Lets discuss Grant Holt

[ca 1]

I know we''ve had a good result today against the top of the league so it seems harsh to cast doubt on anyone''s peformance plus I know that Holt was immense for us last season, we love him to bits and he''s scored some great goals in the past.

I also appreciate that he works hard, puts himself about and holds the ball up well but ................ either he''s still not fit so should he be playing or maybe he''s going to find goals hard to come by in this league. Also I dont understand why he spends so much time on the wings when he should be in the box?????

I know he did great for us last season but this league is a whole different ball game for him so do you think he''ll cut it in the championship or do you think like me that we need to get an experienced championship striker in on loan to give him competition or play instead of him with Martin or Jackson if he isnt cutting the mustard?

Whats your  thoughts ?

[Gingerpele 0]

Jesus.....

(Lambert is God...)

[Gingerpele 0]

*(maybe try Martin and Jackson together?)

[CanaryJames 0]

My thoughts are that Holt was very good today, and has been improving each game over the last month or so.

He won us the penalty, held the ball up brilliantly, and would have scored had he not been fouled. I also think if Jackson had passed to him earlier in the 2nd half, he wouldn''t have been forced wide onto his left foot, and he''d have got a much better shot away.

He led the team brillliantly (as he did last season) today, marshalling the front line. On more than one occassion he could be seen scrapping back defensively, or making a crucial clearance from a QPR set-piece.

If you are going to knock Grant Holt then feel free, but why do it after he (and the team) have just put in another fantastic shift? He was poor at the start of the season, but is warming to the task nicely. I sense that he''s getting close to top form, and the goals will start coming more regularly soon enough, starting on Tuesday.

[Herman 9,768]

Cityangel makes a point.Why is he out so wide all the time.Get in the box.

[Bill 1,788]

He tends to drag defenders with him, which can be a bit confusing for defenders when they are expecting to be mostly in front of their own goal, not getting ''in the way'' of a fullback.

I''m sure that was why Lambert signed Jackson to run at defences that have been pulled around. Worked perfectly against Bristol.

Palace will be a good game to judge him by, that''s one we should and do need to win. Goals and goals scoring opportunities will be under the spotlight.

[Lambert is King 0]

I have just put on another thread that I hope Holt will come good, however IF he does not Lambert has a huge decision to make in January. Proven goal scorers though come at a premium and cover for Holt would probably wipe out Lamberts budget, and if you were a proven goal scorer at championship / lower premiership level why would you want to warm the bench at Norwich. IMO if Lambert had to make this move it would be Holt that would be warming the bench.  One of Holts saving graces imo has been his defensive work, however does our back four now coupled with our midfield need his defensive input anymore ? ( question not a statement )

[Morisons Prozac 0]

To be fair from what I saw today Holt had a really good game and played a lot better than he has done so far in previous games.

[Guest]

[quote user="cityangel"]

I know we''ve had a good result today against the top of the league so it seems harsh to cast doubt on anyone''s peformance plus I know that Holt was immense for us last season, we love him to bits and he''s scored some great goals in the past.

I also appreciate that he works hard, puts himself about and holds the ball up well but ................ either he''s still not fit so should he be playing or maybe he''s going to find goals hard to come by in this league. Also I dont understand why he spends so much time on the wings when he should be in the box?????

I know he did great for us last season but this league is a whole different ball game for him so do you think he''ll cut it in the championship or do you think like me that we need to get an experienced championship striker in on loan to give him competition or play instead of him with Martin or Jackson if he isnt cutting the mustard?

Whats your  thoughts ?

[/quote]

You think Martin and Jackson are any better?

[ca 1]

[quote user="CanaryJames"]. If you are going to knock Grant Holt then feel free, but why do it after he (and the team) have just put in another fantastic shift? .[/quote]

I chose my words very carefully so as not to knock him but

 honestly just wanted to know people''s thoughts as to

1) Do you think he''ll cut it in the championship and score a decent amount of goals for a championship striker  

2) Should he spend so much time on the wings when he should be in the box more.

3) Do we need another striker at the club in the same mould as Holt but with proven championship experience, just in case he struggles, or is injured ??

Seeem fair enough questions to me.

[John 0]

I''m going to recycle an old argument of mine on this subject. Hopefully it''s written in a context for which is applicable to this subject.[quote user="Sussex King Canary on 606"]Despite performing fantastically for us last season, his lack of

discipline left him missing vital games on his course to what could of

been a record breaking season for him personally. I can only imagine his

suspensions left him rather damning of his mistakes, to the extent that

he''s made it a personal mission not to let such a barrier confront him

again. However, because of this, many many times this season he has left

the 50/50, 40/60, 30/70...etc. opportunities he always use to go for,

and his confidence as a result seems drained. He''s not playing his game,

and without doing so he''s not half the player we know he can be.His

discipline has been quite remarkable from what i can gather now, which

is far cry from what it was last season, and whilst i''m sure the

determination to score remains there in essence with him, this air of

caution about him could well be the factor that oversees his demise

unfortunately. Though i''d argue it''s certainly not his ability (or

supposed "lack of it") that''s holding him back.It''s one heck of a

monkey that he''s got on his back, but he could still throw it off. And

if he ''does'' within the next 6 or 7 games, i''d still expect him to be

hitting around the 20 kind of mark (and please god i hope he does!).As

for his ability as a ''lower league'' player being put in question, i

have collected this array of stats of strikers outside of the Premier

League. In the Football League it''s quite clear that providing a player

has a decent team behind them, they can very often carry on their

goalscoring scoring form in the same vain regardless of the League

they''re in, even when having not proven themselves in the higher leagues

at a similar age to Holt prior to their promotion to them, i.e. :(These stats are all taken from the course of 2 seasons...)

Jason Scotland -League One apps : 43League One goals : 23---Championship apps : 39Championship goals : 21...................................................Chris Iwelumo -League One apps : 46League One goals : 17---Championship apps : 41Championship goals : 18...................................................Gary Hooper -League One apps : 47League One goals : 24---Championship apps : 31Championship goals : 19...................................................

And

as for Grant Holt, he''s proved it''s not a feat beyond him, maybe he can

do it again? I wouldn''t be surprised, even at this stage.Grant Holt -League Two apps : 46League Two goals : 20---League One apps : 39League One goals : 24[/quote]

[Smudger 0]

[quote user="IncH_HigH "][quote user="cityangel"]

I know we''ve had a good result today against the top of the league so it seems harsh to cast doubt on anyone''s peformance plus I know that Holt was immense for us last season, we love him to bits and he''s scored some great goals in the past.

I also appreciate that he works hard, puts himself about and holds the ball up well but ................ either he''s still not fit so should he be playing or maybe he''s going to find goals hard to come by in this league. Also I dont understand why he spends so much time on the wings when he should be in the box?????

I know he did great for us last season but this league is a whole different ball game for him so do you think he''ll cut it in the championship or do you think like me that we need to get an experienced championship striker in on loan to give him competition or play instead of him with Martin or Jackson if he isnt cutting the mustard?

Whats your  thoughts ?

[/quote]

You think Martin and Jackson are any better?

[/quote]

Yes I do think they are both better!

[Bill 1,788]

1. Yep, he''s not been at his best - so is that due to lack of form or ability at this level. I would say the former.

2. What is this obsession that Holt should not stray more than 5 yards fron the penalty box D ? If he was doing wrong I''m sure lambert would have pulled him up about it = maybe he has been instructed to put himself about. Try playing where you are supposed to be marking one player and his is all over the park, not easy.

3. No. "proven championship experience" is meaningless gibberish. As no player would acquire that experience and no player would lose ability. It is far, far more important on how the squad is strauctured, how the aplyers are motivated than any idea that you simply get a player with "proven championship experience" in the same way you might acquire any other commodity.

[manbearpig 0]

Id try Martin and Jackson upfront! I think Martin is strong and can hold the ball up and he works hard plus I think hes a better finisher of the ball than Holt! And as someone else said Holt spends far to much time drifting out wide!

[Shack Attack 0]

I think it''s a decent point to raise CA. Grant Holt is twenty nine years old. How many goals has he scored at this level?I love him for what he did for us last season but we shouldn''t let that blind us to any faults he may have.

[CanaryJames 0]

CA, in answer to your questions...

1) Yes, I think he''ll get a decent return eventually this season. Not outstanding, but 12-15 odd which would do me fine. Let''s not forget he''s set up almost half a dozen goals already as well...

2) He could perhaps get himself more central on occassion I agree, but on the flip-side if he wasn''t running himself into the ground closing down full-backs/working the channels/etc, I think the ball would end up coming straight back into our half alot more often than it does. Although I''d like to see him play centrally, if Lambert wants him to get involved out wide then that''s enough for me. One thing I will say though is that he should be in the area pretty much constantly when we have throw-ins/etc, rather than offering a short option.

3) I said before the season started we needed 5 strikers. I still think this, as injuries would leave us short. Getting an alternative to Holt would be very much welcome in my eyes, although truthfully any competent striker would add to the squad. Maybe look at Leigh Griffiths of Dundee given their recent financial problems? We could get him cheaply, and he''d be an excellent player to round off our attacking options.

4) Not actually your question, but Holt is the first choice striker right now. Him and Jackson have shown they work well together, so that''s what we should go with for now. In a game like today, we were never going to feel the full benefits of their partnership, but I''m extremely confident we''ll see both at their best over the next two games.

On a completely different note, Andrew Crofts is absolutely brilliant. And Russel Martin is rapidly becoming a dark horse for POTY - another fantastic display again in testing conditions.

[Phyxius 0]

He looked absolutely shattered in the last 20 minutes of the Bristol City game and didn''t seem it it. Although he did see, to drag defenders across and give Hoolahan free reign on the left wing.. I was surprised when Jackson was taken off for Martin and not Holt.

[GJP 79]

[quote user="manbearpig"]I think Martin is strong and can hold the ball up and he works hard plus I think hes a better finisher of the ball than Holt!  [/quote]

Well you got the first half of that quite wrong but you probably got the second half right.

[mrs miggins 0]

do you think we could afford leroy lita; strong, quick, finisher

[Beijing Canary 0]

A reminder to those knocking Grant Holt:

a) He has already scored the winner in TWO away games this season
b) The guy is a ****ing hero after what he did last season and deserves 100% support
c) Who won the penalty today?
d) If Lambert thinks he''s good enough - he IS good enough
e) Grow up

 

[Houston Canary 0]

He may not be pounding them is like last season, but his name seems to be associated with plenty of goals as the one who made the pass that was converted.

Whether he scores of helps someone else score, as long as we score when he''s on, then he''s value for us.

[BroadstairsR 0]

Telephone quote from Ranger''s fan to me last night: "Blimey!  That Holt is a handful, Gorrks was all at sea for parts of the game. WE could do with him to complement our lot, who are sometimes over-fussy. Our defenders will need a quiet Sunday to recover."

Exactly.

The goals will come soon enough.

[Canary Pirate 0]

In the championship you can not afford to carry any passengers in the side therefore his contribution can not be underestimated. Whilst we continue to perform in the manner we have so far then I don''t feel the need to change anything. Yes extra competition for places is always preferred but with our overall financial situation as it is I think we should go with what we''ve got for the time being at least. I don''t think a Martin / Jackson partnership would be as dangerous. Holt offers a goal threat in the air that neither Martin nor Jackson could match. They are good questions to ask but I am happy how things are at the moment. [:)]

[Captain Holt 522]

Holt was awesome yesterday. A forward can have a good game without scoring.

[Canary Pirate 0]

Apparently, ( according to a 606 listener anyway ) Wayne Rooney is not world class and would struggle to get into the Bristol Rovers side at the moment ! Well, if he does become available for about £500 k then I think he is woth a punt as cover for Holt ! [;)]

[king canary 7,607]

Lamberts only error thisa summer was not signing some back up for Holt. I dont think he would have rushed him in so quickly if we had someone else with the physical presence that Holt has to play up top. We saw against Watford how the Jackson/Martin partnership worked- nobody could hold up the ball and Watford got it back very quickly.

[Mister Chops 7]

I also think he has a big influence on team morale - the "Malky factor", if you like - and that should count in his favour.  He''s a leader, and a focal point for our attack.  We''re better with him in the side than out of the side.

[paul moy 235]

[quote user="manbearpig"]Id try Martin and Jackson upfront! I think Martin is strong and can hold the ball up and he works hard plus I think hes a better finisher of the ball than Holt! And as someone else said Holt spends far to much time drifting out wide![/quote]

No way does Martin offer more than Holt, in physical presence or goals. With a bit more luck, Holt could have scored a hat-trick yesterday. I was at the game and he absolutely worked his socks off against a very solid QPR team. He will come good if we stick by him !!!

[Lewie - Holt Our Saviour 0]

[quote user="cityangel"]

I know we''ve had a good result today against the top of the league so it seems harsh to cast doubt on anyone''s peformance plus I know that Holt was immense for us last season, we love him to bits and he''s scored some great goals in the past.

I also appreciate that he works hard, puts himself about and holds the ball up well but ................ either he''s still not fit so should he be playing or maybe he''s going to find goals hard to come by in this league. Also I dont understand why he spends so much time on the wings when he should be in the box?????

I know he did great for us last season but this league is a whole different ball game for him so do you think he''ll cut it in the championship or do you think like me that we need to get an experienced championship striker in on loan to give him competition or play instead of him with Martin or Jackson if he isnt cutting the mustard?

Whats your  thoughts ?

[/quote]He may not be providing the goals but he is providing the assists, did he not win us the penalty yesterday?

[ron obvious 1,502]

Grant''s irreplaceable, at least at anything like the money. Apart from his other qualities, he can be surprisingly agile for a big bloke. The way he got himself some space for that toe-poke early on was superb. A pound shop Dean Ashton!