Interesting article about Sorenson on the homepage

[king canary 7,624]

Wagner talking about Sorenson getting a run in his so called best position in defensive midfield.

https://www.pinkun.com/news/23623968.norwich-city-david-wagner-jacob-sorensens-best-position/

Personally, I don't see it with him- the few times he's played there he appears lightweight and not that great at reading the game. I'd be concerned if this is how we're approaching such a key position next season. 

[KiwiScot 1,459]

Well we do have to cover a lot of bases in terms of positions and have to shift some players first and it is Wagners first pre-season. Hopefully if he's not as good as you suggest then his run in is early on so we can address it.

[Siva 0]

For me his best position is ironically when he has been playing out of position at Left Back. Feel much happier with him there than any other of the current incumbents !

[king canary 7,624]

9 minutes ago, Siva said:

For me his best position is ironically when he has been playing out of position at Left Back. Feel much happier with him there than any other of the current incumbents !

I think his likely role is utility guy. Can do a job at right back, left back and in central midfield but probably shouldn't be starting in any of those positions week in week out. Not a central defender though.

[Capt. Pants 4,262]

5 minutes ago, Siva said:

For me his best position is ironically when he has been playing out of position at Left Back. Feel much happier with him there than any other of the current incumbents !

Agree. I think his lateral movement is pretty ordinary. OK with anything in front of him but doesn't cover the ground well enough, he's very linear. At fullback out wide he's fine.

But I'd rather he'd played in midfield and not centre half!

[tricky974 61]

Since 2020 he has been here and I know he has played in various positions but if he was able to play the defensive midfield role, his favoured position don't you think he would have played there more by now, especially as we have had problems in that area of the pitch and also injuries, I like Sorenson but I have not seen enough to think that he is the answer to our defensive midfield role, but I would love to be proved wrong.

[jaberry2 554]

Its this type of subject Wagner throws out which leaves me unconvinced by his management. Will withhold judgement till I can see what he can do with a full pre season and new players.

[Dean Coneys boots 1,400]

If the clubs answer to the glaring hole at CDM is Sorensen then we are in trouble…if he’s back up CDM then ok. But noises this week suggest Barnes is the Pukki replacement and he is the CDM. That is not good. Especially if Duffy and Stacey replace big Andy and Aarons. At that point we have witnessed an obvious decline in quality and we were hardly firing at the tail end of last season. 

[Google Bot 3,297]

Wagner did talk about this at the forum, It does make you wonder if Sorensen is going to be CDM if we fail to bring anyone else in.

I really like him as a player, but not sure in that position yet but as all players he needs a run of 5-6 games there to really see what he's capable of.

[TheGunnShow 5,956]

Barnes will replace Pukki as an attacker but he'll play it differently whilst giving us far more ability to hold the ball up than we ever had under Pukki. Lungi's never really had a chance to stake a claim in defensive midfield and especially in a settled midfield group. Skipp got there first in his first season and really took his chance, then Lungi also had a couple of nagging injuries to boot so he's never really had a run in his preferred position.

Lungi's strength in defensive midfield is that he holds his position pretty well and when he goes in for a tackle he's pretty good at getting it. He's not bad at picking off interceptions either. His weaknesses are all relative physical ones - he lacks a yard of pace here and a pound of muscle there. A settled midfield in front of him and I think he'll do very well. Can see him, McLean and Gibbs/Sara making a very serviceable midfield. Not sure I'd put Lungi and Nunez in the same starting line-up though.

A few seem to think Lungi lacks aggression. Think he showed with that flashpoint against O'Nien in my avatar that there's aggression in him, he just has a very focused approach in the game where he tries not to let his heart rule his head.

Edited June 30, 2023 by TheGunnShow

[Dr Greenthumb 750]

Looked good in his natural position against Milwall. Not the tough tackling player we need in the middle though!

[king canary 7,624]

6 minutes ago, TheGunnShow said:

Barnes will replace Pukki as an attacker but he'll play it differently whilst giving us far more ability to hold the ball up than we ever had under Pukki. Lungi's never really had a chance to stake a claim in defensive midfield and especially in a settled midfield group. Skipp got there first in his first season and really took his chance, then Lungi also had a couple of nagging injuries to boot so he's never really had a run in his preferred position.

Lungi's strength in defensive midfield is that he holds his position pretty well and when he goes in for a tackle he's pretty good at getting it. He's not bad at picking off interceptions either. His weaknesses are all relative physical ones - he lacks a yard of pace here and a pound of muscle there. A settled midfield in front of him and I think he'll do very well. Can see him, McLean and Gibbs/Sara making a very serviceable midfield. Not sure I'd put Lungi and Nunez in the same starting line-up though.

A few seem to think Lungi lacks aggression. Think he showed with that flashpoint against O'Nien in my avatar that there's aggression in him, he just has a very focused approach in the game where he tries not to let his heart rule his head.

First Placheta now Lungi.

I admire your desire to see the potential in these deeply average players.

[Google Bot 3,297]

8 minutes ago, TheGunnShow said:

His weaknesses are all relative physical ones - he lacks a yard of pace here and a pound of muscle there.

So he's not the quickest when it comes to pace, but he is mobile and like Pukki, if you're carrying IQ it makes up the yards - particuarly in an area where are watching the game unfold.

He comes across as a very smart, considered player and we've yet to see him have a spell in his preferred position.  But if we don't bring in a CDM then it's a little concerning.

Edited June 30, 2023 by Google Bot

[hogesar 9,705]

I just don't see it.

I get he's not had a proper run in his position for 15-20 games but part of that is down to his own performances not being able to hold down a place at times. He's a utility player not because he's exceptionally talented but because he hasn't done enough in his time here to take a starting position in the team in a preferred role.

I have no problem with him being in the squad because it's one spot that covers multiple positions when required.

I would be concerned if he was seen as the solution to our CDM position this season.

[TheGunnShow 5,956]

1 hour ago, king canary said:

First Placheta now Lungi.

I admire your desire to see the potential in these deeply average players.

Deeply average players don't play out of their ostensibly best position consistently well like Lungi did. Some fans seem to talk about players and criticise to the extent that it sounds like they practically can't kick a ball straight when in many cases, the issue is much more nuanced.

Not to mention that players can often be far worse (or better) over time, or be better suited to different tactics. Hugill and indeed any striker that's left us in the last four years not called Pukki are cases in point as they were pretty much different kinds of striker to a channel runner in Pukki. Hugill often looked poor for us, but he got some crucial goals for Rotherham in the same division with a team more suited to his strengths. Gibson was excellent in his Championship-winning season but IMO quite poor last time out.

Said for some time I think our biggest problem is that we're sticking with wingers AND overlapping full-backs, so we're naturally quite exposed in midfield when the ball is lost. Personally, I'd ditch the wingers. But we've got an intriguing prospect in Rowe on the wing, probably Springett and also possibly Mumba. So I'd rather the full-backs be more inverted and come into the midfield rather ala Guardiola (or indeed Cruyff before him) when Man City are in possession. But I don't think that is Wagner's bag.

[AJ 1,224]

I don't have an issue with him and Kenny in DM roles with Sara further forwards. Sounds like a good trio to me - all good passers of the ball 

[TheGunnShow 5,956]

1 hour ago, AJ said:

I don't have an issue with him and Kenny in DM roles with Sara further forwards. Sounds like a good trio to me - all good passers of the ball 

Need to tell Kenny to stop chasing everything that moves though. Kenny's always willing to work hard and press, but damn, he's easily sucked out of position and it exposes everyone else.

(I can sympathise. If you're the one with the engine, guess who's expected to chase? Get that in vets footy a fair bit).

[cambridgeshire canary 6,755]

Odd how he seems fine playing anywhere except the one position that's supposed to be his natural one..

Edited June 30, 2023 by cambridgeshire canary

[Google Bot 3,297]

6 minutes ago, hogesar said:

He's a utility player not because he's exceptionally talented but because he hasn't done enough in his time here to take a starting position in the team in a preferred role.

Most concerning is that CDM is a critical position that we've been routinely lacking in, yet it's seen more a priority for him to fill in as a fullback which is less critical in regards to the overall team.

I do rate him as a player, but he's certainly got 'jack of all trades' stamped on his box right now.

[norfolkngood 1,087]

19 minutes ago, Dean Coneys boots said:

If the clubs answer to the glaring hole at CDM is Sorensen then we are in trouble…if he’s back up CDM then ok. But noises this week suggest Barnes is the Pukki replacement and he is the CDM. That is not good. Especially if Duffy and Stacey replace big Andy and Aarons. At that point we have witnessed an obvious decline in quality and we were hardly firing at the tail end of last season. 

My thoughts Exactly looked around the world for a CDM and we had one here already !! 

How can Barnes be a Pukki replacement ? he is not a goal scorer like Pukki totally different ,

i do not rate Wagner and he needs a huge turn around in results 

[A Load of Squit 5,186]

We signed his as a CDM and he thinks that is his position.

https://www.pinkun.com/news/22703621.city-confirm-jacob-lungi-s-rensen-deal/

 

[jaberry2 554]

I reckon Barnes will be better than Pukki based on last years performances anyways, but that is kind of off subject. If the talk is about a DM being installed it shows what type of system Wagner prefers to play. I prefer Kenny sitting deeper if im honest, plus has Sorensen ever played more than 20 games a season with us? Thats a question, I dont know.

[yellowrider120 766]

Just now, norfolkngood said:

My thoughts Exactly looked around the world for a CDM and we had one here already !! 

How can Barnes be a Pukki replacement ? he is not a goal scorer like Pukki totally different ,

i do not rate Wagner and he needs a huge turn around in results 

Agree. It will be a terrible dereliction of duty (again!) if we fail to address the CDM role. Someone with pace and tackling aggression is needed and Sorenson lacks those qualities. Intelligent footballer yes so ideal to bring on if you're looking to manage a 2-0 lead over the line with 15 or so minutes to go. If we offload AO and go with Duffy + A N Other (Gibson to start with) that will put even more onus on a suitable CDM and Sorenson does not fit that role. 

[yellowrider120 766]

3 minutes ago, A Load of Squit said:

We signed his as a CDM and he thinks that is his position.

https://www.pinkun.com/news/22703621.city-confirm-jacob-lungi-s-rensen-deal/

 

We did indeed but if the rumours were correct a few months down the line of Farke not trusting him in that role as he ....'could not get around the pitch quick enough' (as another poster on here has alluded to) then he is not what we need in that crucial role.

[ZLF 274]

I'm a lungi fan but his lack of pace is a real issue.   He has impressed there (Millwall & blackburn away) but has also been overrun there (he was far from alone under wagner in that last season)

If wagner is trying that then the message seems to be webber is unable to source an actual solution, which means more of kenny, gibbs or lungi failing to fulfill a role they are proven to be wholely unsuited to.

A cdm has been needed for multiple windows,with only skipp successfully filling the role since tetteys retirement: another without a significant signing would be webbers biggest failure.

Edited June 30, 2023 by ZLF

[norfolkngood 1,087]

1 minute ago, yellowrider120 said:

We did indeed but if the rumours were correct a few months down the line of Farke not trusting him in that role as he ....'could not get around the pitch quick enough' (as another poster on here has alluded to) then he is not what we need in that crucial role.

i agree Sorenson has his uses , Great on the bench as he can fill a few positions but after waiting to replace Tetty and Skipp if the club seriously thinks sorenson can do that role all season we are in trouble as the weak midfield has not changed 

[ec-p 98]

That we have’t had a permanent cdm signing since Tettey is utter madness. 

Edited June 30, 2023 by ec-p

[Conrad 171]

12 minutes ago, A Load of Squit said:

We signed his as a CDM and he thinks that is his position.

https://www.pinkun.com/news/22703621.city-confirm-jacob-lungi-s-rensen-deal/

 

Well he is wrong. If no Norwich manager has consistently picked him in that position, a position that we have been lacking in over recent years, then that should tell him something.

[Google Bot 3,297]

19 minutes ago, norfolkngood said:

How can Barnes be a Pukki replacement ? he is not a goal scorer like Pukki totally different ,

You say that, but knock a few early goals in and if you find yourself on 5-6 in as many games it doesn't take a great deal to get to the 20 mark over the remaining 40 matches.  Look at Sarge and his purple patch as an example, if we then continued with him up front he would've been 20+ I'm sure of it.

[norfolkngood 1,087]

5 minutes ago, Google Bot said:

You say that, but knock a few early goals in and if you find yourself on 5-6 in as many games it doesn't take a great deal to get to the 20 mark over the remaining 40 matches.  Look at Sarge and his purple patch as an example, if we then continued with him up front he would've been 20+ I'm sure of it.

Burnley	2013–14[54]	Championship	21	3	—		—		—		21	3
	2014–15[55]	Premier League	35	5	1	0	1	0	—		37	5
	2015–16[56]	Championship	8	0	0	0	0	0	—		8	0
	2016–17[57]	Premier League	28	6	3	0	0	0	—		31	6
	2017–18[58]	Premier League	36	9	1	1	2	0	—		39	10
	2018–19[59]	Premier League	37	12	0	0	1	0	5[e]	1	43	13
	2019–20[60]	Premier League	19	6	0	0	0	0	—		19	6
	2020–21[61]	Premier League	22	3	2	0	1	0	—		25	3
	2021–22[62]	Premier League	23	1	0	0	2	0	—		25	1
	2022–23[63]	Championship	39	6	3	0	3	1	—		45	7

Edited June 30, 2023 by norfolkngood