Mackail-Smith - what price?

[BroadstairsR 0]

I will add.

 

If we were offered £5-6M for Holt at the moment by a Wigan etc. : same deal loan leading to purchase, would anybody on this Board be in favour?

 

Grant ain''t worth that normally, but he''s worth double that to us now.

[Muddy funster 0]

I do agree but it seems that they may have a couple of new options lined up - just in case he is sold. Maybe that''s a free season long loan from us of Jackson. I''m sure that would appeal to them, although, yes, it does provide a risk if he doesn''t settle/gel well. Maybe they have an agreement with a club if they sell CMS to buy at a certain price. Maybe Darrens Daddy can offer them a Man Utd yoof striker on loan if they sell him. But again, it would be a slight gamble. The best result for them would be to sell for a hugely over-inflated price, get someone for free from us and they bang in 8 goals in 8 games to help them get promoted. They''d take that I''m sure.

[ricardo 7,395]

[quote user="BroadstairsR"]

Peterborogh are looking good for promotion themselves. Selling this player would very much jeopodise their current position and thus cost them money. It would also be a kick in the teeth to their fans. 

 

It seems they are making the right noises by doing everything they can to hang onto the player for the rest of this season. They probably know £3m is more than fair, if not slightly ridiculous, but have to weigh up the damage and cost to themselves.

 

Fry has admitted that they would not hold him back next season.

 

Peterborough''s stance is correct and totally in the interests of  the Club.

[/quote]I disagree. The noises coming out of P''Boro suggest they want to keep this thing alive. They know that after the deadline passes we won''t be coming back with anything like the present offer. If they hang on to him until the summer there will be no rush to buy him at £3 million. The promotion issue is a double edged sword for them. They have no guarantee that they will go up even if they keep him. Its just as much of a gamble for them as it is for us.They will be lucky to get half that sum in the summer and if we go up he won''t even be on our radar.

[Eam 0]

He is hot property not only because of his scoring record but because these clubs have had him watched several times and know how he gives teams problems for 90 minutes.

Pace is pace whether its in league1 or the Prem and he wont lose his ability to read the game either.

As for his record in the championship he was playing with Mcclean who is a very similar player, they were making the same runs watering down their effectiveness. Also Posh threw the towel in midseason and loaned out Boyd who creates a lot of chances.

If he just scores a couple of goals that help us get promoted it will money well spent.

The point is the club and fans (Posh) see what he does week in week out for 90 mins out and that is why they think he is worth more than £3m.

[nutty nigel 7,537]

[quote user="ricardo"][quote user="BroadstairsR"]

Peterborogh are looking good for promotion themselves. Selling this player would very much jeopodise their current position and thus cost them money. It would also be a kick in the teeth to their fans. 

 

It seems they are making the right noises by doing everything they can to hang onto the player for the rest of this season. They probably know £3m is more than fair, if not slightly ridiculous, but have to weigh up the damage and cost to themselves.

 

Fry has admitted that they would not hold him back next season.

 

Peterborough''s stance is correct and totally in the interests of  the Club.

[/quote]

I disagree. The noises coming out of P''Boro suggest they want to keep this thing alive. They know that after the deadline passes we won''t be coming back with anything like the present offer. If they hang on to him until the summer there will be no rush to buy him at £3 million.

The promotion issue is a double edged sword for them. They have no guarantee that they will go up even if they keep him. Its just as much of a gamble for them as it is for us.

They will be lucky to get half that sum in the summer and if we go up he won''t even be on our radar.


[/quote]

It''s a game isn''t it Rickyyyyyy. They have a little time to play with so I reckon Peterboro are making the right noises to keep the fans onside and maybe try and increase the fee. But there will be no added time after 5pm next Thursday for either side to get a winner so the game will end befoire then and my Money''s on Mackail-Smith coming here.

 

 

[grantroederdisaster 0]

Hes good, would certainly add to our squad and could help push us over the line this season but we can''t let Cockney wideboy independant trader Barry Fry rip us off!

 

£1M rising to £2M if we go up this season with possibly a player or two chucked in and £500,000 after 50 appearances would be fair enough!

[ricardo 7,395]

[quote user="nutty nigel"][quote user="ricardo"][quote user="BroadstairsR"]

Peterborogh are looking good for promotion themselves. Selling this player would very much jeopodise their current position and thus cost them money. It would also be a kick in the teeth to their fans. 

 

It seems they are making the right noises by doing everything they can to hang onto the player for the rest of this season. They probably know £3m is more than fair, if not slightly ridiculous, but have to weigh up the damage and cost to themselves.

 

Fry has admitted that they would not hold him back next season.

 

Peterborough''s stance is correct and totally in the interests of  the Club.

[/quote]I disagree. The noises coming out of P''Boro suggest they want to keep this thing alive. They know that after the deadline passes we won''t be coming back with anything like the present offer. If they hang on to him until the summer there will be no rush to buy him at £3 million. The promotion issue is a double edged sword for them. They have no guarantee that they will go up even if they keep him. Its just as much of a gamble for them as it is for us.They will be lucky to get half that sum in the summer and if we go up he won''t even be on our radar.

[/quote]

It''s a game isn''t it Rickyyyyyy. They have a little time to play with so I reckon Peterboro are making the right noises to keep the fans onside and maybe try and increase the fee. But there will be no added time after 5pm next Thursday for either side to get a winner so the game will end befoire then and my Money''s on Mackail-Smith coming here.

 

 

[/quote]Yes Nigel, I think you''ve got it about right.Its a game of double bluff and we will see who blinks first. The only thing that might go wrong is if another club comes in with a stupid offer. If that happens then I think we are better off out of it. It never pays to overbid your hand.A serious injury or a ban could alter the picture but at the moment I don''t think we are as desperate as some people think.

[nycanary 1]

few thoughts.  firstly think this is a different time from when the ashton/earnshaw deals were done.  with a few notable torres/carroll exceptions, the prices for players have gone down dramatically since then.  that should influence things.but more importantly, i dont think this is about what mackail-smith''s ''market value'' is.  thinking its more about what he is worth TO US and TO POSH.  and if those two things agree, then there''s a deal.his ''market value'' is probably 1-2mm.  but that''s not really the point.  if he is the difference between us going up or not (or making it more likely) then he''s worth a helluva lot more.  and for posh, if he''s the difference between them going and not going up, he''s worth a helluva lot to them too.  given that, if this deal is done, then i think we should have little doubt that we will be paying well over ''market value''.  there''s no other way for it to happen. hopefully, on our side, the board structures it in a way that protects us as much as possible if we dont get promoted and i''m sure they will.  personally, i would love to see a deal that says:500k loan feeincremental 1mm if we dont get promoted (for a total of 1.5mm)incremental 2-2.5mm if we do get promoted (for a total of 2.5-3mm)even if he doesn''t cut it in the prem, i''d pay an extra mill to increase our chances that we actually DO get there!

[BroadstairsR 0]

[quote user="ricardo"][quote user="BroadstairsR"]

Peterborogh are looking good for promotion themselves. Selling this player would very much jeopodise their current position and thus cost them money. It would also be a kick in the teeth to their fans. 

 

It seems they are making the right noises by doing everything they can to hang onto the player for the rest of this season. They probably know £3m is more than fair, if not slightly ridiculous, but have to weigh up the damage and cost to themselves.

 

Fry has admitted that they would not hold him back next season.

 

Peterborough''s stance is correct and totally in the interests of  the Club.

[/quote]

I disagree. The noises coming out of P''Boro suggest they want to keep this thing alive. They know that after the deadline passes we won''t be coming back with anything like the present offer. If they hang on to him until the summer there will be no rush to buy him at £3 million.

The promotion issue is a double edged sword for them. They have no guarantee that they will go up even if they keep him. Its just as much of a gamble for them as it is for us.

They will be lucky to get half that sum in the summer and if we go up he won''t even be on our radar.


[/quote]

 

May be you are right, but you do discount Peterborough Football Club rather easily. They have ambitions the same as us and I am sure that their fans are every bit as much for promotion as us lot. The sale of M-S would have most of them crying in their beer.

 

We have been on the wrong end of bigger clubs snapping up our stars at  pertinent times to appreciate this. They have a  gamble too ie. the increased income of being in a higher league. That''s the system.

[Big Slob 0]

Perhaps in return for him, we should give them Jackson, Johnson and McDonald, plus Wilbraham if we get promoted. Plus 500k

[ricardo 7,395]

[quote user="BroadstairsR"][quote user="ricardo"][quote user="BroadstairsR"]

Peterborogh are looking good for promotion themselves. Selling this player would very much jeopodise their current position and thus cost them money. It would also be a kick in the teeth to their fans. 

 

It seems they are making the right noises by doing everything they can to hang onto the player for the rest of this season. They probably know £3m is more than fair, if not slightly ridiculous, but have to weigh up the damage and cost to themselves.

 

Fry has admitted that they would not hold him back next season.

 

Peterborough''s stance is correct and totally in the interests of  the Club.

[/quote]

I disagree. The noises coming out of P''Boro suggest they want to keep this thing alive. They know that after the deadline passes we won''t be coming back with anything like the present offer. If they hang on to him until the summer there will be no rush to buy him at £3 million. The promotion issue is a double edged sword for them. They have no guarantee that they will go up even if they keep him. Its just as much of a gamble for them as it is for us.They will be lucky to get half that sum in the summer and if we go up he won''t even be on our radar.

[/quote]

 

May be you are right, but you do discount Peterborough Football Club rather easily. They have ambitions the same as us and I am sure that their fans are every bit as much for promotion as us lot. The sale of M-S would have most of them crying in their beer.

 

We have been on the wrong end of bigger clubs snapping up our stars at  pertinent times to appreciate this. They have a  gamble too ie. the increased income of being in a higher league. That''s the system.

[/quote]I don''t discount PBoro FC at all. The gamble for them is they could keep him and still not go up. Looking at the League 1 table I would say our chance of promotion is greater than theirs.They obviously understand that dilema or they wouldn''t still be making positive noises about a transfer.

[Bill 1,788]

Or CMS has a clause in his contract that allows him to leave if certain figures are offered ie transfer fee/wages for him. This is pretty standard for many players.

This means Peterboro have little option but to try and get the best deal for themselves. That would mean publicising his imminent departure and trying to raise the stakes. Bandiying around ridiculous prices would be part of that tactic.

If he istoo join us then I would like to see Jackson go the other way. He doesn''t seem to have improved since he came here and would most likely fare better in a lower league.

For us a playoff place should be worth a good half million or more simply via the two games.

A playoff final place adds a further £1.2m plus as there is a gentlemens agreement that the losing team keep the gate receipts

Promotion, well...............

I am certain the club will be doing all it can to get this player (and others ?) if Lambert thinks he is the one we need (and is available). As to his worth, measure that against current financial possibilities. A playoff place looks fairly certain and it will be easier to stay in second place than it will be to win the play offs.

We only have to play as well as others below us to stay second. We have to beat two of them to win the play offs.

[Road to Nowhere 0]

Good point.

 

[quote user="BroadstairsR"]

I will add.

 

If we were offered £5-6M for Holt at the moment by a Wigan etc. : same deal loan leading to purchase, would anybody on this Board be in favour?

 

Grant ain''t worth that normally, but he''s worth double that to us now.

[/quote]

[Norfolk Mustard 94]

Adam Hammill went from Barnsley to Wolves for just £500,000. That makes this proposed deal for CMS look ridiculously expensive. Supply and demand dictates everything doesn''t it?...

[Well I Never 0]

On yer bike Mr Fry

[Snakepit Lass 0]

After reading that Fergie Junior wants more for CMS i think we should push up a bit more for him after all we want him and we need him. Thought it was a blunt for him to say that : They want to get into the Premier League which is worth an awful lot of money, and if they want to be serious about it they need to make us a decent offer.

But i suppose he says it like it is... Can you imagine Holt and CMS playing together i think they would have a dream team then!

But like we all say what''s his price prob something stupid. Smith gave an interview for the EDP saying that he is getting on and that he really really wantto move to the club he was very upset :(

http://www.edp24.co.uk/sport/norwich-city-fc/norwich_city_target_mackail_smith_looking_for_move_1_831267

[Snakepit Lass 0]

4m max?

[CDMullins 436]

Seriously, theres a thread 5 below this called ''CMS What price''

[Morisons Prozac 0]

According to Talksport (yes I know they said Lambert was leaving)we have tabled a second bid for CMS and that the original bid was closer to £2m with the new bid at £3m, which is believed to be close to what P''Boro want.

Fingers crossed this comes off!

http://www.talksport.co.uk/sports-news/football/football-league/league-one/5939/6/norwich-table-new-bid-peterborough-hotshot-mackail-smith

[@jayncfc 0]

I hope we are not whippin ourselves into a frenzy for no reason here......

[a1canary 0]

Well i think it''s too much. Unless it is structured something like this:£750k now.£750k at the end of the season regardless of promotion. £1.5m bonus payment if we are promoted.Making £1.5m if we are not promoted and £3m if we are.

[BroadstairsR 0]

If we are not promoted?

 

Why should it cost Peterborough if we fail to go up? There are a lot more factors to be taken into account in our promotion surge surely.

 

A deal is a deal and should not have anything at all to do with the subsequent performaces of the buying club. If we fold, why should Peterborough be worse off?

[scrappy33 0]

cms not worth 3m.

[ricardo 7,395]

[quote user="BroadstairsR"]

If we are not promoted?

 

Why should it cost Peterborough if we fail to go up? There are a lot more factors to be taken into account in our promotion surge surely.

 

A deal is a deal and should not have anything at all to do with the subsequent performaces of the buying club. If we fold, why should Peterborough be worse off?

[/quote]It wouldn''t cost PBoro anything. Its a prospect of extra money over and above what they can reasonably expect to get.They wouldn''t get that kind of deal from a club that has no chance of going up to the Prem. Hull, Southampton, Watford etc won''t be offering £3 million or any prospect of it. They won''t get that kind of money if they leave it to the summer either.The ball is in their court to stick or twist.

[Smudger 0]

There is no way that I would be paying £3 million for him.  He is overpriced at that in my opinion.I notice that there was a thread on here about Nicky Maynard earlier this week.  He is another player who I said that we should''ve gone for years ago, when the majority of people were saying that Luke Varney was the better of the two strikers playing at Crewe.  I would have gone for Maynard way back then when he would have been available for probably £500k.  I would still be interested in us looking at Maynard, rather than Mackail-Smith now if we are talking the kind of money that Peterborough are looking for (£3 million plus).Better player, better strike rate, more pace and 3 years younger to boot.

[Smudger 0]

[quote user="Snakepit Lass"]4m max?[/quote]Behave yourself... if Lambo pays £4 million for him then I reckon that we should be calling for the men in white coats!

[Bill 1,788]

" I hope we are not whippin ourselves into a frenzy for no reason here......"

Given that is the behaviour of many on here I shouln''t let this latest bout of over exitement bother yourself too much.

Why should it cost Peterborough if we fail to go up? A deal is a deal and should not have anything at all to do with the subsequent performaces of the buying club "

That is one of the silliest comments of the season. The logical counter points is why shouldn''t Peterboro benefit if we do go up ? Almost every single contract is conditional.

We sold Lewis to Peterboro believing that he would not only be a top class keeper but a future england keeper. Peterboro bought a good keeper who was not first choice here. So conditions are written into the contract that allows us to be paid the full value if Lewis turns out as good as we claimed and Peterboro only to pay the fee for what he was worth at the transfer date if he turns out not to be. Likewise with any sell on clause.

Any figure quoted now will be the cost of buying out CMS current contract, plus whatever Peterboro feel they should get for his value plus agents fees plus signing on fee, plus future contract fees plus bonuses sell on fees etc. If you want the true fee then pick one, some or all of the above and you will have the true figure.

All that can be said is that club accounts have proved time and time and time again that the ridiculous figures quoted are invariably way, way off the truth and are merely nonsense spouted by the terminally stupid in the same way simple people threw stones at the moon because it made it seem as if they knew something.

[BroadstairsR 0]

[quote user="City1st"]" I hope we are not whippin ourselves into a frenzy for no reason here......" Given that is the behaviour of many on here I shouln''t let this latest bout of over exitement bother yourself too much. Why should it cost Peterborough if we fail to go up? A deal is a deal and should not have anything at all to do with the subsequent performaces of the buying club " That is one of the silliest comments of the season. The logical counter points is why shouldn''t Peterboro benefit if we do go up ? Almost every single contract is conditional. We sold Lewis to Peterboro believing that he would not only be a top class keeper but a future england keeper. Peterboro bought a good keeper who was not first choice here. So conditions are written into the contract that allows us to be paid the full value if Lewis turns out as good as we claimed and Peterboro only to pay the fee for what he was worth at the transfer date if he turns out not to be. Likewise with any sell on clause. Any figure quoted now will be the cost of buying out CMS current contract, plus whatever Peterboro feel they should get for his value plus agents fees plus signing on fee, plus future contract fees plus bonuses sell on fees etc. If you want the true fee then pick one, some or all of the above and you will have the true figure. All that can be said is that club accounts have proved time and time and time again that the ridiculous figures quoted are invariably way, way off the truth and are merely nonsense spouted by the terminally stupid in the same way simple people threw stones at the moon because it made it seem as if they knew something.[/quote]

 

I have to reply to that nonsense. Presumably if Peterborborough fail to go up we pay them a million.

 

I repeat a "deal is a deal." How can it possibly formulated upon the prospects of either partners?

 

I think you seem to have been influenced by the Barry Fry way of thinking. If we go up, it will be a team and management effort. Not as a result of the efforts of one ex-Peterborough player. He will be a cog.

[ricardo 7,395]

[quote user="BroadstairsR"]

[quote user="City1st"]" I hope we are not whippin ourselves into a frenzy for no reason here......" Given that is the behaviour of many on here I shouln''t let this latest bout of over exitement bother yourself too much. Why should it cost Peterborough if we fail to go up? A deal is a deal and should not have anything at all to do with the subsequent performaces of the buying club " That is one of the silliest comments of the season. The logical counter points is why shouldn''t Peterboro benefit if we do go up ? Almost every single contract is conditional. We sold Lewis to Peterboro believing that he would not only be a top class keeper but a future england keeper. Peterboro bought a good keeper who was not first choice here. So conditions are written into the contract that allows us to be paid the full value if Lewis turns out as good as we claimed and Peterboro only to pay the fee for what he was worth at the transfer date if he turns out not to be. Likewise with any sell on clause. Any figure quoted now will be the cost of buying out CMS current contract, plus whatever Peterboro feel they should get for his value plus agents fees plus signing on fee, plus future contract fees plus bonuses sell on fees etc. If you want the true fee then pick one, some or all of the above and you will have the true figure. All that can be said is that club accounts have proved time and time and time again that the ridiculous figures quoted are invariably way, way off the truth and are merely nonsense spouted by the terminally stupid in the same way simple people threw stones at the moon because it made it seem as if they knew something.[/quote]

 

I have to reply to that nonsense. Presumably if Peterborborough fail to go up we pay them a million.

 

I repeat a "deal is a deal." How can it possibly formulated upon the prospects of either partners?

 

I think you seem to have been influenced by the Barry Fry way of thinking. If we go up, it will be a team and management effort. Not as a result of the efforts of one ex-Peterborough player. He will be a cog.

[/quote]Plenty of deals are predicated on the prospects of the partners. What do you think add ons for goals, appearances or International recognition are?If CMS is as good as they think he is then it should be a pretty good bet for them that he will fire us over the line. If it brings them more money than the guys net worth it should be a tempting offer for them.One thing is certain, nobody is going to pay them £3 million for him in a straight deal.

[St.John Cooper 0]

We do not need this player, he is unproven at any decent level, hardly young, over priced and over hyped.

1 Million is all he is worth..if that!