1 win in 10 is relegation form and worthy of sacking.

[norfolkngood 1,087]

1 minute ago, mannings bandy legs said:

Really feel this one of the weakest,mentally,physically and ability wise,squads we have had for a long,long while. We need such a drastic overhaul,its probably going to take two very good,or three or four average transfer windows to sort the mess out.Not hopeful the present encumbents are capable of that task.

it will take some time to sort this mess out 

every signing is going to have to hit ground running and we all know every signing is a gamble 

[Samwam27 531]

2 minutes ago, norfolkngood said:

it will take some time to sort this mess out 

every signing is going to have to hit ground running and we all know every signing is a gamble 

Which is why Byram and Dowell should not be renewed. We need players hungry and fit and who can last a season. We need players we can count on.

A fresh needs to be exactly that, replace what we have so we have no scars from last few seasons 

[Mello Yello 2,298]

26 minutes ago, Mengo said:

And what a fùçķìñg awful mess this club is in. 

                                                    

                                                                     There are some on here that will beg to differ....

[Monty13 2,235]

46 minutes ago, Michael Starr said:

It's too early to talk about Wagner, he's been given absolute trash. He needs to make it his team

I’m getting a bit alarmed about this to be honest. I’ve no idea what a Wagner Norwich team is based on his tenure but we clearly don’t have the players. A complete rebuild in Wagner’s style if it doesn’t work is another massive step back. 

I don’t blame Wagner, but I’m not confident on the idea of betting the house on him either.

We should have kept the possession based style that was so successful for those two seasons and built upon it. This chopping and changing from Farke to Smith to Wagner is completely the opposite to what the SD model promised.

[keelansgrandad 6,679]

50 minutes ago, Michael Starr said:

It's too early to talk about Wagner, he's been given absolute trash. He needs to make it his team

What about his strange tactics then?

[Monty13 2,235]

14 minutes ago, norfolkngood said:

it will take some time to sort this mess out 

every signing is going to have to hit ground running and we all know every signing is a gamble 

But some are more of a gamble than others.

Theres betting on a pretty sure thing and betting on a long shot, we need to do more of the former.

[vos 155]

I do agree that new managers need time. I also have to confess I did not initially rate Farke. But with the best will in the world I just cannot see Wagner pulling this Club round. Bringing on four subs at a time is pure desperation and is tactically niaive.

[Dean Coneys boots 1,400]

2 minutes ago, Monty13 said:

I’m getting a bit alarmed about this to be honest. I’ve no idea what a Wagner Norwich team is based on his tenure but we clearly don’t have the players. A complete rebuild in Wagner’s style if it doesn’t work is another massive step back. 

I don’t blame Wagner, but I’m not confident on the idea of betting the house on him either.

We should have kept the possession based style that was so successful for those two seasons and built upon it. This chopping and changing from Farke to Smith to Wagner is completely the opposite to what the SD model promised.

Agree. They opted to change because it didn’t work in the prem- but it sure worked in the champs and was so much better to watch than the dire rubbish served up since 

[repman 635]

53 minutes ago, hogesar said:

His starting tactics, and tactics with a fit squad haven't been naive, it had actually improved and compensated for some of our weaknesses.

His weird desperation to get 4 strikers on the pitch at some point is a problem.. 

His early stuff was good but it appears that it was the depth of his coaching (particularly in possession). The issues that plagued him in his previous jobs have shown up here and he clearly doesn't have the answers for them. 

His subs have been shocking for a long time and of course I agree about the constant effort to fill the pitch with forwards.

[hogesar 9,709]

1 hour ago, norfolkngood said:

As we said last week Hog he does some funny old things tactics and subs wise 

i really do not trust him to rebuild in the Summer 

I dont think him being in charge impacts the rebuild too much.

He isn't particularly unique in wanting a high energy high pressing team and it wouldn't be difficult to replace with a manager with similar ideologies 

[norfolkngood 1,087]

1 minute ago, hogesar said:

I dont think him being in charge impacts the rebuild too much.

He isn't particularly unique in wanting a high energy high pressing team and it wouldn't be difficult to replace with a manager with similar ideologies 

i would rather we replaced before the rebuild though 

Then the new h/c could bring his fresh ideas and maybe some of players he has worked with before and trusts 

i totally agree sound be same style manager and keep the same style throughout thats where Webber really went wrong Farke to Smith was Crazy to much change in style 

[Danke bitte 967]

I think it’ll be fine. A couple of sexy signings to give our tired team a refresh and we’ll be laughing. We’ve gotten too used to this team that’s tired and an mis match of players and style. I’m actually pretty excited for a clean slate 

[repman 635]

12 minutes ago, hogesar said:

I dont think him being in charge impacts the rebuild too much.

He isn't particularly unique in wanting a high energy high pressing team and it wouldn't be difficult to replace with a manager with similar ideologies 

While the high pressing might be likely it's clear you need to be a better possession based side in this league. We have 2 years of evidence of that with Farke and just take a look at Burnley this year.

Until we have someone who can coach that we will be having rebuilds every season.

[Worthy Nigelton 1,058]

The form is terrible but it is not his fault. He needs to freshen up the players, then we can start to judge him. Give him a break.

[Feedthewolf 4,861]

I think we all accept we need a refresh over the summer; whether that's playing personnel, manager, sporting director, owners or any combination of the above.

Whatever configuration we start next season with, though, let's please accept that it will take time. Unless we somehow get a Kompany-style cheat code, it's going to be another tough old slog. And to think we could end up with Everton, Southampton and Leicester down here with us... no problem at all with people calling for change, but if we get it then we will need to be patient.

[norfolkngood 1,087]

i think if you could see some type of progress with Wagner it would give me hope 

i just think he is another Paul Lambert great at one club but can not repeat it as he has shown in his last two jobs 

[Feedthewolf 4,861]

Just now, norfolkngood said:

i think if you could see some type of progress with Wagner it would give me hope 

i just think he is another Paul Lambert great at one club but can not repeat it as he has shown in his last two jobs 

I had pretty high hopes after those first few games, we seemed to press higher, be more brave on the ball, full backs getting higher up the pitch and so on. But after half a season with Wagner, I haven't seen anything to convince me he'd take us up next season. Wouldn't mind if we gave him the summer and the start of next season, but equally I wouldn't be gutted if we parted ways over the summer.

[Danke bitte 967]

10 minutes ago, Worthy Nigelton said:

The form is terrible but it is not his fault. He needs to freshen up the players, then we can start to judge him. Give him a break.

This. Simply this 

[norfolkngood 1,087]

1 minute ago, Feedthewolf said:

I had pretty high hopes after those first few games, we seemed to press higher, be more brave on the ball, full backs getting higher up the pitch and so on. But after half a season with Wagner, I haven't seen anything to convince me he'd take us up next season. Wouldn't mind if we gave him the summer and the start of next season, but equally I wouldn't be gutted if we parted ways over the summer.

My Main worry if we gave him 10 /15 games next season we have wasted a summer transfer and bought players that would suit his system maybe some of his former players 

i do not think we can do that 

if a New manager came in Proven on a upward curve in his career we would instantly have hope 

same with DOF webber he is damaged beyond repair his signings and recruitment have been terrible for a couple of seasons do we really want to waste more time and money backing that 

it will be up to the owners to decide but in a way they have time as end of season but if the same toxic feel around the club at start of season it will be a long season 

[Branston Pickle 3,669]

11 minutes ago, Feedthewolf said:

I think we all accept we need a refresh over the summer; whether that's playing personnel, manager, sporting director, owners or any combination of the above.

Whatever configuration we start next season with, though, let's please accept that it will take time. Unless we somehow get a Kompany-style cheat code, it's going to be another tough old slog. And to think we could end up with Everton, Southampton and Leicester down here with us... no problem at all with people calling for change, but if we get it then we will need to be patient.

The problem is that there’s some who seem to think we can change absolutely everything almost overnight - that just isn’t realistic, this isn’t some sort of computer game.  

[Feedthewolf 4,861]

1 minute ago, norfolkngood said:

My Main worry if we gave him 10 /15 games next season we have wasted a summer transfer and bought players that would suit his system maybe some of his former players 

i do not think we can do that 

if a New manager came in Proven on a upward curve in his career we would instantly have hope 

same with DOF webber he is damaged beyond repair his signings and recruitment have been terrible for a couple of seasons do we really want to waste more time and money backing that 

it will be up to the owners to decide but in a way they have time as end of season but if the same toxic feel around the club at start of season it will be a long season 

I think a lot depends on what happens at the very top. If the takeover gets completed over the summer, fans will be more likely to give the new regime time to make decisions. From what I've seen of the Attanasios, they don't strike me as the types to come in and tear the club apart from top to bottom immediately.

If the takeover doesn't get completed, and we start the new season with Webber and Wagner still in situ, we will need to hit the ground running or I don't think the fans will be especially patient.

[Feedthewolf 4,861]

1 minute ago, Branston Pickle said:

The problem is that there’s some who seem to think we can change absolutely everything almost overnight - that just isn’t realistic, this isn’t some sort of computer game.  

When we did 'change everything almost overnight', in 2016, it took more than a year for the Webber/Farke axis to bear fruit. And there were plenty of people calling for Farke's head during that first season. I just hope that if we do get the change that a lot of fans are craving, those same fans are patient enough to look at the bigger picture and give the new setup time to bed in. But somehow I doubt it.

[Davidlingfield 63]

2 hours ago, Mengo said:

And what a fùçķìñg awful mess this club is in. 

Inevitable given lack of governance. It was only a matter of time…

[Danke bitte 967]

1 minute ago, Feedthewolf said:

When we did 'change everything almost overnight', in 2016, it took more than a year for the Webber/Farke axis to bear fruit. And there were plenty of people calling for Farke's head during that first season. I just hope that if we do get the change that a lot of fans are craving, those same fans are patient enough to look at the bigger picture and give the new setup time to bed in. But somehow I doubt it.

No. Patience does not exist. If Wagner doesn’t get a tune out of his squad after 7/8 games I can see him being ousted. It also depends on Mark and what happens with his involvement with the club 

[king canary 7,643]

2 minutes ago, Feedthewolf said:

When we did 'change everything almost overnight', in 2016, it took more than a year for the Webber/Farke axis to bear fruit. And there were plenty of people calling for Farke's head during that first season. I just hope that if we do get the change that a lot of fans are craving, those same fans are patient enough to look at the bigger picture and give the new setup time to bed in. But somehow I doubt it.

Just because Farke needed time doesn't mean every manager gets time no matter what. I've got zero idea what Wagner is trying to achieve right now and he's showing nothing to say it'll get better with time. 

You say we need to look at the bigger picture to give stuff time to bed in but what bigger picture exactly? What style is he trying to embed? 

It also doesn't hugely help that his managerial career peaked in 2018 and has been largely down from there. I struggle to see much a case for keeping him beyond a faith that more time will equal better results.

[The Bunny 310]

Surely it's been demonstrated by now that sacking the manager is a pointless exercise that serves only to distract from the real issues. 

Let's recap:

We lost our two best players upon getting promoted (one sold, one end of loan) and then blew the proceeds from our record sale on players who were a much lower standard. Webber took the squad backwards at a time when clubs would normally invest and strengthen. The squad that "competed" in the premier league in 21/22 was significantly weaker than the team that got promoted previous season.

Farke paid the price for that a few weeks later. 

Dean Smith struggled to get a tune out of those same players (which should have been a surprise to no-one), and he was next in line for the chopping block. 

People proposing we sack Wagner have clearly not been paying attention. 

[Feedthewolf 4,861]

3 minutes ago, king canary said:

Just because Farke needed time doesn't mean every manager gets time no matter what. I've got zero idea what Wagner is trying to achieve right now and he's showing nothing to say it'll get better with time. 

You say we need to look at the bigger picture to give stuff time to bed in but what bigger picture exactly? What style is he trying to embed? 

It also doesn't hugely help that his managerial career peaked in 2018 and has been largely down from there. I struggle to see much a case for keeping him beyond a faith that more time will equal better results.

Sorry, think we've crossed wires here. My previous post wasn't talking about retaining Wagner, but more about what happened if there was the wholesale change that some people are craving (i.e. if Webber/Wagner leave). As I've said in another post, Wagner showed initial promise in those first few games, but overall I'm unconvinced by him. If he's still here at the start of next season, he'll need results quickly or he'll be judged accordingly – especially if Webber is still here too.

[HazzaJet 256]

2 hours ago, Michael Starr said:

It's too early to talk about Wagner, he's been given absolute trash. He needs to make it his team

Totally agree. You can't expect any manager to do well with a team unless they have a decent squad. Look at the difference between what Lambert did with us to what he did with our rivals 

[Mengo 825]

2 minutes ago, Davidlingfield said:

Inevitable given lack of governance. It was only a matter of time…

And looks like that inevitable time has well and truly arrived. I feel very sorry for pukki. I wanted him to go out on a high.

For me I would play him and sub him just after half time , so he can recieve some cheers of appreciation,  then if the crowd want to voice any opinions about the way things are , they can do that with pukki after he has said his 👋 goodbyes.

The result against Blackpool is well ! what is there to say. Meaningless comes to mind.

. 

[Mengo 825]

12 minutes ago, The Bunny said:

Surely it's been demonstrated by now that sacking the manager is a pointless exercise that serves only to distract from the real issues. 

Let's recap:

We lost our two best players upon getting promoted (one sold, one end of loan) and then blew the proceeds from our record sale on players who were a much lower standard. Webber took the squad backwards at a time when clubs would normally invest and strengthen. The squad that "competed" in the premier league in 21/22 was significantly weaker than the team that got promoted previous season.

Farke paid the price for that a few weeks later. 

Dean Smith struggled to get a tune out of those same players (which should have been a surprise to no-one), and he was next in line for the chopping block. 

People proposing we sack Wagner have clearly not been paying attention. 

Let's recap Bunny. People don't want to talk about the as you say the real issues . It's an utter cluster F.