Knappers First Transfer Window

[Danke bitte 967]

Good if unspectacular.

Decks cleared of want aways, back loan option brought in and transfer targets identified.

As others have said, powder kept dry for a new head coach in Summer. Interesting stuff.

[S_81 816]

Agree with most of that. But feel getting rid of Placheta is undoubtedly a good thing. An ineffective waste of a wage. Never getting ahead of Sainz or Onel. Nor of use at left back. 

[Ulfotto 640]

25 minutes ago, Conrad said:

It makes more sense if Wagner is leaving in the summer. 

I agree but surely they should have sacked him by now if that was the case. Why back publicly after Blackburn then not back him now. It’s like all the eggs are in the reboot it in the summer this fails to realise we are 2 points from the playoffs with a favourable fixture list. This might be our best chance to get promoted for years.

[shefcanary 2,435]

I'm just going to refer to a table I keep updated re. our squad.

The window has to a certain extent had a focus on removing some players who fundamentally haven't been doing enough for the squad, which seems a positive.

One feature now is this has left us with only 9 homegrown players over 21 on 1 January 2023 (the EFL cut-off for homegrown qualification date, with a minimum 8 required in every squad). As 4 of these are CB's unless we play 3 at the back, once any of these 9 get an injury then Wagner has to select an U21 for the squad of 20. on top of this as there are only 9 overseas players over 21, he was always destined to pick at least 2 U21's anyway, Borja Sainz and Rowe being shoe ins for those two spaces. However, my sense is that Knapper has engineered a bit more pressure on Wagner to pick U21's for the squad now, to open up progression for academy players and that has to be a good thing. We will see more U21's appearing on the bench in future as injuries to the ageing contingent are inevitable.

Another feature is that when it comes to the named squad, we potentially had as many as 7 positions available for transfers in. This is as much as I have ever recorded but will be a good indicator of who the club thinks will progress from the academy when they name the 25 for their squad next week.

Are there gaps - well right full back looks a particularly vulnerable position. Given the age of our natural CB's we are bound to rely on Kenny and Lungi to fill in here, but that leaves our defensive midfield looking very weak - yet again another window passes and no CDM. 

So with that in mind some dead wood moved on, but it still looks like we are relying on very good luck as far as injuries are concerned. Or, academy lads will play a bigger part in our squads for the rest of the season.

 

[hogesar 9,709]

Uhh, the only real known good business is the business we didn't do - i.e keeping hold of Sara and Rowe.

It's interesting to ponder how this window would be viewed if it was exactly the same but with Webber in charge. Far more negatively I imagine.

I'm also predicting that if Sydney scores the same amount of goals in similar time on the pitch as Idah, Sydney will be regarded as a success....hopefully he offers us more otherwise we've weakened our forward line.

[S_81 816]

The most glaring omission is yet another window where we’ve failed to sufficiently strengthen defensive midfield. 
 

And I don’t care for answers trying to justify the madness of Wagner feeling we are fine being over run through the middle. As we clearly aren’t. 
 

It staggers me that Knapper hasn’t tackled that.  

[king canary 7,643]

12 minutes ago, hogesar said:

I'm also predicting that if Sydney scores the same amount of goals in similar time on the pitch as Idah, Sydney will be regarded as a success....hopefully he offers us more otherwise we've weakened our forward line.

I'd hope we can assess a player beyond just looking at their goal totals.

It could be Sydney scores less but his overall contribution to the team is greater. By biggest criticism of Idah was always how easy he seems to make life for defenders when he starts games, so if the new boy is more of a handful then I'll be happy.

[Nuff Said 5,153]

59 minutes ago, Conrad said:

It's the same people that think Idah will come good. (actually I hope that he comes back from Celtic a better player). 

Not necessarily. I do think Idah will eventually prove himself, but he needs to play more. Not sure he’ll get that at Celtic though.
 

I can’t help feeling he needs to work on the mental side of his games, he’s been better at the snap shots and instinctive play, whenever he’s had a run on goal with only the keeper to beat he appears to think too much and c0ck it up. I suppose playing at Celtic Park will get him used to pressure.

[Conrad 171]

33 minutes ago, Ulfotto said:

I agree but surely they should have sacked him by now if that was the case. Why back publicly after Blackburn then not back him now. It’s like all the eggs are in the reboot it in the summer this fails to realise we are 2 points from the playoffs with a favourable fixture list. This might be our best chance to get promoted for years.

Probably more to do with not wanting to get players now that Wagner may want, if, come the summer, they may not be ones that a new coach may want. 

[Nuff Said 5,153]

1 hour ago, BurwellCanary said:

Are you Criag Revell-Horwood in disguise?

 

44 minutes ago, Robert N. LiM said:

If so it's a bloody good disguise.

Good chant though. I just can’t quite work out the context in which it would be used yet though.

[hogesar 9,709]

11 minutes ago, king canary said:

I'd hope we can assess a player beyond just looking at their goal totals.

It could be Sydney scores less but his overall contribution to the team is greater. By biggest criticism of Idah was always how easy he seems to make life for defenders when he starts games, so if the new boy is more of a handful then I'll be happy.

Oh don't get me wrong, I'm sure no matter what happens there'll be a % who find a way to prove that new guy is better than "national league" Idah, but I think fans were generally very harsh on him. Sydney has a long name and didn't come from our academy so weirdly he'll get loads of additional leeway.

[king canary 7,643]

38 minutes ago, Danke bitte said:

Good if unspectacular.

Decks cleared of want aways, back loan option brought in and transfer targets identified.

As others have said, powder kept dry for a new head coach in Summer. Interesting stuff.

It felt similar in a way to last January where we clearly were focused on moving on some of our higher wage earners in order to reshape the squad. 

Moving on Foreshaw, Placheta and Hwang saves us money and doesn't really hurt us in any way. Similarly in the summer I'd imagine we'll see Dimi, Batth, Sorenson move on too. Just hoping we don't replace them with a bunch of 30+ journeymen this time.

[Conrad 171]

4 minutes ago, Nuff Said said:

Not necessarily. I do think Idah will eventually prove himself, but he needs to play more. Not sure he’ll get that at Celtic though.
 

I can’t help feeling he needs to work on the mental side of his games, he’s been better at the snap shots and instinctive play, whenever he’s had a run on goal with only the keeper to beat he appears to think too much and c0ck it up. I suppose playing at Celtic Park will get him used to pressure.

Being at Celtic could be a bit like 'shooting rats in a barrel'. If he cannot score there, with the number of chances they should create against lower quality opposition, then he will probably never score anywhere. All he has to do is get into the team! 

[Capt. Pants 4,263]

I think the window was pretty neutral. We'll see what SVH can do, but he doesn’t have a lot of time to settle - the trouble with half season loans is that they must have instant impact.

Another pro is keeping Giannoulis. Yes a fee from Ajax would have been nice, but I'd rather have the player.

 

[JonnyJonnyRowe 451]

4 hours ago, Nuff Said said:

I don’t get the people who think Placheta had latent talent. He’d been here three years, had a loan at another Championship club and none of it uncovered any sort of promise. He did ok in a couple of games this season to be fair but that soon tailed off and if that’s the best he could do after the time and training invested in him, meh. We won’t miss him.

I do think there is an element of people not being able to say a bad word about him really, seems like a decent chap and we've never heard any inkling about attitude issues, just people wishing him well. 

And he's definitely a better footballer now than he was in his first season.

[JonnyJonnyRowe 451]

2 hours ago, hogesar said:

Sydney has a long name and didn't come from our academy so weirdly he'll get loads of additional leeway.

More likely to get that leeway because he dad was an elite striker.

[repman 635]

3 hours ago, Ulfotto said:

I agree but surely they should have sacked him by now if that was the case. Why back publicly after Blackburn then not back him now. It’s like all the eggs are in the reboot it in the summer this fails to realise we are 2 points from the playoffs with a favourable fixture list. This might be our best chance to get promoted for years.

I think all signs point to Knapper essentially being told to write this season off, and perhaps not change too much too fast. Not that I think that's an acceptable outcome but it is the most likely imo.

While we aren't far off the playoffs I don't think we really have much chance of getting into it. I do think with a better coach we could easily trouble that top 6, which is where my main frustration with Knapper would lie.

[Nuff Said 5,153]

There’s a lot of talk about a push for the play-offs, but they are largely a lottery. While I think we’d all love to see it, lose and where are we? Effectively the same place as if we finish in 7th, maybe a bit of momentum for next season.

 

Reading that back, it is a bit defeatist though, so PLAYOFFS HERE WE COME! OTBC!

[Worthy Nigelton 1,058]

5 hours ago, Nuff Said said:

I don’t get the people who think Placheta had latent talent. He’d been here three years, had a loan at another Championship club and none of it uncovered any sort of promise. He did ok in a couple of games this season to be fair but that soon tailed off and if that’s the best he could do after the time and training invested in him, meh. We won’t miss him.

Yeah Placheta is rubbish. Not Championship standard and basically another terrible signing. He doesn't get mentioned enough among the plethora of horrific signings of the last few years. What was he, about £3m? Absolute dross for £3m wasn't he...?

[hogesar 9,709]

1 hour ago, JonnyJonnyRowe said:

More likely to get that leeway because he dad was an elite striker.

That would make even less sense, to be honest.

[norfolkngood 1,087]

4 hours ago, king canary said:

I'd hope we can assess a player beyond just looking at their goal totals.

It could be Sydney scores less but his overall contribution to the team is greater. By biggest criticism of Idah was always how easy he seems to make life for defenders when he starts games, so if the new boy is more of a handful then I'll be happy.

Do not get me wrong his teamwork is very important ,

but i feel we often settle for a hardworking striker who does not score here  ,

a striker will or should get the most chances so i do judge on goals scored say ( 65 %goals /35 % workrate  ratio ) 

Teamwork . making chances and pressing is all part of the job but i feel most important thing for a striker is getting in there and scoring let the others in the team create chances  etc 

the modern striker has to do everything and for what we pay it is hard to find that person Pukki was the last of course ,

Sarge can do it Barnes can not a rarely scoring striker who is a handful but does he really create enough to warrant a start ? 

we need goals in our team hopefully our new striker can do the hard work but score goals his main aim 

 

[astro 364]

At some point you have to stick or twist with fringe players, and I think he deserves credit for twisting with Idah, Placheta and Springett tbh. 

[PurpleCanary 5,575]

5 hours ago, hogesar said:

Uhh, the only real known good business is the business we didn't do - i.e keeping hold of Sara and Rowe.

It's interesting to ponder how this window would be viewed if it was exactly the same but with Webber in charge. Far more negatively I imagine.

I'm also predicting that if Sydney scores the same amount of goals in similar time on the pitch as Idah, Sydney will be regarded as a success....hopefully he offers us more otherwise we've weakened our forward line.

I think that is a touch unfair. As you know I am a hopeless judge of players, and especially strikers🤩😛, but two things struck me about Idah. One that there was not one aspect of the game that he was very good at, let alone exceptional. Secondly, that he lacked the technical qualities (ball control etc) that seem now to be needed even for goalscorers, given how flexible formations are.

I know next to nothing about van Hooijdonk but his pedigree - Dutch upbringing - suggests  he may have the all-round abilities that Idah lacks. And he might even have one aspect of his game at which he is very good.

[Mason 47 1,389]

Good window for me.

I was of the opinion months ago that Norwich City needs a point-to-point restoration. This won't happen by gagging after the playoffs, we need to take a much broader view.

Placheta, Springett, Forshaw and Idah were 3rd and 4th choice in various degrees. Warner and the youth contingent need higher level games that they won't get here. The squad reset began this month, believe that- I doubt there will be more than a handful of the current starters still around next year.

Our only signing is exactly what people want. A pre-prime player of potential who wants to show what he can do; someone who I believe will supplant one of the older heads over time. 

If we fluke our way to the PL, great. The money will make the transformation much easier. 

[Indy_Bones 441]

33 minutes ago, Mason 47 said:

If we fluke our way to the PL, great. The money will make the transformation much easier. 

I'm not entirely sure that would be the case though Mason, on one hand we would have the far greater finances provided simply by being in the PL, but on the flip side of that, you need a much higher calibre of player alongside it which carries a equivalent cost as well - especially when in reality we need to replace a signifcant number of our starting XI to even have the vaguest chance of staying up if that happens.

We'd probably need virtually an entire back 4 as Gibson, Batth, Dimi and McCallum are likely leaving/out of contract, and Stacey desperately needs stronger cover than Fisher at that level. Hanley and Duffy are knocking on as well, and I doubt either of Warner or Tomkimson are anywhere near ready to be regular starters in the prem for that matter..

In midfield we've been crying out for a Tettey/Skipp type player, McLean isn't getting any younger and isn't as impressive in the PL as in the champs, Fassnacht has struggled to even show what's needed at this level, and in many ways Nunez still provides the conundrum of exactly what is his best role and he's yet to truly show the ability he displayed when he first arrived with any consistency since either.

Whether or not we can even keep Rowe beyond the summer is another major concern, we may have an outside chance of him staying IF we were to get promoted and offer him a vastly improved contract, but money talks, and a significant offer (especially if he decides he wants the move) puts an end to that entire conversation.

Upfront we have basically Sarge and the unproven as yet SVH (who we may not even buy) with the jury out on Idah (if he even returns from his loan) and Barnes is not what we need, which means the most expensive position to get quality in is where we arguably need it most, as another injury to Sarge leaves us in a real mess.

Not to mention that we look far weaker without Gunn in goal, so potentially another keeper to replace Long is required, as I wouldn't trust him for any extended period of time.

All of that isn't cheap, and not forgetting that you've then got the potential issue of integrating numerous players at once, ideally under a different system and different manager as most of us aren't convinced that Wagner is the man (again further cost).

I'm not surprised that Knapper is taking his time over decisions, as from an external view, it's a big ask to make all these changes (many of which are very necessary) whilst still operating with a much lower budget than many of our counterparts, and we don't have owners who are going to throw 200 million or so at players in the way that the likes of Forest or Fulham have done.

I think we've been sensible in this window, offloaded a few squad players to save wages, given Idah the chance to show if he can finally live up to his potential or not, and left a clear option there to replace Wagner in or just before the summer when the main rebuild is needed and no point buying multiple players for the current boss if we intend to change it all in a few months time.

Going to be an interesting 6 months I think, could be good, bad or very ugly though...

[Mason 47 1,389]

35 minutes ago, Indy_Bones said:

I'm not entirely sure that would be the case though Mason, on one hand we would have the far greater finances provided simply by being in the PL, but on the flip side of that, you need a much higher calibre of player alongside it which carries a equivalent cost as well - especially when in reality we need to replace a signifcant number of our starting XI to even have the vaguest chance of staying up if that happens.

We'd probably need virtually an entire back 4 as Gibson, Batth, Dimi and McCallum are likely leaving/out of contract, and Stacey desperately needs stronger cover than Fisher at that level. Hanley and Duffy are knocking on as well, and I doubt either of Warner or Tomkimson are anywhere near ready to be regular starters in the prem for that matter..

In midfield we've been crying out for a Tettey/Skipp type player, McLean isn't getting any younger and isn't as impressive in the PL as in the champs, Fassnacht has struggled to even show what's needed at this level, and in many ways Nunez still provides the conundrum of exactly what is his best role and he's yet to truly show the ability he displayed when he first arrived with any consistency since either.

Whether or not we can even keep Rowe beyond the summer is another major concern, we may have an outside chance of him staying IF we were to get promoted and offer him a vastly improved contract, but money talks, and a significant offer (especially if he decides he wants the move) puts an end to that entire conversation.

Upfront we have basically Sarge and the unproven as yet SVH (who we may not even buy) with the jury out on Idah (if he even returns from his loan) and Barnes is not what we need, which means the most expensive position to get quality in is where we arguably need it most, as another injury to Sarge leaves us in a real mess.

Not to mention that we look far weaker without Gunn in goal, so potentially another keeper to replace Long is required, as I wouldn't trust him for any extended period of time.

All of that isn't cheap, and not forgetting that you've then got the potential issue of integrating numerous players at once, ideally under a different system and different manager as most of us aren't convinced that Wagner is the man (again further cost).

I'm not surprised that Knapper is taking his time over decisions, as from an external view, it's a big ask to make all these changes (many of which are very necessary) whilst still operating with a much lower budget than many of our counterparts, and we don't have owners who are going to throw 200 million or so at players in the way that the likes of Forest or Fulham have done.

I think we've been sensible in this window, offloaded a few squad players to save wages, given Idah the chance to show if he can finally live up to his potential or not, and left a clear option there to replace Wagner in or just before the summer when the main rebuild is needed and no point buying multiple players for the current boss if we intend to change it all in a few months time.

Going to be an interesting 6 months I think, could be good, bad or very ugly though...

I do agree in part, however, I see this change as coming regardless. A Stacey backup, replacement for 2 of Batth, Gibson, Hanley, both left backs show no indication of staying, we need to reinforce the midfield & our effective forward options begin and end with the first choice three. These things will be true regardless of which league we end up in.

The calibre of player we could attract would ultimately be higher a league up, regardless of if we got relegated. And we would be able to hang onto Sara, Rowe etc to make that transition less broad at once.

All that being said, I still think it'll be the Championship and for the purposes of the rebuild, I'll take it.

 

[mastoola 185]

10 hours ago, Satriales said:

He might go on to score a shed load, will be interesting to see how he goes up there.

Will be a very small shed  maybe a 5x2?

Edited February 2 by mastoola

[Monty13 2,235]

10 hours ago, shefcanary said:

I'm just going to refer to a table I keep updated re. our squad.

The window has to a certain extent had a focus on removing some players who fundamentally haven't been doing enough for the squad, which seems a positive.

One feature now is this has left us with only 9 homegrown players over 21 on 1 January 2023 (the EFL cut-off for homegrown qualification date, with a minimum 8 required in every squad). As 4 of these are CB's unless we play 3 at the back, once any of these 9 get an injury then Wagner has to select an U21 for the squad of 20. on top of this as there are only 9 overseas players over 21, he was always destined to pick at least 2 U21's anyway, Borja Sainz and Rowe being shoe ins for those two spaces. However, my sense is that Knapper has engineered a bit more pressure on Wagner to pick U21's for the squad now, to open up progression for academy players and that has to be a good thing. We will see more U21's appearing on the bench in future as injuries to the ageing contingent are inevitable.

Another feature is that when it comes to the named squad, we potentially had as many as 7 positions available for transfers in. This is as much as I have ever recorded but will be a good indicator of who the club thinks will progress from the academy when they name the 25 for their squad next week.

Are there gaps - well right full back looks a particularly vulnerable position. Given the age of our natural CB's we are bound to rely on Kenny and Lungi to fill in here, but that leaves our defensive midfield looking very weak - yet again another window passes and no CDM. 

So with that in mind some dead wood moved on, but it still looks like we are relying on very good luck as far as injuries are concerned. Or, academy lads will play a bigger part in our squads for the rest of the season.

 

I honestly wondered if that’s Knapper’s thinking. 

Wagner has appeared to be reluctant to play younger players, reducing the options forces him to use the players at his disposal. 

To be honest if Varane had come off I’d say on paper it would have been an excellent first window, especially given the extreme lack of movement in England.

The only slight negative for me is if we were really pushing for top 6 Knapper didn’t have one player in mind for a loan to give us a bit of an edge, I was hoping he’d pluck someone from the Arsenal academy.

On paper I think he’s done well, each decision makes sense to me. The proof is in what happens next as always, I always feel positive after a window. There’s always a chance the Donk is a masterstroke that kicks on our season.

[Monty13 2,235]

2 hours ago, Mason 47 said:

I do agree in part, however, I see this change as coming regardless. A Stacey backup, replacement for 2 of Batth, Gibson, Hanley, both left backs show no indication of staying, we need to reinforce the midfield & our effective forward options begin and end with the first choice three. These things will be true regardless of which league we end up in.

The calibre of player we could attract would ultimately be higher a league up, regardless of if we got relegated. And we would be able to hang onto Sara, Rowe etc to make that transition less broad at once.

All that being said, I still think it'll be the Championship and for the purposes of the rebuild, I'll take it.

 

Honestly this is setting up to be one of the biggest churns in playing squad for a long while. Probably more than any of Webber’s.

Forshaw and Placheta already gone. A large number of players out of contract in the summer and I see little reason to keep any of them.

Sargent and Rowe at a minimum will be in high demand. Probably Gunn and Sara as well. Idah May move on if we still deem him not ready. There’s possibly Kenny as well, I wouldn’t be surprised to see Farke come knocking again.

Even if we somehow get to the PL I don’t think it changes much of the above other than keeping players safe from the circling teams. It would be unthinkable IMO for us to repeat the mistakes of the past and sell a Rowe or Sargent on promotion.