I get the frustration, but........

[lake district canary 4,533]

........we have the players to do something this season. I thought we were poor up front yesterday, but there were reasons for it.

Firstly I thought Preston's approach was cowardly.....yes they needed to stop the rot, but they stood off us so much it was embarrassing. It nearly worked and they nearly nicked it, but they gave us far too much respect.

That approach caused us problems but we failed to take advantage of their lack of pressing us. Idah for me doesn't use his strength well - why he went down when through on goal from Hernandez's pass is a mystery, did he slip? Was he looking for a penalty rather than try and power through? I don't know, but it was very disappointing, because the defender didn't seem to be doing much and Idah is a strong lad and should have been able to power through.  Sargent is a pain in the aris for defenders and is far more effective than Idah at pressing and roughing up defenders, which is a shame because Idah surely has the physicality to cause problems - as he did in the previous game to win it for us, but didn't happen yesterday.

On the right of the pitch there was very little overlap play - Fassnacht and Stacey didn't appear to have much going on between them. Stacey got forward a lot, but there didn't seem to be much help from Fassnacht. It improved when Fisher and Rowe came on, but even then there wasn't a lot coming from the right.

So maybe it is just down to one or two players not being good enough.  Get Sargent back in, get Rowe in as a starter (why he isn't picked from the start is a bit if a mystery).  Barnes doesn't look 100% yet, but if you pick him, imo you have to pick Rowe to create havoc around the box to open up spaces.

So it was all a bit too stale up front - poor team selection for me. Preston's approach was dreadful - understandable  from their point of view maybe - but we were set up with the wrong team for that approach - and changes needed to be made earlier. Brave decisions needed to change it up at half time. All comes back to the head coach for me - he needs to be braver imo, especially at home - and he needs to trust his creative players - Rowe and Sainz.  It's all there - we have the players - just need to use them well!

A poor Preston team did us tactically yesterday - and it made us look mediocre too - which we probably are - but there is hope there, whether it's with Wagner or someone else - this season isn't done yet.

[......and Smith must score. 1,345]

You can’t throw your toys out of the pram because Preston came with a game plan and it worked. It was up to us to break them down. We didn’t and you admit we were stale up front.

You’re still clutching straws but as far as a top six place is concerned this season is over. The only saving grace is we’re probably safe from a relegation battle.

[Robert N. LiM 4,385]

6 minutes ago, lake district canary said:

. All comes back to the head coach for me - he needs to be braver imo,

For all possible criticisms of Wagner, this seems an odd one. He picked a very attacking team yesterday: a defence with a midfielder in it, two midfielders whose strengths are much more creative than defensive, and four attacking players. Strikes me he's brave to a fault. 

Didn't watch the game, but sounds like one of those days where the oppo came for a point and we weren't good enough to break down a dogged defensive setup. It happens.

[glory.win or die. 270]

We do have the players.. we compare them to Farke teams and they are well below, but compare them to teams in the league and we are top 6 easily.

A good coach with a single minded drive for promotion would get us in play offs comfortably.

 

[The Real Buh 3,444]

Absolute guff post

You are accepting of increasingly lowering standards at the club, that’s the bottom line.

[cambridgeshire canary 6,735]

9 minutes ago, Robert N. LiM said:

For all possible criticisms of Wagner, this seems an odd one. He picked a very attacking team yesterday: a defence with a midfielder in it, two midfielders whose strengths are much more creative than defensive, and four attacking players. Strikes me he's brave to a fault. 

Didn't watch the game, but sounds like one of those days where the oppo came for a point and we weren't good enough to break down a dogged defensive setup. It happens.

I just wish he would stop playing favorites and would start playing players in what is clearly their better positions..

Yes Mclean has looked decent at centreback but how must Batth be feeling? Why did we even sign him when a midfielder has taken his place? Why is Hernandez starting over young and promising Sainz? Just why the hell is Sara at defensive midfield when all his assists and goals have come when he plays further foward?

Edited December 10, 2023 by cambridgeshire canary

[The Raptor 1,211]

When? We've arguably had the players for the last few years and underachievement. I'm tired of waiting

Edited December 10, 2023 by The Raptor
Wark is a fool!

[Monty13 2,235]

23 minutes ago, Robert N. LiM said:

For all possible criticisms of Wagner, this seems an odd one. He picked a very attacking team yesterday: a defence with a midfielder in it, two midfielders whose strengths are much more creative than defensive, and four attacking players. Strikes me he's brave to a fault. 

Didn't watch the game, but sounds like one of those days where the oppo came for a point and we weren't good enough to break down a dogged defensive setup. It happens.

Completely agree with this, the one thing you can’t accuse Wagner of is a lack of bravery. Against the best teams in this league that lineup was suicidally attacking.

I watched the game, IMO we just don’t have the players to unlock a team that parks the bus. 

[Creedence Clearwater Couto 1,286]

47 minutes ago, Robert N. LiM said:

For all possible criticisms of Wagner, this seems an odd one. He picked a very attacking team yesterday: a defence with a midfielder in it, two midfielders whose strengths are much more creative than defensive, and four attacking players. Strikes me he's brave to a fault. 

Didn't watch the game, but sounds like one of those days where the oppo came for a point and we weren't good enough to break down a dogged defensive setup. It happens.

There was no intensity to our play, except the last 10-15 minute where we raised it a bit and the crowd responded. First 30 minutes was dire, on and off the pitch. 

I don’t think Preston particularly defended well. It was very easy for them. The biggest issue were the 3 attacking midfielders. They offered next to nothing, and weren’t able to take possession between the lines, from Kenny, Sara or McLean, who saw plenty of the ball, Duffy too tbf. Preston were never made to panic. Rowe and Gibbs came on, and followed suit. 

We’re recycling possession really well with Nunez and Sara, aided with Kenny at the back. It’s the 4 in front we can’t get right. Sargent will improve it.. but you can make an argument for needing to sign 3 new players to slot in behind. Fass and Barnes are decent squad players. But you can’t start both of them together in a three. It’s one or the other.

We also rely heavily on the full backs. Dimi was decent, but suffered from having Hernandez in front of him. There’s just no understanding there… as for Stacy, he’s really gone off the boil. Don’t think he beat his man once when attacking, and his deliveries were poor.  

The positive for me, is that I left thinking that there is a nucleus here and it just needs pulling together with 2 or 3 players. But those players need brining in. That’s assuming Sainz is another Webber dud.

 

Edited December 10, 2023 by Creedence Clearwater Couto

[cambridgeshire canary 6,735]

May LDC and his endless optimism shine bright even if we get battered by the binners

[Jim Smith 2,322]

56 minutes ago, Robert N. LiM said:

For all possible criticisms of Wagner, this seems an odd one. He picked a very attacking team yesterday: a defence with a midfielder in it, two midfielders whose strengths are much more creative than defensive, and four attacking players. Strikes me he's brave to a fault. 

Didn't watch the game, but sounds like one of those days where the oppo came for a point and we weren't good enough to break down a dogged defensive setup. It happens.

He’s not brave. He’s either just hugely stubborn or he’s thick. He doesn’t understand that playing more attacking players doesn’t necessarily mean better possession or more attacking threat. 

[Hardhouse44 261]

40 minutes ago, Jim Smith said:

He’s not brave. He’s either just hugely stubborn or he’s thick. He doesn’t understand that playing more attacking players doesn’t necessarily mean better possession or more attacking threat. 

Exactly. If that were the case teams would start with 10 strikers. 
playing Kenny at centre back has not bitten him on the äřşè yet because the two teams he’s been up against were toothless but against Ipswich he’ll get ripped to shreds. 
Tactically I can’t remember a manager who is so poor. Constantly trying to put square pegs in round holes. 
 

[Midlands Yellow 3,995]

How dare Preston set up how they did and be content gaining a point. We’d never deploy tactics like that ever. 

[nutty nigel 7,539]

59 minutes ago, Creedence Clearwater Couto said:

There was no intensity to our play, except the last 10-15 minute where we raised it a bit and the crowd responded. First 30 minutes was dire, on and off the pitch. 

I don’t think Preston particularly defended well. It was very easy for them. The biggest issue were the 3 attacking midfielders. They offered next to nothing, and weren’t able to take possession between the lines, from Kenny, Sara or McLean, who saw plenty of the ball, Duffy too tbf. Preston were never made to panic. Rowe and Gibbs came on, and followed suit. 

We’re recycling possession really well with Nunez and Sara, aided with Kenny at the back. It’s the 4 in front we can’t get right. Sargent will improve it.. but you can make an argument for needing to sign 3 new players to slot in behind. Fass and Barnes are decent squad players. But you can’t start both of them together in a three. It’s one or the other.

We also rely heavily on the full backs. Dimi was decent, but suffered from having Hernandez in front of him. There’s just no understanding there… as for Stacy, he’s really gone off the boil. Don’t think he beat his man once when attacking, and his deliveries were poor.  

The positive for me, is that I left thinking that there is a nucleus here and it just needs pulling together with 2 or 3 players. But those players need brining in. That’s assuming Sainz is another Webber dud.

 

The crowd got behind the team. It was a dull game you can't expect a cauldron of noise. It was certainly better than QPR. There was disappointment at the end because we didn't manage to score but constantly having two strikers injured makes for a lack of options off the bench to change it. Most people around me understand that but one guy was seething because we played "Nunez in central defence". 

[cambridgeshire canary 6,735]

18 minutes ago, Hardhouse44 said:

Exactly. If that were the case teams would start with 10 strikers. 
playing Kenny at centre back has not bitten him on the äřşè yet because the two teams he’s been up against were toothless but against Ipswich he’ll get ripped to shreds. 
Tactically I can’t remember a manager who is so poor. Constantly trying to put square pegs in round holes. 
 

To this day getting Huddersfield promoted of all clubs to the Prem and then somehow keeping them up will still be the only decent thing he's ever done with his managerial career

 

In some ways he's a bit like Lambert. Did wonders for us but since leaving us was awful and did nothing of note. Wagner was a manager who was at the perfect club for him at the perfect time where things went perfect but sadly despite being a nice guy it's clear things just have not worked out for him since leaving Huddersfield

Edited December 10, 2023 by cambridgeshire canary

[The Real Buh 3,444]

40 minutes ago, nutty nigel said:

The crowd got behind the team. It was a dull game you can't expect a cauldron of noise. It was certainly better than QPR. There was disappointment at the end because we didn't manage to score but constantly having two strikers injured makes for a lack of options off the bench to change it. Most people around me understand that but one guy was seething because we played "Nunez in central defence". 

But he did spend the majority of the game in central defence. How dare a basic point like that be eluded to, eh?

[nutty nigel 7,539]

4 minutes ago, The Real Buh said:

But he did spend the majority of the game in central defence. How dare a basic point like that be eluded to, eh?

Prima Donna Buh...

I'm off to the ballet. Have a wonderful afternoon. I hope you get the moon in a stick but you won't find it here.

[The Real Buh 3,444]

1 minute ago, nutty nigel said:

Prima Donna Buh...

I'm off to the ballet. Have a wonderful afternoon. I hope you get the moon in a stick but you won't find it here.

Hope it all goes well mate, you’ll make a perfect sugar plum fairy

[Creedence Clearwater Couto 1,286]

42 minutes ago, nutty nigel said:

The crowd got behind the team. It was a dull game you can't expect a cauldron of noise. It was certainly better than QPR. There was disappointment at the end because we didn't manage to score but constantly having two strikers injured makes for a lack of options off the bench to change it. Most people around me understand that but one guy was seething because we played "Nunez in central defence". 

Clearly a change of tactic at half time to have Nunez spilt the centre half’s, and take the ball from deeper, allowing the full backs to turn into wingbacks in attempt to overcome Preston’s low block, but doesn’t surprise me some fans couldn’t understand what Nunez was being asked to do. He did it very well too. I actually thought Wagner showed some decent in game tactical nous there. 

The Barclay and Snakepit woke up after about 20 minutes and it was ok.. and again last 10-15 tried to ramp it up. But it’s a world away from 2019.

[Making Plans 936]

2 hours ago, lake district canary said:

........we have the players to do something this season.

As it's pantomime season and this is a pantomine post, let me be the first say

OH NO WE HAVEN'T

[Branston Pickle 3,661]

17 minutes ago, Creedence Clearwater Couto said:

Clearly a change of tactic at half time to have Nunez spilt the centre half’s, and take the ball from deeper, allowing the full backs to turn into wingbacks in attempt to overcome Preston’s low block, but doesn’t surprise me some fans couldn’t understand what Nunez was being asked to do. He did it very well too. I actually thought Wagner showed some decent in game tactical nous there. 

The Barclay and Snakepit woke up after about 20 minutes and it was ok.. and again last 10-15 tried to ramp it up. But it’s a world away from 2019.

Definitely - strange that the change, the reason for it, and the impact it had, were lost on some ‘experts’.  

[pete 319]

Best get used to the Preston plan, shutting up shop at Carrow Rd.  Upcoming Sheff Wed, Huddersfield and Rotherham will all adopt similar tactics due to relegation fears.  Recently we have faced teams who no longer fear the two time Championship winners and recognise how poor we are and come to play and come awasy with wins.  Luckily QPR only started to pick up results after their visit to Norwich otherwise their plan might have worked.  Only way to overcome these tactics is score but to do that requires creativity in short supply at City. 

[The Real Buh 3,444]

3 minutes ago, Branston Pickle said:

Definitely - strange that the change, the reason for it, and the impact it had, were lost on some ‘experts’.  

Or those just clinging on to the status quo and ever sliding standards because they met Delia once that they are willing to now accept an attacking midfielder at Center back and give it a clap as a brilliant idea because you’ve fully lost it.

would you cheer Lambert if he put Hoolahan at Center back?

open your eyes, Wagner is a joke.

[Branston Pickle 3,661]

7 minutes ago, The Real Buh said:

Or those just clinging on to the status quo and ever sliding standards because they met Delia once that they are willing to now accept an attacking midfielder at Center back and give it a clap as a brilliant idea because you’ve fully lost it.

would you cheer Lambert if he put Hoolahan at Center back?

open your eyes, Wagner is a joke.

And here comes one of those ‘experts’….

[hogesar 9,676]

32 minutes ago, Creedence Clearwater Couto said:

Clearly a change of tactic at half time to have Nunez spilt the centre half’s, and take the ball from deeper, allowing the full backs to turn into wingbacks in attempt to overcome Preston’s low block, but doesn’t surprise me some fans couldn’t understand what Nunez was being asked to do. He did it very well too. I actually thought Wagner showed some decent in game tactical nous there. 

The Barclay and Snakepit woke up after about 20 minutes and it was ok.. and again last 10-15 tried to ramp it up. But it’s a world away from 2019.

Yes, I thought Nunez was good in that role too.

But the likes of @cambridgeshire canary who's never been to a football match in his life can't work out why Baath might not be starting. To anyone looking at how we are trying to play it would be blindingly obvious.

[The Real Buh 3,444]

3 minutes ago, Branston Pickle said:

And here comes one of those ‘experts’….

And here comes Delias Lapdog.

I’m not the one who’d justify Angus Gunn having a go on the wing as “truly inspired”

Imagine believing it’s part of some ‘plan’ by clueless Wagner. How embarrassing for you.

[cambridgeshire canary 6,735]

4 minutes ago, hogesar said:

Yes, I thought Nunez was good in that role too.

But the likes of @cambridgeshire canary who's never been to a football match in his life can't work out why Baath might not be starting. To anyone looking at how we are trying to play it would be blindingly obvious.

You know nothing about me. 

 

So stop being a phallic object please.

[S_81 802]

3 hours ago, lake district canary said:

........we have the players to do something this season. I thought we were poor up front yesterday, but there were reasons for it.

Firstly I thought Preston's approach was cowardly.....yes they needed to stop the rot, but they stood off us so much it was embarrassing. It nearly worked and they nearly nicked it, but they gave us far too much respect.

That approach caused us problems but we failed to take advantage of their lack of pressing us. Idah for me doesn't use his strength well - why he went down when through on goal from Hernandez's pass is a mystery, did he slip? Was he looking for a penalty rather than try and power through? I don't know, but it was very disappointing, because the defender didn't seem to be doing much and Idah is a strong lad and should have been able to power through.  Sargent is a pain in the aris for defenders and is far more effective than Idah at pressing and roughing up defenders, which is a shame because Idah surely has the physicality to cause problems - as he did in the previous game to win it for us, but didn't happen yesterday.

On the right of the pitch there was very little overlap play - Fassnacht and Stacey didn't appear to have much going on between them. Stacey got forward a lot, but there didn't seem to be much help from Fassnacht. It improved when Fisher and Rowe came on, but even then there wasn't a lot coming from the right.

So maybe it is just down to one or two players not being good enough.  Get Sargent back in, get Rowe in as a starter (why he isn't picked from the start is a bit if a mystery).  Barnes doesn't look 100% yet, but if you pick him, imo you have to pick Rowe to create havoc around the box to open up spaces.

So it was all a bit too stale up front - poor team selection for me. Preston's approach was dreadful - understandable  from their point of view maybe - but we were set up with the wrong team for that approach - and changes needed to be made earlier. Brave decisions needed to change it up at half time. All comes back to the head coach for me - he needs to be braver imo, especially at home - and he needs to trust his creative players - Rowe and Sainz.  It's all there - we have the players - just need to use them well!

A poor Preston team did us tactically yesterday - and it made us look mediocre too - which we probably are - but there is hope there, whether it's with Wagner or someone else - this season isn't done yet.

There’s no hope of promotion with Wagner. Wake up man. 

[Branston Pickle 3,661]

7 minutes ago, The Real Buh said:

And here comes Delias Lapdog.

I’m not the one who’d justify Angus Gunn having a go on the wing as “truly inspired”

Imagine believing it’s part of some ‘plan’ by clueless Wagner. How embarrassing for you.

You ought to have a name change to ‘the real Blah’ as underneath the snide comments that’s all you have.  

[S_81 802]

12 minutes ago, hogesar said:

Yes, I thought Nunez was good in that role too.

But the likes of @cambridgeshire canary who's never been to a football match in his life can't work out why Baath might not be starting. To anyone looking at how we are trying to play it would be blindingly obvious.

“How we’re trying to play”. You’re still here defending Wagner’s attempt at tactics are you? Would have thought you’d have piped down by now after your relentless defence of playing no CDM this season. But no.