The CB question

[NFN FC 1,123]

15 hours ago, Danke bitte said:

“Edited: Drinking” Edit of the season?!

We will see, plenty of beer fuelled post to come.... 

Edited July 30, 2023 by NFN FC
Drinking again, Belgian Monk!

[Nuff Said 5,142]

5 hours ago, ged in the onion bag said:

When we went to Liverpool that first day on 2019/20 season, Hanley had to play because of injuries but was considered 4th choice at the time despite being more experienced.    
 

Oh, how we’ve declined.    Funny ol’ game…. And some fans are desperate for him back in the team.

I’d need to some convincing evidence that “fourth choice” was real but in the three years since then, he has proven himself to be a top Championship defender that most of not all other clubs in the Championship would have loved to recruit. You’re the one in favour of developing players by playing them!

Edited July 30, 2023 by Nuff Said

[Danke bitte 965]

38 minutes ago, NFN FC said:

We will see, plenty of beer fuelled post to come.... 

I got a lot of time for the ‘Monk

[RobJames 881]

1 hour ago, AJ said:

In the meantime though, I'd prefer Omo to play so he can progress but would understand if we go for experience in Gibson

That's NOT what happens. Clubs do not leave a better player on the bench so another lesser play can 'develop' - as that is what you are stating. Players make the first team when they are 'up to it'. Some, like Gibbs (and now Fishers I suspect) reach that level early in their career.

If it was the case, either Reyes or Barden would be playing rather than Gunn. Just as Kamara would not have gone out on loan, he would be in the first team ahead of Sgt or Barnes so as to 'progress'.

If there is a serious bid for Omo then that has to be a sale. His value is in his age. Duffy looks and is better, but for how many more seasons. With Omo you are buying another dozen or so seasons. And if as it looks this other Irish lad looks to be signing, then we have him, Tomkinson and Warner already, with Hills as well out on loan.

This season is about getting back to the PL. We'll worry then about what happens next., after that.  Anything surplus that can raise money, or can cut the wage bill needs to be thrown overboard - sorry about the blunt analogy, but stripped down, that's what it amounts to.

[sgncfc 1,228]

1 hour ago, RobJames said:

This season is about getting back to the PL

Is it? Of course every team states that as their aim at the start of the season, but in reality I don't think anyone around our team thinks that is actually achievable this year. Ashley Barnes talks a good game though.....

Personally, I think this is Year 1 of a rebuild so anything which is an improvement on last year is the real aim.

[RobJames 881]

You seem to have over looked the reality of our situation. There is no Year 2 of rebuild, hence us bringing in short term 'fixes' such as Barnes. Our income will fall by just over £30m next season and there is no sell on (Maddison) fee anywhere. Similarly, we are likely to pick up around another £20m from Aarons/Rashica. If we are unable to mount a serious challenge this season, how on earth do you think we will be able to with a likely £60m plus reduction next season ?

This supposed Year 2 of rebuilding will actually be a season where the top earners are gone, if only that we cannot afford their wages.  This will be the first year in 13, that we are either not been in the PL or in receipt of parachute payments. Why do you think we have signed so many 'promising youngsters ? We have while we can. And we have one season to get them up to speed, if we don't get up this season. As they are what is facing us otherwise.

[mrD66M 99]

Saw a link to a defender from Drogheda FC, 19yo, can't recall the name of the player though.

[Mr Angry 1,562]

25 minutes ago, mrD66M said:

Saw a link to a defender from Drogheda FC, 19yo, can't recall the name of the player though.

Emmanuel Adegboyega, mentioned earlier today by @shefcanary. 7 yellows and a straight red this season in 22 games, seems a bit raw!

[mrD66M 99]

49 minutes ago, Mr Angry said:

Emmanuel Adegboyega, mentioned earlier today by @shefcanary. 7 yellows and a straight red this season in 22 games, seems a bit raw!

Cheers for that. Sounds a bit like a Godfrey type..

[RobJames 881]

51 minutes ago, mrD66M said:

Saw a link to a defender from Drogheda FC, 19yo, can't recall the name of the player though.

as "And if as it looks this other Irish lad looks to be signing, " above.

Gibson has looked more assured in the pre season games.  He is out of contract next summer so that alone should be enough to focus his mind. Olympiacos are no mugs. They turned over Rangers a few days before, but hardly got a sniff against us.

[daly 503]

4 hours ago, RobJames said:

That's NOT what happens. Clubs do not leave a better player on the bench so another lesser play can 'develop' - as that is what you are stating. Players make the first team when they are 'up to it'. Some, like Gibbs (and now Fishers I suspect) reach that level early in their career.

If it was the case, either Reyes or Barden would be playing rather than Gunn. Just as Kamara would not have gone out on loan, he would be in the first team ahead of Sgt or Barnes so as to 'progress'.

If there is a serious bid for Omo then that has to be a sale. His value is in his age. Duffy looks and is better, but for how many more seasons. With Omo you are buying another dozen or so seasons. And if as it looks this other Irish lad looks to be signing, then we have him, Tomkinson and Warner already, with Hills as well out on loan.

This season is about getting back to the PL. We'll worry then about what happens next., after that.  Anything surplus that can raise money, or can cut the wage bill needs to be thrown overboard - sorry about the blunt analogy, but stripped down, that's what it amounts to.

More about staying in TC imagine this team in The Premiership 

[RobJames 881]

22 minutes ago, daly said:

More about staying in TC imagine this team in The Premiership 

So you are suggesting we'll be more likely to be facing relegation than promotion. Dream on, binner.

Edited July 30, 2023 by RobJames

[Capt. Pants 4,236]

I'm struggling with notion that some on here think Omo is worth £15-£20m yet will pick Gibson ahead of him.

Andy O isn't going to warm the bench as that will be a sure fire way if getting sod all for him.

I think the club needs to see the bigger picture here.

[ged in the onion bag 855]

2 hours ago, Capt. Pants said:

I'm struggling with notion that some on here think Omo is worth £15-£20m yet will pick Gibson ahead of him.

Andy O isn't going to warm the bench as that will be a sure fire way if getting sod all for him.

I think the club needs to see the bigger picture here.

Most fans can’t see it either.    
 

They think let’s get promotion and worry about it later…… stuff development.    They can’t see that we’d need a whole new squad and that we don’t have the money for it.    They don’t have a clue that the quality in this team is just not at the level to introduce it in the EPL.
 

But sure enough when we got promoted last time, they couldn’t cope that we weren’t competitive and they won’t cope next time either.    With our funding policy, failing to develop is just unsustainable.  

[daly 503]

14 hours ago, RobJames said:

So you are suggesting we'll be more likely to be facing relegation than promotion. Dream on, binner.

So if someone disagrees with your remark 

You're a binner

Grow up 

[Ward 3 372]

On 30/07/2023 at 09:09, Terminally Yellow said:

Hey look everyone's favourite school kid is back. Mummy letting you use the internet on a Sunday? 

🥱 boring. Oh look nobody liked your comment this time around. 

[Terminally Yellow 2,448]

1 minute ago, Ward 3 said:

Wah wah blub blub wah cry cry cry snob snort snort snort 

Your obsession with me is really odd mate. Keep crying. Maybe someone will care one day. 

[Ward 3 372]

1 minute ago, Terminally Yellow said:

Me me me me me....

Stop screaming for attention, it's embarrassing 

[Terminally Yellow 2,448]

Just now, Ward 3 said:

Stop screaming for attention, it's embarrassing 

Says the guy responding to my messages from 24 hrs ago. Last bite from me as I actually have something to do now rather than talk to petulant cry babies on the internet. I've linked you to the definition of the word petulant as I know you won't understand it. 

Enjoy your summer holidays kid, I'd say go outside but it's just started raining. Watch some cartoons and stop crying on the internet.

[Ward 3 372]

7 hours ago, Terminally Yellow said:

Says the guy responding to my messages from 24 hrs ago. Last bite from me as I actually have something to do now rather than talk to petulant cry babies on the internet. I've linked you to the definition of the word petulant as I know you won't understand it. 

Enjoy your summer holidays kid, I'd say go outside but it's just started raining. Watch some cartoons and stop crying on the internet.

You replied within the same hour everytime 🤣🤣🤣. Cute 

[chicken 2,627]

Hanley is out until Jan. At which point it'd be nuts to rush him back unless we have to. We also have Gibson in the last year of his contract and rumoured to be one of our hoghest paid players.

Duffy covers both the injury to Hanley and the first season, potentially, without Gibson. Clever signing imho.

[Corbs1 89]

I’m a little puzzled by the Omo story thus far. I can’t think of many cases like this in recent times. Unless I’m mistaken he has shown promise but was not a shoe-in for the first team, partly due to a few poorer games.

I understand we are in selling mode, and have to listen to offers, but I’m slightly disappointed that there seems to be an assumption that he’s on his way out and we in fact want this to occur. For me Buendia was clearly overdue to go when he did, but for my money why wouldn’t we want to hold on to a young prospect like Omo. As ever as fans we know little of the real truth, but for me this an unusual one; Omo pushed into the shop window. 

[ged in the onion bag 855]

53 minutes ago, Corbs1 said:

I’m a little puzzled by the Omo story thus far. I can’t think of many cases like this in recent times. Unless I’m mistaken he has shown promise but was not a shoe-in for the first team, partly due to a few poorer games.

I understand we are in selling mode, and have to listen to offers, but I’m slightly disappointed that there seems to be an assumption that he’s on his way out and we in fact want this to occur. For me Buendia was clearly overdue to go when he did, but for my money why wouldn’t we want to hold on to a young prospect like Omo. As ever as fans we know little of the real truth, but for me this an unusual one; Omo pushed into the shop window. 

It does seem odd, I agree.    Initailly the recruitment team failed, now I'm a little concerned about our coaches too.     Many of this latest crop who all have plenty of talent, Idah, Sargent, Tzolis, Omobamidele, Gibbs, McCallum, Rowe and Springett have been around the first team for over two years now (all except McCallum and Gibbs have had minutes in the EPL) and none have 'evidently' progressed very far.   Whether through poor coaching, lack of adequate opportunity (and opportunity in their preferred positions), managers desperate for results so playing tried / tested players or loans and some injuries havent helped either but they aren't coming through as quickly or as convincingly...... and of course we've not been getting the results either.   

Now we have a team like AC Milan interested in our player and think they can get a tune from him.    I suspect they can and fear we won't.

[AJ 1,221]

On 30/07/2023 at 14:59, RobJames said:

That's NOT what happens. Clubs do not leave a better player on the bench so another lesser play can 'develop' - as that is what you are stating. Players make the first team when they are 'up to it'. Some, like Gibbs (and now Fishers I suspect) reach that level early in their career.

If it was the case, either Reyes or Barden would be playing rather than Gunn. Just as Kamara would not have gone out on loan, he would be in the first team ahead of Sgt or Barnes so as to 'progress'.

If there is a serious bid for Omo then that has to be a sale. His value is in his age. Duffy looks and is better, but for how many more seasons. With Omo you are buying another dozen or so seasons. And if as it looks this other Irish lad looks to be signing, then we have him, Tomkinson and Warner already, with Hills as well out on loan.

This season is about getting back to the PL. We'll worry then about what happens next., after that.  Anything surplus that can raise money, or can cut the wage bill needs to be thrown overboard - sorry about the blunt analogy, but stripped down, that's what it amounts to.

I'd say you're being a bit extreme in your reply. Omo is an experienced first teamer who has played regularly in our starting XI in the past season or two. Reyes, Barden and any others you mention are no where near the level Andy is at. Gibson has also hardly set the world on fire when he has played, but he does have experience on his side. 

Would a regular run in the team aid Andy's development and make him a better player? Absolutely yes. But as I said in my original comment, if Wagner opts for the experience of Gibson instead, I would understand that choice. 

[shefcanary 2,409]

A potential solution to the CB crisis (well in a couple of years time anyways).

Norwich City complete signing of Emmanuel Adegboyega - Norwich City (canaries.co.uk)

 

[cambridgeshire canary 6,721]

13 minutes ago, shefcanary said:

A potential solution to the CB crisis (well in a couple of years time anyways).

Norwich City complete signing of Emmanuel Adegboyega - Norwich City (canaries.co.uk)

 

From what I have been hearing he's good enough to be in the first team

[TheGunnShow 5,940]

4 minutes ago, cambridgeshire canary said:

From what I have been hearing he's good enough to be in the first team

Hard to tell with youngsters, especially when coming over from another country. Makes more sense to put him in the Academy set-up. If he's got the minerals, he might just pull a Kellen Fisher off. If not, or he needs more time, then it's a bit easier for him.

[jaberry2 550]

It sounds like Hanley & Tomkinson are ahead of schedule for injury, so with the latter being ready soonish would we require another CB. I suppose the question is, is Tomkinson good enough for the first team? I also hear Sainz is out of his boot and should be available earlier than initial estimates were as well.

[RobJames 881]

An indication of where the club thinks he's at will be what happens. A loan to a L1/2 club would suggest he is just off the first team squad. Joining the U21's suggest he has a way to go yet. Either way, welcome on board Manny.

[mrD66M 99]

2 hours ago, jaberry2 said:

It sounds like Hanley & Tomkinson are ahead of schedule for injury, so with the latter being ready soonish would we require another CB. I suppose the question is, is Tomkinson good enough for the first team? I also hear Sainz is out of his boot and should be available earlier than initial estimates were as well.

Easy on that optimism 😂