Vaccine Passports - October 1st

[Greavsy 2,415]

4 minutes ago, FenwayFrank said:

Yes, security guards could do it but to cover opening hours and days off you will need to employ a minimum of three as the current guards already have their work cut out dealing with shoplifting. That’s another 120 hours a week to be paid, not going to happen unfortunately.

a security guard on the door would potentially deter the shoplifters, possibly. 

surely the number required would depend on the size of the shop?! 

Also, remember when lockdown first started the shops managed to source additional security guards to police attendance and distancing.  

[Virtual reality 712]

Does anyone agree that this is an acceptable comment as I find it quite disgraceful to be honest. Where would you draw the line at removing health care for avoidable illness. Would we withdraw healthcare for a drinker who got liver cancer? a smoker who got lung cancer? How about a car crash victim who was driving dangerously? Piers Morgan shouts his trap off a lot but I think this Is really poor

 

[Greavsy 2,415]

Poor from Piers, as much as i dislike the deniers / anti vax brigade, everyone has paid in for this service. In fact some would claim that via tax on the cigarettes smokers have paid in more. 

Once the NHS becomes selective like that it would massively decrease  the status of this country. Its the envy of the world, and long may it continue. 

[Michael Starr 519]

I haven't yet had a vax. Mainly because I'm super scared of needles and I was a little nervous about how rushed through the vax's were initially, so I kept myself to myself and tried my best to mask up etc, but now I intend to get my first jab next week because, ultimately, I don't want to risk others. It's not about me, it's about doing my bit for the wider world and that should really be the driving force for everyone.

[Virtual reality 712]

2 minutes ago, Greavsy said:

Poor from Piers, as much as i dislike the deniers / anti vax brigade, everyone has paid in for this service. In fact some would claim that via tax on the cigarettes smokers have paid in more. 

Once the NHS becomes selective like that it would massively decrease  the status of this country. Its the envy of the world, and long may it continue. 

Agree. I think it’s time that everybody just took a step back and look at what is happening. Are we happy to live in a country where people with a fair bit of clout are pushing for the removal of health care

[Greavsy 2,415]

Just now, Michael Starr said:

I haven't yet had a vax. Mainly because I'm super scared of needles and I was a little nervous about how rushed through the vax's were initially, so I kept myself to myself and tried my best to mask up etc, but now I intend to get my first jab next week because, ultimately, I don't want to risk others. It's not about me, it's about doing my bit for the wider world and that should really be the driving force for everyone.

Respect for getting it done, with your genuine fear. 

Im sure you'll be fine.  

[Virtual reality 712]

1 minute ago, Michael Starr said:

I haven't yet had a vax. Mainly because I'm super scared of needles and I was a little nervous about how rushed through the vax's were initially, so I kept myself to myself and tried my best to mask up etc, but now I intend to get my first jab next week because, ultimately, I don't want to risk others. It's not about me, it's about doing my bit for the wider world and that should really be the driving force for everyone.

I’ve also had a fear of needles my whole life. I can tell you that you don’t feel a thing when you have it but I know it isn’t about that. It’s just what I would describe as an irrational fear. I just got it in my mind that I was going to do it and shut my eyes! Lol

[Block Y Seat 176 80]

2 minutes ago, Virtual reality said:

I’ve also had a fear of needles my whole life. I can tell you that you don’t feel a thing when you have it but I know it isn’t about that. It’s just what I would describe as an irrational fear. I just got it in my mind that I was going to do it and shut my eyes! Lol

When I go to the dentist and about to have an injection I push the nail on my index finger into the soft flesh of my thumb. The slight discomfort of my action is always greater than any needle from the dentist. Covid jab does not cause any discomfort, just let your arm dangle by your side in a relaxed manner and engage in conversation with lady behind the desk. Over in sec…..👍

[Virtual reality 712]

2 minutes ago, Block Y Seat 176 said:

When I go to the dentist and about to have an injection I push the nail on my index finger into the soft flesh of my thumb. The slight discomfort of my action is always greater than any needle from the dentist. Covid jab does not cause any discomfort, just let your arm dangle by your side in a relaxed manner and engage in conversation with lady behind the desk. Over in sec…..👍

I’ll remember that one if I ever get to see a dentist again 🤣

[cornish sam 954]

21 minutes ago, Virtual reality said:

I’ve also had a fear of needles my whole life. I can tell you that you don’t feel a thing when you have it but I know it isn’t about that. It’s just what I would describe as an irrational fear. I just got it in my mind that I was going to do it and shut my eyes! Lol

Same here, total phobia, spent half an hour before telling myself.how stupid it was to be like that and it didn't help one bit...

[cornish sam 954]

32 minutes ago, Virtual reality said:

Does anyone agree that this is an acceptable comment as I find it quite disgraceful to be honest. Where would you draw the line at removing health care for avoidable illness. Would we withdraw healthcare for a drinker who got liver cancer? a smoker who got lung cancer? How about a car crash victim who was driving dangerously? Piers Morgan shouts his trap off a lot but I think this Is really poor

 

Whilst I don't agree with piers (and I doubt I ever will), the drinker and smoker have at least paid extra tax to be such and so given more money to the NHS...

[Iwans Big Toe 312]

"By 2030 you'll own nothing and be happy about it" - Klauss Scwabb.

Looking at the attitude of the many since enforced lockdowns, I think Klauss may well be right. Most seem thrilled to death at the (not so) subtle erosion of their liberties. 

 

[Virtual reality 712]

16 minutes ago, cornish sam said:

Same here, total phobia, spent half an hour before telling myself.how stupid it was to be like that and it didn't help one bit...

Every time after I’ve had one I tell myself that was nothing to have been afraid of. And then as sure as day follows night the fear returns before the next one. People say you don’t feel it and they are right but as I said to Michael Star, it isn’t about the pain it’s just an irrational fear of being injected. Unfortunately though we sometimes have to do things we don’t want to or that we fear!

[Paul101 93]

Vaccines work on a herd unless about 75% of a population is vaccinated they will not work

 

90% imunity is no good if your the only person with it roll a 10 sided dice and see how many times 10 comes up

 

as for mentioning australia they only have 10% of the whole population vaccinated

 

India have over 4.5 million excess deaths based on the average over the last 10 years  thats the sort of stats you need to be reading

 

 

[Badger 2,406]

1 hour ago, Virtual reality said:

Does anyone agree that this is an acceptable comment as I find it quite disgraceful to be honest. Where would you draw the line at removing health care for avoidable illness. Would we withdraw healthcare for a drinker who got liver cancer? a smoker who got lung cancer? How about a car crash victim who was driving dangerously? Piers Morgan shouts his trap off a lot but I think this Is really poor

 

I agree with you here. You can't just leave people to die.

I wish that they would show the same consideration for others though.

[Badger 2,406]

1 hour ago, Virtual reality said:

I’ll remember that one if I ever get to see a dentist again 🤣

You can get sedation, which is very good, but it costs.

[Iwans Big Toe 312]

41 minutes ago, cornish sam said:

Whilst I don't agree with piers (and I doubt I ever will), the drinker and smoker have at least paid extra tax to be such and so given more money to the NHS...

But we don't refuse access to those who haven't smoked or have never had a drink yet develop kidney failure or lung cancer. What about those who have never paid taxes, such as those on benefits? Should they be denied health care also because it could mean better health care for those who have?

Should we start denying access to things like water, food and housing to those who aren't willing to tow the party line?

Following Piers Morgan's logic to it's conclusion is a slippery slope to be taking. 

 

[Badger 2,406]

1 minute ago, Iwans Big Toe said:

But we don't refuse access to those who haven't smoked or have never had a drink yet develop kidney failure or lung cancer. What about those who have never paid taxes, such as those on benefits? Should they be denied health care also because it could mean better health care for those who have?

Should we start denying access to things like water, food and housing to those who aren't willing to tow the party line?

Following Piers Morgan's logic to it's conclusion is a slippery slope to be taking. 

 

I agree with the main thrust of what you say but I think that drinkers and smokers actually benefit the treasury. They contribute hugely through excise duties (regardless of income tax) and die earlier saving a fortune in pensions.

Although their medical treatment is expensive, the sad fact is that we are all going to die of something and will require expensive treatment at some stage. I suspect that they probably end up having less medical treatment than those who live to a ripe old age and may have had a series of treatments for different ailments before they die. I don't have the proof, but I'm sure there is a calculation somewhere.

Ex-smoker - deeply regret my earlier weakness.

[Well b back 3,216]

1 hour ago, Michael Starr said:

I haven't yet had a vax. Mainly because I'm super scared of needles and I was a little nervous about how rushed through the vax's were initially, so I kept myself to myself and tried my best to mask up etc, but now I intend to get my first jab next week because, ultimately, I don't want to risk others. It's not about me, it's about doing my bit for the wider world and that should really be the driving force for everyone.

As some will know I work on the vaccine sites and help encourage people have the jab. This is something we hear regularly, but let me assure you the needles for the COVID vaccines are very thin and often people comment that until they were told it was done they didn’t even realise. I always recommend go in short sleeved shirt, that saves time messing about rolling up sleeves and gives you lots less time to think about it. I also tell people just look away and think of something nice that you can do safer once you are fully vaccinated. I can’t guarantee you won’t feel anything at all, but it is over so, so quick.

One last point, this is 2 quick jabs 8 weeks apart. Should you or any of your relatives, friends, get COVID bad and are hospitalised or get long COVID you will be having endless jabs, blood tests, steroids ect ect. 
Hope that helps.

[CirclePoint 204]

1 hour ago, Virtual reality said:

Does anyone agree that this is an acceptable comment as I find it quite disgraceful to be honest. Where would you draw the line at removing health care for avoidable illness. Would we withdraw healthcare for a drinker who got liver cancer? a smoker who got lung cancer? How about a car crash victim who was driving dangerously? Piers Morgan shouts his trap off a lot but I think this Is really poor

 

I agree with what Piers is saying, however the application of this idea in the NHS system would not work.

Here in America, where the healthcare system is set up differently, the government offered to cover all COVID expenses at the beginning on the pandemic. I feel this should now be rescinded for those in hospital who have not chosen to be vaccinated.

[cornish sam 954]

40 minutes ago, Iwans Big Toe said:

But we don't refuse access to those who haven't smoked or have never had a drink yet develop kidney failure or lung cancer. What about those who have never paid taxes, such as those on benefits? Should they be denied health care also because it could mean better health care for those who have?

Should we start denying access to things like water, food and housing to those who aren't willing to tow the party line?

Following Piers Morgan's logic to it's conclusion is a slippery slope to be taking. 

 

Just to be clear, I wasn't advocating that we cut anyone off from the health service, merely playing devil's advocate with similar logic to badgers...

[Kenny Foggo 1,116]

I really don't agree with Piers Morgan as much as anti Vaxer's annoy me. Thin edge of the wedge.. what next, you smoke so no cancer treatment, like a pint.. no liver treatment for you.. 

[Kenny Foggo 1,116]

Just now, Kenny Foggo said:

I really don't agree with Piers Morgan as much as anti Vaxer's annoy me. Thin edge of the wedge.. what next, you smoke so no cancer treatment, like a pint.. no liver treatment for you.. 

Doesn't make it right though, that idiots put the rest of us in danger because of bogus false doctor advice or fake spreading of information.

[Iwans Big Toe 312]

5 minutes ago, cornish sam said:

Just to be clear, I wasn't advocating that we cut anyone off from the health service, merely playing devil's advocate with similar logic to badgers...

I never for an instance thought otherwise Sam and if you feel that I inferred that my apologies.

I was just trying to point out that people shouldn't be denied or granted access to services because of what people perceive they do or do not contribute to society. Those boundaries are subject to change at a whim.

This it's why I feel 'vaccine passports' are a very dangerous precedent, as were the lockdowns. Two years ago it would have been hard for anyone to have been able to predict what has happened in that time. If you had even suggested how the world looks now you would have been labeled a lunatic conspiracy theorist. I myself said on the 20th of March Boris would never force the country into a total lockdown, but just 2 hours later it was being announced on the news.

However, the genie is out of the bottle now and I suspect it will be almost impossible to put it back. I can only see a world where more and more of the freedoms our grandfathers (great grandfathers in some cases) fought for are taken from us "in our best interests". I think if they could see some of the rhetoric being spouted by some on this forum at the moment they would be ashamed.

 

 

[Virtual reality 712]

I’m just waiting for when the triple jabbers turn on us double jabbers…

[FenwayFrank 2,459]

The Booster Bunch will be the gang to be in 

[Coneys Knee 962]

4 hours ago, Badger said:

Do you also believe that people should be allowed to drink and drive and carry firearms?

What a silly thing to say. Those things are criminal offences and not remotely comparable in any way. You Wally!

[Coneys Knee 962]

3 hours ago, Greavsy said:

Poor from Piers, as much as i dislike the deniers / anti vax brigade, everyone has paid in for this service. In fact some would claim that via tax on the cigarettes smokers have paid in more. 

Once the NHS becomes selective like that it would massively decrease  the status of this country. Its the envy of the world, and long may it continue. 

You are aware it is possible to be one or the other of such things. This is where I get annoyed, because I quite simply don’t want to and don’t believe the effectiveness of a mask. But that is my only thing. It doesn’t automatically follow that being anti mask makes you anti vaccine or a COVID denier.

For the record, I believe that COVID is a dreadful illness that we should all be concerned about deeply. I also think we should be taking up the vaccine as a population as soon as we can, however I don’t believe in wearing a mask as is my right. You see, a person doesn’t have to be all of the sins you despise so greatly, indeed they might only be some of those things to the tiniest degree. Keep it real greavsy please.

[Badger 2,406]

23 minutes ago, Coneys Knee said:

What a silly thing to say. Those things are criminal offences and not remotely comparable in any way. You Wally!

Not in all societies. We have chosen to limit the peoples freedom to make them criminal offences. In the US for example, there is a far more tolerant attitude to gun laws, as there is to drinking alcohol and driving in some countries. The state limits freedom to protect its citizens: that is the similarity.

It also suggests that you think it is OK to carry guns whilst in the US and drink drive where that is allowed, but not here. It is not therefore about morals and right but it seems simply a matter of law. Let's hope they pass the legislation.

 

 

Edited July 28, 2021 by Badger
Added 2nd para

[Badger 2,406]

5 minutes ago, Coneys Knee said:

however I don’t believe in wearing a mask as is my right

And what are your responsibilities...?

For that matter what are your qualifications that mean that you know better than most medical experts about the efficacy of masks?