606 caller

[Worthy Nigelton 1,058]

10 minutes ago, Midlands Yellow said:

October saw us take one point from 5 matches. 

I know. That's not my point.

[BroadstairsR 2,197]

There's no such thing as this 20%, it was silly talk.

The support of any football club can never be such a homogeneous element that it could justify such a blanket description.

Supporters of NCFC, in common with all clubs, have their reasons for supporting the club, and they vary enormously.

The intensity of that support is individualistic and cannot be accounted for in general terms.

Some are fervent and claim to bleed yellow and green, whilst at the other end of the spectrum some are fair weather supporters and only resume interest when times are good. The vast majority are probably somewhere in between these two extremes.

The most common factor is surely that most were born in the City or the wider area with support being in the family from birth and enjoy the game as a sport. To call this habitual is far from accurate, as it is a constant passion and interest wherever life takes you. It is only habitual as far as the Saturday habit goes.

Delia could be better advised to consider the apparent growing apathy within the ground on match days rather than invent imaginary percentages about unreasonable dissidents. 

There was a much greater revolt (about 80%? 😆) when Robert Chase became unpopular, despite having brought us the best period in our history, than there is these days for some reason and even though similarities in the situation exist.

Perhaps times change, with more other interests and concerns these days that take precedent over getting worked up about the fortunes of a football club, or perhaps it is the demographics mentioned above, with a much older support in attendance who will clearly be less vocal. You can hardly complain about the wares on sale if you are unable to get into the shop.

 

Edited January 2 by BroadstairsR

[Midlands Yellow 4,031]

2 minutes ago, Worthy Nigelton said:

I know. That's not my point.

Fair enough, we were quite poor back then and still are now. 

[Creedence Clearwater Couto 1,295]

34 minutes ago, Worthy Nigelton said:

You think we weren't playing attacking front-foot football then? We were the second highest scorers in the league! Your reaction illustrates my point perfectly, it was 'crap football' because we weren't winning, not because it was dull, long-ball, safety-first etc.

It really doesn’t!! 

As Midland points out, we took 1 point from 5 games!! 

Of those 5 games, we failed to score more than 1 goal in 4 of them! 

Where on earth are you getting attacking, front-foot football from!! 3 of those games were Coventry, Middlesbrough and Sunderland where we employed negative tactics too and were awful!!

Edited January 2 by Creedence Clearwater Couto

[sonyc 5,541]

11 hours ago, Christoph Stiepermann said:

Most fans I speak to in person who have season tickets or go regularly don't really care about results or how we play. They just like the day out with their family or go out of habit because they always have done.

I think your post (in full) is an important one and you've made very logical points. Two ideas for me arise from it...and also a summary conclusion with is linked but not directly.

(1) away crowds are quite a bit different - funnier with gallows humour, more rowdy and enthusiastic. It's a different dynamic because it's a different demographic. It supports your point. Webber was annoyed with part of a home support wasn't he?

(2) The football needs to have something that draws in the crowd too. And in this respect we are poorly served at the moment though it's not the worst by a long way. There are things to enjoy. Yet we as fans can  become polarised very easily.

Linked to the above I don't think it has helped with the former SD moaning about unfair criticism nor Delia's 20% comment. I don't doubt both have validity but they should have kept that view to themselves. I also reckon their complaint pertains and is valid for every other football team in the country..The point I'm getting at is that those comments have created a divide. A division which wasn't necessary nor a positive thing. It has left an unhappiness about the place. A rift between fans and club. And to think we were all told about being one community club. Those comments were made by the very same leadership that created the atmosphere for an important community club like ours. Even to the point of putting upfront in the annual.reports. We also hear how fans are so important, the only thing that matters. You could argue that a part of the 'contract' has been broken by those comments. Yet as fans we also want honesty!

 

Anyway, just some impressions. I don't know the answer. Change is needed though. Your idea of cheap tickets is interesting for starters. It has galvanised support from younger fans at clubs in League Two for example.

[Midlands Yellow 4,031]

3 minutes ago, Creedence Clearwater Couto said:

It really doesn’t!! 

As Midland points out, we took 1 point from 5 games!! 

Of those 5 games, we failed to score more than 1 goal in 4 of them! 

Where on earth are you getting attacking, front-foot football from!! 3 of those games were Coventry, Middlesbrough and Sunderland where we employed negative tactics too and were awful!!

August and part of September saw us playing a lot of free flowing and pleasing on the eye football. After the Leicester defeat at home the rot set in and the beatings arrived on tap. 

[Jim Smith 2,339]

6 minutes ago, sonyc said:

I think your post (in full) is an important one and you've made very logical points. Two ideas for me arise from it...and also a summary conclusion with is linked but not directly.

(1) away crowds are quite a bit different - funnier with gallows humour, more rowdy and enthusiastic. It's a different dynamic because it's a different demographic. It supports your point. Webber was annoyed with part of a home support wasn't he?

(2) The football needs to have something that draws in the crowd too. And in this respect we are poorly served at the moment though it's not the worst by a long way. There are things to enjoy. Yet we as fans can  become polarised very easily.

Linked to the above I don't think it has helped with the former SD moaning about unfair criticism nor Delia's 20% comment. I don't doubt both have validity but they should have kept that view to themselves. I also reckon their complaint pertains and is valid for every other football team in the country..The point I'm getting at is that those comments have created a divide. A division which wasn't necessary nor a positive thing. It has left an unhappiness about the place. A rift between fans and club. And to think we were all told about being one community club. Those comments were made by the very same leadership that created the atmosphere for an important community club like ours. Even to the point of putting upfront in the annual.reports. We also hear how fans are so important, the only thing that matters. You could argue that a part of the 'contract' has been broken by those comments. Yet as fans we also want honesty!

 

Anyway, just some impressions. I don't know the answer. Change is needed though. Your idea of cheap tickets is interesting for starters. It has galvanised support from younger fans at clubs in League Two for example.

They absolutely 100% do not have any validity. Norwich fans are incredibly patient and easy going. Webber’s poison and disdain for the fans has crept through the club and you could almost hear him speaking in sone of the stuff Delia comes out with. She is clearly incredibly easily influenced by those she is in thrall to. 

[king canary 7,654]

1 hour ago, littleyellowbirdie said:

That's great, but what does the 20% actually want? Is there a coherent preference? Do they prioritise results or do they prioritise eye-catching performances and entertainment. Without a lot more money than we have, you can't reliably expect both. Granted, with new investment maybe  we should be able to hope for both in the future, but people should be making at choice at the moment and sticking to it, because it's just unrealistic otherwise.

Even if we're just talking 20% of match going fans, that is around 5,000 people. They aren't an organised pressure group with a manifesto and they aren't a homogenous mass. So there won't be just one thing that they want. But the crowd is as apathetic as it's ever been and it is the clubs role to understand and try and address what concerns they reasonably can. There will always be some who can't be pleased- I sat in front of a guy who never liked Darren Huckerby! - but you've got to engage to at least make people feel heard.

[Worthy Nigelton 1,058]

9 minutes ago, Creedence Clearwater Couto said:

It really doesn’t!! 

As Midland points out, we took 1 point from 5 games!! 

Of those 5 games, we failed to score more than 1 goal in 4 of them! 

Where on earth are you getting attacking, front-foot football from!! 3 of those games were Coventry, Middlesbrough and Sunderland where we employed negative tactics too and were awful!!

We were the second highest scorers in the league at that point in the season. We were trying to outscore people. The football was crap because we weren't winning - it really isn't hard. We scored in every game that month despite three being away. We scored two in 45 minutes at home to Leeds. I know we took one point... that is why you think it was crap football - as I said, you keep backing up my point.

[debbie does norwich 13]

My tuppence worth, I think possibly, a slightly different viewpoint. At least I cannot recall this being said in all the game analysis threads that I've skimmed through.

I sit in the middle of the south stand so not one of the traditional areas which create the noise/atmosphere. However, I do join in when songs are being sung. And I certainly vent if/when I see a perceived injustice.

Was yesterday worse than usual? It seems so but I didn't particularly notice. Why, because I was 100% engaged in what was happening on the pitch right upto the final whistle. It was disciplined and  controlled, theatre, drama and totally enthralling. The movement and support, particularly across the midfield 4, was the best I've seen for ages.

Admittedly, I'm referring to the time out of possession but that, as been mentioned many times, was 3/4 of the game.

In possession, we were not good. Often struggled to get out of our own half but to be fair, their press was pretty impressive.

I came away pretty chuffed and completely surprised that people were moaning after we avoided an odds on defeat.

[Midlands Yellow 4,031]

13 minutes ago, Worthy Nigelton said:

We were the second highest scorers in the league at that point in the season. We were trying to outscore people. The football was crap because we weren't winning - it really isn't hard. We scored in every game that month despite three being away. We scored two in 45 minutes at home to Leeds. I know we took one point... that is why you think it was crap football - as I said, you keep backing up my point.

We were crap against Sunderland, at home to Boro, lucky at Coventry and poor at Swansea. For an hour we played well against Leeds but that was a month of dire football on the whole. Norwich certainly weren’t trying to outscore opponents for four of those five matches. 

Edited January 2 by Midlands Yellow

[Creedence Clearwater Couto 1,295]

28 minutes ago, Worthy Nigelton said:

We were the second highest scorers in the league at that point in the season. We were trying to outscore people. The football was crap because we weren't winning - it really isn't hard. We scored in every game that month despite three being away. We scored two in 45 minutes at home to Leeds. I know we took one point... that is why you think it was crap football - as I said, you keep backing up my point.

You’re deluded if you think our football was free flowing and exciting during October. Completely deluded. Your making a mockery of your own point.

Look back at the games, you’ll realise then.

Edited January 2 by Creedence Clearwater Couto

[Creedence Clearwater Couto 1,295]

16 minutes ago, Midlands Yellow said:

We were crap against Sunderland, at home to Boro, lucky at Coventry and poor at Swansea. For an hour we played well against Leeds but that was a month of dire football on the whole. Norwich certainly weren’t trying to outscore opponents for four of those five matches. 

Accurate summary. I’m at a loss how anyone can argue we were trying to outscore opponents with free flowing attacking football in any of those games… absolutely mental suggestion.

[sonyc 5,541]

26 minutes ago, debbie does norwich said:

My tuppence worth, I think possibly, a slightly different viewpoint. At least I cannot recall this being said in all the game analysis threads that I've skimmed through.

I sit in the middle of the south stand so not one of the traditional areas which create the noise/atmosphere. However, I do join in when songs are being sung. And I certainly vent if/when I see a perceived injustice.

Was yesterday worse than usual? It seems so but I didn't particularly notice. Why, because I was 100% engaged in what was happening on the pitch right upto the final whistle. It was disciplined and  controlled, theatre, drama and totally enthralling. The movement and support, particularly across the midfield 4, was the best I've seen for ages.

Admittedly, I'm referring to the time out of possession but that, as been mentioned many times, was 3/4 of the game.

In possession, we were not good. Often struggled to get out of our own half but to be fair, their press was pretty impressive.

I came away pretty chuffed and completely surprised that people were moaning after we avoided an odds on defeat.

Credit to you for those observations debbie. You can get an appreciation of many aspects, other than the obvious optics. It must take some stamina though at times if that was the only menu being offered. I felt similarly when we played them down the road. We were definitely inferior in may aspects but you couldn't fault our determination, fight and spirit. That we also came back from being down was another plus. Like yesterday.

 

[Making Plans 939]

There is a World of difference between being a supporter and somebody who has a season ticket and turns up every match just to watch the game.

These people believe they are supporters just because they shell out £500 a season to be there.

The problem at NCFC is that the vast majority of the crowd at Carrow Road fall into the latter category who, to their credit, will be there through thick and thin.

However, they readily accept whatever happens on the football pitch whether it is good, bad or indifferent, without ever becomming emotionally involved.

 

 

 

 

[Mr.Carrow 378]

1 hour ago, sonyc said:

 

 

Anyway, just some impressions. I don't know the answer. Change is needed though. Your idea of cheap tickets is interesting for starters. It has galvanised support from younger fans at clubs in League Two for example.

With respect, how/why would we implement cheap tickets if every ticket except restricted view and single seats sell out anyway? The issue is that CR is effectively a closed shop dominated by an ageing demographic who generally go out of habit or because they've got nothing better to do.

The only way to open the ground up to new, more vibrant demographics is expansion. Then we can maybe offer cheaper tickets for teens/large groups etc.

[Worthy Nigelton 1,058]

53 minutes ago, Creedence Clearwater Couto said:

You’re deluded if you think our football was free flowing and exciting during October. Completely deluded. Your making a mockery of your own point.

Look back at the games, you’ll realise then.

No. Its like Hoggy says, we've just become entitled at this level. Any time we're not performing excellently and beating teams easily, then it's poor. Well I don't agree. I've seen us look poor (Roeder, Peter Grant, Bryan Gunn, Bryan Hamilton) and we are/were a million miles away from that level. Disappointing, yes, but nobody appreciates that football is cyclical and we're going through an underwhelming cycle right now, but it's nowhere near as bad as you are suggesting and the style being served up could be infinitely worse. Watch us under Chris Hughton and then tell me that Wagner is not an attacking, good-footballing manager. His instincts are to try and score goals and to pass the ball out from the back, we just don't have good enough players.

If you want to criticise his team selection or his tactics or whether he's getting the best out of the players, fine, Id agree with you on much of that, but to suggest the football is awful is not correct.

[essex canary 504]

6 minutes ago, Mr.Carrow said:

With respect, how/why would we implement cheap tickets if every ticket except restricted view and single seats sell out anyway? The issue is that CR is effectively a closed shop dominated by an ageing demographic who generally go out of habit or because they've got nothing better to do.

The only way to open the ground up to new, more vibrant demographics is expansion. Then we can maybe offer cheaper tickets for teens/large groups etc.

Why not make the single seats cheaper?

Do they want to choke off people who go out of habit or loyalty? 

Cambridge United have sent out emails to season ticket holders saying if you don't want to attend the match taking place in 2 days time click here. That then facilitates a resale. No money back but you couldn't expect that from a Club who largely lives of gate money that hasn't been the recent NCFC experience.

NCFC's recent 'own the pitch' initiative is a good one in funding defibrillators in the community. Why though not link that to Season Ticket match surrender rather than yet another gambling opportunity as currently constructed?

[sonyc 5,541]

18 minutes ago, Mr.Carrow said:

With respect, how/why would we implement cheap tickets if every ticket except restricted view and single seats sell out anyway? The issue is that CR is effectively a closed shop dominated by an ageing demographic who generally go out of habit or because they've got nothing better to do.

The only way to open the ground up to new, more vibrant demographics is expansion. Then we can maybe offer cheaper tickets for teens/large groups etc.

Yes I appreciate that but you go about it by having more dynamic ticketing policies and target more. I do agree with your point about expansion and season tickets. It's more about thinking ahead and establishing a strategy to encourage younger supporters.

Swansea have done it recently. Bradford City's initiatives for many years now has led to a younger demographic - likewise linked to season ticket initiatives. 

I think there are things the club could do. Rather than alienating fans by comments about how they should support or show their feelings. Norwich City ought to be a progressive club in all respects (like the mental health work they've been lauded for). And being progressive means to think ahead about their support base. I'm not being uber-critical of the club. Just think it's an area we should or could explore more....explicitly, by intention.

Anyway, link here if you've any interest.

https://www.swanseacity.com/news/swansea-city-introduce-dynamic-ticket-pricing-2023-24-season

Edited January 2 by sonyc

[Creedence Clearwater Couto 1,295]

23 minutes ago, Worthy Nigelton said:

No. Its like Hoggy says, we've just become entitled at this level. Any time we're not performing excellently and beating teams easily, then it's poor. Well I don't agree. I've seen us look poor (Roeder, Peter Grant, Bryan Gunn, Bryan Hamilton) and we are/were a million miles away from that level. Disappointing, yes, but nobody appreciates that football is cyclical and we're going through an underwhelming cycle right now, but it's nowhere near as bad as you are suggesting and the style being served up could be infinitely worse. Watch us under Chris Hughton and then tell me that Wagner is not an attacking, good-footballing manager. His instincts are to try and score goals and to pass the ball out from the back, we just don't have good enough players.

If you want to criticise his team selection or his tactics or whether he's getting the best out of the players, fine, Id agree with you on much of that, but to suggest the football is awful is not correct.

Ok, we’ll have to agree to disagree. I’m not sure you’ll get much support for Wagner being a good attacking manager. 

RE entitlement. I’m adamant it’s not that. No Norwich fan thinks winning the championship should be given to them on a plate. Many do expect us to be top 6 challengers and to win more than we lose at this level, which is in line with current status and the clubs own targets and expectation. 

There’s difference between entitled and expectation. Throwing entitled around as a reason is lazy, ignorant, and disrespectful to fellow city fans.

Edited January 2 by Creedence Clearwater Couto

[Worthy Nigelton 1,058]

1 minute ago, Creedence Clearwater Couto said:

Ok, we’ll have to agree to disagree. I’m not sure you’ll get much support for Wagner being a good attacking manager. 

RE entitlement. I’m adamant it’s not that. No Norwich fan thinks winning the championship should be given to them on a plate. Many do expect us to be top 6 challengers and to win more than we lose at this level, which is in line with current status and the clubs own targets and expectation. 

There’s difference between entitled and expectation. Throwing entitled around as a reason is lazy, ignorant, and disrespectful to fellow city fans.

It's not something unique to city fans. Look at that lot down the road who insist they're the biggest/best club in East Anglia despite being largely s**t for 40+ years. There are countless other examples. I want us to do well as much as you do, and I'm not happy with where we are because potentially I think we are a top tier team, but unless you're a fan of a very select few clubs, the reality is you will spend much of your time being disappointed with your team - but there are levels to the disappointment and this could be so, so much worse. Have a good day!

[sonyc 5,541]

5 minutes ago, Worthy Nigelton said:

the reality is you will spend much of your time being disappointed with your team - but there are levels to the disappointment and this could be so, so much worse.

Indeed. Yesterday was a bitter disappointment. We were outplayed largely at our own home. But...we are not in the bottom 3, nor will we be this season. And we do have players to excite us. If we want to look for a very dour period we only need to go back to the mid/ late 90s. Or relegation to L1. We are on a cusp with new owners and SD. But that's football. Folk care enough to post about how frustrated they are and that's all fine. It could be so much worse. The obvious flip side is that also we could be so much better!

[shefcanary 2,441]

3 hours ago, king canary said:

Without meaning to chuck a hand grenade in, I'd ask...do our previous majority shareholders actually want a proper atmosphere?

Delia & MWJ's 80% of 'good supporters' mainly aren't the loud kind. They are the kind I mentioned in an earlier post, those who clap and cheer along at times, celebrate a goal but don't want to chant/sing. If we lose they'll clap the team off and for a good effort and then get on with their lives. Nothing wrong with that to be clear. However I'm largely of the believe these are the kind of fans Delia & MWJ are the most comfortable with having. 

The biggest contradiction is that in recent years the fans who've made the most concerted effort to improve our atmosphere sit firmly in that 20%. City Elite are made up largely of those who got ridiculed for their bedsheet protest. 

I think if the club want a real atmosphere then they are better served trying to get that 20% back onside than by hoping the 80% of placid, polite fans suddenly fancy creating a fortress mentality. 

 

True, when did you last see either of them jumping up in the Director's box when we scored / won a game? I know they probably struggle physically nowadays, but Delia's mum was far more active closing in on her 100th year, than Delia is currently! As for Michael, he only moves fast when he's dying for a fag!

[Ulfotto 641]

13 hours ago, littleyellowbirdie said:

Our season's points tally was the worst since 1903. Hardly fine margins, was it? Teams that could and should have done well in the premier League don't crash and burn to that extent.

This is one of the contradictions right we finished 21/22 a long way adrift yet the following seasons we are supposed to win every game at championship level. Most fans stated this season that challenging for the playoffs would be a good result this year. That is exactly what we are doing yet it’s now not good enough.

My point is that from 2018 - 2021 was one of the best Norwich team most people can remember in terms of style of play, fan engagement and basically every other metric. It felt different to the Lambert era. Yet despite two championship titles it seems a bit empty given what happened on Promotion. Somewhere in that period there was a lost season where we did “ok” in the premier league say a comfortable mid table finish. I would maintain if 2018/2019 ended in glorious failure we would have got promoted the following year and then thrived rather than been embarrassed. Sort of switching with what Bielsa Leeds team did.

[lake district canary 4,542]

2 hours ago, debbie does norwich said:

My tuppence worth, I think possibly, a slightly different viewpoint. At least I cannot recall this being said in all the game analysis threads that I've skimmed through.

I sit in the middle of the south stand so not one of the traditional areas which create the noise/atmosphere. However, I do join in when songs are being sung. And I certainly vent if/when I see a perceived injustice.

Was yesterday worse than usual? It seems so but I didn't particularly notice. Why, because I was 100% engaged in what was happening on the pitch right upto the final whistle. It was disciplined and  controlled, theatre, drama and totally enthralling. The movement and support, particularly across the midfield 4, was the best I've seen for ages.

Admittedly, I'm referring to the time out of possession but that, as been mentioned many times, was 3/4 of the game.

In possession, we were not good. Often struggled to get out of our own half but to be fair, their press was pretty impressive.

I came away pretty chuffed and completely surprised that people were moaning after we avoided an odds on defeat.

I would agree it was an enthralling match the way it turned out, but my biggest complaint was that we kicked of at the beginning of the match and literally shrank back into eleven behind the ball from the first second. It was bizarre and not what you expect to see from a home team, whoever we are playing.

I know people say we are not a good side, but are we really that insecure as a team we have to set up like that? I remember a few years ago we had to play a great in posession Swansalona team at CR.  Yes, they had a lot of posession, but we played well, taking the fight to them, weathered the storm and won 2-0.  That is what you are supposed to do as a home team - not surrender posession from the kick off like we did.

People can argue the ends justify the means, because we got a point and could have won it, but the fact remains we had 28% posession, with little to offer in the way of getting and keeping the ball because we had 11 players behind the ball most of the match. It was Southampton, not Man City! 

 

[Sufyellow 222]

4 hours ago, Midlands Yellow said:

Sounds like you need 20,000 not to renew to create the desired atmosphere. 

I don't believe anyone will replace them.  

[......and Smith must score. 1,355]

2 hours ago, sonyc said:

I think your post (in full) is an important one and you've made very logical points. Two ideas for me arise from it...and also a summary conclusion with is linked but not directly.

(1) away crowds are quite a bit different - funnier with gallows humour, more rowdy and enthusiastic. It's a different dynamic because it's a different demographic. It supports your point. Webber was annoyed with part of a home support wasn't he?

(2) The football needs to have something that draws in the crowd too. And in this respect we are poorly served at the moment though it's not the worst by a long way. There are things to enjoy. Yet we as fans can  become polarised very easily.

Linked to the above I don't think it has helped with the former SD moaning about unfair criticism nor Delia's 20% comment. I don't doubt both have validity but they should have kept that view to themselves. I also reckon their complaint pertains and is valid for every other football team in the country..The point I'm getting at is that those comments have created a divide. A division which wasn't necessary nor a positive thing. It has left an unhappiness about the place. A rift between fans and club. And to think we were all told about being one community club. Those comments were made by the very same leadership that created the atmosphere for an important community club like ours. Even to the point of putting upfront in the annual.reports. We also hear how fans are so important, the only thing that matters. You could argue that a part of the 'contract' has been broken by those comments. Yet as fans we also want honesty!

This is spot on.

Whether home or away spectators want to enjoy watching their team. Enjoyment on the field has been in short supply for far too long. 

Away crowds are different. Many people who have home season tickets rarely if ever go to away games and the audience is much younger and more boisterous. Perhaps the commitment  needed to get to other grounds forms a common bond that you don’t see so much at Carrow Rd.

I think the last paragraph is so true. Our generally unloved ex-SD was notoriously thin skinned and Delia really should have learnt her lesson after that Man City debacle. Are we still a community club ? We probably can still claim to be but the feeling is wearing thin.
 

 

 

[Mr.Carrow 378]

1 hour ago, essex canary said:

Why not make the single seats cheaper?

Do they want to choke off people who go out of habit or loyalty? 

Cambridge United have sent out emails to season ticket holders saying if you don't want to attend the match taking place in 2 days time click here. That then facilitates a resale. No money back but you couldn't expect that from a Club who largely lives of gate money that hasn't been the recent NCFC experience.

NCFC's recent 'own the pitch' initiative is a good one in funding defibrillators in the community. Why though not link that to Season Ticket match surrender rather than yet another gambling opportunity as currently constructed?

They don't know which single seats will be left until the day of the game, and if they advertise "half price single seats" many people will hold off buying until the day. Don't think that's really feasible. I do agree with you and sony that there are probably more proactive things the club can do and that they have become extremely complacent. But It's not much good talking about what Swansea etc are doing when they have 7-8000 good seats available per game whereas we have 6-800 restricted view and single seats. To revive the support and atmosphere we need more seats. 

[shefcanary 2,441]

2 minutes ago, lake district canary said:

but my biggest complaint was that we kicked of at the beginning of the match and literally shrank back into eleven behind the ball from the first second. It was bizarre and not what you expect to see from a home team, whoever we are playing.

Was that opening a sliding doors moment - the moment we all faced up to the fact the head coach thinks we are crap. Trouble was, as soon as they scored, we had another sliding doors moment when Sarge and Rowe made it all look so easy, why the **** didn't we play like that all game! Then I've seen others mention another sliding doors moment when we reverted to 4-4-2 and we looked crap again! All in the same match. And all triggered by one person - the Head Coach.

If Wagner goes, we might finally see a Head Coach that can galvanise all four stands, finding a consistency in game play that makes it easy for the fans to connect. At the moment every match is like a chess match, you either get it and absorb yourself, or you just ignore. Is it really that difficult?

Maybe, but also the club could and should do more to get us onside with the Wagner / Knapper revolution. But their marketing is just so poor. They fail to see it can be a chicken and egg situation - can the crowd galvanise the team? I sense that is what many on this thread are expecting. That I would argue is a slower process, but was achieved in the past and can work again. Raise the excitement, with new fresh ideas on fan engagement. 

However, currently, we seem to be getting a clear message that as far as Head Coach is concerned its "as you were"! And the marketing team are focussed on peripheral niceties rather than looking at the matchday product. 

Ultimately, the remaining 2 year of the Smith & Jones / Attanasio concord is going to be a struggle for any supporter of the club. Whose side are we on - the club's of course, but how long before the Board focus on that?

[king canary 7,654]

5 minutes ago, shefcanary said:

If Wagner goes, we might finally see a Head Coach that can galvanise all four stands, finding a consistency in game play that makes it easy for the fans to connect.

If we can find a head coach that can galvanise the River End he should probably be knighted on the spot.