Michael and Delia are “ devastated “

[komakino 272]

29 minutes ago, Creedence Clearwater Couto said:

Delia and Michael are tone deaf. There's no need to say anything right now, and if they must, something short and professional! Thank or praise him for the work he's done and suggest the time is right for both parties move on. "absolutely devastated" suggests we can't do better, and implies he had their full unwavering support despite his high profile issues with fans and local media, etc. It's a terrible PR statement, and one that again shows how emotionally attached and weak the owners are when it comes to running a football club. 

Agreed. In stark contrast to when McNally resigned/unresigned when the were 'relieved' and 'glad to see the back of him'. That of course was never made public. 

Delia & Michael have always got too close to senior staff and can't divorce business from friendship. I can't imagine Leeds fans being too enamoured with him if he starts telling them to support Manchester Utd after a 0-0 draw.

I'm curious to see whether Norwich City (i.e Delia and MWJ) held Webber back or whether the Peter Principle applies to Webber as it has done to many others. 

 

[Soldier on 160]

Devastated or not I’d be grateful of them providing some clarity at what is happening at the club and what their short/ long term objectives are!!!

[CANARYKING 641]

2 hours ago, Soldier on said:

Devastated or not I’d be grateful of them providing some clarity at what is happening at the club and what their short/ long term objectives are!!!

As long as they get their free away trips by plane together with free meals both home and away, they’ll be happy.

[Nora's Ghost 157]

Smith and Jones need someone fatter and taller to hide behind this time....

 

What an utter joke our once gritty club has become with low grade journeyman signings coming here knowing they will have an easy life.

[komakino 272]

1 hour ago, Nora's Ghost said:

Smith and Jones need someone fatter and taller to hide behind this time....

 

What an utter joke our once gritty club has become with low grade journeyman signings coming here knowing they will have an easy life.

They had Jez Moxey in that role, but that ended almost before it started. 

[Google Bot 3,294]

7 hours ago, Creedence Clearwater Couto said:

Thank or praise him for the work he's done and suggest the time is right for both parties move on. "absolutely devastated" suggests we can't do better

That's an insecure conclusion, another is that the devastation is how they feel on a personal/friendship level.  Not everyone's a robot.

[Davidlingfield 63]

11 minutes ago, Google Bot said:

  Not everyone's a robot.

Love that based on your profile name….

[The Raptor 1,218]

They're being so nice about webber because they want his wife to stay.

[Miss Demeanor 67]

Pi$$ed more money up the wall than any of his predecessors!

[Creedence Clearwater Couto 1,288]

14 hours ago, Google Bot said:

That's an insecure conclusion, another is that the devastation is how they feel on a personal/friendship level.  Not everyone's a robot.

It's not at all. 

Devastated - cause (someone) severe and overwhelming shock or grief - Are they really devastated? 

In any case, be devastated in private. Releasing statements and comments like that into the public in this situation when you are the owners of big business and organisations, makes you weak and submissive, and arguably suggests it's Webber who's bigger and outgrown Norwich. Of course, that's just my opinion. 

I just don't like it from the owners of our Football Club. It's a position that requires an element of ruthlessness, which is not in their DNA. 

[Capt. Pants 4,260]

Webber has been great for Delia and Michael. He's undoubtedly taken the focus and flack away from them. Similarly Webber deserves all the credit for all the good things that have happened in the last 5 or so years.

It's time for D&M to step aside ASAP.

[Soldier on 160]

2 minutes ago, Capt. Pants said:

Webber has been great for Delia and Michael. He's undoubtedly taken the focus and flack away from them. Similarly Webber deserves all the credit for all the good things that have happened in the last 5 or so years.

It's time for D&M to step aside ASAP.

Indeed the proof is in the pudding though. Do Delia and Michael realise it’s time to step aside ?

[Google Bot 3,294]

1 minute ago, Creedence Clearwater Couto said:

Devastated - cause (someone) severe and overwhelming shock or grief - Are they really devastated? 

Yes, I'd imagine they are devastated as they've clearly become close with both Stuart and Zoe over the years and have a lot of respect for what he's achieved here.  We don't see any of what has changed internally, such as the work that Stu does connecting owners with staff and owners with individual fans - but it's been starting to come out from different people since his resignation.

4 minutes ago, Creedence Clearwater Couto said:

I just don't like it from the owners of our Football Club. It's a position that requires an element of ruthlessness, which is not in their DNA. 

Well, that's your opinion.  I love seeing the personal aspect and emotion attached between owners and staff at the club, even seeing Delia and MWJ during that Brentford match knowing what was to come really demonstrates how much they care for the club, fans and people working for it.

Humanity comes above business for me and it's sad to see people ****ting on this idea that displaying your emotions to staff leaving is in some way weak or not ruthless enough -  it's far more cowardly to hide behind HR and PR ****.

Anyone who works in the corporate world know it's full of ****esters looking out for themselves, and there's nothing cut-throat or strong about it, they're all just passing the buck down the line to escape responsibility as they're scared of coming under fire themselves.

[PurpleCanary 5,570]

Of all the sticks with which to beat the owners taking exception to this comment of theirs seems the feeblest, and that is among some pretty steep competition for feebleness.

[komakino 272]

20 minutes ago, Google Bot said:

Yes, I'd imagine they are devastated as they've clearly become close with both Stuart and Zoe over the years and have a lot of respect for what he's achieved here.  We don't see any of what has changed internally, such as the work that Stu does connecting owners with staff and owners with individual fans - but it's been starting to come out from different people since his resignation.

Well, that's your opinion.  I love seeing the personal aspect and emotion attached between owners and staff at the club, even seeing Delia and MWJ during that Brentford match knowing what was to come really demonstrates how much they care for the club, fans and people working for it.

Humanity comes above business for me and it's sad to see people ****ting on this idea that displaying your emotions to staff leaving is in some way weak or not ruthless enough -  it's far more cowardly to hide behind HR and PR ****.

Anyone who works in the corporate world know it's full of ****esters looking out for themselves, and there's nothing cut-throat or strong about it, they're all just passing the buck down the line to escape responsibility as they're scared of coming under fire themselves.

You cannot let emotions get in the way of sound business sense and many ways Delia and MWJ have been unable to do so, affecting the club in a negative way as a result. Just because they 'care' about the club is totally irreverent. It's the decisions they make which count. 

I'm in business and while we are not 'corporate' in any sense, if humanity came above business we wouldn't be in business. As with Webber connecting with individual fans, he's not capable as all he does is insult them. The customer always comes first, therefore as an employer I wouldn't touch him with a bargepole. 

Edited June 16, 2023 by komakino

[Creedence Clearwater Couto 1,288]

22 minutes ago, Google Bot said:

Yes, I'd imagine they are devastated as they've clearly become close with both Stuart and Zoe over the years and have a lot of respect for what he's achieved here.  We don't see any of what has changed internally, such as the work that Stu does connecting owners with staff and owners with individual fans - but it's been starting to come out from different people since his resignation.

Well, that's your opinion.  I love seeing the personal aspect and emotion attached between owners and staff at the club, even seeing Delia and MWJ during that Brentford match knowing what was to come really demonstrates how much they care for the club, fans and people working for it.

Humanity comes above business for me and it's sad to see people ****ting on this idea that displaying your emotions to staff leaving is in some way weak or not ruthless enough -  it's far more cowardly to hide behind HR and PR ****.

Anyone who works in the corporate world know it's full of ****esters looking out for themselves, and there's nothing cut-throat or strong about it, they're all just passing the buck down the line to escape responsibility as they're scared of coming under fire themselves.

I understand your view, and agree with the sentiment. The issue here is, it's always personal and emotional with the owners. There has to be a balance, and an ability to flex ruthlessness if required. Being too emotionally attached has cost us in the past with delayed decisions. 

With this particular situation, the owners know how spiky the relationship is between the fans and Webber. Surely a more PR friendly statement was require, not one that almost sticks a finger up to the supporters he angered and upset. As I say, it's tone deaf. 

[Creedence Clearwater Couto 1,288]

16 minutes ago, PurpleCanary said:

Of all the sticks with which to beat the owners taking exception to this comment of theirs seems the feeblest, and that is among some pretty steep competition for feebleness.

It really isn't. 

It's a completely unnecessary comment from the owners and ill timed. A comment that shows support for a person that has aggrieved many supporters through his unprofessional and passive aggressive nature. It's absolutely clear to everyone that Webber and Norwich have run it's course. Their comments suggest he could have carried on as long as he wanted, and that's worrying. 

So it's more than just "taking exception" to the comment - it's the context behind it. 

Edited June 16, 2023 by Creedence Clearwater Couto

[king canary 7,623]

17 minutes ago, PurpleCanary said:

Of all the sticks with which to beat the owners taking exception to this comment of theirs seems the feeblest, and that is among some pretty steep competition for feebleness.

Disagree- it was a really weird statement by any measure and as I said elsewhere it does nothing for their image as people who get too emotionally invested in their employees. 

[Google Bot 3,294]

25 minutes ago, Creedence Clearwater Couto said:

It's a completely unnecessary comment from the owners and ill timed.

(In your opinion)

[Google Bot 3,294]

44 minutes ago, komakino said:

I'm in business and while we are not 'corporate' in any sense, if humanity came above business we wouldn't be in business. As with Webber connecting with individual fans, he's not capable as all he does is insult them.

Sure he does, that's why he arranged Delia and Michael to contact my friend when he was on his death bed wasn't it?  Not to mention getting one of the players to go visit him, too.

But we'll just ignore all that and go for the headlines as it's easier for the populous to digest.

Edited June 16, 2023 by Google Bot

[essex canary 497]

43 minutes ago, Google Bot said:

Sure he does, that's why he arranged Delia and Michael to contact my friend when he was on his death bed wasn't it?  Not to mention getting one of the players to go visit him, too.

But we'll just ignore all that and go for the headlines as it's easier for the populous to digest.

Good to read about the Club's response to your friend.

The problem with this though is it is not everyone's experience. It is challenging for the Club to treat people equally but the Chief Operating Officer (Ben Kensell) role is far more suitable for that purpose than the Sporting Director which makes it hard to explain why the COO has been discontinued.

As a case in point the guy on here going through a traumatic divorce doesn’t think Webber is remotely sensitive.

[hogesar 9,704]

53 minutes ago, Google Bot said:

Sure he does, that's why he arranged Delia and Michael to contact my friend when he was on his death bed wasn't it?  Not to mention getting one of the players to go visit him, too.

But we'll just ignore all that and go for the headlines as it's easier for the populous to digest.

There's a big group of fans who just simply aren't interested in this sort of thing, unfortunately. He was mean and nasty and that's all there is to it. 

It doesn't suit the current rhetoric and all we care about are the headline click-bait stuff that Archant decided to go with at the time.

[essex canary 497]

13 minutes ago, hogesar said:

There's a big group of fans who just simply aren't interested in this sort of thing, unfortunately. He was mean and nasty and that's all there is to it. 

It doesn't suit the current rhetoric and all we care about are the headline click-bait stuff that Archant decided to go with at the time.

That wasn't the point I was making in my response to @Google Bot.

[komakino 272]

15 minutes ago, hogesar said:

There's a big group of fans who just simply aren't interested in this sort of thing, unfortunately. He was mean and nasty and that's all there is to it. 

It doesn't suit the current rhetoric and all we care about are the headline click-bait stuff that Archant decided to go with at the time.

If he does a nice thing doesn't make him a nice person. Any therapist will tell you that. He's been hostile and arrogant on too many occasions. That behaviour has been tolerated by Smith & Jones, but will not get tolerated elsewhere. No club will put up with it.It's nothing about 'headlines', we've all seen and heard what he has done since 2017 and overall his behaviour has not been acceptable. 

[TIL 1010 4,760]

18 minutes ago, hogesar said:

 

It doesn't suit the current rhetoric and all we care about are the headline click-bait stuff that Archant decided to go with at the time.

Not that Webber set himself up for it with his attitude towards the local media and comments about fans.

[Google Bot 3,294]

1 hour ago, essex canary said:

The problem with this though is it is not everyone's experience. It is challenging for the Club to treat people equally but the Chief Operating Officer (Ben Kensell) role is far more suitable for that purpose than the Sporting Director which makes it hard to explain why the COO has been discontinued.

Well, I don't know about that, just giving some first hand experience to demonstrate how the headlines do not always reflect the person, nor do they get discussed as it's not headline worthy.

In regards to infrastructure, this is our first attempt at the SD/Head coach model so there will be mistakes made as there are budget concerns and we're always learning.  Are you suggesting we should extend our wage bill for a COO?  

1 hour ago, essex canary said:

As a case in point the guy on here going through a traumatic divorce doesn’t think Webber is remotely sensitive.

Was this guy being abusive too, then?  As the word 'Abusive' was used in tandem when describing such people, but it seems to get ignored.

The headline and discussions that came from that quote is quite damning and he can be a bit of a **** at times.

I also think he deliberately used the term in a way to negatively hit back at those who abused him, it's almost like painting them as failures in some respect.  But, we wanted raw/unedited interviews and that's what we got. 

Not everyone has the stomach for that kind of talk.  Personally, I respect that he probably knew he'd put his foot in things but was happy for the interviews to go out as promised.

[hogesar 9,704]

1 hour ago, komakino said:

If he does a nice thing doesn't make him a nice person. Any therapist will tell you that. He's been hostile and arrogant on too many occasions. That behaviour has been tolerated by Smith & Jones, but will not get tolerated elsewhere. No club will put up with it.It's nothing about 'headlines', we've all seen and heard what he has done since 2017 and overall his behaviour has not been acceptable. 

Well, if he joins super massive Leeds, they will know exactly what his behaviour has been here, and are happy to employ him sooooo

[komakino 272]

15 minutes ago, hogesar said:

Well, if he joins super massive Leeds, they will know exactly what his behaviour has been here, and are happy to employ him sooooo

I'm sure they do, but he won't behave like that at Leeds because he will not be given the environment to do so. 

[essex canary 497]

@Google Bot

Not sure exactly what the last post meant.

To pick up another example there was a fairly recent case in which the family of a supporter of the year who had passed away went to the press to seek some financial help from fellow supporters. It then transpired that the Club had charged a fee for the Wake to be held at Carrow Road.

I don't know and I am not sure that any other supporter does as to how the case was resolved.

At one point they had a Budget for both Ben Kensell and Zoe Webber. I don't understand why that still isn't the case and/or how Ben's duties were allocated. Merely that I believe the Club should have resolved supporter engagement matters such as this in a far better way than they have done.

[Google Bot 3,294]

44 minutes ago, essex canary said:

I believe the Club should have resolved supporter engagement matters such as this in a far better way than they have done.

I can only speak of my own and friends first hand experience, and they've been brilliant.  I've had a season ticket off and on since I was a junior in the 80s and never had a issue with the club, I've been at corporate events with various people from the club and they've all been great.

The only first hand experience of negativity I had was at a party with an ex player and ex manager who felt they were isolated from the club, but this was during McNally's reign.

If you're saying the club is wrong to charge for hiring Carrow Road facilities for the wake of a fan, I really don't know the ins and outs of it all to really make a judgement and it appears you don't either?  I can only speak on first hand experiences, or those that I can make a fully informed decision on.

But I'm not trying to push a bias so not reaching for examples to match.

The issue in regards to this thread is whether the club are being unprofessional in being passionate about an outgoing staff member.  It seems that some think we are, others think we're not doing enough, and I'm somewhere in the middle.

But I know one thing for sure, when it's time for Delia to move on and we're looking at an American businessman at the helm who's face we see a few times each year, it may not be to everyone's taste.

Edited June 16, 2023 by Google Bot