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I actually think this style of play invariably gets us nowhere particularly against sides who are not that great and tend to sit back. The problem is that after all the "fannying around" the eventual positive forward pass still falls to a defender which is not their greatest asset. Additionally the opposition have had ample time to tighten up the midfield and it is blindingly obvious we cannot find anyone in space. Aarons is the classic example of this in that he continually turns back as the only player in some space is his fellow defender. How many times does the ball eventually get returned to our keeper. So what is Glen Roeder's protege's answer. Move the ball much quicker out of defence to an attacking ball player (schemer) i.e. Hoolahan who will be in more space and then move on from there. Take it from me, football really is a simple game. In making these observations I do accept that our current tactics partly evolved from Farke who rightly took the view it was a waste of time to thump long high balls up the middle to Pukki.

Agree entirely. If anything we are far worse than on Sunday. The opposition is more or less non-existent but our build ups are so slow and pedestrian and we do not seem to have a clue how to break them down when within 25 yards of their goal. Have really created nothing with little desire and drive. Wagner has to do some serious rollicking.

AJ We will have to beg to differ. In no way do I see this as an “unnatural position”. Having played a lot of sport when you are jumping about your arms are never tucked in by your side. Actually when you see defenders placing their arms across their chest that definitely is not natural.

I think there is a link. The more frustrated the home fans get the worse the ref is !!!!!

Crazy decision. They have to make adjustments to this rule. Defender only had his arm in the air as part of the normal movement to jump and had no idea of the trajectory of the ball.

I suppose I should add prove to my Very Old Supporter standing by recalling my attendance at the 5th Round FA Cup Tie at Roker Park on 10 Feb 1951. A crowd of just over 65000 and we lost 3-1. A special overnight train was laid on and I still remember sitting in a Cafe beside the River Wear at around 7.00am having a breakfast. Never been so cold in all my life. Can't remember how we passed the time away pre Kick Off nor what actually happened in the match. Sunderland were an established First Division side and I don't think we gave them too much to worry about. Johnny Gavin scored our goal.

Worked very hard for the Club and completed many judicious deals. Had to continually complete juggling acts in the transfer market - nothing has changed. Very unfairly criticised.

The way we play out from the back means he is frequently in possession with a fair amount of space. But it is noticeable that he is not good at playing a decent ball from there. Most of his passes this evening were up the line to Hernandez when he was already closely marked and we never made any progress and invariably lost the ball. As is regularly stated he is not a great defender. I would probably go for Sorensen.

Best Ref I have seen this season. Allowed the game to flow. Agree we should get rid of VAR. Game played by humans (well most of them !!!) and should be controlled by similar types. Very noticeable that with us being in front most of second half the opponents time wasting and antics disappeared. For me too much messing about over the taking of freekicks etc.

Been twice over recent years. Never seen any trouble despite thrashing them 5-1on one occasion and suggesting home fans were leaving early due to a fire drill !!! As already mentioned there is now an away fans walkway from Ground to South Bermondsey station. Usually travel as suggested. Car to Epping Station, now £6 all day, and Tube to London Bridge and then take overground. Don't think the Den these days is much to worry about.

I think you might be right there!!!!!

I was 9 - nearly 10 !!! 1-5 Ipswich 1947. Probably less than a shilling to go in River End but we did not have a roof. Only able to go if I went without porridge for a couple of days. Am slightly better off these days. Remind me - what is this thread all about. 2-1 home win tomorrow. If anyone wants a laugh watch You Tube - Vincent Kompany - team talk.

Or joined the Government.

Being one of many "Pinkun Experts" I was delighted to at last see a manager who could see the blindingly obvious that our only problem was the attacks coming in from the Coventry right winger who Gianoullis just could not get to grips with. Decisive action was taken at half time rather than wait until the hour was up. If Wagner continues to keep this current style and results going - what on earth will we have to talk about !!!

I would suggest that Krul was recalled purely because the defence in particular badly needed some "vociferous leadership" and organisation. Hanley is worth his place and gives his all but shows little signs of what is needed from a captain. As regards goalkeeping skills I would say Gunn shades it and it was very worrying to see the number of short passes Krul gave to defenders who already had opposing attackers in close proximity. We got away with it and overall he is still good enough at the higher levels. I have no wish to see Gunn go but it is a fact that there are Premiership sides looking to replace their ageing keepers and must be eying the situation. We could do with a few million at the moment !!

I will try again !!!

Nutty. Thats a bit of a young supporters question !!!!! I saw this guy play against Ipswich in 1947. Needless to say we lost 1-5. footballer.pdf

I totally agree with mrdi’s post. I suppose the most significant factor of this game was there was barely any entertainment value. Watfords’s tactics were appalling and I am fed up with Refs who seem to need a minute to set up a free kick. The second half was more or less watched in silence at the River End. I think it is at last sinking in that we don’t have a lot of individual quality and what I find so frustrating is the number of passes made to team mates who are already closely marked and invariably lose possession. Partly due to our weak midfield who cannot creat space in attacking positions. So playing three “strikers” up front, with the smallest in the middle, will get us nowhere. Did we actually have a shot on target today !!! Stuart Webber must take some blame in that he has “pxxxxd” a lot of money up the wall on many mediocre players and we have no winger who can contribute for 90 minutes.I really am very very Grumpy.

Kenny was our best player this evening. Organised the defence very well and used his experience to cover most threats. He is much more suited to a CDM as he no longer has the pace and drive to have an impact in an attacking role. I initially admired Nunez but he had another poor game tonight. Sara performed fairly well now that he has a huge weight of his shoulders !!!

Good luck Ricardo. In due course we look forward to your future Reports which hopefully will show we are moving in the right direction.

Don't think so. As I just mentioned on another thread this current side - perm any 11 from 20 - is not remotely anywhere near as good as the side who demolished Boro in the Wembley play-offs.

Purely by chance just watched highlights of the Wembley play-off v Boro. The team we put out that day were light years ahead of anything we have seen this season. Not only from the angle of style and teamwork but individually every player looked far better than any of the current squad. A sad but true reflection of how badly we have fallen away since the days of Neil and Farke.

I think he would make a great "hands on" manager.

Cannot believe we are sending out such a defensive line up against pretty moderate opponents. No creativity, no pace, and no width. Hopefully we might scrape a 1-0 win. If we go down methinks this thread will be a bit hot around 9.40 !!!