Delia Out - Strategy Thread

[Monty13 2,252]

14 minutes ago, nutty nigel said:

But we're moving right off point now. The conversation I alluded to would be from improved communication with our club. But I don't really think supporters in the ground can't work out for themselves why Idah has a 5 year contract. And anyway, the abuse of players during the game isn't really a conversation is it?

I think in many ways the best answer to this came from @TIL 1010 about the internet. I saw it in real time last Thursday evening when there was a tweet? allegedly from TNC about Delia and Michael's supposed comments concerning Stuart Webber and David Wagner. This was then read out in the form of a shareholder's question. Of course Michael.and Delia immediately dismissed it as a lie but that added to the overall bad mood surrounding the AGM. We see almost daily where such 'lies' are repeated on here. Truth really doesn't seem to matter so much since the internet has become so vital to the conversations.

Not really. My point was player situations is not what I’m talking about in terms of communication. The why’s and the wherefores of footballing decisions will always be debated, regardless of the official position.

My point was how the club communicates to the supporters more broadly in its messages, whether through its own channels or interviews.

No one has to read lies to be upset with that communication the last few years, the truth has been pretty bad in itself including the AGM IMO. An endless array of unpleasant/poor soundbites taking away from whatever the actual message is meant to be whether 20% whingers, snakepit divorcees, 90%, the fact there isn’t a disconnect etc. etc. 

Worse thing the club ever did was buy into this ignore the noise mentality IMO. It basically meant ignore the supporters and their concerns. That resentment from the more passionate has been building up while many of the rest just slip into apathy.

That’s my generalised assessment. You can’t engage and ignore simultaneously. So the result is an unengaged supporter base. Doesn’t matter when you’re winning, when you aren’t they aren’t waiting to pick you up and expecting them to be is a little naive.

Edited December 5, 2023 by Monty13

[Duncan Edwards 2,271]

Doesn’t matter when you’re winning

 

The end. 

[essex canary 506]

5 minutes ago, Duncan Edwards said:

Doesn’t matter when you’re winning

 

The end. 

Are we less likely to win in such circumstances?

[Duncan Edwards 2,271]

3 minutes ago, essex canary said:

Are we less likely to win in such circumstances?

My point is/was that none of this stuff matters when we’re winning. Nobody gives a shiny Tom **** about “corporate governance” or Delia being Delia or contracts for young players and, undeniably, the atmosphere in the ground is upbeat. As I’ve said elsewhere, when Delia spouts some old sh1te about the best supporters in the world when we get promoted or whatever, she’s just a loveable old dear in the background. Talk about the fans when we’re NOT winning and she’s an out of touch, dictatorial, power crazed narcissist clinging on to power. It’s mental gymnastics.

I have been asked about “improving atmosphere” at Carrow Road a few years ago. The simple answer I gave was to win more games. I’m yet to be convinced there’s another answer. That infernal fcking drum certainly wasn’t it. 

[essex canary 506]

8 hours ago, Duncan Edwards said:

My point is/was that none of this stuff matters when we’re winning. Nobody gives a shiny Tom **** about “corporate governance” or Delia being Delia or contracts for young players and, undeniably, the atmosphere in the ground is upbeat. As I’ve said elsewhere, when Delia spouts some old sh1te about the best supporters in the world when we get promoted or whatever, she’s just a loveable old dear in the background. Talk about the fans when we’re NOT winning and she’s an out of touch, dictatorial, power crazed narcissist clinging on to power. It’s mental gymnastics.

I have been asked about “improving atmosphere” at Carrow Road a few years ago. The simple answer I gave was to win more games. I’m yet to be convinced there’s another answer. That infernal fcking drum certainly wasn’t it. 

I am guessing you don't believe in Daniel Farke's line about the crowd being the 12th. man? The pandemic proved it though with away teams doing much better. Then we restricted our own crowd at Chelsea and lost 7-0.

 

[Sufyellow 223]

8 hours ago, Duncan Edwards said:

My point is/was that none of this stuff matters when we’re winning. Nobody gives a shiny Tom **** about “corporate governance” or Delia being Delia or contracts for young players and, undeniably, the atmosphere in the ground is upbeat. As I’ve said elsewhere, when Delia spouts some old sh1te about the best supporters in the world when we get promoted or whatever, she’s just a loveable old dear in the background. Talk about the fans when we’re NOT winning and she’s an out of touch, dictatorial, power crazed narcissist clinging on to power. It’s mental gymnastics.

I have been asked about “improving atmosphere” at Carrow Road a few years ago. The simple answer I gave was to win more games. I’m yet to be convinced there’s another answer. That infernal fcking drum certainly wasn’t it. 

It's alot more than winning a few games , as we saw under smith.  As fans we need a plan to buy into and get behind,  something we can all believe in and we can all be part of. Unfortunately the plan went out of the window when Emi left , we couldn't build any higher and we couldn't get a skipp replacement either. We then finished it sacking farke. We now can't build a team to compete in the prem,  and we can't buy players when we are there to compete, so what is their to look forward too? Unfortunately there hasn't been a plan since farke went. And the last transfer window,  looked like we were just trying to survive this season.  

 

[Bert 236]

At the end of the day Dennis is allowed his opinion, he is clearly profoundly wrong in his support for the stowmarket 2 but that is his right.

part of the aging process is that we start to lose our cognitive abilities and he is losing his bless his little cotton socks 

[essex canary 506]

7 minutes ago, Bert said:

At the end of the day Dennis is allowed his opinion, he is clearly profoundly wrong in his support for the stowmarket 2 but that is his right.

part of the aging process is that we start to lose our cognitive abilities and he is losing his bless his little cotton socks 

Are you saying that this red top rag hack had any cognitive abilities in the first place?

[Monty13 2,252]

9 hours ago, Duncan Edwards said:

My point is/was that none of this stuff matters when we’re winning. Nobody gives a shiny Tom **** about “corporate governance” or Delia being Delia or contracts for young players and, undeniably, the atmosphere in the ground is upbeat. As I’ve said elsewhere, when Delia spouts some old sh1te about the best supporters in the world when we get promoted or whatever, she’s just a loveable old dear in the background. Talk about the fans when we’re NOT winning and she’s an out of touch, dictatorial, power crazed narcissist clinging on to power. It’s mental gymnastics.

I have been asked about “improving atmosphere” at Carrow Road a few years ago. The simple answer I gave was to win more games. I’m yet to be convinced there’s another answer. That infernal fcking drum certainly wasn’t it. 

But that’s the point Duncan, it’s not that it doesn’t matter when we are doing well, it’s that the majority don’t care, quite legitimately IMO. 

There will be people who do, there’s always those who question things regardless of how good things are going. However when we aren’t doing well why that is is always going to come into focus.

As for Delias comments you are exactly right, when doing well they are laughed off when we aren’t they are inflammatory. However it’s not mental gymnastics, it’s perception and context as anyone who knows PR knows well.

[Fuzzar 1,703]

30 minutes ago, Bert said:

At the end of the day Dennis is allowed his opinion, he is clearly profoundly wrong in his support for the stowmarket 2 but that is his right.

part of the aging process is that we start to lose our cognitive abilities and he is losing his bless his little cotton socks 

You must be well over 100 then. 

[littleyellowbirdie 2,598]

54 minutes ago, Sufyellow said:

It's alot more than winning a few games , as we saw under smith.  As fans we need a plan to buy into and get behind,  something we can all believe in and we can all be part of. Unfortunately the plan went out of the window when Emi left , we couldn't build any higher and we couldn't get a skipp replacement either. We then finished it sacking farke. We now can't build a team to compete in the prem,  and we can't buy players when we are there to compete, so what is their to look forward too? Unfortunately there hasn't been a plan since farke went. And the last transfer window,  looked like we were just trying to survive this season.  

 

With such a wide range of what 'we' want, the club is always doomed to disappoint.

[Yobocop 1,105]

On 03/12/2023 at 09:51, The Real Buh said:

First of all I fully accept that Delia hasn’t always been a bad owner for us. I was there for the titles and I was there at Wembley. I haven’t had selective amnesia.

But… It’s over. It’s been over for quite a while now.

She won’t go quietly, that’s for sure. However, she is weak. I don’t think she’s ever been this weak. We have a golden opportunity to oust her right now. The exit door is open for her.

We definitely need to strategise, and I’m not talking about bedsheets at the ground, somebody else can organise a MySpace event or whatever it is. That’s not my bag.

If we want to get Delia I’m afraid it’s got to be character damage and I’m afraid it’s got to be national. Local level damage to her reputation isn’t enough and she knows that. Any time that escapes local news and into a wider sphere is where she panics. Her weakness has always been her ego. I believe we need to attack that ego. Embarrass her and have the sky cameras pan over to her, that’s what she fears. 

She also needs to be, and it’s a shame to say this, baited into making a fool of herself.

I’m fairly sure that we’ve come to the point that the only thing that would facilitate an exit from this club for her is another “let’s be having you” style moment. I kind of think that’s got to happen, and then she’s convinced to leave as a result of the reaction.
 

It’s a shame it’s come to this but maybe it was always going to end this way, with her disgraced. What always matters is the club though. We will survive and we have a good heart.

For me they’re most definitely in a transitional phase at the club right now, she will be gone within the next two years 

Not to quote the great and not late Gary Barlow esq but ‘have a little patience’ 

[......and Smith must score. 1,361]

1 hour ago, Sufyellow said:

It's alot more than winning a few games , as we saw under smith.  As fans we need a plan to buy into and get behind,  something we can all believe in and we can all be part of. Unfortunately the plan went out of the window when Emi left , we couldn't build any higher and we couldn't get a skipp replacement either. We then finished it sacking farke. We now can't build a team to compete in the prem,  and we can't buy players when we are there to compete, so what is their to look forward too? Unfortunately there hasn't been a plan since farke went. And the last transfer window,  looked like we were just trying to survive this season.  

 

Agree with this.

Purely winning doesn’t seem to be the be all and end all anymore. Early doors under Smith we won a lot of games but the football was s*ite. I remember us beating Stoke 3-1 at Carrow Rd and it was dross. Most games we’ve won under Wagner that have been pretty poor too.

There seems to have been a sea change amongst our supporters over recent years. They want to see a bit of style as well as  substance and they haven’t been getting it

[Sufyellow 223]

5 hours ago, littleyellowbirdie said:

With such a wide range of what 'we' want, the club is always doomed to disappoint.

I was happy to be a good championship club , trying to build something. When fans started moaning about Farke I never believed the board would agree with them,  they raised the bar and brought the last 2 years on themselves. I hope Knapper can find us a plan to buy into. 

[Monty13 2,252]

7 hours ago, littleyellowbirdie said:

With such a wide range of what 'we' want, the club is always doomed to disappoint.

Did you actually read their post?

It’s not about giving all the supporters what they want, it’s about communicating a clear vision and plan to get there.

Something we haven’t done since the Buendia sale.

[littleyellowbirdie 2,598]

15 minutes ago, Monty13 said:

Did you actually read their post?

It’s not about giving all the supporters what they want, it’s about communicating a clear vision and plan to get there.

Something we haven’t done since the Buendia sale.

How does one player constitute a plan ?

[essex canary 506]

1 hour ago, littleyellowbirdie said:

How does one player constitute a plan ?

The plan should include extracting money from all these diaspora supporters.

Edited December 6, 2023 by essex canary

[Capt. Pants 4,284]

2 hours ago, Monty13 said:

Did you actually read their post?

It’s not about giving all the supporters what they want, it’s about communicating a clear vision and plan to get there.

Something we haven’t done since the Buendia sale.

I think I agree and I have suggested we might/ought to look forward to Knapper's strategy. The challenge is pleasing most of the supporters as we do have previous in making promotion look relatively easy, so there will be a level of expectation and unfortunately I have to say, heightened by that lot down the road. I think many supporters would buy into a rebuild so long as we don't have to wait 2 years before we start whilst Smith and Attanasio dance around handbags, or whilst Knapper decides if Wagner is the future or not. 

[Monty13 2,252]

2 hours ago, littleyellowbirdie said:

How does one player constitute a plan ?

What are you talking about?

[Sufyellow 223]

3 hours ago, littleyellowbirdie said:

How does one player constitute a plan ?

When we sold Emi on getting promoted,  it showed we couldn't even hold on to a decent Premier league player. Our whole plan was to build a team and go up with it, and add to it. We ended up losing 2 of our best players.  We already knew we can't  afford to buy Premier league players. So yes selling one player was huge. 

[Sufyellow 223]

1 hour ago, essex canary said:

The plan should include extracting money from all these diaspora supporters.

They used that plan on me to get Svenson , mckenzie and hucks to get promoted,  and then to buy Holt when we got relegated. Unfortunately Mr Webber under Delia,  means I will never be doing that again. 

[essex canary 506]

1 minute ago, Sufyellow said:

They used that plan on me to get Svenson , mckenzie and hucks to get promoted,  and then to buy Holt when we got relegated. Unfortunately Mr Webber under Delia,  means I will never be doing that again. 

You can be an honory member of the domestic shareholders group.

[Sufyellow 223]

21 hours ago, essex canary said:

You can be an honory member of the domestic shareholders group.

Thank you Essex,  but I don't think Delia and Michael, [ that's for Nige my new friend],  will be selling me any shares , I am definitely not on the Xmas list. 

[littleyellowbirdie 2,598]

On 06/12/2023 at 22:48, Sufyellow said:

When we sold Emi on getting promoted,  it showed we couldn't even hold on to a decent Premier league player. Our whole plan was to build a team and go up with it, and add to it. We ended up losing 2 of our best players.  We already knew we can't  afford to buy Premier league players. So yes selling one player was huge. 

Buendia made it very clear he no longer wanted to be here. I find it amazing people continue to gloss over this like it's of no importance.

Regardless, a plan is not one player. It strikes me that the plan didn't change, only how well it was working changed. So overall what everyone means about a 'plan' is positive progress. The stuff about communication is absolute bunk, reinforced by the fact that so many people clearly had no clue what Webber and Farke had stated our aims were of being a top 26 club when it became clear we couldn't cut it in the Premier League.

Edited December 8, 2023 by littleyellowbirdie

[Sufyellow 223]

17 hours ago, littleyellowbirdie said:

Buendia made it very clear he no longer wanted to be here. I find it amazing people continue to gloss over this like it's of no importance.

Regardless, a plan is not one player. It strikes me that the plan didn't change, only how well it was working changed. So overall what everyone means about a 'plan' is positive progress. The stuff about communication is absolute bunk, reinforced by the fact that so many people clearly had no clue what Webber and Farke had stated our aims were of being a top 26 club when it became clear we couldn't cut it in the Premier League.

Where did I say the club were to blame with Emi leaving ? The problem was it showed we can't hold on to a premier league player , so we can't build a squad to compete, we couldn't even get close to what a low to mid premier league club would pay. Sorry to point this out , but Webber sacked farke when in the top 26 so why did he sack him ? Webber obviously thought we were a top 20 club , but I have no idea why he thought that. 

[littleyellowbirdie 2,598]

2 hours ago, Sufyellow said:

Where did I say the club were to blame with Emi leaving ? The problem was it showed we can't hold on to a premier league player , so we can't build a squad to compete, we couldn't even get close to what a low to mid premier league club would pay. Sorry to point this out , but Webber sacked farke when in the top 26 so why did he sack him ? Webber obviously thought we were a top 20 club , but I have no idea why he thought that. 

Farke was our coach for our worst points haul in a season since 1903. He was on target for less points when he was sacked. Top 26 or not, that's abysmal. We may not have had the best players, but we needed to be setting up to grind out wins and win ugly, not try to do what we'd done in the Championship. Farke was simply incompetent on that score. I really don't think anyone in their right mind should wonder why he was sacked.

Edited December 8, 2023 by littleyellowbirdie

[Midlands Yellow 4,083]

10 minutes ago, littleyellowbirdie said:

Farke was our coach for our worst points haul in a season since 1903. He was on target for less points when he was sacked. Top 26 or not, that's abysmal. We may not have had the best players, but we needed to be setting up to grind out wins and win ugly, not try to do what we'd done in the Championship. Farke was simply incompetent on that score. I really don't think anyone in their right mind should wonder why he was sacked.

He was no Dean Smith was he!! 

[littleyellowbirdie 2,598]

8 minutes ago, Midlands Yellow said:

He was no Dean Smith was he!! 

Funnily enough though, Wagner does seem to be getting a bit of slack now for winning three games on the trot winning ugly, which only goes to show just how bewilderingly spiteful and vindictive a lot were about Dean Smith when he got no slack at all from many when we were in the auto slots on the basis of performances not being pretty enough.

I find it amazing that it's still there as well that you keep bringing him up. Bizarre.

 

Edited December 8, 2023 by littleyellowbirdie

[Midlands Yellow 4,083]

3 minutes ago, littleyellowbirdie said:

Funnily enough though, Wagner does seem to be getting a bit of slack now for winning three games on the trot winning ugly, which only goes to show just how bewilderingly spiteful and vindictive a lot were about Dean Smith when he got no slack at all from many when we were in the auto slots on the basis of performances not being pretty enough.

I find it amazing that it's still there as well that you keep bringing him up. Bizarre.

 

More amazing you’d defend him, the man will never never get a job anywhere this level again. 

[littleyellowbirdie 2,598]

Just now, Midlands Yellow said:

More amazing you’d defend him, the man will never never get a job anywhere this level again. 

Maybe. I can't say I care. I just don't like spite, and the treatment of him was pure spite.