Corona Virus main thread

[Van wink 2,994]

11 minutes ago, ricardo said:

Hope he's not doing them tomorrow when Mrs R goes in😱

Could be worse.......possibly

 

[Van wink 2,994]

https://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/entry/****-swab-test-covid_uk_6013eaacc5b622df90f2616f
 

This will prove interesting at the test centres, excuse me madam would you mind sticking your bum out of the window.

[Van wink 2,994]

18 hours ago, Creative Midfielder said:

You may think that neither approach is right or wrong but I don't think most scientists would go along with that.

We, and all other developed countries, have over the years developed very high and rigorous standards for the testing of vaccines and medicines generally because we've learnt some very harsh lessons from things going disastrously wrong when treatments that were initially looking very promising were deployed without sufficiently rigorous testing.

So frankly, projecting efficacy just isn't the way we do things any more, especially on a treatment that is going to be given to many millions of people. Just as giving a second dose after 12 weeks when we only have data to prove efficacy after 4 weeks because we think it's very likely that it will be ok.

And it may very well be OK but the proper way to do it, by which I mean the scientific way accepted all round the globe, is that we test our theories first in very controlled circumstances, with a very detailed and precise evaluation of the results - and if a treatment meets the standard then it is rolled out.

That is still the way that nearly every country other than the UK is approaching the pandemic, but we are effectively conducting a massive unlicensed and uncontrolled vaccine trial. Like all gambles it may work out, or of course sadly for us it may not.

So far Johnson has taken several high risk gambles and every one has blown up in his and our faces. Hopefully, for all our sakes he has got lucky this time.

But it seems pretty bizarre to me, given we've known of significant concerns about vaccine take up for a long while and we're currently spending many millions of pounds on advertising campaigns to convince people that the vaccine is safe whilst pretty much shouting from the rooftops that we're so smart that we don't need to apply the same rigour to testing and licensing the vaccine as the rest of the world.

Seems to me the same muddled thinking and complete absence of a strategy that has be-devilled this country's response to the pandemic from the very start of the crisis.

Looks like the EMA has approved AZ for all age groups

Edited January 29, 2021 by Van wink

[ricardo 7,416]

OUR EUROPEAN "FRIENDS"

[paul moy 235]

1 hour ago, ricardo said:

 

 

The same people who a few short weeks ago were boasting how bulk buying would get a much cheaper price than the UK.

Indeed Ricardo, I referred to that exact point also last week.   The EU put money and its own state control above its own people's lives and those EU backers criticised us for putting lives before money.  

The media at last is starting to criticise the EU .......     a scathing article here :

https://www.express.co.uk/comment/expresscomment/1390792/eu-news-covid-19-vaccine-astrazeneca-novavax-ursula-von-der-leyen-uk-vaccine-rollout

 

 

[paul moy 235]

5 hours ago, horsefly said:

How stupid do you have to be to claim that money we payed into the EU as an oblgation of our membership was not thus EU money, but still our money merely  "redirected"? That this comes from the distorted brain of someone who laughably claims to be an "economist" makes it even more contemptible. It's on a par with your employer claiming the money she is obliged to pay to you for your labour is not your money at all but hers just redirected. Cretinous almost beyond belief.

It is our money redirected, just as UK taxpayers money is redirected by HMG to spend on NHS etc.  We chose not to accept this any more and took back control of the 15 Billion or so we pay the EU annually.  We can now give that directly to biotech if we wish rather than having the EU do it for us.  Why should the EU continue to take undeserved credit from ignorant people like you for spending OUR money .....  😎

I am not surprised really that you cannot understand this simple fact. 😛

Edited January 29, 2021 by paul moy

[ricardo 7,416]

I didn't expect they would be this stupid.

I admit I was wrong.

Total madness which is ulikely to end well.

A complete inability to accept that they skrewed up their proccurement.

Edited January 29, 2021 by ricardo

[Herman 9,842]

****'s sake Moy. The Express is always criticizing the EU. It's all it does.

 

[keelansgrandad 6,679]

1 minute ago, ricardo said:

I didn't expect they would be this stupid.

I admit I was wrong.

Total madness which is ulikely to end well.

A complete inability to accept that they skrewed up their proccurement.

A trait not unfamiliar closer to home Ricardo.

[Herman 9,842]

1 minute ago, ricardo said:

I didn't expect they would be this stupid.

I admit I was wrong.

Total madness which is ulikely to end well.

A complete inability to accept that they skrewed up their proccurement.

Sad on the outside. Laughing on the inside. We see you.

[ricardo 7,416]

Just now, keelansgrandad said:

A trait not unfamiliar closer to home Ricardo.

Gives Boris all the cover he needs. A page straight out of the Mafiosa playlist. Stupid beyond belief.

[paul moy 235]

2 minutes ago, Herman said:

****'s sake Moy. The Express is always criticizing the EU. It's all it does.

 

All media should have always criticized the EU.   At last they are seeing the light.

[The Real Buh 3,486]

I think it’s pretty clear going forward from a international stage point of view we are going to have to classify the EU in the same bracket as Russia and China, as an existential threat.

[keelansgrandad 6,679]

3 minutes ago, ricardo said:

Gives Boris all the cover he needs. A page straight out of the Mafiosa playlist. Stupid beyond belief.

I think thats why he is avoiding criticising it/them. I couldn't believe how much sympathy Gove had yesterday when I thought he would have rubbed their/its nose in it.

[The Real Buh 3,486]

6 minutes ago, ricardo said:

Gives Boris all the cover he needs. A page straight out of the Mafiosa playlist. Stupid beyond belief.

Literally an open goal isn’t it. Boris just had to sit back and watch.

[ricardo 7,416]

1 minute ago, keelansgrandad said:

I think thats why he is avoiding criticising it/them. I couldn't believe how much sympathy Gove had yesterday when I thought he would have rubbed their/its nose in it.

They have a history of bullying behind the scenes but this is just brazen.

Surely there are some sensible people in Brussels who will knock heads together. I certainly hope so but given the track record I wouldn't lay money on it.

[ricardo 7,416]

National

29079 - 0 ? surely an input failure here

Local

All green on the local scene, very good news.

 

Up 160k on yesterday

Edited January 29, 2021 by ricardo

[Herman 9,842]

29 minutes ago, ricardo said:

They have a history of bullying behind the scenes but this is just brazen.

Surely there are some sensible people in Brussels who will knock heads together. I certainly hope so but given the track record I wouldn't lay money on it.

A more sensible outlook....

 

[Yellow Fever 3,844]

Predictable echo chamber arrived I see. Wind them up and set them going.

Now, back in the real world how do we fix this ?

[ricardo 7,416]

The biggest losers are the 400 million Europeans who will get vaccinated later than expected. All becasuse Brussels wanted its flag on it.

[horsefly 4,318]

It does seem morally perverse that some on here are taking a great delight in the prospect of more EU citizens dying as a result of not getting the vaccines they need. Surely YF is right to ask "how do we fix this?". If you find yourself not wanting as many people as possible to get the vaccine as soon as possible, irrespective of their nationality, then I suggest you need to examine your conscience very carefully.

[ricardo 7,416]

The Government Coronavirus Dashboard has now been corrected

actually 443,935 jabs  so up by 160k

 

[ricardo 7,416]

5 minutes ago, horsefly said:

It does seem morally perverse that some on here are taking a great delight in the prospect of more EU citizens dying as a result of not getting the vaccines they need. Surely YF is right to ask "how do we fix this?". If you find yourself not wanting as many people as possible to get the vaccine as soon as possible, irrespective of their nationality, then I suggest you need to examine your conscience very carefully.

My sympathy is entirely with the people not with the EU Commission.

Late to the game, penny pinching on price and very parsimonious with their contribution to Covax.

If there is any conscience examining to be done it needs to start in Brussels.

Edited January 29, 2021 by ricardo

[keelansgrandad 6,679]

3 minutes ago, horsefly said:

It does seem morally perverse that some on here are taking a great delight in the prospect of more EU citizens dying as a result of not getting the vaccines they need. Surely YF is right to ask "how do we fix this?". If you find yourself not wanting as many people as possible to get the vaccine as soon as possible, irrespective of their nationality, then I suggest you need to examine your conscience very carefully.

The fix is for someone to tell them all to shut up and get making more vaccines. They had troubles with the culture in Brussels and someone mentioned "best effort" from the EU. So it was always going to end badly.

Rather than waving contracts about like Neville Chamberlain, get working.

[ricardo 7,416]

Possibly the first signs of the vaccine effect with the elderly rate falling off sharply.

[The Real Buh 3,486]

13 minutes ago, horsefly said:

It does seem morally perverse that some on here are taking a great delight in the prospect of more EU citizens dying as a result of not getting the vaccines they need. Surely YF is right to ask "how do we fix this?". If you find yourself not wanting as many people as possible to get the vaccine as soon as possible, irrespective of their nationality, then I suggest you need to examine your conscience very carefully.

Imagine still supporting the EU, even now.

snatching vaccines out of old and vulnerable UK peoples arms because they messed up their procurement because as an entity they are USELESS. 
 

This is going to end the EU. Other countries will leave because of this catalyst. It’s over soft lad.

[Barbe bleu 834]

15 minutes ago, ricardo said:

My sympathy is entirely with the people not with the EU Commission.

Late to the game, penny pinching on price and very parsimonious with their contribution to Covax.

If there is any conscience examining to be done it needs to start in Brussels.

Do we know the price anyone agreed?

There was speculation and rumour and incomplete photos but was it bottomed out anywhere?

[ricardo 7,416]

I doubt that is entirely true Buh, but if it doesn't shatter some illusions I will be very surprised.

[Herman 9,842]

33 minutes ago, Yellow Fever said:

Predictable echo chamber arrived I see. Wind them up and set them going.

Now, back in the real world how do we fix this ?

As the contracts were signed before we officially left the EU I feel the only fair way is if we shared any made in the UK with our friends in Europe. I am sure some of our concerned citizens will understand.

[The Real Buh 3,486]

Just now, ricardo said:

I doubt that is entirely true Buh, but if it doesn't shatter some illusions I will be very surprised.

How long before a government comes to power in the EU with an EU referendum in its manifesto?

just wait until the vaccines start rolling in Europe and they all go to France and Germany and “teething problems” prevent them getting to less well developed countries. 
 

The EU has proved it cannot protect its citizens. 
 

my moneys on Poland leaving first, Maybe Italy.