It's all baffling

[PurpleCanary 6,391]

I am getting very confused. Our directors are all know-nothing fools who never get anything right. That is fact. No need even to explain why and how.But if - only if, you understand - one didn''t know better one would almost think there was some of intelligent scheme being carried out. Balls arrives and says he is going to formulate a long-term plan to cope with the inevitable ups and downs that a club like Norwich City will face. Yeah, right. How we laughed.But we switch to a voguish continental-style management structure of a sporting director and a head coach. Which could, if you were very naive, look rather like a key component of a long-term plan.And to implement said voguish system we somehow manage to poach rising-star Webber from on-their-way-to-the-Premier-League Huddersfield Town, and a well-regarded coach from one of the best clubs in world football, which apparently was miffed at losing him.Then, to cope with an impending sharp loss of income, what would - again if you were very gullible - seem like a well-worked out plan of getting veteran high-earners off the books (and actually making a profit on one or two?!) and replacing them with lower-waged and hungry young players is started. And might almost be going rather well. Meanwhile even younger talent for the future is being picked up from unlikely places, with some then being loaned out to clubs - even abroad, for heaven''s sake - where they will get valuable game time.I suppose I just need reassurance that this crazy notion of mine cannot possibly be right, and that the club is still - as it always has been for the last 20 years - in the hands of complete idiots.

[lappinitup 629]

The  cook has been here over twenty years and still knows NOTHING about running a football club. [8o|]And don''t even get me started about all this nephewism stuff. [:@]

[king canary 8,763]

Fundamentally you''re right- the plan and structure being put in place is eminently sensible. I don''t think they are idiots although they''ve been guilty of some deeply questionable decisions over the years.

However, even with this new model, the questions remain about long term funding and ownership. Can we be competitive with a wage budget of £20m odd? How can we hang on to players who impress if we have to sell to buy? How likely is promotion with such a minuscule margin for error?

[TCCANARY 263]

[quote user="king canary"]Fundamentally you''re right- the plan and structure being put in place is eminently sensible. I don''t think they are idiots although they''ve been guilty of some deeply questionable decisions over the years.

However, even with this new model, the questions remain about long term funding and ownership. Can we be competitive with a wage budget of £20m odd? How can we hang on to players who impress if we have to sell to buy? How likely is promotion with such a minuscule margin for error?[/quote]Football has taught me that everything is likely, nothing is certain.

[Crabbycanary3 994]

The future''s bright, the future''s...................................yellow and green

[Big Vince 427]

[quote user="king canary"]Fundamentally you''re right- the plan and structure being put in place is eminently sensible. I don''t think they are idiots although they''ve been guilty of some deeply questionable decisions over the years.

However, even with this new model, the questions remain about long term funding and ownership. Can we be competitive with a wage budget of £20m odd? How can we hang on to players who impress if we have to sell to buy? How likely is promotion with such a minuscule margin for error?[/quote]

The record of the Suffolk Socialists speaks for itself.

They have failed to establish the club in the EPL and they haven''t won any major trophies. Wigan and Swansea and Leicester have done so in recent times.

They want to make the club smaller than what it is because that is the only version they can afford.

[Rogue Baboon 0]

If this project we are going through is the right thing to do and the best way to guarantee results, how come we are the only club doing it?

How come more clubs aren’t?

[PurpleCanary 6,391]

[quote user="king canary"]Fundamentally you''re right- the plan and structure being put in place is eminently sensible. I don''t think they are idiots although they''ve been guilty of some deeply questionable decisions over the years.

However, even with this new model, the questions remain about long term funding and ownership. Can we be competitive with a wage budget of £20m odd? How can we hang on to players who impress if we have to sell to buy? How likely is promotion with such a minuscule margin for error?[/quote]Two points. I think it is a mistake to assume the self-funding model is set in stone. Events - good or bad - may dictate otherwise. As to competitivenes, I think it is perfectly feasible to stay in the Championship with this greatly reduced budget. Which would almost certainly include having to sell a player ot two every season. And there might be the occasional chance of promotion and ditto of relegation. With midtable being the norm. As it happens very much like the 11 seasons between getting out of Division Three and getting to Division One under Saunders.

[Big Vince 427]

[quote user="PurpleCanary"][quote user="king canary"]Fundamentally you''re right- the plan and structure being put in place is eminently sensible. I don''t think they are idiots although they''ve been guilty of some deeply questionable decisions over the years.

However, even with this new model, the questions remain about long term funding and ownership. Can we be competitive with a wage budget of £20m odd? How can we hang on to players who impress if we have to sell to buy? How likely is promotion with such a minuscule margin for error?[/quote]Two points. I think it is a mistake to assume the self-funding model is set in stone. Events - good or bad - may dictate otherwise. As to competitivenes, I think it is perfectly feasible to stay in the Championship with this greatly reduced budget. Which would almost certainly include having to sell a player ot two every season. And there might be the occasional chance of promotion and ditto of relegation. With midtable being the norm. As it happens very much like the 11 seasons between getting out of Division Three and getting to Division One under Saunders.[/quote]

Except that unlike in the 60s our competitors in this league are getting richer whilst we get poorer in comparison to them (eg. Barnsley.)

[king canary 8,763]

Point 1- you''re probably right but I''m of the believe it may take some pressure from fans to abandon it.

Point 2- that may be the case, I''m too young to remember. However I''m not a fan of the deterministic view that ''this is how it was, so it is how it always is.''

[Fromage Frais 14]

Ok forget about football.

Your a Billionaire and I have a proposition for you.

There is business I have for sale its about 30 million £ and most likely it looses money operationally to stay competitive.

However you can buy members of staff for say 500k or a million £ and then every couple of seasons you can sell them on for 5 6 and every so often 10-20 million if you buy right.

And if you lucky you may get promoted and the business will then turnover 100m and you can sell it for 50-100m profit.

or

You can buy this business spend 50-100 million £ on excellent staff you get promoted or loose loads of money.

Once promoted you can sell the team for about the same you paid out to get there. also if you dont spend another 50 million you may get relegated.

My feeling is that with the wage bill trimmed and the costs down your more likely to sell the team.

You certainly cannot sell it with Maddison etc as he may be worth more then 50% of the whole business and nobody is going to want to pay for him and then sell him for the same ish value (or he gets injured).

[nutty nigel 7,902]

How long does a club have to spend in the PL to be established members?

[Len 74]

PurpleCanary, I think you''re underestimating our capabilities with the revamped Chase-Stringer model that Webber has implemented. The Chase-outers of yesteryear will struggle to explain top 6 finishes and regular spells in the top flight.Developing (cheaply bought) young talent, selling our best players for big profits and upgrading facilities is a recipe for disaster, surely?!

[PurpleCanary 6,391]

[quote user="Len"]PurpleCanary, I think you''re underestimating our capabilities with the revamped Chase-Stringer model that Webber has implemented. The Chase-outers of yesteryear will struggle to explain top 6 finishes and regular spells in the top flight.Developing (cheaply bought) young talent, selling our best players for big profits and upgrading facilities is a recipe for disaster, surely?![/quote]As explained a while back, backed up by detailed evidence on transfers and the like, this notion of yours that Wynn Jones came in and tore up some supposed Chase Model is total b*ll*cks. So the Chase Model cannot now be being brought back. In as much as it existed, it never went away.

[Mello Yello 2,573]

It''s all waffling.......

[daly 553]

Well this season at CR must have been the most exciting football seen for years, Can''t wait for next season

Bit like watching paint dry

[Essjayess 307]

[quote user="lappinitup"]The  cook has been here over twenty years and still knows NOTHING about running a football club. [8o|]And don''t even get me started about all this nephewism stuff. [:@][/quote]

Biggest pile of nonsense ive ever seen written. Our cook knows more than just about anyone else how to run a football club. These last 20 years her and hubby have been at the helm of the craziest ridden two decades of English football, with all the loopy Sky money making massive gulfs between the top tier and the rest, on top of that NCFC have for the last decade been in a yo yo situation, meaning each dang year or two the clubs finances are also in a yo yo like state. Its incredibly hard for even the most clever business person to plan to far into the future when the cash flow is hit with enormous spikes.Our cook has experienced highs and lows, the very low coming a decade ago, and absolutely she learnt from that and guards as much as humanly possible  for it never to occur again under her watch. Despite all the cloth cutting going on, despite the supposed notion that almost all other clubs in the Champs have, or are searching, rich sugar daddys, which in itself create more bad pressures on more and more clubs financially, despite all this, financially Norwich are right now 2nd best placed club in the Champs for lack of debt.Want a sugar daddy with hundreds of millions and whos had years and years of being in charge of a club?..walk down the road 40 miles to see the glorious world that is Marcus Evans domain.  Want to be a club thats had a decent amount of seasons in the Prem, so on that basis is assuredly sound and stable if it comes to a relegation?...take a hike up north and gander at the Black Cats, see how happy they are.All this "oh so many other clubs are getting huge investments so it means we are getting smaller and smaller" is total hokum. Any of us were put in charge of NCFC we would have the club liquidated in under a week, after 20 years our club is alive and well as it has been, under extremely trying situations, and it gets increasingly more crazy every year for anyone to sensibly run a football club. Delia and hubby have, and continue, to do a good job in running our club. You want them out Lappin?..fine, but be careful what you wish for.

[Mello Yello 2,573]

Oh, the irony........

[TIL 1010 5,246]

Whooooooooooooooooooooooooooooosh !

[......and Smith must score. 1,600]

[quote user="Essjayess"][quote user="lappinitup"]The  cook has been here over twenty years and still knows NOTHING about running a football club. [8o|]And don''t even get me started about all this nephewism stuff. [:@][/quote]......... You want them out Lappin?..fine, but be careful what you wish for.[/quote]If only they were all as easy as this Lapps....[:D]

[STFU 0]

Just one question Purple. Regardless of the board, how the hell have we not come close to getting back to the Premiership either last season or this season with the players we’ve got?

[Iwans Big Toe 382]

[quote user="STFU"]Just one question Purple. Regardless of the board, how the hell have we not come close to getting back to the Premiership either last season or this season with the players we’ve got?[/quote]I''m hoping this is a rhetorical question. Because if you''re expecting a sensible retort from a poster who can''t understand why certain fans are slightly vexed about the board, yet again, having p@ssed a great financial position up against a wall (Webber''s words not mine), you''re probbably barking up the wrong tree.

[Weve (no longer) Got Angus 0]

I''m quite intrigued to see how it all unravels! OTBC

[PurpleCanary 6,391]

[quote user="STFU"]Just one question Purple. Regardless of the board, how the hell have we not come close to getting back to the Premiership either last season or this season with the players we’ve got?[/quote]The short answer as far as last season goes is that Neil turned out to be a limited manager who nowhere near got the best out of  a talented squad. As to whether he should have been the manager, that is one of those impossible arguments.Yes, we had got relegated from the Premier League under him but he''d done well in the Championship so perhaps (the same reasoning some fans used about Hughton) he would do so again. And we had an excellent start, a run of five losses in a row, and then another good spell. Myself, I wanted him sacked in November, but that was specifically only because Birmingham had just kicked Rowett out and he was available.But that would have ben a very tough decison for the board to make so early in the season, even assuming they rated Rowett as a manager and could have got him. With the complicating factor that I suspect by then the board had decided the next stage would be to have a sporting director and a head coach, so that the yet to arrive SD would in effect make these big decisions. As happened in the spring, with Webber head-hunting Farke.As for this season, our effort has been hamstrung by the fact that the directors gambled financially on getting straight back, so the cutbacks have been more severe than if we had not backed the manager so much last season. Which points up the broader problem.. Other clubs, in the PL and in the Championship, can buy their way out of the consequences of bad - or what turn out to be bad - decisions. We cannot.

[Bonzo 198]

It’s not baffling and apart from the call to back Alex Neill for longer than they should have (with hindsight an easy statement to make) the board now seems to have made some sound decisions and found their way again.

Many fans have a deranged sense of entitlement ( don’t worry we used to have players who were the same) this sense of entitlement is simply not based on any rational analysis. Our league is full of clubs with deep pockets and clubs with the luxury of parachute payments. It is the third most attended league in the world. Promotion from this insanely competitive league takes talent, endeavour and a little bit of luck. We have had to rebuild from what was a demoted PL team to a team that can push for promotion whilst cutting our budget so that we don’t rob fans of a financially stable future ( you do remember what happened at Leeds surely?).

Personally I think the board have taken a courageous and correct decision to adopt the strategy that we have. The club is now better managed than at any time in its history. As for nephew Tom? Leave him alone ffs. Presumably you are going to leave your house to your kids? This is no different. Your kids won’t demolish your house and Tom won’t wreck the club. It is not in his interests to do so.

[Mello Yello 2,573]

.....chortle.......

[Badger 2,745]

"Want a sugar daddy with hundreds of millions and whos had years and

years of being in charge of a club?..walk down the road 40 miles to see

the glorious world that is Marcus Evans domain.  Want to be a club thats

had a decent amount of seasons in the Prem, so on that basis is

assuredly sound and stable if it comes to a relegation?...take a hike up

north and gander at the Black Cats, see how happy they are."I''m not clear about the purpose of your post in general but you whether by intent or not raise very significant points here - you might wish to add a number of other clubs into the picture as well.

[Rudolph Hucker 0]

Shooting themselves in the foot.......

How often has our Board supported a manager for too long before sacking him so late it attracted derision? It might be noble but the perceived wisdom is to replace early.

Aside from the Lambert years how often has our Board failed to get transfer business done in the Summer thus going into the season a key player light (striker or CH)?

As a result of the above how much has our Board squandered on January panic buys who no longer want to be here come the end of the season?

In terms of wasting money how many of those panic buys were pretty much a net loss having made no difference?

What difference would it have made to have invested 30 million of panic buy cash into new capacity? I refuse to believe we could not achieve regular attendances of 32k with over 36k for certain games. That brings a bigger profile and increased revenue, especially as the building could have raised additional funds through non-matchday use.

As I have often said, I have only really ever known NCFC to succeed when they have brought in a maverick, someone who they fear to agree with but allow to lead and conversely NCFC is at its worst when the owner(s) try to call the shots.

Here we are: too prudent to fail, too prudent to succeed.

[Icecream Snow 777]

Jury''s still out for me at the moment.Whilst Farke has shown that he''s tactically strong, and very good at developing young players (eg Maddison and Lewis) there''s still a big question mark for me over the recruitment side under Webber.We know we''ve got to get the wage bill down, and to transition from a side buying expensive Premiership players in the twilight of their career, to buying and improving lower league gems, and using the academy.The decision to release Ruddy, Bennett, Lafferty, Bassong, Turner, Whittaker and Mulumbu was a no-brainer, but the real acid test is going to come in the summer. If we can''t afford to keep Pinto, Klose, Tettey, Hoolahan, Oliveria (and maybe Josh Murphy) it''s a huge ask to recruit players of that quality, when the likes of Franke, Stieperman, Husband and Vrancic are at the best bench warmers or aren''t featuring.

[TIL 1010 5,246]

[quote user="Bonzo"] As for nephew Tom? Leave him alone ffs. Presumably you are going to leave your house to your kids? This is no different. Your kids won’t demolish your house and Tom won’t wreck the club. It is not in his interests to do so.[/quote]My house does not have 25,000 turn up every fortnight to pay to have a look around and i own every single brick in my house and do not have about 6,000 who own a brick or two of it either.