs

So a couple of big club academy grads but plenty who came through the systems of smaller teams.

Declan Rice was in Chelsea's academy before he was released at 14 and joined West Ham. Which proves your point even more - clearly he wouldn't have made it at Chelsea. And they will now have to pay £150m for him.

[BigFish 1,987]

1 hour ago, sgncfc said:

Declan Rice was in Chelsea's academy before he was released at 14 and joined West Ham. Which proves your point even more - clearly he wouldn't have made it at Chelsea. And they will now have to pay £150m for him.

A bit dated, but some context Cobham calling: Chelsea’s academy is colonising the Premier League

[CDMullins 436]

On 24/03/2023 at 22:10, Newtopia said:

Good luck to him, it is hard to believe this is motivated by anything other than money.

Take the tinted glasses off,

Moving to Chelsea is the chance of a lifetime.

[Graham Paddons Beard 2,431]

4 hours ago, king canary said:

Just to add to this it's interesting to look at the last players the big clubs have brought through as regular first teamers

Man U haven't had an academy player become a regular since Rashford.

Chelsea haven't blooded anyone since that spell under Lampard and a transfer embargo, and the recent spending spree probably pushes players like Gallagher further from the first team.

Tottenham have Skipp but he's not a regular and then you're looking at Kane!

Liverpool do OK- Harvey Elliot and Bajcetic have broken through in recent years.

Man City have Foden and Rico Lewis but nothing much else.

Arsenal seem to do the best- Saka, Nketiah, Smith-Rowe and Nelson have all come through in recent years.

But I'm not sure there is much evidence that going to a big clubs academy really gives you much more chance of success.

 

4 hours ago, king canary said:

Just to add to this it's interesting to look at the last players the big clubs have brought through as regular first teamers

Man U haven't had an academy player become a regular since Rashford.

Chelsea haven't blooded anyone since that spell under Lampard and a transfer embargo, and the recent spending spree probably pushes players like Gallagher further from the first team.

Tottenham have Skipp but he's not a regular and then you're looking at Kane!

Liverpool do OK- Harvey Elliot and Bajcetic have broken through in recent years.

Man City have Foden and Rico Lewis but nothing much else.

Arsenal seem to do the best- Saka, Nketiah, Smith-Rowe and Nelson have all come through in recent years.

But I'm not sure there is much evidence that going to a big clubs academy really gives you much more chance of success.

Are you self employed KC ? Or on strike? Or work nights ? I’m only jealous as I would love the sort of time you must have ! 

[Canaries north 151]

3 hours ago, sgncfc said:

Declan Rice was in Chelsea's academy before he was released at 14 and joined West Ham. Which proves your point even more - clearly he wouldn't have made it at Chelsea. And they will now have to pay £150m for him.

Also Kane was released by Arsenal and spent time at Watford before going to Spurs. Saka was also taken from Watford so my Watford supporting friend keeps telling me. Using the EPPP rules now means it's easier and cheaper than ever before for us to steal league 1 and 2 talent but it's impossible for us to fend off bigger clubs and we get very little for it. The big clubs use this as a puppy farm. Take the best talent, if they don't make it sell back to the championship and make way more back than you spent including wages. You really can't lose. 

[king canary 7,607]

54 minutes ago, Graham Paddons Beard said:

 

Are you self employed KC ? Or on strike? Or work nights ? I’m only jealous as I would love the sort of time you must have ! 

No, but all the info is available with a quick Google.

[Newtopia 517]

12 hours ago, CDMullins said:

Take the tinted glasses off,

Moving to Chelsea is the chance of a lifetime.

🫡

Chelsea, chance of a lifetime, possibly, and good luck to him.  Could easily get lost in their system.

[Ulfotto 635]

I appreciate this stuff happens all the time it I think it stinks to be honest.
 

At least it shows we have some talent in our academy. Begs the question what is the point of having academy at all if the time you get a player who could potentially be a first team player he’s poached.

[Wacky Waving Inflatable Arm Flailing Tube Man 3,821]

Done deal.

[Nexus_Canary 1,016]

On 25/03/2023 at 00:12, AJ said:

FIFA did change the rules to stop "talent hoarding" at big clubs by limiting loaning out to 8 players. Sadly they also only applied the rule to players who are over 21 or not home grown effectively making the rule change pointless. I'm not sure it's quite 50 players but it will still probably be enough for 2 full XIs

It's like everything in football these days. Keep the big clubs happy sh1t from a height on the smaller clubs.

Should just cap everything off and allow a splinter super League.

Stick the requirement that you can only play national football if you play in the grass roots leagues.

Then we have a more financially viable football league and the glory hogs and kids can enjoy their stupid cheat code teams.

Really considering supporting the local lower league teams but Wrexham have proven no one is safe from the ££££ corruption. I bet nott county and others are livid.

[shefcanary 2,409]

2 hours ago, Nexus_Canary said:

but Wrexham have proven no one is safe from the ££££ corruption. I bet nott county and others are livid.

Not corruption as such but Macclesfield are proving what a bit of money in non-league can do, if used right.

There are also other clubs who tried the money route who now have folded. Rushden & Diamonds are a team that comes to mind - two teams were merged who had never had a sniff of the football league, got loads of cash from the Dr Martens family and a new stadium followed by promotion to Football League, but then the money ran out and the club went bust, their brand new stadium demolished. 

With the majority of the National Conference retaining full time squads, its really taken a lot of the romance out of that level of football. 

[Capt. Pants 4,236]

Obviously I can understand him jumping at the chance at moving to a big club, but in mind there couldn't be a worse time to go to Chelsea.

They'll be buying their way to re-establishing themselves; there won't be much time for young player development.

Chelsea is a farm, Alex's career could end before it even starts.

Good luck to him, hope it works out.

[Mason 47 1,379]

Hard for a young lad not to jump at the chance to join a club like Chelsea. That being said if you read the Athletics report on post-Potter Chelsea, it might not be the best time to join them.

[GodlyOtsemobor 2,314]

I've always been caught in two minds about moves like this, on one hand you'll be trained by elite coaches, in elite facilities, and being payed elite money (even at youth level you'll get more than you would at youth level here) 

But, on the other hand - (unless your something very special) your career may stagnate, you'll be loaned out to countless teams across the globe until eventually being let go and have to fight your way back into regular football and if your lucky end up working your way back up to top level football - where as staying at a club like ours there much more chance of breaking into the first team as soon as your ready... 

 

I dunno, agents whispers don't help I guess. 

[Mason 47 1,379]

3 minutes ago, GodlyOtsemobor said:

I've always been caught in two minds about moves like this, on one hand you'll be trained by elite coaches, in elite facilities, and being payed elite money (even at youth level you'll get more than you would at youth level here) 

But, on the other hand - (unless your something very special) your career may stagnate, you'll be loaned out to countless teams across the globe until eventually being let go and have to fight your way back into regular football and if your lucky end up working your way back up to top level football - where as staying at a club like ours there much more chance of breaking into the first team as soon as your ready... 

 

I dunno, agents whispers don't help I guess. 

According to MB he was in line for his first appearances in the first team a la Kamara end of this season. Until the move materialised.

[GodlyOtsemobor 2,314]

2 minutes ago, Mason 47 said:

According to MB he was in line for his first appearances in the first team a la Kamara end of this season. Until the move materialised.

This proves the point doesn't it, how long will he be left in the youth ranks at Chelski before getting a sniff of their first team, if ever 

[Channon’s Windmill 326]

We will probably have him back on loan next season.

[FenwayFrank 2,459]

3 hours ago, shefcanary said:

Not corruption as such but Macclesfield are proving what a bit of money in non-league can do, if used right.

There are also other clubs who tried the money route who now have folded. Rushden & Diamonds are a team that comes to mind - two teams were merged who had never had a sniff of the football league, got loads of cash from the Dr Martens family and a new stadium followed by promotion to Football League, but then the money ran out and the club went bust, their brand new stadium demolished. 

With the majority of the National Conference retaining full time squads, its really taken a lot of the romance out of that level of football. 

Goes right down the leagues, I think Heacham now have someone putting what would be considered as decent money into them and some players in The Thurlow Nunn asking for good money at that level

[S_81 798]

On 24/03/2023 at 19:14, vlad666 said:

 

I thought the whole point of cashing in on saleable first teamers was to replace them with future gems. Seems like we’ve got a fire sale going on and will sell both the current and prospective talent. Worst of both worlds.  

[RobJames 881]

2 hours ago, S_81 said:

I thought the whole point of cashing in on saleable first teamers was to replace them with future gems. Seems like we’ve got a fire sale going on and will sell both the current and prospective talent. Worst of both worlds.  

You slagging off the club, again. He was not sold. It was a free, which suggests he was free to move to Chelsea, with City being paid 'add ons'.

[mrD66M 99]

On 24/03/2023 at 19:48, Wacky Waving Inflatable Arm Flailing Tube Man said:

Shame, as he's clearly highly rated in the game if a club like Chelsea are in for him. We'll get some compensation though, unless we're happy to gamble on agreeing a free transfer with significant add-ons, as Fabrizio suggests.

I'm sure we'll get the next BillyG on loan.. but we could do with a player like Broja. Chelsea's triger happy  + scattergun player recruitment style always leads to loans.

Would you mind a Drinkwater at City?

[Yellowhammer 86]

Another future star gone , like Carlton Morris real shame , but obviously great move for him