Which side are you on?

[fredherring 136]

I've long supported Delia and our way in modern football times and under farke we had good times and it worked in the EFL. 

People queue up to say how well run, honest, and noble our club is, and our funding model being the "right" one with youth and success driving income. 

But as we have now found, the Premier league is a different universe. Nobility, honesty, working for income, it all means nothing. 

All that matters is money to buy the biggest, fastest, players, and doing whatever it takes to win. 

So do we reject that and stop caring about being promoted? 

If not, then we have to change owners and change as fans. 

The truth is Delia has always said they are open to investment. 

But you can read between the lines to see it means money with no change in structure. 

She blatantly, openly, does not want a takeover. She wants Tom and a legacy. 

The idea there is no queue of people wanting to buy us is a fantasy peddled to keep us sweet. 

What there isn't, is a queue of people wanting to buy a place on the board while Delia etc carries on as they are. 

There is money, and there are people queueing up to buy English clubs. The list of clubs with owners with huge wallets is massive and growing. 

Newcastle did it. But if approached by the same people, would she ever sell, and would half our fans accept it? 

As fans it's time to make a decision. 

Back the board and "our way" or demand through whatever means in the same ways Newcastle fans did, that change happens, and force it through by direct action. 

So which side are you on? 

[Danke bitte 969]

I don’t care about what owners are in place. It’s a waste of breath shouting about it. 

What I want is, if we get relegated this season, a review of the recruitment process and Webber to admit he got it badly wrong. Because, no matter how you spin it, you can’t say we didn’t spend and Webber wasn’t backed.

And in fact, it’s pi55 poor windows like what just occurred which makes the board reluctant to spend in future instances. Take a look at Chris Hughton’s 13/14 or Alex Neil’s January 15/16 windows as per example. I don’t know why we get it so wrong sometimes. Frustrating. 

[TheGunnShow 6,161]

Rather back the board at the moment, start agitating for clubs to be run like the German model, and most pertinently, for a salary cap to be introduced.

I don't believe that a 'solution' involving a mythical wealthy benefactor not too fussed about seeing a return whilst extending considerable financial largesse (or, put bluntly, financial doping) to a club is the way forward. I certainly don't believe that a club like Barcelona is in a 'healthy' position when carrying over £1bn of debt, a considerable proportion of it being short-term debt to boot. And I will never remotely be persuaded that the solution to our woes is trying to find our own wealthy benefactor in what is basically an arms race between ultra-wealthy individuals, often from places with morally dubious human rights records.

Rather than fighting to enable ourselves to adopt to this footballing financial insanity, as fans of a club that's ran with due financial prudence and diligence, we should be agitating to ask that other clubs run like us, not the other way around.

 

[A Load of Squit 5,270]

The problem is the Premier League, it needs to be changed, unless it is radically reformed the current situation will continue and that's not a good idea.

[Badger 2,421]

I was not quite sure of what you meant by the "two sides?" I will try to clarify.

Side one: those who think that there is a plentiful supply of multi-billionaires ready to gift tens of millions of pounds to us. As the OP implied, we too could be like Newcastle.

Side two: those that think this is highly unlikely.

I think that it is highly unlikely, I'm afraid.

 

[Petriix 2,860]

20 minutes ago, TheGunnShow said:

Rather back the board at the moment, start agitating for clubs to be run like the German model, and most pertinently, for a salary cap to be introduced.

I don't believe that a 'solution' involving a mythical wealthy benefactor not too fussed about seeing a return whilst extending considerable financial largesse (or, put bluntly, financial doping) to a club is the way forward. I certainly don't believe that a club like Barcelona is in a 'healthy' position when carrying over £1bn of debt, a considerable proportion of it being short-term debt to boot. And I will never remotely be persuaded that the solution to our woes is trying to find our own wealthy benefactor in what is basically an arms race between ultra-wealthy individuals, often from places with morally dubious human rights records.

Rather than fighting to enable ourselves to adopt to this footballing financial insanity, as fans of a club that's ran with due financial prudence and diligence, we should be agitating to ask that other clubs run like us, not the other way around.

 

Absolutely this!

[Midlands Yellow 4,142]

6 minutes ago, Badger said:

I was not quite sure of what you meant by the "two sides?" I will try to clarify.

Side one: those who think that there is a plentiful supply of multi-billionaires ready to gift tens of millions of pounds to us. As the OP implied, we too could be like Newcastle.

Side two: those that think this is highly unlikely.

I think that it is highly unlikely, I'm afraid.

 

Or. 

Side one, those who would like to see the club actively encourage new investment which could lead to new owners. These could be from any corner of the globe with no restrictions (camels, sheiks etc, see MWJ past comments) 

Side two, those who love it just how it is and any thought of change is a thing to make them shake with fear. 

 

[Capt. Pants 4,349]

15 minutes ago, A Load of Squit said:

The problem is the Premier League, it needs to be changed, unless it is radically reformed the current situation will continue and that's not a good idea.

It's not a good idea for us as we can't compete, but that doesn't mean the Premier League needs to be changed.

The Premier League won't change, unless you have a Super League and then you are talking 5 smaller leagues with fewer matches and less revenue. Unless you play each each club 4 times.

Nothing will change at NCFC until Neppers Tom inherits the poison chalice and the 'badwill'.

 

[vlad666 205]

This is only going to get worse though. You’re seeing lower league clubs being taken over by multi millionaires all the time. How long before we can’t compete in the championship? 
 

[hogesar 9,864]

16 minutes ago, Badger said:

I was not quite sure of what you meant by the "two sides?" I will try to clarify.

Side one: those who think that there is a plentiful supply of multi-billionaires ready to gift tens of millions of pounds to us. As the OP implied, we too could be like Newcastle.

Side two: those that think this is highly unlikely.

I think that it is highly unlikely, I'm afraid.

 

That's it. And we could go through years of multiple new owners until we find one like a Leicester or whatever anyway. And that's what, based on takeovers in the past 15 years a 1 in 20 shot? We've not got it as bad as some on here want to point out and there's several bigger / similarly sized clubs who's fans and owners would, and have tried, spending 100's of millions just for half of our recent premier league spells in the past 10 years.

If a billionaire comes up who is interested then I'd like to hear what they have to say. I'd be disappointed if Delia etc told them to go do one, and i'd expect any half-respected billionaire to make it public knowledge they enquired if they were told to go do one. If they don't have enough gumption to do that then I don't want them owning our club anyway.

[TheGunnShow 6,161]

Not to mention that @Parma Ham's gone mouldy made a quite excellent post a few days ago highlighting that, paradoxically, our sound financial position actually makes us a less appealing purchase in the upside-down world of football finance.

[nutty nigel 7,704]

Before I decide I'd like to know who the two captains are?

[TeemuVanBasten 3,327]

1 hour ago, TheGunnShow said:

Rather back the board at the moment, start agitating for clubs to be run like the German model, and most pertinently, for a salary cap to be introduced.

Bayern Munich have won the Bundesliga 9 seasons in a row and are still top of the league.

Its less competitive than the Premier League, its practically the SPL. 

And you've still got RB Leipzig being 99% owned by Red Bull, and Bayern Munich who are 8.33% owned by Adidas, 8.33% owned by Allianz, and 8.33% owned by Audi and throw £15m a year at Lewandowski.

How about we end this bizarre fetishism of the German leagues just because we had a German manager and a few bang average German players. Lets move on to a different country, if we were more interested in France or Scandinavia, or Denmark like Brentford, perhaps we'd end up with a squad which is physically capable of competing in the top tier of English football. 

What fans owning a large proportion of clubs really mean is 13 large German clubs being in serious financial problems at the moment with no billionaires there to bail them out, think Schalke or Werder Bremen fans are any happier than us at the minute?

Edited January 13, 2022 by TeemuVanBasten

[Jim Smith 2,367]

20 minutes ago, Badger said:

I was not quite sure of what you meant by the "two sides?" I will try to clarify.

Side one: those who think that there is a plentiful supply of multi-billionaires ready to gift tens of millions of pounds to us. As the OP implied, we too could be like Newcastle.

Side two: those that think this is highly unlikely.

I think that it is highly unlikely, I'm afraid.

 

There are not just two polarised positions. I agree with the sentiment that in an ideal world football would change and come around to our ways but that’s not going to happen any time d soon. 

So until it does I guess we have a choice. Accept we are the plaything/baby of a pair of OAPs which means that in reality we are never going to compete at the top level so will always be a championship club at best with every premier season being a soul destroying humiliation. If that’s the case then let’s admit it snd do the community club thing properly. Don’t preach it then rinse the fans for cash at every opportunity. 

Or pressure them into genuinely looking for the extra investment/resources that might help make us competitive accepting that brings with it a degree of risk of the unknown.

let’s also not pretend that we are run as we are solely out of some kind of moral crusade to change football. It’s done out of necessity to enable the owners to retain their asset without having to put any money in. Not because they think it’s the best way of achieving success. 

[TheGunnShow 6,161]

2 minutes ago, TeemuVanBasten said:

Bayern Munich have won the Bundesliga 9 seasons in a row and are still top of the league.

Its less competitive than the Premier League, its practically the SPL. 

And you've still got RB Leipzig being 99% owned by Red Bull who pay 15 million a year to Lewandowski. 

How about we end this bizarre fetishism of the German leagues just because we had a German manager and a few bang average German players. Lets move on to a different country, if we were more interested in France or Scandinavia, or Denmark like Brentford, perhaps we'd end up with a squad which is physically capable of competing in the top tier of English football. 

What fans owning a large proportion of clubs really mean is 13 large German clubs being in serious financial problems at the moment with no billionaires there to bail them out, think Schalke or Werder Bremen fans are any happier than us at the minute?

Salary cap in the Bundesliga, is there?

[TeemuVanBasten 3,327]

6 minutes ago, TheGunnShow said:

Salary cap in the Bundesliga, is there?

What would it achieve? 

It would mean the worlds best talent goes to some other country and the TV money follows. 

[Midlands Yellow 4,142]

18 minutes ago, TeemuVanBasten said:

Bayern Munich have won the Bundesliga 9 seasons in a row and are still top of the league.

Its less competitive than the Premier League, its practically the SPL. 

And you've still got RB Leipzig being 99% owned by Red Bull who pay 15 million a year to Lewandowski. 

How about we end this bizarre fetishism of the German leagues just because we had a German manager and a few bang average German players. Lets move on to a different country, if we were more interested in France or Scandinavia, or Denmark like Brentford, perhaps we'd end up with a squad which is physically capable of competing in the top tier of English football. 

What fans owning a large proportion of clubs really mean is 13 large German clubs being in serious financial problems at the moment with no billionaires there to bail them out, think Schalke or Werder Bremen fans are any happier than us at the minute?

Red Bull pay lewandowski £15m? 

[TheGunnShow 6,161]

Just now, TeemuVanBasten said:

What would it achieve? 

It would mean the worlds best talent goes to some other country and the TV money follows. 

Like Bayern Munich? 

The French league is looking to implement one from 2023/4 onwards - initially planned for 2021 but the breathing space afforded by the pandemic meant PSG and their new backers went ape in the transfer market. La Liga already has one at 70% of revenues (still not prevented the crap-fest that is Barcelona or Real Madrid's finances, but Barca in particular are not remotely the force they were, and that's a financial mismanagement issue, not the wage cap). Bundesliga doesn't have one but there are signs that it may land up in discussion if nothing else. Serie A doesn't have one, but the likes of Juve were cutting down their wage bill anyway. And UEFA seems to be mooting proposals for replacing the Financial Fair Play rule with something more stringent.

Things are moving that way anyway.

[Mello Yello 2,320]

IN MY OPINION AN' MANY OTHER TRUE SUPPORTERS, THIS CLUB CAN NE'ER DO WRONG!.....If you don't like it - go and support Wroxham or King's Lynn.....Go shopping, fishing, take up golf, walk the dog, go to Cromer an' stroll along the beach an' have fish and chips, get an allotment an' grow peas an' carrots, knit, sew, crochet or spend time in lipstick and lace.....There's many other things to occupy your lives with....If you're unhappy, adjust your life accordingly....I just luvs everything about NCFC....Board, Squad, New Club Crest, the  Stowmarket Two and our illustrious an' industrious DofF.....An' mostly the match-day experience and stuff.....

.....NCFC?......"THEY'RE BRILLIANT!"......

"Cheer up an' refer yourselves to those great lyrics sung so eloquently by Bobby Mcferrin in the late eighties....

"Don't worry, Be Clappy"..... 

[TeemuVanBasten 3,327]

23 minutes ago, Midlands Yellow said:

Red Bull pay lewandowski £15m? 

Ah shucks, I butchered an edit, embarrassing. Changed.

[fredherring 136]

And oh look, farke turns up in Russia. 

Big club, investment, big spending and wages. 

Everything we can never achieve with Delia in control. 

This idea we can't get it, or it's not common is a load of utter sh*te. 

 

[Kenny Foggo 1,122]

46 minutes ago, Jim Smith said:

There are not just two polarised positions. I agree with the sentiment that in an ideal world football would change and come around to our ways but that’s not going to happen any time d soon. 

So until it does I guess we have a choice. Accept we are the plaything/baby of a pair of OAPs which means that in reality we are never going to compete at the top level so will always be a championship club at best with every premier season being a soul destroying humiliation. If that’s the case then let’s admit it snd do the community club thing properly. Don’t preach it then rinse the fans for cash at every opportunity. 

Or pressure them into genuinely looking for the extra investment/resources that might help make us competitive accepting that brings with it a degree of risk of the unknown.

let’s also not pretend that we are run as we are solely out of some kind of moral crusade to change football. It’s done out of necessity to enable the owners to retain their asset without having to put any money in. Not because they think it’s the best way of achieving success. 

Spot on! 

[Haus 260]

40 minutes ago, TeemuVanBasten said:

What would it achieve? 

It would mean the worlds best talent goes to some other country and the TV money follows. 

Any salary cap needs to be applied across European football or there is no point.  

Champions League Salary Cap for example.

[Dr Greenthumb 754]

The board can go and Webber needs to get a scout in that understands the type of players we need in this league

[Kenny Foggo 1,122]

I was not quite sure of what you meant by the "two sides?" I will try to clarify.

Side one: Those that think we are the only club not to be attractive to new investment and that being debt free is a bad think to new investors

Side two: Those that think we need a sensible level of investment to grow the first team and that, if true to their word, they would not take a large amount of money to handover to the club, meaning more investment could be put into growing the club.

I think that it is highly likely.

[Kenny Foggo 1,122]

2 minutes ago, Dr Greenthumb said:

The board can go and Webber needs to get a scout in that understands the type of players we need in this league

Webber clearly has no idea but hey, we've got a Soccerbot and Gilmour is great on it.

[BroadstairsR 2,245]

1 hour ago, TheGunnShow said:

Not to mention that @Parma Ham's gone mouldy made a quite excellent post a few days ago highlighting that, paradoxically, our sound financial position actually makes us a less appealing purchase in the upside-down world of football finance.

Is it such a sound financial position though? Is any pro club in England above that most modest bunch of L1./L2 scrape along clubs that?

Delia Smith herself has said some years ago that the club loses money for every season in the Championship. This has been proven a few times in the past.

Without parachutes (currently being questioned a lot in the game) or a big sale (will we run out of talent sooner or later?) we are surely eventually  to be in trouble.

Every participant in every sport aims for the best. It is what sport is all about. Does the 10, 000 metre also ran not aspire to beat Mo Farah no matter how unrealistic these aims are? He sets out to train harder.

We are a tea and cake club aiming to feast at the top table without adjusting our diet,

Edited January 13, 2022 by BroadstairsR

[Dr Greenthumb 754]

36 minutes ago, Kenny Foggo said:

Webber clearly has no idea but hey, we've got a Soccerbot and Gilmour is great on it.

I still don’t think Webber is the problem. He has gone down in my estimation. But selling your best player straight after promotion and using money from previous seasons sales to make two permanent stinks of our board literally doing nothing but living off the assets. 
they should know by now the level of financial competition in the league. They employ Webber to blatantly keep the books balanced and improve facilities

[Badger 2,421]

3 hours ago, Jim Smith said:

There are not just two polarised positions.

There my some blurring of the issues on the edges but it is pretty polarised: there are those that think that are lots of people waiting to just give the club money and there are those that don't.

There is, I acknowledge, a small subset of people in the latter group above (the "give us" money group), who believe that there may be people willing to give us money in the short-term to take it out in the long term (i.e. a classical investor). I have never seen any of them outline any sort of financial model of how this could work. I, for one, can see any plausible way that this could happen (unless we were a distressed asset) and have seen no one even attempt to try to cost such a venture.

*I have just remembered a discussion we had which could be work - i.e. the sale of new shares, whilst retaining the current owners. This might possibly work but again not easy for the investor to get his/her money back and a very risky way to spend £100 million and is £100 million enough to make much difference anyway?

Edited January 13, 2022 by Badger
Added last paragraph

[Badger 2,421]

1 hour ago, BroadstairsR said:

Is it such a sound financial position though?

Yes (for football). 

Edited January 13, 2022 by Badger
Added parentheses