Harry and Megan

[Herman 9,838]

Well, the press ain't laying into his wife anymore. Job done??😉

[KiwiScot 1,489]

I feel with the way he is now this book and show etc are for cleansing himself of all his sins so he can go forward in life as a do gooding public figure off the back of his previous life, but seperating himself from it.

Remember this. If the Queen was still with us this would all be coming out anyway.

[cambridgeshire canary 6,832]

2 hours ago, Herman said:

Well, the press ain't laying into his wife anymore. Job done??😉

No need to lay into someone when they go on about being spanked by older women and killing people like they are nothing but chess pieces in a fun game for you yet you scream in terror and fear when your brother raises his voice at you.

 

Sometimes if you want to embarrass someone all you have to do is say nothing and let them speak.

[littleyellowbirdie 2,604]

4 minutes ago, cambridgeshire canary said:

No need to lay into someone when they go on about being spanked by older women and killing people like they are nothing but chess pieces in a fun game for you yet you scream in terror and fear when your brother raises his voice at you.

 

Sometimes if you want to embarrass someone all you have to do is say nothing and let them speak.

That's what soldiers do and that's the way they need to think to be effective at their job; the only outcome of compassion and understanding of your enemy is you increase the chances of you and your friends getting killed instead of your enemy. To be honest, disappointed that the army has been so weak as to criticise him for a necessary mindset.

[Yellow Fever 3,841]

Clearly Harry has no sensible advisors that he listens too.

I do hope he realised by extension his chess piece comment can equally apply to him and the 'family' at large. Just a crass comment.

Edited January 7, 2023 by Yellow Fever

[keelansgrandad 6,679]

30 minutes ago, littleyellowbirdie said:

That's what soldiers do and that's the way they need to think to be effective at their job; the only outcome of compassion and understanding of your enemy is you increase the chances of you and your friends getting killed instead of your enemy. To be honest, disappointed that the army has been so weak as to criticise him for a necessary mindset.

I don't think you can say that LYB. Many soldiers, including my son, have taken human life either attacking or defending. There is no gloating. No sense of callousness. Its training.

And not until later, the thought that they have taken another human's life starts to trouble them. That is what PTSD is in many cases. I held my son in my arms when he broke down several months after. The realisation of what he had done was buried until it was sparked off by something trivial.

I think Sussex was just trying to establish his image in the book. And by all accounts he has failed miserably.

[sonyc 5,541]

44 minutes ago, keelansgrandad said:

There is no gloating. No sense of callousness. Its training.

And not until later, the thought that they have taken another human's life starts to trouble them. That is what PTSD is in many cases.

That is right in my experience KG. It also affects those in other non military services like the police. They see terrible things. And they have a deep sense of duty and need to be seen as strong, authority figures whilst keeping their emotions in check. Not a great combination for some people to tolerate.

As YF has also said, PH has been poorly advised and further, judging by passages from his  book he has not been able to use the years of psychotherapy he has taken up. He is either, (a) capitalising on income from sales, or (b) talking incessantly to people (strangers) to try and make sense of himself. In a way perhaps to cope with his grief (mother etc) and from life constrained by the royal family. I think there's something to this.

I think it's a combination of the two. 

It will possibly take many years, decades probably, for him to realise that he is himself a chess piece, a pawn no less. And that actually every other person is one too.

He probably has little understanding either of the life lived by ordinary people who face huge personal challenges, without having such privilege or support structures or deference as he enjoys. If he had one iota of understanding of that he wouldn't be talking about himself in the way he is.

He needs to grow up soon doesn't he?

Edited January 7, 2023 by sonyc
Is he still at the mental age of when his mother died?

[A Load of Squit 5,223]

This does not read like the press have portrayed it & it does not sound like a man with a mental illness.

 

[FenwayFrank 2,469]

 

 

 

 

 

Edited January 8, 2023 by FenwayFrank

[Sheva 124]

Sounding more and more as if Harry has some mental issues that need dealing with and I don’t mean that in any bad way.

 

[Herman 9,838]

15 hours ago, A Load of Squit said:

This does not read like the press have portrayed it & it does not sound like a man with a mental illness.

 

Bump.

[Yellow Fever 3,841]

28 minutes ago, Herman said:

Bump.

 

15 hours ago, A Load of Squit said:

This does not read like the press have portrayed it & it does not sound like a man with a mental illness.

 

This actually doesn't really change the context at all - yes he tries to explain himself but that isn't the central issue.

Harry was not and isn't 'any other soldier' with a troubled conscience and should know (or be advised) better than to state any number of disputed 'kills' let alone the dehumanized 'chess pieces'. Why say it at all for any other reason than effect! 

War is messy, people get killed.

 

[Herman 9,838]

1 hour ago, Yellow Fever said:

 

This actually doesn't really change the context at all - yes he tries to explain himself but that isn't the central issue.

Harry was not and isn't 'any other soldier' with a troubled conscience and should know (or be advised) better than to state any number of disputed 'kills' let alone the dehumanized 'chess pieces'. Why say it at all for any other reason than effect! 

War is messy, people get killed.

 

Was it wise to print it, not really, but I do feel it helps explain his position far more the media are allowing.

[Hook's-Walk-Canary 213]

🙃

[Herman 9,838]

From what I have seen he seems sane, coherent and giving the British press the kicking it thoroughly deserves. 

And Bradbury is a very good interviewer. 

Edited January 8, 2023 by Herman

[benchwarmer 625]

On 08/01/2023 at 09:49, Sheva said:

Sounding more and more as if Harry has some mental issues that need dealing with and I don’t mean that in any bad way.

 

Harry's relationship with the media is at the root of all this imo.  He uses them as a scapegoat for his mother's death because it's too painful to face the fact that in August 1997 she was living it up in Paris with Dodi Fayed instead of spending time with her children during the school holidays.  They hadn't seen her for at least a month before she died. 

It's difficult to get angry with someone who's no longer around, but that's what he needs to do.  Instead he directs it at everyone else - the Family as an institution, William, Kate, Charles, Camilla as individuals, the press, anyone will do. 

He irritates the hell out of me, but I also sympathise.

Edited January 9, 2023 by benchwarmer

[wcorkcanary 4,346]

On 07/01/2023 at 10:47, littleyellowbirdie said:

That's what soldiers do and that's the way they need to think to be effective at their job; the only outcome of compassion and understanding of your enemy is you increase the chances of you and your friends getting killed instead of your enemy. To be honest, disappointed that the army has been so weak as to criticise him for a necessary mindset.

Have you served in the forces Birdyo? 

@littleyellowbirdie

Edited January 9, 2023 by wcorkcanary

[littleyellowbirdie 2,604]

3 hours ago, wcorkcanary said:

Have you served in the forces Birdyo? 

@littleyellowbirdie

Wanted to, but eyesight didn't meet the standard. Why do you ask? Have you?

[keelansgrandad 6,679]

I don't understand why criticism of him equates to hate. Its not. Its an opinion of him. We have no idea whether what he says is factual or truthful. He knows from his thirty odd years of being a Royal that there will be no reply. How can the King get embroiled in a spat by a family member. 

What he mentioned about Afghanistan was about the remoteness of an Apache attack helicopter. Not trying to sleep in a bivvy while the Taliban launch RPGs into your compound. Or having to walk carefully through a farm in case you stand on an IED that is full of human siht so that your chances of avoiding infection, should you survive, are diminished.

He has badly misjudged people.

[littleyellowbirdie 2,604]

3 minutes ago, keelansgrandad said:

I don't understand why criticism of him equates to hate. Its not. Its an opinion of him. We have no idea whether what he says is factual or truthful. He knows from his thirty odd years of being a Royal that there will be no reply. How can the King get embroiled in a spat by a family member. 

What he mentioned about Afghanistan was about the remoteness of an Apache attack helicopter. Not trying to sleep in a bivvy while the Taliban launch RPGs into your compound. Or having to walk carefully through a farm in case you stand on an IED that is full of human siht so that your chances of avoiding infection, should you survive, are diminished.

He has badly misjudged people.

My feeling is he's telling the truth as he sees it, but overall I think he has issues and I think she has exploited those issues to her own ends. Just my opinion.

[wcorkcanary 4,346]

6 hours ago, littleyellowbirdie said:

Wanted to, but eyesight didn't meet the standard. Why do you ask? Have you?

I have.78-84.  I asked because you claimed to have  insight into how a soldiers mind works. You must have studied in order to get that opinion  then , if not through actual experience . Where did you study the psychology of the modern soldier? Or are you  one of those people  who just knows things. 

[littleyellowbirdie 2,604]

3 hours ago, wcorkcanary said:

I have.78-84.  I asked because you claimed to have  insight into how a soldiers mind works. You must have studied in order to get that opinion  then , if not through actual experience . Where did you study the psychology of the modern soldier? Or are you  one of those people  who just knows things. 

My opinions on the subject aren't backed up by qualifications, any more than my opinions on football are backed up with experience as a professional (or amateur) footballer, manager,  senior executive at a football club, or having completed a degree in sports science.

Insight into many things can be obtained through a variety of methods, including: -

• First-hand experience
• Listening to the experiences, thoughts, and feelings of people with first-hand experience
• Reading written accounts of the experiences, thoughts,, and feelings of people with first-hand experience
• Reading the observations of psychologists and psychiatrists regarding their views of how soldiers deal with the subject

In the past, I've produced successful events on the oil and gas industry without having ever worked on an oil platform, worked in an oil refinery, been a lawyer working on the details of negotiating JDAs near maritime borders, or been a security specialist at sites in regions with risk of political instability. I produced these events collecting information to gain understanding and insight both directly and indirectly in much the same way I've built up a picture of the different methods used in the military to cope with killing by military personnel in the different branches of the forces.

In much the same way, the better journalists also use these methods to develop a rounded view on a subject, gain insight, and attempt to communicate that insight to their audience without necessarily having first hand experience of doing what they're writing about.

So you were a soldier. What sort of soldier were you? Have you killed in action? Have you been in a position where you've been called on to kill in action? How did you cope with it? Did Harry's account of his coping mechanisms for killing from the cockpit of an Apache helicopter convince you? Do you think the coping mechanisms of a helicopter pilot would be the same as of a frontline soldier in closer proximity to enemy combatants? Do you think the army's statement on his observations was authentic or driven by a desire to avoid a discussion about a thorny subject in PR terms?

Your thoughts as a former soldier would be of interest to me.

Edited January 10, 2023 by littleyellowbirdie

[wcorkcanary 4,346]

My thoughts as a former soldier are thus....we did as instructed, simple as  . I am surprised that someone as insightful and clearly intelligent  as you doesnt know  that despite being soldiers , each will react differently  to events . Still humans you know.  Some glory in it , some dont. The people most interested weren't there. 

[keelansgrandad 6,679]

13 hours ago, littleyellowbirdie said:

My feeling is he's telling the truth as he sees it, but overall I think he has issues and I think she has exploited those issues to her own ends. Just my opinion.

Of course he is going to say things that are controversial. I doubt many publishers would slash out on a book saying he loved his Dad and Brother.

But as you say, he has issues. Personally, I believe they are to do with his wife, who like his mother, thought they were going to change the Monarchy. What they failed to realise is that the Monarchy is an institution just inhabited by people called Kings and Queens. They are the figureheads of a system that I would wager, the majority of its subjects wish to retain.

I doubt a vote on a Republic would be successful. Unfortunately.

[A Load of Squit 5,223]

1 hour ago, keelansgrandad said:

Of course he is going to say things that are controversial. I doubt many publishers would slash out on a book saying he loved his Dad and Brother.

But as you say, he has issues. Personally, I believe they are to do with his wife, who like his mother, thought they were going to change the Monarchy. What they failed to realise is that the Monarchy is an institution just inhabited by people called Kings and Queens. They are the figureheads of a system that I would wager, the majority of its subjects wish to retain.

I doubt a vote on a Republic would be successful. Unfortunately.

It could be that they were determined that the Monarchy wouldn't change them and the Monarchy didn't like it.

[littleyellowbirdie 2,604]

2 hours ago, wcorkcanary said:

My thoughts as a former soldier are thus....we did as instructed, simple as  . I am surprised that someone as insightful and clearly intelligent  as you doesnt know  that despite being soldiers , each will react differently  to events . Still humans you know.  Some glory in it , some dont. The people most interested weren't there. 

Absolutely, I agree with that. It's also true that his was a totally believable way of coping that mirrors thoughts I've heard from other soldiers who have killed in action. Given that it's the army, directed by our politicians, that puts soldiers in the position where they are required to kill, I don't think the army has any right to cast judgement on how any of the soldiers, sailors, or aviators under their command deal with doing what they're told to do, however unseemly some might find it.

Edited January 10, 2023 by littleyellowbirdie

[wcorkcanary 4,346]

1 minute ago, littleyellowbirdie said:

Absolutely, I agree with that. It's also true that his was a totally believable way of coping that mirrors thoughts I've heard from other soldiers who have killed in action. Given that it's the army, directed by our politicians, that puts soldiers in the position where they are required to kill, I don't think the army has any right to cast judgement on how any of the soldiers, sailors, or aviators under their command deal with doing what they're told to do, however unseemly some might find it.

Good for you.  Harry is a pr@t. Yes ,hes human but still a pr@t. 

As the old military expression goes.... pull up a sandbag, swing the lantern, lean on your rifle, the hero has a story to tell.... 

Best thing for everybody is if he is ignored but while theres money to be made , he wont be. 

[littleyellowbirdie 2,604]

9 minutes ago, wcorkcanary said:

Good for you.  Harry is a pr@t. Yes ,hes human but still a pr@t. 

As the old military expression goes.... pull up a sandbag, swing the lantern, lean on your rifle, the hero has a story to tell.... 

Best thing for everybody is if he is ignored but while theres money to be made , he wont be. 

Yeah he's human,  and he's also a guy who lost his mum at a young age to a reaction of national mass hysteria and the spotlight being put on him and his brother. William dealt with it much better, but kids have gone off the rails for less than that from all walks of life.

Their exit to the States has always been about Meghan. He has followed this path because he clearly loves her very much, but she has ruined his life with the demands she has made of him to fuel her own ambitions, even if he hasn't woken up to that yet.

I agree it's the best thing that the pair of him if they are ignored though.

[FenwayFrank 2,469]

[wcorkcanary 4,346]

1 hour ago, littleyellowbirdie said:

Yeah he's human,  and he's also a guy who lost his mum at a young age to a reaction of national mass hysteria and the spotlight being put on him and his brother. William dealt with it much better, but kids have gone off the rails for less than that from all walks of life.

Their exit to the States has always been about Meghan. He has followed this path because he clearly loves her very much, but she has ruined his life with the demands she has made of him to fuel her own ambitions, even if he hasn't woken up to that yet.

I agree it's the best thing that the pair of him if they are ignored though.

How do you know whos coped better? Your posts are just massive assumptions.  More words dont necessarily  mean more sense.