Woodman 92 Posted March 12, 2019 14 hours ago, Indy_Bones said: I totally get the excitement that the playoffs bring, but there's something fundamentally wrong with a situation whereby a team could finish 12-15+ points above someone in 4th-6th, yet still not get promotion because of a poor result in a playoff scenario, which completely devalues their overall performance across a 46 match season. Imagine running a marathon and being 5-10 mins ahead of everyone for the entire first 25 miles, yet because someone had a faster time than you in purely the final mile (but are still 10-20 minutes behind you overall), then your lead over the whole event becomes utterly worthless and they get the win even though overall you've still finished before them and in a faster time! I've often wondered if 3rd place should go straight to the final and 4th/5th should then have the home/away game to play them in the final. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
westcoastcanary 173 Posted March 12, 2019 40 minutes ago, Woodman said: I've often wondered if 3rd place should go straight to the final and 4th/5th should then have the home/away game to play them in the final. All the focus in this debate is on going up. I'm sure the relegation threatened EPL clubs would welcome a similar debate. For example, if people want 3rd place in the Championship to get proper recognition, how about a Scottish-style play off between EPL 18th and Championship 3rd in lieu of the Championship play offs? 😋 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Branston Pickle 3,733 Posted March 12, 2019 When the play offs were introduced they had the team from higher division included - can’t help but think that makes more sense than giving teams in 6th place such a big chance. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
GenerationA47 767 Posted March 12, 2019 (edited) 15 hours ago, Indy_Bones said: I totally get the excitement that the playoffs bring, but there's something fundamentally wrong with a situation whereby a team could finish 12-15+ points above someone in 4th-6th, yet still not get promotion because of a poor result in a playoff scenario, which completely devalues their overall performance across a 46 match season. Imagine running a marathon and being 5-10 mins ahead of everyone for the entire first 25 miles, yet because someone had a faster time than you in purely the final mile (but are still 10-20 minutes behind you overall), then your lead over the whole event becomes utterly worthless and they get the win even though overall you've still finished before them and in a faster time! Well.. in that case, also imagine that 1) every runner is aware of and consents to the format, including the possibility of this situation 2) actually the marathon is completed and there are three play-off sprints for finishers #3 - #6 to win, for the award of a prize 3) the third placed finisher, having bettered the other three's performance over the 26 miles, may not be in the worst position to win the final three sprints 4) the prize for #1, #2 and the sprint-offs winner is competing in a marathon of higher quality which is much more lucrative. However, I suggest there's no divine or absolute reason that a #3 finisher should actually get to race in the premier marathon. They knew that for automatic promotion they needed to win the race or be runners-up, and sadly they failed. The play-offs give them another bite at the cherry. NB Prior to 1974, 3rd place in Div2 was not considered good enough to be promoted (although luckily enough, we did benefit form the change only a year after the system's first introduction!). Edited March 12, 2019 by GenerationA47 added a bite of cherry Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Nuff Said 5,240 Posted March 12, 2019 18 minutes ago, westcoastcanary said: All the focus in this debate is on going up. I'm sure the relegation threatened EPL clubs would welcome a similar debate. For example, if people want 3rd place in the Championship to get proper recognition, how about a Scottish-style play off between EPL 18th and Championship 3rd in lieu of the Championship play offs? 😋 I like that idea. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
......and Smith must score. 1,368 Posted March 12, 2019 21 minutes ago, Branston Pickle said: When the play offs were introduced they had the team from higher division included - can’t help but think that makes more sense than giving teams in 6th place such a big chance. True but that was only because the authorities wanted to introduce the present set up, ie, 20 teams in the top division and 24 clubs in the three divisions below. At the time there were 22 teams in the top division so they used it for two seasons to get to where we are now. I think the Play-Offs format as it is now is best. In theory all teams have a one-in-four chance of getting promotion which makes for exciting end of season. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
westcoastcanary 173 Posted March 12, 2019 53 minutes ago, ......and Smith must score. said: I think the Play-Offs format as it is now is best. In theory all teams have a one-in-four chance of getting promotion which makes for exciting end of season. As I understand it, the play offs are not about making for an exciting end of season, but creating a realistic goal to incentivise mid- to lower-table teams for whom a top three spot may seem out of reach from comparatively early on. The end of season excitement is a by-product of that, not the aim. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
hogesar 9,808 Posted March 12, 2019 All I know is Leeds have a higher % of tw*t fans than most other clubs in this division and it's for that reason I hope they royally screw up this season. Starting tonight, preferably. 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Surfer 1,547 Posted March 12, 2019 I don't understand why the home and way games leading up to the playoff final are not also played at Wembley, and each of those teams are given a trophy. And then the winner of the playoff final - who get a trophy, while the team that finished 2nd in the league don't - can play the 18th place PL team again at Wembley in a winner takes all game. The winner to get a trophy of course. And then maybe they could play the Scottish Premier League champions, winner to the PL, loser to the SPL. Make it an entire month of playoff celebrations - you've missed out on a revenue opportunity there I think PL/SPL/EFL. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Woodman 92 Posted March 12, 2019 2 hours ago, hogesar said: All I know is Leeds have a higher % of tw*t fans than most other clubs in this division and it's for that reason I hope they royally screw up this season. Starting tonight, preferably. Funny, I'd quite like Leeds to win tonight and Brentford to win at Sheff U. Then if Leeds beat Sheff U on Saturday, that's a lot of points between them and us - assuming we win tomorrow and Saturday of course. Lots of ifs there... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Petriix 2,856 Posted March 12, 2019 48 minutes ago, Woodman said: Funny, I'd quite like Leeds to win tonight and Brentford to win at Sheff U. Then if Leeds beat Sheff U on Saturday, that's a lot of points between them and us - assuming we win tomorrow and Saturday of course. Lots of ifs there... Why would a Leeds win be in any way beneficial? Better if they lose too, then we're more likely to finish above at least one of the two. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
It's Character Forming 1,167 Posted March 12, 2019 3 hours ago, hogesar said: All I know is Leeds have a higher % of tw*t fans than most other clubs in this division and it's for that reason I hope they royally screw up this season. Starting tonight, preferably. It would be interesting if someone did a statistical analysis of twitter posts to see which club has the higher % of tw*t fans I certainly agree with you 100% though ... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
CDMullins 453 Posted March 12, 2019 2 hours ago, Woodman said: Funny, I'd quite like Leeds to win tonight and Brentford to win at Sheff U. Then if Leeds beat Sheff U on Saturday, that's a lot of points between them and us - assuming we win tomorrow and Saturday of course. Lots of ifs there... Wut? Surely if Leeds and Sheff U lose tonigth thats better? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Surfer 1,547 Posted March 12, 2019 Ideally Leeds and Sheff Utd to both lose tonight then Leeds to beat Sheff Utd at the weekend. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
The Great Mass Debater 1,105 Posted March 13, 2019 On 09/03/2019 at 12:37, KeiranShikari said: If we didn't have Pukki we'd be giving game time to one of the division's best ever goal scorers in Jordan Rhodes. It's like saying, if they only played with 10 men they wouldnt be doing so well... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Woodman 92 Posted March 13, 2019 16 hours ago, Petriix said: Why would a Leeds win be in any way beneficial? Better if they lose too, then we're more likely to finish above at least one of the two. 15 hours ago, CDMullins said: Wut? Surely if Leeds and Sheff U lose tonigth thats better? Yes, that would have been the ultimate set of results, but I still think a Leeds win on Saturday would be good for us - as long as we win tonight and Saturday of course. It's still all in our hands. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
It's Character Forming 1,167 Posted March 13, 2019 On balance I'd go for a draw on Saturday Leeds/Sheff U because neither then gets 3 points. The onus is on us to win tonight and put the pressure back on them. Ultimately the other results are out of our hands, it's down to us to get our own results. If we can win tonight, we're back in front and have the advantage that as long as we match Sheff U's results for the rest of the season, we can afford one more defeat than them and we'll be guaranteed to go up. Definitely pressure on for tonight. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Branston Pickle 3,733 Posted March 13, 2019 How is Waccoe tonight, I wonder..... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Nuff Said 5,240 Posted March 13, 2019 18 minutes ago, Branston Pickle said: How is Waccoe tonight, I wonder..... I'd put money on us being called c***s. Again. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Drazen Muzinic 1,457 Posted March 13, 2019 I reckon, even after that sublime third, we still aren't playing the best football in the division...😉 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
splendidrush 700 Posted March 13, 2019 8 minutes ago, Drazen Muzinic said: I reckon, even after that sublime third, we still aren't playing the best football in the division...😉 Carefuuuuul.😁 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Nuff Said 5,240 Posted March 13, 2019 32 minutes ago, Nuff Said said: I'd put money on us being called c***s. Again. Yup. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kathy 746 Posted March 13, 2019 How many fingers have we got tonight? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
wcorkcanary 4,355 Posted March 14, 2019 9 hours ago, Kathy said: How many fingers have we got tonight? Only the two that we are sticking up at those below us, all 23 teams of them!!!. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Grando 283 Posted March 14, 2019 On 12/03/2019 at 12:22, westcoastcanary said: All the focus in this debate is on going up. I'm sure the relegation threatened EPL clubs would welcome a similar debate. For example, if people want 3rd place in the Championship to get proper recognition, how about a Scottish-style play off between EPL 18th and Championship 3rd in lieu of the Championship play offs? 😋 How about in the hopefully unlikely event they we finish third they change the rules this season so that we play-off against a Scottish team? Sounds fair to me! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PurpleCanary 5,601 Posted March 14, 2019 At a tangent, Leeds have this sense of grievance over supposedly being cheated out of the European Cup (not sure it was a bad decision to rule out Lorimer's shot but there was a clear penalty they should have got). But Sheffield United were definitely cheated out of staying in the Premier League in the 2006-2007 season by way of West Ham getting fined rather being docked points, as they should have been, for fielding an Ineligible player. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
