Thomas Hitzlsperger

[morty 0]

[quote user="iron_stan"]morty - players get abuse for all sorts of things anywaybecause we make such a big deal of homosexuality and sportsmen it just makes it worse, the guy you bought your milk off today might have been gay, you didnt care, didnt cross your mind did it, he went about his day being a massive massive gay and he didnt feel the to tell the world about it, and no one cared. It just gets turned into a massive deal where in reality its not, we dont go out and plaster it across the back pages when a player says "IVE GOT A GIRLFRIEND, IM A HETRO EVERYONE LOOK LOOK"its fucking archaic [/quote]I don''t disagree with that, but as I said earlier in the thread, if I was in the position, I wouldn''t want to be the first one to do it. Its not just the abuse from mindless "fans" but the massive fuss, and ensuing picking apart of that persons private life by the media.

[iron_stan 0]

morty thats my point though, because the press are gagging to unveil this individual and make such a massive deal about it just makes it worse, where in truth the footballer is just a bloody footballer who wants their career to be remembered for their ability, medals, achievements etc as opposed to being the first ''gay in the village.....to admit it....whilst still playing''

whatever they do from then on will always have that mentioned, instead of, lkets say, theiur 3 title and fa cup winning medals, the 600 first team appearances or 250 goals etc

tell you what though, whoever does it, is going to make a fortune appearing on oprah and jonathan ross

[morty 0]

[quote user="iron_stan"]morty thats my point though, because the press are gagging to unveil this individual and make such a massive deal about it just makes it worse, where in truth the footballer is just a bloody footballer who wants their career to be remembered for their ability, medals, achievements etc as opposed to being the first ''gay in the village.....to admit it....whilst still playing''

whatever they do from then on will always have that mentioned, instead of, lkets say, theiur 3 title and fa cup winning medals, the 600 first team appearances or 250 goals etc

tell you what though, whoever does it, is going to make a fortune appearing on oprah and jonathan ross [/quote]Which is exactly why no one is going to do it, why would you put yourself through that?

[Mr Jenkins 0]

Gareth Thomas came out while still playing professional rugby, a footballer will do the same before long. About time too.

[Madison 0]

[quote user="Canarygirl"]Gareth Thomas came out while still playing professional rugby, a footballer will do the same before long. About time too.[/quote]

Like that will improve the game!

[im spartacus canary 0]

will wags be replaced by habs ?

[Waveney Canary 0]

There is a lot of self righteous nonsense on this thread. I don''t want to know or give a damn what players do with their todgers in their private lives. My only interest is how well they play for my local team

[William Darby 0]

[quote user="Thorpe end canary"]There is a lot of self righteous nonsense on this thread. I don''t want to know or give a damn what players do with their todgers in their private lives. My only interest is how well they play for my local team[/quote]

Me too, I really couldn''t give a toss.  

The real problem imo isn''t with football or the fans. It comes down to gutter press journos wanting to write salacious stories in the red top rags.

Take Justin, he didn''t come out voluntarily.  He was forced out, to pre-empt  a salacious story about his private life.  The fewer people who stick their noses into somebody''s private life, the more people won''t give a stuff what the do away from their ''jobs''.

[stoke canary 0]

With yesterdays news ,It made me wonder who gave Thomas the nickname THE HAMMER !!

[CambridgeCanary 0]

[quote user="Canarygirl"]Gareth Thomas came out while still playing professional rugby, a footballer will do the same before long. About time too.[/quote]

But that is the point. Rugby crowds do not indulge in the vile behaviour of tribal football fans. There is something very primal about football crowds. People behave in ways and say things at matches that they wouldn''t dream of any where else. Crowds can be vile and cruel in ways unmatched in any other part of our society. Football will always be the last bastion of prejudice.......sadly but inevitably.

[splutcho 173]

I do take a bit of what some of you are saying on board about not really caring, which is fair enough, but things like this are huge for young gay people that think there is no place for them in professional sport.

[Bethnal Yellow and Green 1,557]

[quote user="John from the Tomorrow People"][quote user="Thorpe end canary"]There is a lot of self righteous nonsense on this thread. I don''t want to know or give a damn what players do with their todgers in their private lives. My only interest is how well they play for my local team[/quote]

Me too, I really couldn''t give a toss.  

The real problem imo isn''t with football or the fans. It comes down to gutter press journos wanting to write salacious stories in the red top rags.

Take Justin, he didn''t come out voluntarily.  He was forced out, to pre-empt  a salacious story about his private life.  The fewer people who stick their noses into somebody''s private life, the more people won''t give a stuff what the do away from their ''jobs''.

[/quote]

 

Things have changed since Justin and there are several footballers who many jurnos know are gay, but they refuse to out them without the player''s consent.

[ZLF 274]

The sooner this type of announcement becomes not news the better for all;   and that is the point.   

[The gut 0]

[quote user="splutcho"]I do take a bit of what some of you are saying on board about not really caring, which is fair enough, but things like this are huge for young gay people that think there is no place for them in professional sport.[/quote]

Funny how people see things - I can''t imagine that there are any "young gay people that think there is no place for them in professional sport"

unless they just aren''t good enough.

I would have thought a sports person is a sports person, aiming to do their best to perform at the highest level. Can''t imagine any thinking "can''t do it cos I''m gay".

[the bristol nest 0]

Gay people suffer prejudice as do non white players. Racism has to be tackled as you can see the colour of their skin. Gay people can hide it therefore they do. This means they live in an unequal world. Good for hitz.

[Number 9 0]

My concern is the subliminal link ''jimmy hill'' made on page 1 of this thread that gingers are gay

[morty 0]

Good point bristol nest.

[crabbycanary 2]

[quote user="Bethnal Yellow and Green"][quote user="John from the Tomorrow People"][quote user="Thorpe end canary"]There is a lot of self righteous nonsense on this thread. I don''t want to know or give a damn what players do with their todgers in their private lives. My only interest is how well they play for my local team[/quote]

Me too, I really couldn''t give a toss.  

The real problem imo isn''t with football or the fans. It comes down to gutter press journos wanting to write salacious stories in the red top rags.

Take Justin, he didn''t come out voluntarily.  He was forced out, to pre-empt  a salacious story about his private life.  The fewer people who stick their noses into somebody''s private life, the more people won''t give a stuff what the do away from their ''jobs''.

[/quote]

 

Things have changed since Justin and there are several footballers who many jurnos know are gay, but they refuse to out them without the player''s consent.

[/quote]

With that in mind Bethnal, could someone organise these known guys to do one big ''Out'' and get it all over and done with?

This would spread the individual load, so to speak, and also before we know it, it will be yesterdays headlines, and they can all move on.

[Crystal Canary 0]

I wonder how many of those people saying that it shouldn''t be a big deal are gay or bisexual? Anyone? No?

I love that you guys think you live in this wonderful utopian world where everyone shares your inclusive views and that all footballers feel entirely comfortable living in secret about their sexuality but I can assure it it''s not the case.

The fact that Hitzlsperger felt it necessary to wait until he retired to come out should indicate that there are deep-rooted problems within the game. The macho nature of the changing room must be pretty intimidating for any gay guy. The ''banter'' or jokes that may be light-hearted and not necessarily intended to cause offence can still be upsetting for those guys concealing their own sexuality. This, along with the homophobic chanting from segments of the crowd, can only be eradicated through the willingness of those in the sport to accept the problem and be educated on it.

To pretend it''s not an issue and everything''s fine is naive at best, and condemns those gay people within the sport to a miserable and frustrated life.

[john in exile in leeds 4]

Breaking news:

Hitzlsperger shamefully reveals that he once played for West Ham.

[The gut 0]

Crystal canary

"I wonder how many of those people saying that it shouldn''t be a big deal are gay or bisexual? Anyone? No?

I love that you guys think you live in this wonderful utopian world where everyone shares your inclusive views and that all footballers feel entirely comfortable living in secret about their sexuality but I can assure it it''s not the case.

The fact that Hitzlsperger felt it necessary to wait until he retired to come out should indicate that there are deep-rooted problems within the game. The macho nature of the changing room must be pretty intimidating for any gay guy. The ''banter'' or jokes that may be light-hearted and not necessarily intended to cause offence can still be upsetting for those guys concealing their own sexuality. This, along with the homophobic chanting from segments of the crowd, can only be eradicated through the willingness of those in the sport to accept the problem and be educated on it.

To pretend it''s not an issue and everything''s fine is naive at best, and condemns those gay people within the sport to a miserable and frustrated life."

------------------------------------------------------

I''m not gay, I''m pretty certain, at the moment. I don''t think it would be a big deal if I was. I understand that those in the public eye have added pressure but that is life, no matter what the subject.

I don''t live in a utopian world, far from it.

I have lived in a macho world in the army and in football dressing rooms and the humour in that world can be tough for anyone. It can be a right laugh and it can be he''ll for some. I don''t know what people expect though, I wouldn''t particularly think that it needs to change, why should it. That''s how it is. It''s about the personalities, to me, the only issue is if there is prejudice. Banter is what it is. Prejudice is another matter, that is what most decent people remove themselves from.

We are who we are, we will never be perfect, and we should be true to ourselves.

Straight people who do not think sexuality is a big deal do not condemn gay sportsmen to miserable and frustrated life. Only oursoles do that!

[lake district canary 4,531]

Its a difficult scenario and we can be as liberal as we like, but issues must still arise.   In the real world, we all know people who we either know are gay or who we think are gay, but it presents few problems.  Most of us will have been in a bar frequented by gays at some stage, either by mistake or for a laugh or because it doesn''t bother us so there is no real issue.  However, I have a friend who in recent times has been getting a bit too close for comfort, too many phone calls etc etc and recently said to me "If we''d been gay, we would have got together by now". It makes me feel uneasy about our friendship, I can''t help it.   It''s all very well  saying if you are comfortable in your sexuality it doesn''t matter what people think, but to me it adds pressure to a friendship between people of the same sex when issues like this arise.  So on a personal level - which is what this issue is mainly about - it can be a problem - and could cause problems anywhere, not just football, as has been said.  There are wider issues too, of course, that the media will jump on these things like the parasites they are.   But in the public eye, you have to expect gossip/tittle tattle to cause problems now and then.  I wish we call all live in a liberal and free world where men and women of all persuasions share a changing room without any problem.  The gay men can look at the men, the straight men can look at the women, the lesbians can look at the women too......everyone would be happy then  [:D] - or am I getting myself in hot water..... [:^)]

[The gut 0]

I can''t help thinking you would have been better writing to dear Deirdre LDC.

This board has not been kind to you in the past. You might be lucky cos of the subject matter ;-)

[lake district canary 4,531]

[quote user="The gut"]I can''t help thinking you would have been better writing to dear Deirdre LDC.

This board has not been kind to you in the past. You might be lucky cos of the subject matter ;-)[/quote]

[:D]  No need to bother Deirdre as I don''t have a problem.   But I would agree it is a tricky subject!

[......and Smith must score. 1,343]

[quote user="lake district canary"]I wish we call all live in a liberal and free world where men and women of all persuasions share a changing room without any problem.  The gay men can look at the men, the straight men can look at the women, the lesbians can look at the women too......everyone would be happy then  [:D] - or am I getting myself in hot water..... [:^)][/quote]On this message board ? Nailed on.......... especially as the straight women are getting gawped at by all and sundry .[:D]

[Bill 1,788]

[quote user="lake district canary"]Its a difficult scenario and we can be as liberal as we like, but issues must still arise.   In the real world, we all know people who we either know are gay or who we think are gay, but it presents few problems.  Most of us will have been in a bar frequented by gays at some stage, either by mistake or for a laugh or because it doesn''t bother us so there is no real issue.  However, I have a friend who in recent times has been getting a bit too close for comfort, too many phone calls etc etc and recently said to me "If we''d been gay, we would have got together by now". It makes me feel uneasy about our friendship, I can''t help it.   It''s all very well  saying if you are comfortable in your sexuality it doesn''t matter what people think, but to me it adds pressure to a friendship between people of the same sex when issues like this arise.  So on a personal level - which is what this issue is mainly about - it can be a problem - and could cause problems anywhere, not just football, as has been said.  There are wider issues too, of course, that the media will jump on these things like the parasites they are.   But in the public eye, you have to expect gossip/tittle tattle to cause problems now and then.  I wish we call all live in a liberal and free world where men and women of all persuasions share a changing room without any problem.  The gay men can look at the men, the straight men can look at the women, the lesbians can look at the women too......everyone would be happy then  [:D] - or am I getting myself in hot water..... [:^)]

[/quote]

no ishooooooooooooooooo ?most of us will have frequented football matches, shops restuarants and workplaces frequented by ''these people''"either by mistake" .... why would it be a mistake if it was not an ishooooooooooooooo"or for a laugh" ........ oh dear, has Bedlam closed ?

still it could be that you are not a closet bigot at all, but a devious troll

hmmmm

[im spartacus canary 0]

and that''s coming from the biggest troll on here [:D]