How Bad Was Webber

[Midlands Yellow 4,082]

Luton only need 9 more points to better our totals in the last two attempts at this level. Isn’t it great he’s gone? Make that 6! How pathetic were we in the PL? 

Edited December 26, 2023 by Midlands Yellow

[Fen Canary 868]

7 minutes ago, Midlands Yellow said:

Luton only need 9 more points to better our totals in the last two attempts at this level. Isn’t it great he’s gone? 

I’d argue that Luton team on paper is worse than either of the last two squads we had in the top flight, so maybe your ire should be aimed at Farke as much as Webber for the two appalling seasons? 

[Midlands Yellow 4,082]

Just now, Fen Canary said:

I’d argue that Luton team on paper is worse than either of the last two squads we had in the top flight, so maybe your ire should be aimed at Farke as much as Webber for the two appalling seasons? 

Daniel at Leeds and Webber climbing more hills. Let’s see who’s most in demand  in the coming years. 

[Capt. Pants 4,278]

Rather than Luton, I'm focusing on Knapper and the improvement we've shown since he arrived. I'm inclined to assume Webber wasn't that engaged or focused for the last few weeks of his job.

Further back than Wagner then you have to consider just how bad were Farke and Smith. Bringing it back to Luton and I would say Rob Edwards is way ahead of both of them.

[Fen Canary 868]

Just now, Midlands Yellow said:

Daniel at Leeds and Webber climbing more hills. Let’s see who’s most in demand  in the coming years. 

With the squad he has at Leeds he should be level with Leicester at the top of the division. I’m not going to defend Webbers recruitment as I think he tried to run before he could walk looking too far ahead buying youngsters but Farke shouldn’t escape all the blame for those train crashes either 

[Midlands Yellow 4,082]

2 minutes ago, Fen Canary said:

With the squad he has at Leeds he should be level with Leicester at the top of the division. I’m not going to defend Webbers recruitment as I think he tried to run before he could walk looking too far ahead buying youngsters but Farke shouldn’t escape all the blame for those train crashes either 

He clearly had credit in the bank with two Championship titles. If Sad Stu deemed Farke a failure why didn’t he fall on his own sword and leave too with some honour? 

[essex canary 506]

4 minutes ago, Fen Canary said:

With the squad he has at Leeds he should be level with Leicester at the top of the division. I’m not going to defend Webbers recruitment as I think he tried to run before he could walk looking too far ahead buying youngsters but Farke shouldn’t escape all the blame for those train crashes either 

Who appointed Farke (working on the not necessarily true assumption he isn't very good)?

[Ian 1,136]

I don't think anyone can dispute Webber got it absolutely, and possibly miraculously, spot on during his first couple of seasons with us.

At the same time, I think him taking personal credit for our improvement in facilities (which IMO any vaguely competent business leader would have put in place), despite our shockingly poor recruitment and delivery at Prem level is a bit hard to digest.

I am glad he's gone because we now have someone wholly committed to the role again. Is it really a coincidence that things have improved so much since Knapper has entered the building?

[Midlands Yellow 4,082]

8 minutes ago, Ian said:

I don't think anyone can dispute Webber got it absolutely, and possibly miraculously, spot on during his first couple of seasons with us.

At the same time, I think him taking personal credit for our improvement in facilities (which IMO any vaguely competent business leader would have put in place), despite our shockingly poor recruitment and delivery at Prem level is a bit hard to digest.

I am glad he's gone because we now have someone wholly committed to the role again. Is it really a coincidence that things have improved so much since Knapper has entered the building?

A bigger ego than any mountain he’ll ever climb, Stu will be long forgotten soon enough. 

[Well b back 3,280]

Are we really saying our premiership squads were worse than Luton’s ? Maybe Luton are over achieving, but in that case didn’t we way under achieve ?

Our 2019 squad included 4 players sold for + £20 million, a top international goalkeeper at the time in Krull and a centre forward in Pukki far better than anything Luton have. We had a class act in Klosse ( unfortunately got injured ) and whatever you might think of Cantwell he was pretty good that year.

In defence of them I would argue Luton try to win games 1:0, we were torn apart trying to win games 5:4. Are there really many Luton players you would have added to our squad and got excited about signing.

[Duncan Edwards 2,268]

1 minute ago, Well b back said:

Are we really saying our premiership squads were worse than Luton’s ? Maybe Luton are over achieving, but in that case didn’t we way under achieve ?

Our 2019 squad included 4 players sold for + £20 million, a top international goalkeeper at the time in Krull and a centre forward in Pukki far better than anything Luton have. We had a class act in Klosse ( unfortunately got injured ) and whatever you might think of Cantwell he was pretty good that year.

In defence of them I would argue Luton try to win games 1:0, we were torn apart trying to win games 5:4. Are there really many Luton players you would have added to our squad and got excited about signing.

I’d have been delighted if we’d signed Ross Barkley. 

[Well b back 3,280]

1 minute ago, Duncan Edwards said:

I’d have been delighted if we’d signed Ross Barkley. 

Fair comment

[JonnyJonnyRowe 473]

1 hour ago, Well b back said:

Are we really saying our premiership squads were worse than Luton’s ? Maybe Luton are over achieving, but in that case didn’t we way under achieve ?

Our 2019 squad included 4 players sold for + £20 million, a top international goalkeeper at the time in Krull and a centre forward in Pukki far better than anything Luton have. We had a class act in Klosse ( unfortunately got injured ) and whatever you might think of Cantwell he was pretty good that year.

In defence of them I would argue Luton try to win games 1:0, we were torn apart trying to win games 5:4. Are there really many Luton players you would have added to our squad and got excited about signing.

What they have done is get promoted with a squad full of players with no Premier League experience and wisely brought in a few Premier League veterans who know the league and probably help tell their other players that they have nothing to fear, and to settle nerves.

Andros Townsend, Ross Barkley, Tim Krul. 

Wasn't Webber's (or Farke's?) style at all to throw big wages at players with no resale value, but what Luton have bought themselves there is a few leaders/stewards to help their players transition, all good eggs as well (not prima Donna's like Lingaard).

Ironically we now have Barnes and Duffy in an ageing squad, probably could have done with a couple of experienced pros coming in to aid Farke's young teams. Worthington did this when he signed Prem stalwart Simon Charlton and it was probably the intention with the Helveg signing (he'd won the Champions League two years prior!), however released two dressing room leaders in Malky and Iwan in the process which was a mistake.

Edited December 24, 2023 by JonnyJonnyRowe

[WD40 720]

4 hours ago, Midlands Yellow said:

Luton only need 9 more points to better our totals in the last two attempts at this level. Isn’t it great he’s gone? 

Had the same thought. It’s embarrassing for Norwich how little we put up any sort of competitive fight, and the excuse at the time was always money (Delia did the same in the press). Luton making a mockery of that and winning praise along the way. Of course they will go down but there’s a right way to get relegated.

Webber didn’t have a clue about how to put together a PL squad. 

[Indy 3,319]

Funny but Luton got in an experienced and very good DCM in Barkley! They’re back line is more cohesive and solid.

Luton’s squad is on par if not better than ours was the first season up with Farke!

[Christoph Stiepermann 1,153]

Most of you wouldn't tolerate the style of football Luton play even if it meant potentially surviving. We couldn't have played that way anyway though even if we wanted to with the type of players we had. The problem was a combination of not enough money, poor recruitment from Webber and a style of play from Farke that is never going to work for a promoted club with no money. Webber was poor for his last few years here but Luton isn't a fair comparison because they've done everything so differently. Burnley are a better comparison and they're doing about as badly as we did despite having a bit more money to spend. 

[canarybubbles 1,946]

7 minutes ago, Christoph Stiepermann said:

Most of you wouldn't tolerate the style of football Luton play even if it meant potentially surviving. We couldn't have played that way anyway though even if we wanted to with the type of players we had. The problem was a combination of not enough money, poor recruitment from Webber and a style of play from Farke that is never going to work for a promoted club with no money. Webber was poor for his last few years here but Luton isn't a fair comparison because they've done everything so differently. Burnley are a better comparison and they're doing about as badly as we did despite having a bit more money to spend. 

I agree that Burnley are by far the better comparison. I've been surprised how badly they've done. I didn't use to agree with people who said that an expansive style of football could not succeed for a promoted club in the Prem, but Burnley are bringing me around to agreeing with that idea.

Re Luton, I think it's worth pointing out that in most seasons the points total of the bottom three would see them in a very precarious position and needing a pretty special second half of the season to escape. With Forest imploding and Everton being docked points, this season someone could well stay up with less than 30 points. I think this is unprecedented (?) 

[Ken Hairy 3,781]

9 hours ago, Midlands Yellow said:

Luton only need 9 more points to better our totals in the last two attempts at this level. Isn’t it great he’s gone? 

Is it coincidence our form has taken a turn for the better since he's gone?

[Yobocop 1,105]

10 hours ago, Well b back said:

Are we really saying our premiership squads were worse than Luton’s ? Maybe Luton are over achieving, but in that case didn’t we way under achieve ?

Our 2019 squad included 4 players sold for + £20 million, a top international goalkeeper at the time in Krull and a centre forward in Pukki far better than anything Luton have. We had a class act in Klosse ( unfortunately got injured ) and whatever you might think of Cantwell he was pretty good that year.

In defence of them I would argue Luton try to win games 1:0, we were torn apart trying to win games 5:4. Are there really many Luton players you would have added to our squad and got excited about signing.

Ogbene 

Townsend 

barkley 

osho 

mengi 

 

[Nexus_Canary 1,024]

11 hours ago, Midlands Yellow said:

He clearly had credit in the bank with two Championship titles. If Sad Stu deemed Farke a failure why didn’t he fall on his own sword and leave too with some honour? 

Because if he was a viking king he would have been called Cnute.

I still hope Leeds to up, fall to bits they fire Daniel and we can bring him home.

[cornish sam 965]

3 hours ago, Ken Hairy said:

Is it coincidence our form has taken a turn for the better since he's gone?

Yes

[hogesar 9,751]

On the other side we're currently enjoying watching a talented winger in Sainz who Webber had identified and signed for us. We're suddenly excited about Hwang being back, a signing which was ridiculed (and let's be honest he did look poor to begin with). 

As with everything, it's not so black and white as some posters would love to make it.

[Sufyellow 223]

12 hours ago, Fen Canary said:

I’d argue that Luton team on paper is worse than either of the last two squads we had in the top flight, so maybe your ire should be aimed at Farke as much as Webber for the two appalling seasons? 

Luton have signed some strong experienced players, with no resale value. They will go down though . Webber wanted players to sell on . 

[EastMidsCanary 6]

16 minutes ago, hogesar said:

On the other side we're currently enjoying watching a talented winger in Sainz who Webber had identified and signed for us. We're suddenly excited about Hwang being back, a signing which was ridiculed (and let's be honest he did look poor to begin with). 

As with everything, it's not so black and white as some posters would love to make it.

But also we are going to be left with at least 7 players in the squad over the age of 30 next summer (depending on what we do with Gibson; Forshaw and Batth look unlikely to be around). The squad needs an overhaul which will have to be led by Knapper. Yes there have been some promising signings over the last couple of years, but sadly there have been significantly more (in my view) poor decisions in made, managed by S.Webber. 

Edited December 24, 2023 by EastMidsCanary

[Sufyellow 223]

11 hours ago, Duncan Edwards said:

I’d have been delighted if we’d signed Ross Barkley. 

Definitely not a webber signing. But definitely agree. 

[Creedence Clearwater Couto 1,297]

12 hours ago, Midlands Yellow said:

Luton only need 9 more points to better our totals in the last two attempts at this level. Isn’t it great he’s gone? 

I actually thought when Sainz spanked the second in yesterday.. there’s something very positive Webber has left us.

[Petriix 2,853]

13 hours ago, Well b back said:

Are we really saying our premiership squads were worse than Luton’s ? Maybe Luton are over achieving, but in that case didn’t we way under achieve ?

Our 2019 squad included 4 players sold for + £20 million, a top international goalkeeper at the time in Krull and a centre forward in Pukki far better than anything Luton have. We had a class act in Klosse ( unfortunately got injured ) and whatever you might think of Cantwell he was pretty good that year.

Yes, I'd argue that our Premier League squad was only really a top 8 Championship squad which Farke massively over achieved with, hence the humiliating relegation. Buendia was the only genuine Premier League player in there. 

[Indy 3,319]

Let’s be honest the last three years of Webber were abysmal! We’re left where he took over!

 

[hogesar 9,751]

17 minutes ago, Indy said:

Let’s be honest the last three years of Webber were abysmal! We’re left where he took over!

 

Not quite, we've gone from League One training facilities off the pitch to Top Half Prem standard. We've got a thriving youth academy with a clear pathway to the first team that we are benefiting from this season.

We make decisions without pandering to stupid fans with zero football knowledge. I've not heard Idahs 5 year contract brought up recently,  how odd??

[A Load of Squit 5,221]

Watching the game on at the moment and the rest of the season so far it's obvious that this is the worst Premier League season ever, our promoted team would've easily been top half in this years PL.