Big clubs possible move could ‘end football as we know it'

[Parma Ham's gone mouldy 2,220]

14 hours ago, nutty nigel said:

I would imagine that for these big clubs at least 100x more fans pay to watch on tv than ever pay to get in the stadiums.(maybe thousands times more). Those that pay a premium rate for going to games are really just tv extras and should probably be paid accordingly.

Ouch. 

Parma 👍🏽

[duke63 542]

There is one big plus that could happen if the big six do go. we will no longer see foreign owners wanting to buy into English clubs with the intent of making them a Champions League side.

In fact many of those already in that position - Wolves, West Brom, Everton, Leicester, Burnley...1p5wich 😂, might suddenly find their owners lose interest and want shot of them altogther.

[TeemuVanBasten 3,327]

3 minutes ago, Badger said:

That is what they want to do - UEFA etc, have threatened that they will not let them.

Thought they intend this to replace the Champions League? 

[pete 319]

Righteous indignation from Sky this morning everyone against the plan evidently.  Must be some missing out on the gravy train.  Sky fear missing out to PPV need ESL to offer a solution for Sky to get their bung.  Infantino not getting his cut yet so FIFA against, the Blatter fingerprints not completely dead at the governing body.  A few quid to those PL clubs not invited will see the rest come on board.  It's all about money.

This might kill of UEFA not such a bad thing and get rid of the Russian puppet in charge. 

[duke63 542]

Just now, TeemuVanBasten said:

Thought they intend this to replace the Champions League? 

UEFA oversee all Europan football, including domestic competitions i think.

[sonyc 5,519]

11 minutes ago, duke63 said:

Unsurprisingly, going on to the fans forums of the supposed big six, they all condemn it and suggest they will go back to following local football clubs if it happens.

Thankfully...we have ours!

 

[Parma Ham's gone mouldy 2,220]

14 hours ago, keelansgrandad said:

Funny how the Premier League, who started all this, are now panicking because their earner is drifting off into five or six clubs.

Indeed. The original Faustian bargain. Some costs are only apparent a long way down the line. 

Biter getting bit.

Parma.

Edited April 19, 2021 by Parma Ham's gone mouldy

[Capt. Pants 4,234]

Could be good for Ipswich if there is an overall shuffle up the leagues with the breakaway clubs being replaced. They might end up in the Chump.

The game needs restructuring and there is an opportunity, but the bodies FIFA, UEFA etc have to support it. I suspect it will happen in the near future but not next season. The ESL have effectively created a negotiation position.

On a plus point I would love to see Liverpool thrown out of the EPL.

[TeemuVanBasten 3,327]

2 minutes ago, duke63 said:

UEFA oversee all Europan football, including domestic competitions i think.

The proposal of these 12 clubs is that they would quit the Champions League, and enter their own European Super League,

Meaning that when Leicester win the league, they wouldn't play the likes of Real Madrid in the competition.

That's the whole point, that they want their own closed-shop European competition.

[TeemuVanBasten 3,327]

I can't see Klopp supporting this at all, he'd walk. 

[canarydan23 4,060]

I've not read the whole thread so don't know whether this is a popular opinion or not, but I'm quite excited by the prospect of it.

For sure, there will be short term pain with the inevitable and gargantuan drop off in TV revenue and marketing income, but over a few seasons that will be reflected in player contracts. You could invite Celtic and Rangers down and call it a British Premier League, potentially allowing another spot for a Scottish side and factor in some sort of relegation and promotion playoff between the lowest place Scottish team and the winner of the Scottish top tier.

The biggest barriers to radical policies that football needs are the big clubs. Without them, current fantasies like salary caps suddenly become a reality. In fact, with the income cliff-edge this would cause, a salary cap would become essential.

For me competitiveness is more entertaining than quality and we could end up with a much more competitive sporting environment with players, whilst still earning fortunes, having more more sensible incomes that make them more relatable to fans.

As long as the authorities stand firm to their initial threat that participation in the Super League means you're out of domestic competitions, then fan-bloody-tastic. In a few seasons time the sport could be brilliant again.

And if the Super League need a governing body to look after their referees, then please please please please please please please please please take the ****ing PGMOL with them.

[cambridgeshire canary 6,718]

4 minutes ago, TeemuVanBasten said:

I can't see Klopp supporting this at all, he'd walk. 

And Liverpools owners would just be all 'Oh well he's been **** this season anyway we can do without him'

Edited April 19, 2021 by cambridgeshire canary

[TeemuVanBasten 3,327]

1 minute ago, cambridgeshire canary said:

And Liverpools owners would just be all 'Oh well he's been **** this season anyway we can do without him'

Owners might, but it would further anger their fanbase, 

[Hank shoots Skyler 2,094]

34 minutes ago, TeemuVanBasten said:

UEFA should ban all 12 clubs from European competition for 5 years, and the FA should tell the big six that if they play in this competition they will be suspended from the English league system. 

No messing around, there are other clubs who can win the trophies, football would go on. 

Leicester, West Ham, Everton, and dare I say it Leeds and Villa would all be title contenders. 

Good luck signing the likes of Sancho, Haaland, and Emi if you don't play league football. 

We should meet fire with fire, if clubs are prepared to destroy European football then European football should be prepared to destroy them. 

Absolutely this, nothing to lose now, they think they’re calling a bluff by going through with it, they need to be shown it’s not a bluff ASAP.

[Haus 259]

Im hoping some of the players of the big 6 speak up against this. 

[Ekoku: The Ambassador Of The People 122]

I didn’t realise Citeh were that afraid to play us they would rather being kicked out of the league

[interwebme 52]

56 minutes ago, TeemuVanBasten said:

UEFA should ban all 12 clubs from European competition for 5 years, and the FA should tell the big six that if they play in this competition they will be suspended from the English league system. 

No messing around, there are other clubs who can win the trophies, football would go on. 

Leicester, West Ham, Everton, and dare I say it Leeds and Villa would all be title contenders. 

Good luck signing the likes of Sancho, Haaland, and Emi if you don't play league football. 

We should meet fire with fire, if clubs are prepared to destroy European football then European football should be prepared to destroy them. 

Yup, **** 'em. 

[GenerationA47 752]

15 minutes ago, Hank shoots Skyler said:

Absolutely this, nothing to lose now, they think they’re calling a bluff by going through with it, they need to be shown it’s not a bluff ASAP.

Fascinating to see if the associations & leagues hold their nerve and do exclude the superclubs from all existing competitions & their players from international footie. Especially after there’s some kind of (I’d  assume) planned climbdown by the ESL over the relegation point. 

Everything rides on it. 

Tho I never imagined they would prohibit player transfers to the new ESL. I suppose that might be unlawful if it restricts freedom of employment, & unworkable as mercenary players could just run down contract or resign.

[WD40 720]

I’d love to see everyone’s bluff get called, and the pressure put on the PLAYERS to decide whether they’re for the ESL (more money, no international football) or against it (status quo).

I seriously think you’d see Ronaldo tear up his Juventus contract to play Euros. He cares much more about that at this stage.

Fans can pressure players more than they can clubs. Really interested to see how it develops. 

[Haus 259]

5 minutes ago, GenerationA47 said:

Fascinating to see if the associations & leagues hold their nerve and do exclude the superclubs from all existing competitions & their players from international footie. Especially after there’s some kind of (I’d  assume) planned climbdown by the ESL over the relegation point. 

Everything rides on it. 

Tho I never imagined they would prohibit player transfers to the new ESL. I suppose that might be unlawful if it restricts freedom of employment, & unworkable as mercenary players could just run down contract or resign.

You could however ban teams from doing business with non Uefa sanctioned teams.   No transfers or loans and if someone plays in the ESL then they have to wait a year to become eligible to play in any Uefa sanctioned team after they leave. 

[Badger 2,405]

38 minutes ago, TeemuVanBasten said:

Thought they intend this to replace the Champions League? 

They do, but not yet. It will take time to set up - they will want to stay in the Champions league until then.

[Aggy 755]

It will be interesting if/when the national leagues dig their heels in. The “big” clubs seem to think they can set up this super league and still play in domestic competition - if that isn’t the case then what do they do?

It’s got to be posturing imo ahead of the champions league re-jig. 

Without proper promotion and relegation, without Bayern in particular but also PSG, and without any chance for the likes of Ajax, Porto, Monaco (who in the not so distant past have had successful European cup runs) to ruffle some feathers it’s a crazy idea. Milan and Inter have barely been in the champions league for the last decade, half the English “big 6” are very average at the moment and some of Europe’s biggest clubs aren’t there.

If they aren’t allowed into the domestic competitions, then effectively becomes a franchise competition. But franchise comps in other sports have drafts - you get to see different players at different clubs each year. That isn’t going to work here. Banning transfers completely might not work - players allowed to go if they want - but players will only join those clubs for humongous long term contracts, because they risk their careers outside of the “super league” being cut very short. 

If the champions league wasn’t being reshuffled soon, I don’t think there’s any chance they announce this at this time, without backing from some of Europe’s biggest clubs, or without even a nod from the FAs and UEFA. 

[cambridgeshire canary 6,718]

Remember when certain people on here were screaming Delia out and Stonking rich soulless careless foreign owners in?

 

Wonder why they are being so quiet all of a sudden..

[Badger 2,405]

3 minutes ago, Aggy said:

It will be interesting if/when the national leagues dig their heels in. The “big” clubs seem to think they can set up this super league and still play in domestic competition - if that isn’t the case then what do they do?

I think that ultimately this will be decided by legal opinions. If the clubs were immediately banned from next year's Champions league + their domestic competitions, it would have a huge effect.

However, would it be legal? Are the rights to ban teams from competitions legally enforceable in a massive legal case? If Norwich or West Brom were banned there's nothing we can do about it but with a collective ownership worth hundreds of billions the big 15 might be able to mount an effective legal challenge. (The law and rules don't really apply in the same way to the super rich).

Given the scale of losses that the "rebel clubs" would face, losing the case could be an existential threat to UEFA EPL etc?

[Badger 2,405]

3 minutes ago, cambridgeshire canary said:

Remember when certain people on here were screaming Delia out and Stonking rich soulless careless foreign owners in?

 

Wonder why they are being so quiet all of a sudden..

I think that we will hear plenty from them when we start losing games regularly. 😩

[GenerationA47 752]

10 minutes ago, Haus said:

You could however ban teams from doing business with non Uefa sanctioned teams.   No transfers or loans and if someone plays in the ESL then they have to wait a year to become eligible to play in any Uefa sanctioned team after they leave. 

Yes indeed, the gardening leave clause parallel absolutely comes into its own. Would be intriguing as to whether dollar-hungry defectors would take the hit on a lost year of playing competitively. & would the superclubs take that gamble.

[Aggy 755]

6 minutes ago, GenerationA47 said:

Yes indeed, the gardening leave clause parallel absolutely comes into its own. Would be intriguing as to whether dollar-hungry defectors would take the hit on a lost year of playing competitively. & would the superclubs take that gamble.

As above, the risk there to the players means they are going to want really massive bumper contracts from the super league clubs. Any gain the clubs make from tv revenue could be wiped out paying even higher salaries for longer contracts. 

And in some ways it also limits their ability to refresh a squad - we see already how difficult it is to shift these players on crazy salaries for 5 years contracts, if you’ve got to offer even bigger salaries to attract the players (to mitigate the risk above) then how do you get rid of them or bring someone else in when your budget is gone?

It’s clearly a rushed through proposal which hasn’t had enough thought and hasn’t had enough consultation. Which is why I’m sure it has to be posturing as much as anything to try and influence the new champions league format proposals.

Edited April 19, 2021 by Aggy

[Thumbbass 319]

I have absolutely no idea on the structure of player contracts, but I'd imagine this change could potentially make them null and void. If your pay is based on performance in the current league and cup structure then a new contract would be required which could be rejected? They would then risk losing their best players for nothing, unless it was considered at the time of the initial contract being signed.

It all smells like a bull**** fragranced terrible joke that will never happen. Far too complicated, too much risk.

[GenerationA47 752]

1 minute ago, Aggy said:

As above, the risk there to the players means they are going to want really massive bumper contracts from the super league clubs. Any gain the clubs make from tv revenue could be wiped out paying even higher salaries for longer contracts. 

And in some ways it also limits their ability to refresh a squad - we see already how difficult it is to shift these players on crazy salaries for 5 years contracts, if you’ve got to offer even bigger salaries to attract the players (to mitigate the risk above) then how do you get rid of them or bring someone else in when your budget is gone?

It’s clearly a rushed through proposal which hasn’t had enough thought and hasn’t had enough consultation. Which is why I’m sure it has to be posturing as much as anything to try and influence the new champions league format proposals.

It may well be the nuclear level negotiating move ref. the CL.

Based on the PL experience, you’d expect the ESL clubs now to offer a cut to Uefa & the associations, plus ESL integration into the pyramid. Buy off the opposition as they teeter on the brink. Feels most likely now rather than slinking back to CL with power still lying with Uefa. That’s just a hunch

[PurpleCanary 5,562]

12 hours ago, PurpleCanary said:

It is just another version of the cake-and-eat-it plan that gets aired every so often, either as a genuine proposal or as a bargaining tool, or an option-play gambit as a bit of both.

A true European super league would involved these clubs willingly leaving their domestic leagues. Instead they plan to carry on playing domestically while calling what they think is Uefa's bluff about a ban.

Just to add, this is more serious than previous plans, in the sense that it seems less like a bargaining tool and more like a genuine intention. And the opposition to it, ie the threat of kicking these clubs out of their domestic leagues, looks more like a genuine threat than in the past.

Edited April 19, 2021 by PurpleCanary