WHERE AND WHEN DID THE ROT START

[zemas tendon 0]

I think it was the year we got promoted, N. Worthington started to dismantle a winning team, by letting the likes of Iwan, Malky go, as these were two big players for the club, big leaders in the changing room, now i know they would not have played every game, but how many newly promoted teams gets rid of two not one influential players and not replacing them when they have just been promoted! These two would have been worth their weight in gold if they had been kept on, and would still had a part to play in the premier league, May have been the difference in staying up!! Dean Ashton should have been signed at the start of the season! The club has also now missed out on a decade of fans by not expanding the ground!

[I am a Banana 0]

[quote user="zemas tendon"]I think it was the year we got promoted, N. Worthington started to dismantle a winning team, by letting the likes of Iwan, Malky go, as these were two big players for the club, big leaders in the changing room, now i know they would not have played every game, but how many newly promoted teams gets rid of two not one influential players and not replacing them when they have just been promoted! These two would have been worth their weight in gold if they had been kept on, and would still had a part to play in the premier league, May have been the difference in staying up!! Dean Ashton should have been signed at the start of the season! The club has also now missed out on a decade of fans by not expanding the ground![/quote]

letting iwan and malky go was a massive decision and the wrong one agreed!

but expanding the ground?? with what money?? were £18 in debt!!

[robzilla 0]

Totally agree with that, although Malky would have probably been a bit slow in the premier - he would have been a far better choice than Simon Charlton. I remember the 1st game against Palace when they got thier 1st corner thinking that we were in trouble. Dean Ashton should have been signed at the start of season and as much as Holt was a great player in the championship he was massively out of his depth in the Premier and it took Worthy over alf the season to notice it!

[CANARY CHARGE 0]

[quote user="robzilla"]Totally agree with that, although Malky would have probably been a bit slow in the premier - he would have been a far better choice than Simon Charlton. I remember the 1st game against Palace when they got thier 1st corner thinking that we were in trouble. Dean Ashton should have been signed at the start of season and as much as Holt was a great player in the championship he was massively out of his depth in the Premier and it took Worthy over alf the season to notice it![/quote]

Foundations are what makes a club, i dont mean infrastructure like delia seems to have in her head! The fact Worthington, removed us from the reserves league and the blindness to ignore our youth players created the weakened squad we are left today!  Norwich has always been a club with good foundations, thanks to the board and bad managers we have really kissed good bye to that!

[Evil Monkey 52]

Agree it started with the Malky decision, although at the time I agreed that it was the right one - he was getting on a bit and we were about to enter the unknown and face up to players like Rooney and Gerrard.... had he been replaced with someone competent then things might have turned out differently, but hindsight is a wonderful thing... This, coupled with the failure to buy a proven striker in the summer, meant we were all-but relegated before we started (again, with hindsight).I wonder what Worthy himself thinks of these decisions now.  I understand he was pressing for a striker, but Malky was his decision and I wonder now whether he regrets that.....

[robzilla 0]

Yep agree with that too, for a club which prides itself so much on its academy set up, etc the lack of youth players we have brought through in recent years is shocking. All I was saying though is some incredibly poor decisions on the playing front in that first half of the premier season cost us hugely and another season in the prem with the income it would have brought would have saved all this whats going on now

 

[CDMullins 504]

[quote user="robzilla"]

Yep agree with that too, for a club which prides itself so much on its academy set up, etc the lack of youth players we have brought through in recent years is shocking. All I was saying though is some incredibly poor decisions on the playing front in that first half of the premier season cost us hugely and another season in the prem with the income it would have brought would have saved all this whats going on now

 

[/quote]

 

Malky was worth 4-5 to goals a season at their end, i remember watching us play, having corners and think ''I wish Malky was there now'', like wise Iwan coming on as sub with 10-15 mins to go.

[robzilla 0]

Scoring from corners...... That brings back some memories!

[Captain Holt 582]

When we were 2-0 up against Man City at Carrow Road and blew it. If we''ve held on to those 3 points, we''ve stayed up.

[rjwc22 0]

The rot started when the focus was taken away from football to how the ''club'' could develop into a community brand.

Football not food.

[Salopian 1]

-when we were promoted, unexpectedly, with insufficient funds to survive in the Premiership.We scraped the barrel to fund Ashton in a vain hope, and then on there was not enough.Whatever managerial and board deficiencies there were, it has been the failure to buy good players since then.

[Carlos Valderrama 0]

[quote user="I am a Banana"]

[quote user="zemas tendon"]I think it was the year we got promoted, N. Worthington started to dismantle a winning team, by letting the likes of Iwan, Malky go, as these were two big players for the club, big leaders in the changing room, now i know they would not have played every game, but how many newly promoted teams gets rid of two not one influential players and not replacing them when they have just been promoted! These two would have been worth their weight in gold if they had been kept on, and would still had a part to play in the premier league, May have been the difference in staying up!! Dean Ashton should have been signed at the start of the season! The club has also now missed out on a decade of fans by not expanding the ground![/quote]

letting iwan and malky go was a massive decision and the wrong one agreed!

but expanding the ground?? with what money?? were £18 in debt!!

[/quote]

We had to expand the ground, our South Stand had been condemned.

[JJ 0]

Fulham away.  There were mistakes leading up to then (Malky leaving, etc), but something about that day tore the heart out of everything both on and off the field, and accelerated the decline.

 

[Carlos Valderrama 0]

Agree that releasing Malky Mackay was a mistake.

But it goes like this for me, not buying Ashton earlier, not forcing Dean Ashton to stay post relegation.  The fans turning on Damian Francis because his agent had a big gob, not having the balls to gamble with the first 7m parachute payment, buying Robert Earnshaw.

But, controversially....I think the biggest mistake was sacking Nigel Worthington.  I maintain that the rot would have been stopped and the rebuild well and truly started.  I think Worthy was a good player of the prudent approach that our board favour and new how to play that particular game.

[JJ 0]

[quote user="Spineless Fooks"]When we were 2-0 up against Man City at Carrow Road and blew it. If we''ve held on to those 3 points, we''ve stayed up.
[/quote]

That one too.  The Southampton 2-2 game this season reminded me of that.

 

[InLambertWeTrust! 0]

When Delia Smith bought those shares and became maj. share holder...

[First Wizard 0]

When the cook became majority sharholderl.[:|]

[norfolkchance1 0]

The rot started with Malky and Iwan not being kept but there were numerous other chances to stop the rot most certainly halfway through the doomed first campaign back in the championship when a rudderless team was just drifting along.

Instead worthy was given another summer and hence we wasted a chance to freshen the team up with parachute money, and a new man in charge.

[Clever Farke 75]

According to Hux it was letting Dickson and Earnie go. I think it goes back to not adequately replacing Malky, Iwan and Edworthy.

[norfolkchance1 0]

They didn''t let Dickson and Earnie go, both players showed their true loyalty by having release clauses inserted in contracts, both could have rejected moves. The mistake in my view is letting players sign with accessible release clauses - even though I thought Etuhu was rubbish anyway.

[nutty nigel 7,963]

I so disagree with all of this about Worthy, Malky and Iwan. Malky was a great player for us and a huge character. He was not Premiership standard and Worthy, like West Ham recognised it. Worthy wanted to keep Malky but without the guarantee of regular first team football Malky himself asked to go, just as he did at West Ham the next year. All credit to  Malky for that, there are far to many people happy to sit on their hands getting the odd game in the Prem. Iwan was finished, he''d had a great career but he only managed 20 games for Gillingham and 11 for Cambridge after he left us. Flem too was nearing the end of his career and for these three players the promotion came a couple of years too late. If there was a crime here it was in not adequately replacing them however they would have taken a lot of replacing.

I watched the Hucks interview last night and I felt he was saying what I have been saying for a couple of seasons. The rot came because after Worthy was sacked his players were sold and replaced by much inferior ones. He mentioned the likes of Etuhu and Earnshaw but was too diplomatic to mention their replacements Russell and Cureton.

Worthington to Grant. Etuhu to Russell and Earnshaw to Cureton is where the real rot started but posters rarely agree with me.

 

 

[blahblahblah 2]

[quote]Worthington to Grant. Etuhu to Russell and Earnshaw to Cureton is where the real rot started but posters rarely agree with me.[/quote]Huckerby at the time did, which was why he made that outburst when Etuthu was being sold - I guess he could see a decent team being sold from under him.

[The Butler 0]

[quote user="nutty nigel"]

I so disagree with all of this about Worthy, Malky and Iwan. Malky was a great player for us and a huge character. He was not Premiership standard and Worthy, like West Ham recognised it. Worthy wanted to keep Malky but without the guarantee of regular first team football Malky himself asked to go, just as he did at West Ham the next year. All credit to  Malky for that, there are far to many people happy to sit on their hands getting the odd game in the Prem. Iwan was finished, he''d had a great career but he only managed 20 games for Gillingham and 11 for Cambridge after he left us. Flem too was nearing the end of his career and for these three players the promotion came a couple of years too late. If there was a crime here it was in not adequately replacing them however they would have taken a lot of replacing.

I watched the Hucks interview last night and I felt he was saying what I have been saying for a couple of seasons. The rot came because after Worthy was sacked his players were sold and replaced by much inferior ones. He mentioned the likes of Etuhu and Earnshaw but was too diplomatic to mention their replacements Russell and Cureton.

Worthington to Grant. Etuhu to Russell and Earnshaw to Cureton is where the real rot started but posters rarely agree with me.

 

 

[/quote]

So you blame Worthington then Nutty?[;)]

[norfolkchance1 0]

I take your point NN but it was at the start when Iwan and Malky would have been useful when we were struggling to win. That bit of leadership and winning mentality from the season before may have carried over in the same way Hull started this season.

I also feel he radically changed the team and started with a lot of new players rather than some of the players who had got us there. It may have been better starting with some of the others and gradually bringing players like Jonsson and Helveg in.

I now agree Grant was a mistake although I thought it was a clever move at the time I admit I got it wrong.

I also agree with you about Russell, sometimes it takes me to 60 minutes to realise he''s playing.

[nutty nigel 7,963]

I believe that''s why Worthy wanted Malky to stay Norfolk. He was still under contract and he would have been an asset to the club. It was Malky himself who chose to move on and the club, rightly in my view, didn''t stand in his way. I believe we got around £300,000 for him which obviously wouldn''t fund an adequate replacement. Iwan was out of contract so that was a different kettle of fish. He''d been struggling with fitness for a couple of seasons by then. He was an all time hero of mine but I''m afraid his time was up. If we''d have won that play-off final in 2002 Flem and Iwan would have still been able to have a good season in the Prem. Maybe Malky too with a younger Fleming beside him. But of course we wouldn''t have had Hucks. It''s all ifs and buts really!

I take your point about the release clauses for Etuhu and Earnshaw but there is no reason to believe they would have taken advantage of them if Worthy had still been manager. The big players always produced for Worthy and he got them to sign for him regardless of who ultimately paid for them!

 

[pete_norw 0]

While I agree with most of what is said here, no one has mentioned the real rot started when Martin Oneal was simply not backed and he walked, He is the only manager we have had that has shown what could have been here, even with Walker too but Oneal is still showing us

[Sideshow Tim 110]

[quote user="JJ"]

Fulham away.  There were mistakes leading up to then (Malky leaving, etc), but something about that day tore the heart out of everything both on and off the field, and accelerated the decline.

 

[/quote]

 

Here here. I could have killed one or two City players that day.

[Shaun Tilly Lace 0]

When the club''s "saviours" Smith and Jones rode to our rescue. Oh, how lucky we were!

[0ridgemanddMMyyyy0Falseen-USTrue 0]

Keeping Worthington for the whole of ouf Premiership season when he was clearly out of his depth

Letting our 2 - 0 lead slip against Man City (perhaps Delia should have opened our dressing room door and shouted lets be aving you) letting our 3 - 1 lead at Crystal Palace slip.

Plus not signing replacements equivalent or better to the ones we let go.

Too many mistakes but the worst thing is we are still making them!

[Tumbleweed 106]

There were mistakes before as folks have mentioned but the biggest one to me was the appointment of Peter Grant. He brought in too much deadwood, had no managerial experience and was exactly the opposite of what we needed when Worthy finally left. We needed a guy who could regalvanise the club and who had experience of developing players from an academy. That was acatastrophic mistake, Roeder stripped out even more and our reliance on loan players and the appointment of a blok who has run corporate hospitality were the finals nail in a flat pack coffin made by the club itself.