The rot runs deep

[Robert N. LiM 4,386]

3 minutes ago, Nexus_Canary said:

Although the Daniel Farkes yellow army which must have gone on for near 10 mins was quality.

Did that really happen or are you joking?

[Jimmy Raggatip 60]

what percentage of the blame do we have to appoint on the players for the mess we are in? At some point there will become a common denominator across the entire portfolio of shít that we are collating

[Nexus_Canary 1,020]

12 minutes ago, Robert N. LiM said:

Did that really happen or are you joking?

It happened, started as a Allan Russell then transformed into a Daniel Farkes 

[littleyellowbirdie 2,551]

1 hour ago, Richard Richard said:

A tough job on his hands....that he was being handsomely paid for.

Decent and respectful he may have been (in the main) but ultimately he failed regardless of how many posts you create to try and convince everyone that his sacking was a mistake.

It's almost comical.

He was paid for it.So what? Pukki's paid. Does everybody cry out to get rid when he has a bad game. No they don't, because he's in a contract.

This idiocy over managers is ridiculous. Learn the lesson from this and let whoever gets the job next get on with to the end of the season. You'll back the team energetically with no manager at all ffs. On the other hand, people will boo and jeer the players because they're in a strop over the manager.

Killing their energy with negativity just because people think they know better than whoever happens to be manager at the time is stupid. Too many people on here think they should be club directors instead of supporters,that's their problem.

You know, someone had a go because I'm in another country like hundreds of thousands of other fans who don't live within driving distance of Carrow Road. We still support the club, but it doesn't matter a damn if we're sitting in front of the TV cheering, booing, or just bored. You guys make a difference, and if you're not interested in trying to make a positive difference then you have to include yourself as part of the club's problem.

[By Hook or Ian crook 917]

2 hours ago, Davidlingfield said:

Wholly unqualified husband and wife, sorry I mean wife and husband (the younger, not the older couple) running the club - doesn’t matter if it is 4-4-2, 4-3-3 or 5-3-2. It will remain broken under the current status quo.

As I understand it there is deep trouble between some of the board. It’s not very rosy at the top. 

[Richard Richard 186]

9 minutes ago, littleyellowbirdie said:

He was paid for it.So what? Pukki's paid. Does everybody cry out to get rid when he has a bad game. No they don't, because he's in a contract.

This idiocy over managers is ridiculous. Learn the lesson from this and let whoever gets the job next get on with to the end of the season. You'll back the team energetically with no manager at all ffs. On the other hand, people will boo and jeer the players because they're in a strop over the manager.

Killing their energy with negativity just because people think they know better than whoever happens to be manager at the time is stupid. Too many people on here think they should be club directors instead of supporters,that's their problem.

You know, someone had a go because I'm in another country like hundreds of thousands of other fans who don't live within driving distance of Carrow Road. We still support the club, but it doesn't matter a damn if we're sitting in front of the TV cheering, booing, or just bored. You guys make a difference, and if you're not interested in trying to make a positive difference then you have to include yourself as part of the club's problem.

I'm sorry Birdie, I have little sympathy for Smith. As with all managers, he'll live and die by his success (or lack of).  I don't think the treatment he received at FCR was any harsher than he would have received at any other club given his very poor run of results.

Inevitably, when results are poor, fans will question methods and team selections (and probably fantasize that they know better). 

Unfortunately, for managers, it comes with the territory.

We're all fans, we all want to get behind the team and whoever is manager. I have no preference for who that is - I just hope we improve and start getting back a playing style and identity.

COYY.

 

[Capt. Pants 4,247]

1 hour ago, Robert N. LiM said:

Did that really happen or are you joking?

We were singing it in the Upper Barclay. More gallows humour than anything. Just soul destroying at the moment although the crowd were very supportive unlike when Smith was in charge.

[kenfoggo 247]

After the debacle of the last 12 or 13 games , or the last 18 months, or whatever, and especially after the game at home to Watford which was yet another loss, it must be apparent that the problems at the Club go much further , much deeper than simply the Head Coach.  Farke could not get this squad to work, Dean Smith could not get this squad to work and now the interim coaching team prove that the squad will not work for them either. Which leads me to conclude that this squad is just not good enough. Today we saw no skill, little application and very few ideas. Hanley could not lead a band of Boy Scouts to the corner shop and no player could hit the side of a barn with the ball let alone the opposition goal. It was a sad , sad waste of an afternoon. It really seems not to matter anymore who gets appointed to the position of Head Coach, this sad, tired, jaded, inadequate bunch are not fit for purpose. The Head Coach appointment and the recruitment and construction of this squad is the responsibility of the Sporting Director, a man who will only dedicate 90% of his massive abilities to the job, in between fell walking. The appointment and retention of the Sporting Director is the responsibility of the Directors ( one of whom is the Wife of the Sporting Director so no conflict of interest there)  and the Owners. All of this equates to problems at the Club from the top to the bottom. Sad times with no easy or quick fix. A root and crop rebuild required.

[SwearyCanary 1,179]

41 minutes ago, littleyellowbirdie said:

He was paid for it.So what? Pukki's paid. Does everybody cry out to get rid when he has a bad game. No they don't, because he's in a contract.

This idiocy over managers is ridiculous. Learn the lesson from this and let whoever gets the job next get on with to the end of the season. You'll back the team energetically with no manager at all ffs. On the other hand, people will boo and jeer the players because they're in a strop over the manager.

Killing their energy with negativity just because people think they know better than whoever happens to be manager at the time is stupid. Too many people on here think they should be club directors instead of supporters,that's their problem.

You know, someone had a go because I'm in another country like hundreds of thousands of other fans who don't live within driving distance of Carrow Road. We still support the club, but it doesn't matter a damn if we're sitting in front of the TV cheering, booing, or just bored. You guys make a difference, and if you're not interested in trying to make a positive difference then you have to include yourself as part of the club's problem.

Lyb, the fans WERE trying to make a positive difference. The fans that saw all of the matches recognised Smith was bringing the club down, they voiced their discontent after pretty considerable time and although support has not hit the heights of peak DF years it was MILES from toxic or even just negative on match days until the very recent continued run of bad results. Posters on a forum voiced their concerns earlier based on what they saw, which is completely reasonable but it never really found it’s way into the ground until the position became indefensible. The crowd sought positive change, that required Smith’s removal, therefore the vehicle we have to deliver that message is as seen and heard. Supporters abroad can not take an active part in that, which is a shame. They also can not criticise those that do take an active part because their context is without vital detail. Look, WE GET IT, you think Smith was the answer and you think the fans were the cause of the poor performances. You are entitled to think that. You are in a very exclusive club however, which is fine but it’s done now. The club agreed with us and disagreed with you. Or the club pandered to us (mental if you think that’s the case but hey ho). Either way, what possible good is there of you chiming on? If you really support the club you’ll get behind the new manager now it’s patently obvious Smith isn’t coming back. Anything other than that is just petty and shows your only motivation for continuing is so you can sneeringly sit in your armchair, presumably talking to yourself saying ‘I told them so’. Truth is, even this is TOTALLY futile because you and we will NEVER know what would’ve happened under Smith. NEVER EVER. So there’s no way of proving either side ‘right’.

Just. Drop. It. 

Edited January 2, 2023 by SwearyCanary

[Creedence Clearwater Couto 1,287]

Smith wasn’t the answer, but like Farke, he was completely failed by a Sporting Director who’s set to appoint another fall guy. 

Dean Smith is not as bad a manger as many make out. Far from it. The squad is unbalanced, unable, demotivated and not bursting a gut for Norwich City. He was never going to succeed. 

£12 million on two South Americans, after the Tzolis and Rashica disasters, was irresponsible. That money should’ve be spent on players Smith wanted, and more importantly trusts. 
 

 

[littleyellowbirdie 2,551]

16 minutes ago, SwearyCanary said:

Lyb, the fans WERE trying to make a positive difference. The fans that saw all of the matches recognised Smith was bringing the club down, they voiced their discontent after pretty considerable time and although support has not hit the heights of peak DF years it was MILES from toxic or even just negative on match days until the very recent continued run of bad results. Posters on a forum voiced their concerns earlier based on what they saw, which is completely reasonable but it never really found it’s way into the ground until the position became indefensible. The crowd sought positive change, that required Smith’s removal, therefore the vehicle we have to deliver that message is as seen and heard. Supporters abroad can not take an active part in that, which is a shame. They also can not criticise those that do take an active part because their context is without vital detail. Look, WE GET IT, you think Smith was the answer and you think the fans were the cause of the poor performances. You are entitled to think that. You are in a very exclusive club however, which is fine but it’s done now. The club agreed with us and disagreed with you. Or the club pandered to us (mental if you think that’s the case but hey ho). Either way, what possible good is there of you chiming on? If you really support the club you’ll get behind the new manager now it’s patently obvious Smith isn’t coming back. Anything other than that is just petty and shows your only motivation for continuing is so you can sneeringly sit in your armchair, presumably talking to yourself saying ‘I told them so’. Truth is, even this is TOTALLY futile because you and we will NEVER know what would’ve happened under Smith. NEVER EVER. So there’s no way of proving either side ‘right’.

Just. Drop. It. 

It was a library practically the whole season! When when we were top everybody looked half asleep in the stands. lAt no point was there anything like the positive energy of the crowd as there was the last couple of games. Anybody watching can see and hear the difference.

Make excuses to yourself if you want about it not being entertaining enough, even though we know full well the players need lots of work, but if 'entertaining' is more important to you than winning then be ready to lose, the club to get poorer and poorer, the players recruited to get cheaper and cheaper, and any hope of entertaining football to disappear.

Edited January 2, 2023 by littleyellowbirdie

[SwearyCanary 1,179]

12 minutes ago, littleyellowbirdie said:

It was a library practically the whole season! When when we were top everybody looked half asleep in the stands. lAt no point was there anything like the positive energy of the crowd as there was the last couple of games. Anybody watching can see and hear the difference.

Make excuses to yourself if you want about it not being entertaining enough, even though we know full well the players need lots of work, but if 'entertaining' is more important to you than winning then be ready to lose, the club to get poorer and poorer, the players recruited to get cheaper and cheaper, and any hope of entertaining football to disappear.

Sigh, I tried. 

As you weren’t there for those games you can’t accurately judge it. Noise wasn’t tremulous but it certainly wasn’t a library, except during spells where nothing cheer worthy happened, which was about 80% of all games under DS. Also, not sure you can really quote yourself when making an argument against that quote 😂. I haven’t said anywhere in my post about ‘entertaining’ football being a motivator for wanting Smith out. You can quote ‘ineffective’ if you like? What was Dean Smith’s win % again? (It’s ok I found it for you. 28.57%. Hint: it’s worse than Bryan Gunn and comfortably the worst since Megson who both had half the number of games before being axed). 

 

[littleyellowbirdie 2,551]

34 minutes ago, SwearyCanary said:

Sigh, I tried. 

As you weren’t there for those games you can’t accurately judge it. Noise wasn’t tremulous but it certainly wasn’t a library, except during spells where nothing cheer worthy happened, which was about 80% of all games under DS. Also, not sure you can really quote yourself when making an argument against that quote 😂. I haven’t said anywhere in my post about ‘entertaining’ football being a motivator for wanting Smith out. You can quote ‘ineffective’ if you like? What was Dean Smith’s win % again? (It’s ok I found it for you. 28.57%. Hint: it’s worse than Bryan Gunn and comfortably the worst since Megson who both had half the number of games before being axed). 

 

Nothing cheerworthy happened... nothing much cheerworthy happened these last two games either, but y'all seemed a lot more willing to encourage the players for the sake of having got your way over one guy who watches from the sidelines during a game.

[kenfoggo 247]

It is clear now that the problem was not Daniel Farke nor Dean Smith. The problem was the with squad who are just not good enough. They have been told that they are the best squad in the Championship, but they are not. They are devoid of skill, application, commitment and effort. The Reading and Watford performances at home were as dire as anything ever seen at Carrow Road. The squad is recruited and constructed by the Sporting Director who will now probably appoint an old chum who is out of work and who failed spectacularly in his last two posts. You could not make this situation up, the Sporting Director is virtually undismissable  because his wife is a Director of the Club, and so he will never be held to account for this utter failure . It is a comedy that makes our Club the laughing stock of the Championship as we free fall down the league. Currently 11th. Even Ben Gibson admits the players are “sleep walking” and that they “need to wake up”!  No pride in playing for our Club and no professionalism displayed from this bunch of sleepwalking inadequates. Like many others I find it hard to justify wasting my time and my hard earned money on Supporting this rabble of losers. 

[Indy 3,301]

How can anyone defend Smith as a manager? The players have had their say that it wasn’t working under Smith and they’re happy to see a change and Webber’s too arrogant to admit he got it wrong! It’s the fans fault Smith didn’t know how to get more out of a group of players Farke lead to two championship titles!

Yes the change needs to happen and it starts by the clubs owners and club board acknowledging that the fans are the most important thing to any club, opening up a transparent communication link vis the press again and not being so quick in allowing Webber’s to run a club to their way. If it’s the current majority shareholders true intentions of selling the club then they need to do it quick, agree the deal and move on, as if Webber gets this next appointment wrong we’re fast slipping down the league with a squad of players who look devoid of any passion, fight, quality or cohesion.

[canarybubbles 1,923]

19 minutes ago, kenfoggo said:

It is clear now that the problem was not Daniel Farke nor Dean Smith. The problem was the with squad who are just not good enough. They have been told that they are the best squad in the Championship, but they are not. They are devoid of skill, application, commitment and effort. The Reading and Watford performances at home were as dire as anything ever seen at Carrow Road. The squad is recruited and constructed by the Sporting Director who will now probably appoint an old chum who is out of work and who failed spectacularly in his last two posts. You could not make this situation up, the Sporting Director is virtually undismissable  because his wife is a Director of the Club, and so he will never be held to account for this utter failure . It is a comedy that makes our Club the laughing stock of the Championship as we free fall down the league. Currently 11th. Even Ben Gibson admits the players are “sleep walking” and that they “need to wake up”!  No pride in playing for our Club and no professionalism displayed from this bunch of sleepwalking inadequates. Like many others I find it hard to justify wasting my time and my hard earned money on Supporting this rabble of losers. 

Aarons, Hanley, Gibson, Giannoulis, McLean, Pukki and Cantwell all played a huge part in our last Champs season when we got 97 points. OK, time moves on, and maybe some of them are past their peak, but five of those players have featured regularly this season. Gunn, I would argue, has performed at least as well as Krul did in 20/21.

So half of the side are the same as two years ago and yet the team as a whole is a shadow of what it was two years ago. Yes, we don't have Buendia or Skipp, but I don't think we can assume it's as simple as that no matter how crucial that pair were, so I don't think it's right to call the current squad 'devoid of skill'. Application, commitment and effort I can agree with, but that does not make them bad players, it makes them unmotivated players or perhaps players who don't know what they are supposed to do on the pitch or don't agree with it.

I think we have to give a new manager time to see if he can get a tune again out of these players.

[kenfoggo 247]

1 minute ago, canarybubbles said:

Aarons, Hanley, Gibson, Giannoulis, McLean, Pukki and Cantwell all played a huge part in our last Champs season when we got 97 points. OK, time moves on, and maybe some of them are past their peak, but five of those players have featured regularly this season. Gunn, I would argue, has performed at least as well as Krul did in 20/21.

So half of the side are the same as two years ago and yet the team as a whole is a shadow of what it was two years ago. Yes, we don't have Buendia or Skipp, but I don't think we can assume it's as simple as that no matter how crucial that pair were, so I don't think it's right to call the current squad 'devoid of skill'. Application, commitment and effort I can agree with, but that does not make them bad players, it makes them unmotivated players or perhaps players who don't know what they are supposed to do on the pitch or don't agree with it.

I think we have to give a new manager time to see if he can get a tune again out of these players.

I think that there are too many senior players, Hanley being the most obvious, who believe that they are undroppable and are automatic selections for the team. These “core” players transmit this mindset to the rest who have become complacent, unmotivated and are “sleepwalking “, as Ben Gibson admits, into free fall down the table. They have become comfortable with losing and see that they still get selected and paid no matter how poorly they play, so what is their motivation to change? Get young, hungry, ambitious , motivated players in who have something to prove.

[Hank shoots Skyler 2,094]

10 hours ago, littleyellowbirdie said:

Nothing cheerworthy happened... nothing much cheerworthy happened these last two games either, but y'all seemed a lot more willing to encourage the players for the sake of having got your way over one guy who watches from the sidelines during a game.

And we still only earned a draw and a loss out of that willing encouragement from the fanbase - almost like it’s not the only thing that affects the players right? 

[Naturalcynic 631]

Too many armchair managers on here who seem to think our problems on the pitch could be turned around by playing a different formation, or by dropping someone, or changing someone else’s position, or playing a more direct game, or having earlier substitutions, or having different substitutions etc.  The real problems with our club run much deeper than whether we’re playing to Josh Sargent’s strengths or whether Hanley should be dropped.  NCFC is in a real mess and is slowly decaying from the top down.  Under 26 years of Mr and Mrs Wynne-Jones’ ownership the Club has failed to move forward in any meaningful way.  Yes, we’ve had lots of promotions, but they’ve been cancelled out by the same number of rapid relegations, and here we are once again as a bang average Championship side.  Strident protests were made against Robert Chase due, mainly, to perceived lack of ambition (selling our best players, not keeping Mike Walker, being relegated) despite us having had our most successful period under his ownership.  Yet now our apparent lack of ambition and acceptance of mediocrity seems so much more ingrained, with many supporters being unwilling or unable to accept any murmur of dissent directed at Delia and her husband.  Make no mistake, NCFC is in a real mess, and that runs from the top to the bottom.  Radical change is needed, and that has to start with the ownership.

[littleyellowbirdie 2,551]

 

15 minutes ago, Hank shoots Skyler said:

And we still only earned a draw and a loss out of that willing encouragement from the fanbase - almost like it’s not the only thing that affects the players right? 

Encouragement is not the only thing that affects the players; neither is the manager the only thing that affects the players.

A half season of trying to mould a team was undermined by apathy from fans; two games of enthusiastic effort from excited fans have been undermined by no direction. You need both together, and fans need to forget about obsessing over opinions on managers.

The irony is that the commentary about players on this forum is more interesting than I've ever seen at the moment because we're not swamped with infinite posts dumping on a manager because we don't have one!

But equally it's no good dumping on the players either. They're not good enough, but they want to be better than they are, which needs them to work hard, a coach who can nurture their skills, and a fan base willing to accept they're not perfect and be in their corner every game come what may and that lets them know it.

Edited January 3, 2023 by littleyellowbirdie

[Mello Yello 2,296]

Anyway it's just over a month away before I'm once again (annually) called, 'a much valued supporter'....."Kerching!"..... 😉 

 

[Petriix 2,840]

4 hours ago, Naturalcynic said:

Too many armchair managers on here who seem to think our problems on the pitch could be turned around by playing a different formation, or by dropping someone, or changing someone else’s position, or playing a more direct game, or having earlier substitutions, or having different substitutions etc.  The real problems with our club run much deeper than whether we’re playing to Josh Sargent’s strengths or whether Hanley should be dropped.  NCFC is in a real mess and is slowly decaying from the top down.  Under 26 years of Mr and Mrs Wynne-Jones’ ownership the Club has failed to move forward in any meaningful way.  Yes, we’ve had lots of promotions, but they’ve been cancelled out by the same number of rapid relegations, and here we are once again as a bang average Championship side.  Strident protests were made against Robert Chase due, mainly, to perceived lack of ambition (selling our best players, not keeping Mike Walker, being relegated) despite us having had our most successful period under his ownership.  Yet now our apparent lack of ambition and acceptance of mediocrity seems so much more ingrained, with many supporters being unwilling or unable to accept any murmur of dissent directed at Delia and her husband.  Make no mistake, NCFC is in a real mess, and that runs from the top to the bottom.  Radical change is needed, and that has to start with the ownership.

There is so much I disagree with in this post. Firstly I'm not sure how you can claim to be a Norwich fan and fail to appreciate the excitement and drama of the last 15 years. Short of being a regular top 6 Premier League club with frequent European campaigns, I can't imagine any UK club's supporters have been so entertained. If you would honestly have traded places with Everton for this period then I politely suggest that maybe you should go and support them.

Secondly you didn't seem to notice how most of these players were recently performing way above their current level largely because they were playing a different formation. The downturn has coincided with a failed attempt to change the style of play which is inexplicably carrying on despite changing the manager.

Thirdly you seem to have a weird belief that a change of ownership would miraculously deliver success despite countless examples of clubs which have been bought by incredibly wealthy backers yet performed far worse than us. While we'd all love a cash injection, new owners are far from guaranteed to invest in the playing squad in any meaningful way.

I suspect you are resorting to insulting us 'armchair managers' because you don't have any kind of rational input to the debate about tactics yourself. Maybe you should just scroll on by.

[Naturalcynic 631]

40 minutes ago, Petriix said:

There is so much I disagree with in this post. Firstly I'm not sure how you can claim to be a Norwich fan and fail to appreciate the excitement and drama of the last 15 years. Short of being a regular top 6 Premier League club with frequent European campaigns, I can't imagine any UK club's supporters have been so entertained. If you would honestly have traded places with Everton for this period then I politely suggest that maybe you should go and support them.

Secondly you didn't seem to notice how most of these players were recently performing way above their current level largely because they were playing a different formation. The downturn has coincided with a failed attempt to change the style of play which is inexplicably carrying on despite changing the manager.

Thirdly you seem to have a weird belief that a change of ownership would miraculously deliver success despite countless examples of clubs which have been bought by incredibly wealthy backers yet performed far worse than us. While we'd all love a cash injection, new owners are far from guaranteed to invest in the playing squad in any meaningful way.

I suspect you are resorting to insulting us 'armchair managers' because you don't have any kind of rational input to the debate about tactics yourself. Maybe you should just scroll on by.

Not sure how you can claim to be a Norwich fan?  Go and support Everton?  Charming.  You were the one who used the title “The rot runs deep”, and I was agreeing with that sentiment, but giving my opinion that it goes much deeper than you wish to admit.

[Canaries north 151]

6 hours ago, canarybubbles said:

Aarons, Hanley, Gibson, Giannoulis, McLean, Pukki and Cantwell all played a huge part in our last Champs season when we got 97 points. OK, time moves on, and maybe some of them are past their peak, but five of those players have featured regularly this season. Gunn, I would argue, has performed at least as well as Krul did in 20/21.

So half of the side are the same as two years ago and yet the team as a whole is a shadow of what it was two years ago. Yes, we don't have Buendia or Skipp, but I don't think we can assume it's as simple as that no matter how crucial that pair were, so I don't think it's right to call the current squad 'devoid of skill'. Application, commitment and effort I can agree with, but that does not make them bad players, it makes them unmotivated players or perhaps players who don't know what they are supposed to do on the pitch or don't agree with it.

I think we have to give a new manager time to see if he can get a tune again out of these players.

In my opinion we have a solid team but no flair or out and out pace. I struggle to see a player who can do that trick or bit of skill that gets you out of your seat. Pukki is still a fantastic forward, but he needs service. He needs that player behind him who will beat a man with a bit of skill or pace. Watford were absolutely down to bare bones before the game kicked off then lost 3 players during the game but still had Sarr with the pace to open things up. If that had been a certain Cuban the ball would not have reached the striker. I guess people will say Cantwell but for any number of reasons he can't even get on the pitch. I'm not the biggest Dean Smith fan but I am very worried if anyone can get anything out of this squad more than solid performances. We don't have pace or flair so any other team can sit back in a good shape and we will struggle. 

[Indy 3,301]

It is very interesting all the threads running and the usual posters sway the way they do, but with all our opinions they do not matter, it really should be the club’s majority share holders who dictate what is expected, what goals need to be achieved and serve the consequences. As with any business trying to survive on a budget, there must be goals set for each individual to achieve and if these are failed then they need to fully justify why these have not been met and how things will need to be improved on to achieve them in the next set time frame.

I don’t see any of these goals, Smith should have been sacked pre World Cup, new manager in place and a new plan formalised by the board, putting pressure on Webber to improve his past 12 month performance.

As for the next appointment I hope it isn’t another knee jerk appointment with some sort of justification by Webber, it has to be one which is borne of a young successful manager on the up, not another sacked manager who has some form of proven track record. We don’t need Bruce, not sure Wagner is the right man neither, for me someone who has taken a team on a tight budget and with possible connections to this club might just unite the fans, get all the fans back behind the players and it might just be what’s required to save this season. If Wagner does come in, can’t get this squad going he’s not going to get much time from an already unsettled Canary fan base. I don’t envy anyone who comes in now…..

Edited January 3, 2023 by Indy

[Tumbleweed 106]

I think there are a variety of factors here, and therefore not one single "fix"

1. Smith was clearly not a good fit from the start, obviously a knee jerk reaction leading to a total  dismantling of what Farke had created

2. Recruitment has been patchy with some big signings simply not performing, Rashica being a prime example, and a big gamble on Sara and Nunez settling in super-quickly in one of the toughest leagues out there

3. Morale was tanked by two awful relegations, we were labelled an embarrassment to the PL on a regular basis by almost the entire media

4. (Manager) Smith's disconnect with/contempt for the fans and almost deliberate goading left the atmosphere flat and then poisonous

5. Lack of money available reduces flexibility to fix stuff, the self funding model appears a total anachronism like playing VHS on an OLED TV and complaining about picture quality

6. I have no inside knowledge and have no idea of what NCFC is like behind the scenes but seems like it is run by two couples with a lack of strong quality people around them

For me the solutions are multiple and include, to me at least, as a minimum:

1. Short term- spend time to identify and invest in another young(ish) and hungry manager. I'd like Paul Warne or Emma Hayes but the former is now at Derby and the latter probably too expensive and "left field". That appointee must have worked out, prior to appointment, what system suits the existing player set the best and that should be tested hard in interview.

2 Medium term-  Break up the Ward/Webber duopoloy and recruit a couple of experienced footballing execs to provide balance and experience from elsewhere. The culture at the club may need a bit of a shake up and more positivity. Frankly if Webber had not, at the time of Smith's sacking, already got a continually reviewed succession plan of likely candidates for item 1 then someone must hold him to account as that must surely be a key part of his role

3. Longer term- Sadly I think that Delia and MWJ's time really is up. They need to sell before they  have gone past their "best before" date, if that has not happened  already. Go while the fondness remains and ahead of their financial limitations starting to poison any legacy. Football has changed forever, it is a money game now and without it a club is destined for only short term achievements.

I'm sure there's other stuff but simply swapping from a 4-3-3 to a 4-5-1 or playing Hayden rather than Gibbs is just nibbling at the edges and may gain a few league places but is likely to be just a temporary filip.

[ridgeman 131]

21 hours ago, kenfoggo said:

After the debacle of the last 12 or 13 games , or the last 18 months, or whatever, and especially after the game at home to Watford which was yet another loss, it must be apparent that the problems at the Club go much further , much deeper than simply the Head Coach.  Farke could not get this squad to work, Dean Smith could not get this squad to work and now the interim coaching team prove that the squad will not work for them either. Which leads me to conclude that this squad is just not good enough. Today we saw no skill, little application and very few ideas. Hanley could not lead a band of Boy Scouts to the corner shop and no player could hit the side of a barn with the ball let alone the opposition goal. It was a sad , sad waste of an afternoon. It really seems not to matter anymore who gets appointed to the position of Head Coach, this sad, tired, jaded, inadequate bunch are not fit for purpose. The Head Coach appointment and the recruitment and construction of this squad is the responsibility of the Sporting Director, a man who will only dedicate 90% of his massive abilities to the job, in between fell walking. The appointment and retention of the Sporting Director is the responsibility of the Directors ( one of whom is the Wife of the Sporting Director so no conflict of interest there)  and the Owners. All of this equates to problems at the Club from the top to the bottom. Sad times with no easy or quick fix. A root and crop rebuild required.

Interesting to read the comments of journalist Nick Ma****ter on twitter ; 7 Nov 21  Don't expect it to cure all the ills at Norwich though. Problems run much deeper.  27 Dec 22  - 13 months on since sacking Daniel Farke and you can change  the manager again but the bigger problems remain.

It seems those in the know have known about the problems for some time only the majority shareholders are unaware of any problems.

[keelansgrandad 6,679]

5 minutes ago, ridgeman said:

Interesting to read the comments of journalist Nick Ma****ter on twitter ; 7 Nov 21  Don't expect it to cure all the ills at Norwich though. Problems run much deeper.  27 Dec 22  - 13 months on since sacking Daniel Farke and you can change  the manager again but the bigger problems remain.

It seems those in the know have known about the problems for some time only the majority shareholders are unaware of any problems.

Or of course others can either ignore it or deny it.

[Nexus_Canary 1,020]

23 hours ago, littleyellowbirdie said:

He was paid for it.So what? Pukki's paid. Does everybody cry out to get rid when he has a bad game. No they don't, because he's in a contract.

This idiocy over managers is ridiculous. Learn the lesson from this and let whoever gets the job next get on with to the end of the season. You'll back the team energetically with no manager at all ffs. On the other hand, people will boo and jeer the players because they're in a strop over the manager.

Killing their energy with negativity just because people think they know better than whoever happens to be manager at the time is stupid. Too many people on here think they should be club directors instead of supporters,that's their problem.

You know, someone had a go because I'm in another country like hundreds of thousands of other fans who don't live within driving distance of Carrow Road. We still support the club, but it doesn't matter a damn if we're sitting in front of the TV cheering, booing, or just bored. You guys make a difference, and if you're not interested in trying to make a positive difference then you have to include yourself as part of the club's problem.

What a melt 🤣