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pete

Desperately seeking striker

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Goals win matches and one in the last 8 will see another relegation next season with that record, successive relegations from PL is not unheard.  Pukki who will not be going elsewhere because of a compete loss of form might refind that earlier form that is not a guarantee.  Dermic has proved beyond doubt he is no kind of striker  when and if he finds fitness.  We will rely on Mr 10 minutes Adam Idah who doesn't seem to impress Farke beyond late cameos.  Therefore looking for at least one additional striking option we need to find a cheap and experienced option one who comes to mind is Jordan Rhodes who although aging did provide evidence in 1918/9 that he could still do it.  And after his contract expires at Sheff Wed his options will be limited and fit the cheap requirement.

Can we go down the loan option well yes but our recent history Rhodes apart has not been good.  Young PL top 6 strikers learning their trade is the usual way to go the likes of Nketiah, Parrott and Brewster being approached is any better than Idah we may never know.  Can we go international perhaps but it will be a gamble with no guarantee of goals.

Unless Pukki shakes off the doldrums or Adam proves an unlikely goal machine at 18 next season may well be a disaster, no goals with our leaky defence playing zonal defence, top 26 just a dream, Div1 the nightmare.  Trust in Farke and Webber whose stock this season has taken a massive reversal, don't think they have earned that trust after this season.      

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We Need another and if we sell our youngster we should push the boat out for a Good striker 

i would Move Pukki on 

But i think Idah is in for a great season if played 

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We have a good striker in Pukki. He needs confidence and you get that from scoring goals. Should be playing now and if the manager is allowed a free hit and excuses I sure as hell believe a guy who scored 30 goals in as season many are touting as one of our greatest also should have some slack cut him.

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Pukki and Adam will score goals. All day long. The key thing this coming season will be finding two or three players (midfield) who can regularly and consistently supply the quality passes and feeds. It's about players with the right technical skill of course but as much about intelligence. The latter on a football pitch is rarer but what makes the difference, that extra second of thought and awareness.

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I really hope Norwich might be able to convince the FA to allow Soto to get a work permit. Blame it on COVID and how he’d have qualified if it wasn’t for the cancellation of international game. 

Farke has been using Idah out wide, so wonder if that is where he sees him fit best. Could be a real threat with his pace from those positions and it is an easier introduction than being a lone striker. 

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Would be a huge gamble going with the three strikers we have now , Drmic looks as bad as anything we have had before ,Idah is young and unproven and Pukki is ageing and looks shot to pieces . Out of the three Idah is the only one i would keep ,afraid these will be our strikeforce next season though.

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I feel we should play 3 up front. Two strikers and a winger. I still think Teemu might be leaving us and if he does we need to find a new striker to partner Adam.

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The issue for Pukki this season is simply that the bulk of our possession has been in our own half which has meant that neither Cantwell nor Buendia have been able to deliver the volume of line breaking passes they did last season because they are back helping out defensively.

For Pukki to be effective we need a platform of possession in the opponents half in order for Cantwell and Buendia to work their magic. We've rarely had that.

Pukki is good at running into spaces on angled runs to through balls and most of this is from short passes in and around the box. 

Secondly we have lacked an effective number 10 who would be another supply line to our striker.

Thirdly, opposition coaches are wise to how we play and in the Premiership they are much more astute tactically and the defensive manpower is of a far higher quality.

Most negate Pukki by isolating him mainly by pressing us high. 

They know Pukki is our main goal threat and they prepare for him specifically. Once teams had worked us out we had no real plan B.

We had to play through the press which did work sometimes but it always takes a lot of passes to move the ball from one end of the pitch to the other and each pass risks a turnover in possession.

Without the ball most sides we played had the quality to play around our press and as a result we rarely won ball in the opponents half. 

Eventually teams worked out that they could just throw numbers forward against us as West Ham did. 

It looks like Farke is well aware of all of these issues, firstly because he's been toying with 442 which that means opponents have less manpower to commit to the press and his other solution is different players- Sorensen for example has a good record for long passing and Placheta has a lot of pace which will give us more options against the high press because of the threat of the ball over the top. The big question is who our number 10 will be.

We have the scope to be a much more effective attacking force this season than we were when we went up last year because a season of Premiership football has forced us to address these points. What doesn't kill you makes you stronger.

The solution isn't to replace Pukki the solution is to beat the press and get Pukki into the game by not to allowing the opposition to keep him at arms length.

I expect us to score more goals this year than we did in our last Championship season. Other teams are going to hate playing us. 

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On 19/07/2020 at 13:26, Bethnal Yellow and Green said:

I really hope Norwich might be able to convince the FA to allow Soto to get a work permit. Blame it on COVID and how he’d have qualified if it wasn’t for the cancellation of international game. 

Farke has been using Idah out wide, so wonder if that is where he sees him fit best. Could be a real threat with his pace from those positions and it is an easier introduction than being a lone striker. 

Idah played wide a lot as a club youth at Corinthians and also for RoI youth teams( Troy Parrott central) , he's well used to it. First time i saw him he was tearing it up down the right , have seen him play on the left too in the past . I'm pretty sure when he played for  Cork Schoolboys Schoolboys league, he predominantly  played through the middle. Just depends on who else is on the pitch and their attributes ....hes versatile from what I've seen. Incredible change in physique  from  the gangly skinny youth of 6 years ago.

 

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Posted (edited)

I think all three of our strikers can score goals in the second tier with the right service. A new one would be nice but not essential IMO. 
 

Getting the five blokes behind whichever striker plays right is the key.

Edited by Gordon Bennett

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On 19/07/2020 at 14:20, City 101 said:

Drmic looks as bad as anything we have had before

Clearly you are too young to remember the legend that was Dean Coney. His **** actually scored more goals than his feet.

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What player we'd prefer.....Desperately seeking striker.....Maradona.....

What we're likely to get......Desperately seeking Susan.....Madonna......

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On 19/07/2020 at 13:25, sonyc said:

Pukki and Adam will score goals. All day long. The key thing this coming season will be finding two or three players (midfield) who can regularly and consistently supply the quality passes and feeds. It's about players with the right technical skill of course but as much about intelligence. The latter on a football pitch is rarer but what makes the difference, that extra second of thought and awareness.

This. 

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On 19/07/2020 at 14:49, Harry53 said:

I feel we should play 3 up front. Two strikers and a winger. I still think Teemu might be leaving us and if he does we need to find a new striker to partner Adam.

Why do you feel that? 

If you watched a single game you'd have seen its supply to the striker that's the problem.

Until you fix that wtf good is a second striker? 

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Getting the defence right is key here. The more you can free up the attacking midfielders, the more dangerous our attack looks. We know Pukki is a good finisher when fully fit. The problem we've had is - as someone rightly said earlier - the supply line got cut.

Supply line got cut as everyone had to be more defensive to compensate for the fact we had a ton of defenders missing, or they were playing their way back into fitness and by definition were not remotely at their best. I fancy Idah to show up quite well next season, he's not played too much this season as I very strongly suspect Farke wanted just to ease him in and not give him too much time in a struggling team. As Garry Nelson wrote in his book Left Foot In The Grave, much of bringing youngsters along is to give them positive experience.

I'll be amazed if Idah's not at least a rotation option next season, assuming he shows up well in pre-season. The really interesting thing is - does he have the same idea for Martin, or is he going to get loaned out? 

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Is anybody else worried we get an announcement in a month or so saying Idah has gone on loan to a Portsmouth or Charlton for the season? 

Anyway.. I think the problem this season was the way teams set up against us which was always going to be different to last season. 
 

When you’re top of the champs, especially at Carrow Road, a managers default position is to set their team up to try and “get something” which means sitting deeper, retaining shape and standing off us more. This plays into our hands. It allows midfielders like Trybull or Leitner to pick the ball up off the defenders or GK and bring forward past the half way line, facing the opposition goal and pick their passes under little pressure.

The movement and interplay amongst Pukki, Buendia and Cantwell etc was excellent and clearly worked on in training. This meant that despite the opposition sitting deep we were able to carve out a lot of chances and Pukki was on fire.

Imo the only team to set up like that against us this season was Newcastle at home. Brucey played right into our hands with his typical style of football. Consequently, imo, that was the only game we dominated this season in a way we did last.

A great first 10 games is essential for us next season if we’re to play like last and Pukki is to score a bucket again. 

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On 19/07/2020 at 12:53, pete said:

Goals win matches and one in the last 8 will see another relegation next season with that record, successive relegations from PL is not unheard.  Pukki who will not be going elsewhere because of a compete loss of form might refind that earlier form that is not a guarantee.  Dermic has proved beyond doubt he is no kind of striker  when and if he finds fitness.  We will rely on Mr 10 minutes Adam Idah who doesn't seem to impress Farke beyond late cameos.  Therefore looking for at least one additional striking option we need to find a cheap and experienced option one who comes to mind is Jordan Rhodes who although aging did provide evidence in 1918/9 that he could still do it.  And after his contract expires at Sheff Wed his options will be limited and fit the cheap requirement.

Can we go down the loan option well yes but our recent history Rhodes apart has not been good.  Young PL top 6 strikers learning their trade is the usual way to go the likes of Nketiah, Parrott and Brewster being approached is any better than Idah we may never know.  Can we go international perhaps but it will be a gamble with no guarantee of goals.

Unless Pukki shakes off the doldrums or Adam proves an unlikely goal machine at 18 next season may well be a disaster, no goals with our leaky defence playing zonal defence, top 26 just a dream, Div1 the nightmare.  Trust in Farke and Webber whose stock this season has taken a massive reversal, don't think they have earned that trust after this season.      

Parrott is a good shout, him and Idah have played together for years for RoI squads. He can also play at no 10. Mourinho  may not play him much at spurs so he may( Parrott) fancy coming to us. It may even improve his international chances as RoI have many  championship players in their  squad. There is hope Peteo. Honest.

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They could do worse than have a look at Peterborough’s Ivan Toney. Been banging ‘em in for fun in League One and I’m sure he’d make a big impact at Championship level. 

Would cost the thick end of £10m though so with our track record of paying pennies it would probably rule us out.

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Some of the comments on Pukki  are very very unfair. He has had a brilliant 1.5 seasons and a poor 0.5. In the latter injuries and being flogged to death as the only real striker caught up with him and yes a loss of confidence. This also coincided with our ability to  make chances drying up. Yes we need other striking options not least a big lad to allow us to go direct if need be but for me Pukki is still a fine player and give him chances at Championship level and he will score

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1 minute ago, Yorkshire Canary said:

Some of the comments on Pukki  are very very unfair. He has had a brilliant 1.5 seasons and a poor 0.5. In the latter injuries and being flogged to death as the only real striker caught up with him and yes a loss of confidence. This also coincided with our ability to  make chances drying up. Yes we need other striking options not least a big lad to allow us to go direct if need be but for me Pukki is still a fine player and give him chances at Championship level and he will score

I agree with you, there is also the unmentioned aspect of Pukki's career to consider. 

Last season was a blip in his career, he was scoring goals at a level that he hasn't ever done before, the stars aligned. 

Hopefully he'll have a good season in the Championship but realistically he over performed last year.

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6 minutes ago, Number9 said:

I agree with you, there is also the unmentioned aspect of Pukki's career to consider. 

Last season was a blip in his career, he was scoring goals at a level that he hasn't ever done before, the stars aligned. 

Hopefully he'll have a good season in the Championship but realistically he over performed last year.

He didn’t over perform, he played to his potential.

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1 hour ago, Van wink said:

He didn’t over perform, he played to his potential.

Ok fair enough, the point I was trying to get across was that he hasn't scored that heavily previously so we shouldn't necessarily expect that in future times.

Hopefully he will, but it's not guaranteed. 

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9 minutes ago, Number9 said:

Ok fair enough, the point I was trying to get across was that he hasn't scored that heavily previously so we shouldn't necessarily expect that in future times.

Hopefully he will, but it's not guaranteed. 

He over performed in 18/19 - that is pretty clear. Nothing to say he can’t over perform again of course, but that season was a slight anomaly for him.

Norwich definitely need another source of goals, whether that is a back up striker to keep Pukki on his toes, or someone from midfield who is a constant threat. More so than a striker, I think a goal scoring midfielder is the key to Norwich’s recruitment.  

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1 minute ago, Bethnal Yellow and Green said:

He over performed in 18/19 - that is pretty clear. Nothing to say he can’t over perform again of course, but that season was a slight anomaly for him.

Norwich definitely need another source of goals, whether that is a back up striker to keep Pukki on his toes, or someone from midfield who is a constant threat. More so than a striker, I think a goal scoring midfielder is the key to Norwich’s recruitment.  

I agree with the sentiment although others may argue about the semantics.

The problem appears to be that our recruitment team have had countless attempts at buying midfielders and it's resulted in a huge collection of unsuitable midfielders, many of whom can't possibly be in the squad on any given day.

This having been done at the expense of the strike force and defence which have both been lacking. 

I appreciate that some will say 'we need midfielders to chip in with ten goals each, or we need midfielders to protect the defence and break up attacks etc', so why have all these unsuitable midfielders been brought into the club, at some cost, over the past couple of years?

Some of them are just not good enough, some have just got the wrong side of Farke. 

Do you actually trust the incumbents to get it right now?

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One thing which Idah has over Pukki is height . 

 He would be more useful at set pieces both in offence and defence and we certainly need to be better at set pieces.

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27 minutes ago, Number9 said:

I agree with the sentiment although others may argue about the semantics.

The problem appears to be that our recruitment team have had countless attempts at buying midfielders and it's resulted in a huge collection of unsuitable midfielders, many of whom can't possibly be in the squad on any given day.

This having been done at the expense of the strike force and defence which have both been lacking. 

I appreciate that some will say 'we need midfielders to chip in with ten goals each, or we need midfielders to protect the defence and break up attacks etc', so why have all these unsuitable midfielders been brought into the club, at some cost, over the past couple of years?

Some of them are just not good enough, some have just got the wrong side of Farke. 

Do you actually trust the incumbents to get it right now?

Over three seasons, for the money spent, Norwich’s recruitment is still very good. That includes the opportunity cost of bringing in certain players over others  

Some players have taken longer than others to settle in and when there have been failures they have been understandable. 

Apart from Amadou and maybe Rupp, I’m not sure who the ‘unsuitable midfielders’ you mention are. While I think Norwich will and need to have a big refresh in midfield, that isn’t due to any players being a particular failure but just they have aged or the club is now looking to achieve something different to when they were signed. 

I have a lot of faith in Norwich’s recruitment to be honest. I’d just like to see someone brought in who can score 10+ goals from midfield (I include the three behind the striker in my midfield). In the Championship winning season about 30% of Norwich’s goals came from Pukki - that isn’t a particularly health balance. 

I don’t think Placheta is this goal scoring player, so that is what I’m still waiting for. 

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1 hour ago, Bethnal Yellow and Green said:

Over three seasons, for the money spent, Norwich’s recruitment is still very good. That includes the opportunity cost of bringing in certain players over others  

Some players have taken longer than others to settle in and when there have been failures they have been understandable. 

Apart from Amadou and maybe Rupp, I’m not sure who the ‘unsuitable midfielders’ you mention are. While I think Norwich will and need to have a big refresh in midfield, that isn’t due to any players being a particular failure but just they have aged or the club is now looking to achieve something different to when they were signed. 

I have a lot of faith in Norwich’s recruitment to be honest. I’d just like to see someone brought in who can score 10+ goals from midfield (I include the three behind the striker in my midfield). In the Championship winning season about 30% of Norwich’s goals came from Pukki - that isn’t a particularly health balance. 

I don’t think Placheta is this goal scoring player, so that is what I’m still waiting for. 

In the context of my comment. 

I've been told by many posters that our scoring problems are because midfielders are not getting ten goals per season each, and our conceding problems are because midfielders are not protecting the defence. 

This would make pretty much all of our midfielders unsuitable.

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