Let's cut Neil some slack...

[Jools 584]

He only flew out to get his Uefa coaching badges after the play-off semi-final against the sh@t last year [:|][:$]So far this season he''s fielding a 4-2-3-1, which is a hell of a complex system to play, as I pointed out previously in  the following thread: [url]http://services.pinkun.com/forums/pinkun-forums/cs/forums/3404973/ShowPost.aspx[/url]What I also pointed out in that thread was Neil''s mistake of playing Howson instead of Mulumbu in the double pivot which mostly consists of two defensive/holding midfielders -- Neil, got that part right today by selecting both Tettey & Mulumbu, but it''s the three attacking midfielders that are failing to gel right now.I would suggest Pritchard (when fit) & Canós for  Hoolahan & Howson if Neil insists on playing the 4-2-3-1 [Y]  

[Cantiaci Canary 557]

Pritchard will make a huge difference.

[havemyhowsonit 0]

Do you think Neil is learning quick enough?

I think he''s head strong and keeps going with the wrong decisions

[Jools 584]

[quote user="have my howson it"]Do you think Neil is learning quick enough?

I think he''s head strong and keeps going with the wrong decisions[/quote]He does seem to be a tad slow on the uptake, but eight points from twelve hardly renders him ineffectual.I just hope he picks up on my advice [Y]

[Essjayess 307]

Heard the Radio Norfolk guy say today, after the match on Canary Call, that its not the time right now to be trying out new guys, young guys, blah blah, we need existing players whove been at the club, seen it, done it etc...I think not, already i have seen enough of the Wes / Naisy  duo to see its not fully  working. We have two seasons with parachute payments, this is the season for Alex to be putting in Canos, Maddison, Pritchard (when hes fit), to blood them, if we dont go up this season, still next one to fall back on.Cut him some slack?.. i see the same midfield so far...Wes, Mulumbu, Howson et al and seen  many of the issues we had last season as regards the midfield engine room. Yes hes tried the Murphys, thats good, but i, we, want to see these exciting  young players hes signed, not the right time?...so when is the right time?

[Well b back 3,207]

Why not sack him ? Played four ( and on a previous thread it said we would not get a point from our first games ) undefeated and according to the bookies the three to go up will be Newcastle, Norwich and Brighton. Villa now 14/1

[Alex Moss 2,165]

2 wins, 2 draws - I''ll take that 👍

[Well b back 3,207]

Agreed Alex. I think half the problem is those saying we were tosh are being prooved wrong so getting a point away from home is now something to use to beat the club with.

[kick it off 1,952]

Agree with much of what you say Jools (for once) however I don''t understand why you''d take Hoolahan out the team. I''m not one of the Wessi fanboys, but he is in decent form at the moment and Naismith has done nothing to merit a place on the bench, let alone in the team as it stands, imo.

Is there a reason you''d select Naismith in the #10 role ahead of Wes, because I fail to see what he offers, and Wes is playing well?

[Alex Moss 2,165]

Yep, likewise, agreed We''llbback 👍.

Funny thing is this, I have super high expectations for us this season and fully expect us to be promoted. I also know we''ll draw and lose games this season on our road to hopeful promotion, thats a given. Yet the ones complaining about draws like they''re a loss, well, most of those who weren''t so optimistic at the start of the season were saying its a real tough league etc, so surely it should be those folks even happier than myself with the unbeaten start? - Yet they''re the ones complaining?!. I guess some people actually thrive on being unhappy, which to me is a really weird concept but there you go. For me 2 wins and 2 draws is a good start and I''m happy with that. Funny old game, disappointed we couldn''t win the derby but like Paul Lambert always said, if you can''t win then just make sure you don''t lose - and that''s exactly what we did and exactly what we''re doing 👍

[93vintage 16]

It''s the poor football that concerns me most. AN is 18 months into the job, but I''m starting to wonder why we''re still constantly giving the ball away.

[hogesar 9,672]

I don''t like Tettey and Mulumbu together in that holding two.

Primarily because neither of them seem to be able to pass for toffee.

I take that back, I think Mulumbu''s % was probably Ok, but his refusal or inability to turn meant he simply kept playing it to players under pressure already.

[Indy 3,300]

Why do we need 2 holding midfield players? I think this is what messes up our defence pushing up and allows weaker teams to pile pressure on us!

Just Tettey in there might be the way to go.

Yes 4 games unbeaten is a good start but the standard of football has been as poor as last year and it''s the same players as last year.

AN needs to stop building us up as an all out attacking team and just get on grinding out results. If we play like we are and go up not many will be complaining.

[lake district canary 4,531]

I don''t like a 4231 formation, but if it is to work, the key to it is the three creative players working well together. Mulumbu has the capability to be a great player for us if he is fully motivated and match fit and alongside Tettey, should give us what we need to break up the opposition attacks. So the issue in that situation is who would be the most effective three players in front of that behind a single striker.   Wes, Naismith and Howson were not effective enough yesterday.  Howson had one of his less prominent games imo and that put more onus on Wes and Naismith, both players who like to try intricate passing movements that are by nature hit or miss - will work sometimes, but when they don''t it looks poor.  But we have alternatives with Canos and Pritchard and the Murphys. As to the op - let''s not cut Neil any slack. Why should we?  He wouldn''t expect it - but as long as the team is getting results, then he won''t get much flack anyway.  Four matches, unbeaten, well placed in the league with a long season ahead to get the best out of his good squad.  No reason to give him too much flack at the moment, with plnty to come from his strong squad.

[Norfolk Mustard 94]

When Pritchard is fit I think Naismith is the most likely to make way for him. If, as rumoured Sunderland offer top £ money I wouldn''t be surprised to see him move on - he doesn''t look engaged to me.

So far we have averaged 2 points per game which is a decent start, however most of us know with a bit more oomph we could have had all 12 points. Maddison, Canos & Pritchard are creative options, so plenty to look forward to regardless of the striker situation...

[Jim Smith 2,317]

[quote user="Jools"]He only flew out to get his Uefa coaching badges after the play-off semi-final against the sh@t last year [:|][:$]So far this season he''s fielding a 4-2-3-1, which is a hell of a complex system to play, as I pointed out previously in  the following thread: [url]http://services.pinkun.com/forums/pinkun-forums/cs/forums/3404973/ShowPost.aspx[/url]What I also pointed out in that thread was Neil''s mistake of playing Howson instead of Mulumbu in the double pivot which mostly consists of two defensive/holding midfielders -- Neil, got that part right today by selecting both Tettey & Mulumbu, but it''s the three attacking midfielders that are failing to gel right now.I would suggest Pritchard (when fit) & Canós for  Hoolahan & Howson if Neil insists on playing the 4-2-3-1 [Y]  [/quote]

I don''t disagree with Canos and Pritchard playing in the wider positions but if you think dropping Hoolahan is the way to go then frankly I find that staggering.

[Jim Smith 2,317]

[quote user="Jools"][quote user="have my howson it"]Do you think Neil is learning quick enough?

I think he''s head strong and keeps going with the wrong decisions[/quote]He does seem to be a tad slow on the uptake, but eight points from twelve hardly renders him ineffectual.I just hope he picks up on my advice [Y][/quote]

I think there is no doubt that Neil learns lessons after games (or at least eventually). He''s supposedly very big on post and pre-match analysis and I think that shows. He rarely gets the starting line up wrong twice in a row and we rarely play badly twice in a row so I am comfortable that he can address issues between games.

What worries me with him at present is that I just don''t feel he has the knack of reading the game and making pre-emptive changes or changes during the match that alter the course of proceedings. Whilst some of that ability comes with experience in part I think its something you can''t teach. Lambert had this ability (even if he quite often got the starting line up wrong) and it won us a lot of points. I''ve yet to see it with Neil but maybe it will come in time.

[Cobain18 0]

Don''t get people criticising Neil at all. We''ve got 8pts out of 12 with a few key injuries. Keep that up and we''ll go back up.

[norfolkngood 1,087]

i have said it all along that i do not rate AN

BUT he is doing well with the points and thats proving me wrong

i really want Norwich to have a manager to build the club over the next few years and build a solid team where we just need to add a couple of players a year

producing younger player and really get the club running well playing a system that is successful

the concerns i have with AN are

1, he has not stamped a style of play to the team

2, the team looks disjointed for some reason after playing together for a couple of seasons under AN

3,The players do not look like they are running trough brick walls for the manager ?

4 , in game lacks reading / seeing ahead and changing tactics and subs

5, playing the old guard instead ( out of form ) of fresh hungry players

6, transfers lacks the knowledge of a experienced manager i dont know if lack of targets or he is afraid to pull the trigger because he is nervous of making a mistake

i think the board and fans have given him more support than alot of managers and plenty of slack after last season where we could well of stayed up

he should be under pressure to do well this season

and he should also remember where he came from and the support we and the board have given him instead of telling chris sutton ( if true ) the board are not backing him

[Jools 584]

[quote user="Jools"]He only flew out to get his Uefa coaching badges after the play-off semi-final against the sh@t last year [:|][:$]So far this season he''s fielding a 4-2-3-1, which is a hell of a complex system to play, as I pointed out previously in  the following thread: [url]http://services.pinkun.com/forums/pinkun-forums/cs/forums/3404973/ShowPost.aspx[/url]What I also pointed out in that thread was Neil''s mistake of playing Howson instead of Mulumbu in the double pivot which mostly consists of two defensive/holding midfielders -- Neil, got that part right today by selecting both Tettey & Mulumbu, but it''s the three attacking midfielders that are failing to gel right now.I would suggest Pritchard (when fit) & Canós for  Hoolahan & Howson if Neil insists on playing the 4-2-3-1 [Y]  [/quote]Bump! [:|]

[FenwayFrank 2,459]

You know what they say about self praise ..

[Herman 9,765]

Was there much pivoting tonight?

[Hank shoots Skyler 2,094]

Many pivots pivoted.

[Jools 584]

[quote user="Herman "]Was there much pivoting tonight?[/quote]Read the original post, Herman, it has little to do with our player selection & formation for the Coventry match, but more to do with our next League game against Birmingham and Neils likely insistence on fielding the 4-2-3-1  for said fixture.

[Webbo118 0]

[quote user="Jools"][quote user="have my howson it"]Do you think Neil is learning quick enough?

I think he''s head strong and keeps going with the wrong decisions[/quote]He does seem to be a tad slow on the uptake, but eight points from twelve hardly renders him ineffectual.I just hope he picks up on my advice [Y][/quote]

I really don''t know why he doesn''t employ you as his special adviser. He must be really slow on the uptake if he hasn''t snapped you up already.

[Hank shoots Skyler 2,094]

So what''s the underlying point behind your bump here? Because AN fielded a 4-2-3-1 tonight he probably will on Saturday too?

Shock..

[Jools 584]

[quote user="hogesar"]I don''t like Tettey and Mulumbu together in that holding two.

Primarily because neither of them seem to be able to pass for toffee.

I take that back, I think Mulumbu''s % was probably Ok, but his refusal or inability to turn meant he simply kept playing it to players under pressure already.

[/quote]Has to be said, hoggy, Dorrans & Howson have adapted to unfamiliar defensive-midfielder roles to make up the double pivot very well indeed [Y] They''ve mostly stayed deep and their distribution has been superior to that of both Tettey & Mulumbu.

[Jools 584]

[quote user="Hank shoots Skyler"]So what''s the underlying point behind your bump here? Because AN fielded a 4-2-3-1 tonight he probably will on Saturday too?

Shock..[/quote]Yes and look how that panned out [:|]

[mighty yellow 0]

[quote user="Jools"][quote user="hogesar"]I don''t like Tettey and Mulumbu together in that holding two.

Primarily because neither of them seem to be able to pass for toffee.

I take that back, I think Mulumbu''s % was probably Ok, but his refusal or inability to turn meant he simply kept playing it to players under pressure already.

[/quote]Has to be said, hoggy, Dorrans & Howson have adapted to unfamiliar defensive-midfielder roles to make up the double pivot very well indeed [Y] They''ve mostly stayed deep and their distribution has been superior to that of both Tettey & Mulumbu.[/quote]

You''re a pouble divot.

[hogesar 9,672]

[quote user="Jools"][quote user="hogesar"]I don''t like Tettey and Mulumbu together in that holding two.

Primarily because neither of them seem to be able to pass for toffee.

I take that back, I think Mulumbu''s % was probably Ok, but his refusal or inability to turn meant he simply kept playing it to players under pressure already.

[/quote]Has to be said, hoggy, Dorrans & Howson have adapted to unfamiliar defensive-midfielder roles to make up the double pivot very well indeed [Y] They''ve mostly stayed deep and their distribution has been superior to that of both Tettey & Mulumbu.[/quote]

I think Dorrans has always been quite well disciplined and doesn''t mind getting stuck in so always thought he would be capable of playing the deeper role. 

Howson has also done well - they''re both playing a little deeper than they naturally would but their work rate has been exceptional and like we say, their distribution is much better than Tettey or Mulumbu. I''ve also noticed when attacking they take it in turns to take the more advanced role, particularly when pressing the opposition into their own half.