Do you think we'll see Tzolis in a Norwich shirt again?

[KeiranShikari 1,524]

Can obviously leave the discussion in the other thread. Interested to see how people are feeling on this one.

[Mr Angry 2,017]

29 minutes ago, KeiranShikari said:

Can obviously leave the discussion in the other thread. Interested to see how people are feeling on this one.

Like Hugill, we will never see Tzolis in a Norwich shirt again 🤣

[KeiranShikari 1,524]

5 minutes ago, Mr Angry said:

Like Hugill, we will never see Tzolis in a Norwich shirt again 🤣

I thought it would be Tzolis staying with Hernandez leaving. 

[AJ 1,359]

Smith seemed pretty clear he wants Tzolis to have a future here but he needs to go play and develop. A season it with regular match time could kick start his career

[Yobocop 1,444]

42 minutes ago, AJ said:

Smith seemed pretty clear he wants Tzolis to have a future here but he needs to go play and develop. A season it with regular match time could kick start his career

Agree 

[canarybubbles 2,199]

I don't think Smith's statement carries any weight. Smith says what people want to hear. The PR side of modern football management is one aspect of his job which he's very good at IMO. Saying very little, coming out with platitudes, and yet generally leaving a positive impression is not a talent many coaches have.

Edited July 23, 2022 by canarybubbles

[ged in the onion bag 961]

Hope so but fear he’s scarred here.   This loan is a year late, major balls up by the club.    Gotta feel for the lad, we should have known better….. season of development pretty much wasted and his reputation with our unreasonable fans is already shot!    

[hogesar 10,763]

Possibly, but I've seen very little to suggest he is suited to English football. 

[Danke bitte 1,154]

3 minutes ago, hogesar said:

Possibly, but I've seen very little to suggest he is suited to English football. 

Usually you’re very balanced with your critique of our players but you really don’t rate Tzolis do you?! You almost border on Lakey and Snodgrass’s tentative relationship 😁

[canarybubbles 2,199]

If he doesn't succeed at Twente and comes back, it's hard to see him making the first team for us, especially if we have by any chance got promoted again.

On the other hand, if he's a massive success at Twente, why would he want to come back to a club where either he failed, or he was badly neglected, or both, especially if good European clubs are sniffing around him and we haven't got promoted?

The only way I could see him playing for us again is if the reality is somewhere in-between: he's a qualified success at Twente and we believe we can develop him further.

 

[hogesar 10,763]

8 minutes ago, Danke bitte said:

Usually you’re very balanced with your critique of our players but you really don’t rate Tzolis do you?! You almost border on Lakey and Snodgrass’s tentative relationship 😁

Yeah I'm told regularly I'm too harsh on him for a supposedly bright European, talented winger I've not seen him with any significant pace, which when you think about it there's few top wingers at Prem level who don't have pace. Secondly, he's not particularly tall or physical or skillful to make up for that, from what I've seen.

Of course, his confidence has been low and that can transform a player but I don't really even see the raw attributes of a top winger. Here's hoping he proves me incredibly wrong, mind.

[canarybubbles 2,199]

Just now, hogesar said:

Yeah I'm told regularly I'm too harsh on him for a supposedly bright European, talented winger I've not seen him with any significant pace, which when you think about it there's few top wingers at Prem level who don't have pace. Secondly, he's not particularly tall or physical or skillful to make up for that, from what I've seen.

Of course, his confidence has been low and that can transform a player but I don't really even see the raw attributes of a top winger. Here's hoping he proves me incredibly wrong, mind.

Maybe he won't turn out to be a winger?

[Branston Pickle 4,150]

There should be a ‘whatever’ option as tbh I don’t really mind either way: if he has a good season then he comes back so it’s hopefully yes; otherwise it is what it is and presumably no.

But ultimately, hopefully for the lad he gets going and delivers on the apparent talent he has - not that we saw a huge amount of evidence of it last season.

[cambridgeshire canary 7,798]

I have heard posters say the same about Hugill and Cantwell in the past so I'm not going to risk saying no

Edited July 23, 2022 by cambridgeshire canary

[Capt. Pants 5,008]

I would rather play against Tzolis than I would Hugill. 

 

[hogesar 10,763]

28 minutes ago, Capt. Pants said:

I would rather play against Tzolis than I would Hugill. 

 

Yep, he doesn't seem to have a key attribute that makes him difficult to fear with or causes defences major problems.

48 minutes ago, canarybubbles said:

Maybe he won't turn out to be a winger?

Possibly, but he doesn't have the pace to play as a second striker and nothing to suggest he has the vision for a number 10 spot. Maybe it'll become clearer if he gets lots of game time on loan.

[TIL 1010 5,246]

1 hour ago, hogesar said:

Yeah I'm told regularly I'm too harsh on him for a supposedly bright European, talented winger I've not seen him with any significant pace, which when you think about it there's few top wingers at Prem level who don't have pace. Secondly, he's not particularly tall or physical or skillful to make up for that, from what I've seen.

Of course, his confidence has been low and that can transform a player but I don't really even see the raw attributes of a top winger. Here's hoping he proves me incredibly wrong, mind.

Yeah but would you look twice at him at Sloughbottom Park on a Sunday morning ? 😂

[canarybubbles 2,199]

27 minutes ago, hogesar said:

Yep, he doesn't seem to have a key attribute that makes him difficult to fear with or causes defences major problems.

Possibly, but he doesn't have the pace to play as a second striker and nothing to suggest he has the vision for a number 10 spot. Maybe it'll become clearer if he gets lots of game time on loan.

Obviously, none of us has much evidence to go on when we talk about Tzolis because he played so few minutes over the past season. But from the little I've seen, I would argue that he has a good eye for goal, and I would much prefer a chance to fall to him than either Rashica or Sargent or, if the chance was on the ground, Hugill. I also think Tzolis is constantly trying to get into good positions to receive the ball when we have it around the box, and that for this particular skill speed of movement is much less important than quick speed of thought and a strong positional sense. I think he is a much better reader of the overall pattern of forward play than, for example, Rashica. Rashica, for me, is a much more traditional winger whose strength is trickery and a floated cross into the box (which may explain why there is a general agreement on here that he and Pukki never really built up any kind of understanding). Finally, I get the feeling that Tzolis is a player who works better alongside other players, and therefore needs to move infield, unlike 'true' wingers whose work is more individualistic.

Again, let me say I know this is very speculative based on little evidence. I agree with you, though, that we have seen nothing to suggest that Tzolis might be anything special out on the wing. In that situation, he looks slow and a bit leaden-footed.

[Ken Hairy 4,272]

1 hour ago, hogesar said:

Yeah I'm told regularly I'm too harsh on him for a supposedly bright European, talented winger I've not seen him with any significant pace, which when you think about it there's few top wingers at Prem level who don't have pace. Secondly, he's not particularly tall or physical or skillful to make up for that, from what I've seen.

Of course, his confidence has been low and that can transform a player but I don't really even see the raw attributes of a top winger. Here's hoping he proves me incredibly wrong, mind.

I totally agree with you, it'll be interesting to see how he pans out this season in The Netherlands, but I don't see a single attribute in him currently to suggest he'll ever make it here. 

Edited July 23, 2022 by Ken Hairy

[The Real Buh 3,765]

Wolfswinkle II

[chicken 3,086]

He'll be playing with the big bad wolf next season so I think it could actually work out nicely as Ricky has always been a bit gutted it didn't work out with us. Perhaps his wise words of advice and someone with a Norwich connection could help Tzolis?

Edit:
 

Edited July 23, 2022 by chicken

[ged in the onion bag 961]

2 hours ago, canarybubbles said:

If he doesn't succeed at Twente and comes back, it's hard to see him making the first team for us, especially if we have by any chance got promoted again.

On the other hand, if he's a massive success at Twente, why would he want to come back to a club where either he failed, or he was badly neglected, or both, especially if good European clubs are sniffing around him and we haven't got promoted?

The only way I could see him playing for us again is if the reality is somewhere in-between: he's a qualified success at Twente and we believe we can develop him further.

 

That sounds about right, which (unless he is an absolute superstar) is probably in a scenario where we don't get promoted ourselves!  

[pete 371]

Only way to recoup any fees paid is for Tzolis to show there is a player there.  Don't expect Dutch club to spend fees wanted even if proves to be superstar.  Will have to prove that in EFL.  Just hope he gets the opportunities to show what he casn do and not bench wasrmer. 

[shefcanary 2,955]

If we get promoted to the EPL, Tzolis has a fair season in the Eredivisie building a rapport with The Wolf, I can see him coming back. I think as he matures and fills out, he could become a Mitrovic type player scoring for fun. 😲 Yes, you read that right, just hoping he scores more in the EPL than what Mitrovic has done so far.

[Mr Angry 2,017]

3 hours ago, canarybubbles said:

If he doesn't succeed at Twente and comes back, it's hard to see him making the first team for us, especially if we have by any chance got promoted again.

On the other hand, if he's a massive success at Twente, why would he want to come back to a club where either he failed, or he was badly neglected, or both, especially if good European clubs are sniffing around him and we haven't got promoted?

The only way I could see him playing for us again is if the reality is somewhere in-between: he's a qualified success at Twente and we believe we can develop him further.

 

He wouldn't have any choice but to come back-we own his registration.

[Hook's-Walk-Canary 222]

1 minute ago, Mr Angry said:

He wouldn't have any choice but to come back-we own his registration.

The question is whether we'd see him play in a City shirt again..

 

[Capt. Pants 5,008]

1 hour ago, chicken said:

He'll be playing with the big bad wolf next season so I think it could actually work out nicely as Ricky has always been a bit gutted it didn't work out with us. Perhaps his wise words of advice and someone with a Norwich connection could help Tzolis?

Edit:
 

Great to see Wolfie looking well and Christos with a smile on his face. The spell away from Norwich and hopefully playing football will do him good.

[Ken Hairy 4,272]

2 hours ago, The Real Buh said:

Wolfswinkle II

Ironically playing alongside him now

[TheGunnShow 7,377]

Could work with the Wolf, who's not unlike Pukki in that he thrives off balls pinged into channels or low skidders between goalies and defences. Tzolis looks like he might have the skidder in his locker if the ball is worked out wide, and if not then at least he will come off his wing to shoot so there's always the chance of a rebound breaking loose.

I'm interested in Placheta at Brum for the opposite reason, as they've got Jutkiewicz up top, who's a proven Championship target man and general nuisance, even if not out-and-out prolific. I've maintained for a long time Pukki up top hurts Placheta even more than Rashica, who at least can be very awkward in tight spaces, which Placheta hasn't got.

[canarybubbles 2,199]

17 minutes ago, TheGunnShow said:

Could work with the Wolf, who's not unlike Pukki in that he thrives off balls pinged into channels or low skidders between goalies and defences. Tzolis looks like he might have the skidder in his locker if the ball is worked out wide, and if not then at least he will come off his wing to shoot so there's always the chance of a rebound breaking loose.

I'm interested in Placheta at Brum for the opposite reason, as they've got Jutkiewicz up top, who's a proven Championship target man and general nuisance, even if not out-and-out prolific. I've maintained for a long time Pukki up top hurts Placheta even more than Rashica, who at least can be very awkward in tight spaces, which Placheta hasn't got.

Reading your post made me realise just how recruitment over the last 18 months seems to have given no consideration to how the various parts might fit together.