REFEREE

[Harry53 209]

43 minutes ago, mccanary said:

Anyone think that the refs birthplace had anything to do with this???

 

 

He was born in Middlesbrough to save you googling!!

How can that be allowed? It's like us having a Norwich born and bred, and secret ncfc supporter reffing our game on Saturday 

[SteveN8458 64]

4 minutes ago, Harry53 said:

How can that be allowed? It's like us having a Norwich born and bred, and secret ncfc supporter reffing our game on Saturday 

Yes Please 🙂

[dylanisabaddog 4,929]

I was at the theatre last night and missed all the fuss. I've just looked at the various angles and doubt it was a yellow let alone a red. Possibly a bit silly but Howson is the real offender here. 

[Graham Paddons Beard 2,431]

15 minutes ago, Robert N. LiM said:

Thanks. Just looked it up. What a piece of work.

Agreed. 
 

In the moment refs are faced with applying the laws and many factors come into play. There are examples of refs who climb the ladder by giving percentage decisions - a free kick on the half way line isn’t given as a pen. It avoids “headlines” and helps them through assessments. 
On the other hand a desire for limelight occurs. We see this from Stroud in particular- and back in the day Clattenburg. 
Last night was that . Madley taking centre stage unnecessarily. 

Also There is unconscious bias . Why lecture Ayling for 2 mins for kicking Sainz , see Sainz tangle with Howson and then blame Sainz? Something happened in his head. Madley thinks he has seen a reaction from Sainz that isn’t there. 
 

Madley is a poor ref. Since he came back he has done 2 prem games in 3 years. That tells you he gets on , has a stinker then goes back down to the Championship. 
 

Last night was a mid table championship match not on mainstream tv. Classic game to send a poor ref on. 
 

 

 

[Ian 1,129]

1 minute ago, dylanisabaddog said:

I was at the theatre last night and missed all the fuss. I've just looked at the various angles and doubt it was a yellow let alone a red. Possibly a bit silly but Howson is the real offender here. 

Made me laugh when Radio Norfolk were defending him, suggesting he was beyond reproach and was just drawing the ref's attention to it like a professional footballer should.

Presumably they missed the bit where he hopped around several times as if his leg had been shot.

[Grumpy 122]

Initially It appeared the foul had gone against Howson but the resulting red card was to say the least a surprise.
Slow motion seems to suggest that Howson went into the back of Sainz right knee and ankle with both feet and studs up which in itself is a red card offence.
Sainz swivels on his back holding the injured leg and looks to brush Howsons thigh.In true footballers fashion Howson has milked it for all his worth possibly to detract from what I think he thought was a yellow card(or worse) coming his way.

[Addick/Canary 72]

Nobody has mentioned the Stacey forearm into the neck of the opponent late in the game when challenging for a high ball on the wing. Perhaps he got away with it because the other player just got up without any protest, although it looked quite intentional to me, in real time and in the replay.

Either the ref didn't see it or perhaps he ignored it in view of his earlier mistake with the Sainz red.

[hogesar 9,676]

2 minutes ago, Graham Paddons Beard said:

Agreed. 
 

In the moment refs are faced with applying the laws and many factors come into play. There are examples of refs who climb the ladder by giving percentage decisions - a free kick on the half way line isn’t given as a pen. It avoids “headlines” and helps them through assessments. 
On the other hand a desire for limelight occurs. We see this from Stroud in particular- and back in the day Clattenburg. 
Last night was that . Madley taking centre stage unnecessarily. 

Also There is unconscious bias . Why lecture Ayling for 2 mins for kicking Sainz , see Sainz tangle with Howson and then blame Sainz? Something happened in his head. Madley thinks he has seen a reaction from Sainz that isn’t there. 
 

Madley is a poor ref. Since he came back he has done 2 prem games in 3 years. That tells you he gets on , has a stinker then goes back down to the Championship. 
 

Last night was a mid table championship match not on mainstream tv. Classic game to send a poor ref on. 
 

Thing is, Madley is looking directly at the entire event. He should see Howson late it on Sainz too, but that's not relevant to the red-card decision.

The fact he's watching it, and we've all seen the replays, there is no direct kick-out or leg extension from Sainz. His legs are up from getting kicked and he's rubbing his leg as footballers tend to nowadays if they get studded.

So at absolute worst case, Madley MIGHT think Sainz had a little intention there. But excessive force? Endangering an opponent? Also, what he's just seen doesn't correlate with intention so you're almost trying to see something that's not there. At that point, any decent ref realises they haven't got conclusive evidence and at worst case gives a yellow. 

Worth noting at this point that Madley's brother, Andrew, is a current Premier League referee. They wouldn't keep him in a job just because he's one of the boys, surely? 

.....

[Graham Paddons Beard 2,431]

5 minutes ago, Ian said:

Made me laugh when Radio Norfolk were defending him, suggesting he was beyond reproach and was just drawing the ref's attention to it like a professional footballer should.

Presumably they missed the bit where he hopped around several times as if his leg had been shot.

Ref has bought the reaction from Howson. 

[Ian 1,129]

Just now, Graham Paddons Beard said:

Ref has bought the reaction from Howson. 

It was just an inept display of refereeing. I understand it's a very difficult job, but firstly he allows Ayling and Howson to both go through the back of Sainz in a potentially dangerous way, without any sort of sanction, and then gives a red card presumably to something he thought he saw happen but didn't. Zero consistency.

[Grumpy 122]

11 hours ago, Jim Smith said:

Agree entirely. Howson’s tackle on the other hand is a red card offence, as possibly was the earlier one by Ayling which didn’t get a card. 
 

This is why I think the ref originally gave the free kick to Norwich. Sainz has clearly slid in and got the ball and Howson comes in late and commits a two footed foul in the back of Sainz' right leg.

[shefcanary 2,409]

12 hours ago, Feedthewolf said:

It's certainly not natural the way that Sainz spins round and launches his feet upwards,

You've just been studded in the back of the knee. The pain is unbearable so you look to relieve it. The first way of doing that is extending your leg to allow the blood to drain, thankfully you are in a position that your leg is in an upward direction, so all you have to do is flex it. The natural reaction is thus a straightening of the leg. Unfortunately this takes the foot toward Howson. 

The movement was not a flick out - it was an extension of the leg to reduce the pain from a very nasty challenge. 

 

[shefcanary 2,409]

12 hours ago, Feedthewolf said:

City skipper Grant Hanley’s furious reaction

Ha, really. Says it bloody all about him. A really poor performance last night and this sums it up. His anger should have been channelled into leading a response from the team, instead this. He is shot!

[Feedthewolf 4,846]

19 minutes ago, shefcanary said:

You've just been studded in the back of the knee. The pain is unbearable so you look to relieve it. The first way of doing that is extending your leg to allow the blood to drain, thankfully you are in a position that your leg is in an upward direction, so all you have to do is flex it. The natural reaction is thus a straightening of the leg. Unfortunately this takes the foot toward Howson. 

The movement was not a flick out - it was an extension of the leg to reduce the pain from a very nasty challenge. 

Well that's one possible interpretation...

[Feedthewolf 4,846]

21 minutes ago, shefcanary said:

Ha, really. Says it bloody all about him. A really poor performance last night and this sums it up. His anger should have been channelled into leading a response from the team, instead this. He is shot!

I think that's reactionary nonsense. He's come back extremely strongly from a potentially career-ending injury, and has been playing really well since he came back – coinciding with an excellent run of form in which we'd lost one in 10 (Sargent obviously a big factor in that too, though).

He had a poor game last night, as we collectively melted down after the red card. Deep breaths, on to Saturday.

Edited March 7 by Feedthewolf
typo

[Jim Smith 2,319]

What frustrates me is the number of people, including most pundits, who don’t actually look at what the laws say. They just say “there is contact” and “he’s left his leg there” so it was justified or won’t be overturned. it’s similar to the “there was contact” so it must be a foul brigade in the national media as indeed was echoed by Howson himself.
 

FTW had excellently summarised the law on offences deserving of a red card. If this red does not get overturned then it’s utterly laughable.

[SwindonCanary 455]

I've never liked that ref !

[Feedthewolf 4,846]

3 hours ago, mccanary said:

Anyone think that the refs birthplace had anything to do with this???

He was born in Middlesbrough to save you googling!!

No, you've just made that up. He was born and raised in Wakefield, West Yorkshire.

[shefcanary 2,409]

1 hour ago, Feedthewolf said:

I think that's reactionary nonsense. He's come back extremely strongly from a potentially career-ending injury, and has been playing really well since he came back – coinciding with an excellent run of form in which we'd lost one in 10 (Sargent obviously a big factor in that too, though).

He had a poor game last night, as we collectively melted down after the red card. Deep breaths, on to Saturday.

FTW: I have never been persuaded that Hanley is a good captain. He's an okay centre-half if you want a row Z one. Last night on Connor's match blog I highlighted very early that Boro's supposed passive press was all about forcing the ball at Hanley's feet, and Norwich had no support for him. His only out ball was either Gunn, or to try and pass to Fassnacht, who invariably lost the ball. Carrick knows a weakness and had obviously seen it. I've seen it for years, but for whatever reason I've never been able to persuade people on here. Last night seemed vindication for years of being knocked back.

Not reactionary at all - I've been saying this for years!!!!!

[Feedthewolf 4,846]

Just now, shefcanary said:

FTW: I have never been persuaded that Hanley is a good captain. He's an okay centre-half if you want a row Z one. Last night on Connor's match blog I highlighted very early that Boro's supposed passive press was all about forcing the ball at Hanley's feet, and Norwich had no support for him. His only out ball was either Gunn, or to try and pass to Fassnacht, who invariably lost the ball. Carrick knows a weakness and had obviously seen it. I've seen it for years, but for whatever reason I've never been able to persuade people on here. Last night seemed vindication for years of being knocked back.

Not reactionary at all - I've been saying this for years!!!!!

Okay, fair enough – I withdraw my accusation of 'reactionary'

We're not going to sign Ruben Dias any time soon. At this level, all players have more pronounced weaknesses that can be exploited; Hanley is definitely more in the mould of the 'row Z stopper' than the 'ball-playing CB', but for a big lad he's always been very quick and mobile. I think he's definitely helped by having his international teammate Kenny playing alongside him at the back, as Kenny can do more of the distribution while he goes for the high balls and does the simple stuff.

Obviously if we did somehow sneak promotion I wouldn't want Grant and Kenny at CB in the Prem, but at this level I think they actually make a really good pairing. I'd be looking to offload Batth, Gibson and Duffy in the summer, then sign a young left-footed CB to play understudy to Kenny, and choose the best of the out-on-loan right-footed CBs (Hills, Warner, Tomkinson, Adegboyega) to join the first-team squad.

[Robert N. LiM 4,360]

40 minutes ago, shefcanary said:

Not reactionary at all - I've been saying this for years!!!!!

 

34 minutes ago, Feedthewolf said:

Okay, fair enough – I withdraw my accusation of 'reactionary'

You can replace it with an accusation of 'confirmation bias'. Only joking, @shefcanary. (Sort of.)

And I did genuinely like your defence of Sainz. Do you have a window in your schedule to represent NCFC at the appeal? Liked the blood-flow to the leg stuff in particular.

[shefcanary 2,409]

1 hour ago, Robert N. LiM said:

You can replace it with an accusation of 'confirmation bias'. Only joking, @shefcanary. (Sort of.)

Ah, FTW just accused me of that on another thread, I wondered where he got that from! (just joking @Feedthewolf)

Infamy, infamy, they've all got it in for me! 🤣

[Robert N. LiM 4,360]

1 minute ago, shefcanary said:

Ah, FTW just accused me of that on another thread, I wondered where he got that from! (just joking @Feedthewolf)

Infamy, infamy, they've all got it in for me! 🤣

Out of reactions so please imagine the laughing one.

[Feedthewolf 4,846]

1 minute ago, Robert N. LiM said:

Out of reactions so please imagine the laughing one.

Look at us, being all civil about our differences of opinion.

It's totally unacceptable.

[Robert N. LiM 4,360]

Just now, Feedthewolf said:

Look at us, being all civil about our differences of opinion.

It's totally unacceptable.

Reported

[Feedthewolf 4,846]

1 minute ago, Robert N. LiM said:

Reported

Binner

[shefcanary 2,409]

4 minutes ago, Feedthewolf said:

Look at us, being all civil about our differences of opinion.

It's totally unacceptable.

Aaagh. I am out of reactions too! 🤣🤣

Edited March 7 by shefcanary

[Jim Smith 2,319]

Club have confirmed it’s been appealed. 

[TheGunnShow 5,940]

Even as someone who defends referees most of the time, even I'm scratching my head at how he's got a red card for Sainz out of that.

I don't even think Sainz gives a damn where Howson is at that point. I think he's just checking his leg after being hit!

[littleyellowbirdie 2,550]

18 hours ago, Rich T The Biscuit said:

That's a bit of a stretch, he's not kicked out or even thrust his leg forward. Yes he could have probably placed his legs differently but his legs remained the same position for the whole movement so never a red!

It's barely a yellow let alone a red, what it is is really poor from Howson who got a fellow pro sent off for what was the tiniest of touches.

Yup. He wasn't even looking at Howson either.