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Sheva

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  1. Sheva

    Ukraine Protests

    ''The Malaysian aircraft was shot down by Russian soldiers'', most say by mistake but I have yet to hear any stories within Ukraine that it was shot down by Ukrainian aircraft Or even Ukrainian people.....................

    We have been told by family and friends within the war zone that thousands of Russian soldiers have been killed Inside of Ukraine, now news agencies are beginning to report this.

    The mothers of dead Russian soldiers first brought this news into the open in Russia. Their boys Did not know they were going into Ukraine to fight in many instances and their deaths have been covered up as ''heart'' attacks whilst on training exercises etc.

    The figure alone for Russian soldiers who invaded Ukraine and died in fighting, is above 3,500 with many more seriously injured.

    Russian government still says No Russian soldiers are fighting in Ukraine, a few went there on holiday!

    Afew hundred Ukrainians in the Donbass, are fighting for money and trying to restore a state where the ruling mafia''s scammed the region on a massive scale, non more so the former President and his son + mates. Putin and his Government is working very hard to stir up trouble and keep this war going, without Russian interference , this conflict would have died out a long while ago. people in the Donbass just want their lives back, their homes back and their kids safe, they have no fight with Western Ukraine or where ever, they never took to the streets as in Kiev, they always had to be paid or threatened with losing their jobs,to do so.

    Be careful of so called ''Facts'' from weirdo websites, better stick to Reuters ,BBC and Sky unless you know people on the ground there and can trust them.

    ............................................................................

  2. Sheva

    Ukraine Protests

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/b04j2pjj/panorama-putins-gamble

    Even the BBC are starting to understand what''s going on in Ukraine, at least they have a man on the ground who talkes to people both sides and witnesses events unlike the majority of ''experts'' who just trawl the websites to suite their agenda or ''leanings''

    I''m lucky enough to be spending most of my time in Norfolk/Suffolk, however some of my family and friends are right in the middle of the fighting, some displaced some unable to move, all Russian speaking, so believe me I know exactly how it is and why.

    Watch the BBC Panorama programme, the reporter makes some very good points, the will was never there for the Russian speaking people to go back to living under Russian rule, this is a fact and the Russians Had to invade, which they did many months ago , to stir it up.

    Russian and Ukrainian speakers are no different they Had no problem, we live side by side, drink together and so it goes on..............

    Even now people will get over this, its in their DNA to shrug off hardship and war, this has always amazed me how Ukrainian/Russians can fight, be brutal towards each other, then forgive.

    There''s still a good to even chance this dangerous conflict can be resolved. Putin has gambled, it seemed the perfect time, what with the distraction of Syria/Iraq, UK split, and also having a lot of the Western countries relying on Russian money and Gas. Also the West looking weak in leaders.

    I feel Putin has been building for this moment since 1992, if it goes wrong for him, then he knows he is finished in the eyes of the Russian people, I fear he will make this his last stand.
  3. Sheva

    Ukraine Protests

    All these so called intercepted phone conversations! Would be interesting to hear some of Mr Putins, when he gives orders to go do some ''work'', but then he is very careful how and where he talks to people. Even Bonny Prince Charlie the future King of England wanted to take a machine gun and go kill some Irish , did he not?

    I’m not going to totally stand up for Yulia I have said for over 10 years, I’m not convinced about her even when she was the darling of the majority of Ukraine. What I do know is that she has no fear, she’s tough + some more and also highly intelligent.

    I’m not going to take as true something from a German paper. They have their own agenda and it’s a nice art to cobble together words and phrases from a much longer conversation, which portrays that person as a devil of kind.

    At the end of the day Ukraine needs a President who can unite the whole country, [ which is split, not so much because we have’ Russian Ukrainians’ and Ukrainians. Its more like a ‘time delay’. The east is lagging in its cultural development. Given another 10/15 years they will have very similar desires to be given the same opportunities and lifestyle which is enjoyed in Europe.] Yulia although having many good qualities , is not that person, she missed her opportunity from the Orange Revolution. The man who is favourite to win the forth coming Presidential elections, would be Petr Poroshenko, known as the ‘chocolate king’ .An oligarch, but seen as never being in the pocket of Russia or the gangsters of the Party of Regions. He could be the link man Europe and the East wants. Yulia and Klitchko are on record as saying they would support him , if they don’t get carried forward to the second round of voting.

    The most important is not letting another Party of Regions gangster back in .

  4. Sheva

    Ukraine Protests

    Nevermind. I will go where I like and not where you want me to.

    I have the ability and means to do that. You need to except that not everyone is going to follow your anti Yankie leftie views. Maybe you haven’t had or been able to make the same opportunities as myself to travel and work around the world, but if you had then maybe it might of given you a far better perspective of the world, not one you just seem to gleam from your computer searches. You’ve talked about our situation in Ukraine from a point of view of knowledge, a knowledge of no experience. If I’ve called you wrong then please forgive me, although I don’t think so.

  5. Sheva

    Ukraine Protests

    Wasn’t really intending to post any more on here but it might be wise to throw in a few thoughts from the ‘horses mouth’ and correct some of the stuff gleamed from the Internet searches.

    Yulia, who is she:

    OK as a former neighbour, not on speaking terms as such, I can tell you that she doesn’t consider herself Jewish , is that what was implied?. She is as Ukrainian as they come, although her gran was of Jewish decent. What is 100% true, is that she is from Dnipropetrovsk and that has the worlds biggest Jewish Centre , so to be a Jew there is if anything a bonus! BTW she does have a very big support, she is the strongest man in politics’, but is having serious medical attention in Germany ATM. Yulia is a friend of the west, she paid a heavy price in the Orange Revolution by trying to please the West and keeping the gas flowing to your homes. She is standing for President and Putin would not dare cross her.

    Does she have a nuclear weapon up her sleeve? Well lets put it this way. Dnipropetrovsk built the rockets and weapons that armed the former USSR, its still there and still builds rockets. Ukraine as you all know or should do, agreed to give them up in the 90,s, although 1 or 2 went missing!!...............I’m told this, but can’t confirm, so don’t lose any sleep. It does however have a lot of dirty stuff hidden and stored that I do know and it is not safe.

    What else that I can say, without being arrested!. …. Head of armed services resigned cos the soldiers didn’t shot back in Crimea, although they were humiliated in their own country and needed to respond. However Russia knows it will pay a price but for now it fills its boots . Putin will take what he can get and a bit more, its his mission. If only for a strong Western leader this would not happen and we could all sleep better. Thatcher was so admired in Russia and Ukraine, Reagan was great to. As I’ve said before, never show weakness to a Russian, Never. I believe the US knows this well, but the EU seems to be a bit soft. Not seems , are!. Also let me say this. When Putin and Russia says, we won’t invade into Eastern Ukraine, its best always to expect the opposite. Hitler said the same and what did he do, that’s right, dropped bombs on Kiev and Ukraine lost 12 million lives, thereon.

    I guess you have heard of all the cash and gold being found in the former Governments safes, millions in cash and gold. I will without doubt be putting in a claim to the new energy minister for the return of several thousands of $ stolen from me.

    Someone said, ‘Oh what can we do’. Well there’s a big Ukrainian movement in the UK and worldwide, commonly known as ‘LondonMaiden, ParisMaiden etc. These people have left Ukraine, something like 7 millions in as many years and they through Facebook, lobby governments and highlight their experiences of life in Ukraine and what can help change things. Its an very powerful protest that points the finger in the right places. Its 100% peaceful as was the protests in Ukraine for 10 years before they were attacked,… and dignified.

    Mostly Russians/Ukrainians east and east get on. Don’t buy into all this Western Ukrainian Fascists, clap trap, haven’t you ever heard of Putins ‘Hitler Youth’, if you want a fascist look over there, but in reality there’s not much difference to eastern Europe and 70’s England. No ones going to change my opinion because I have lived in all regions, including England and within my family we have some very bright scholars who can dissect and explain the Ukrainian/Russian history in the most minute details. There’s just to much conspiracy flying around today………. The tensions have been artificially created to serve Mr Putin’s plan, its no secret, however if he carries on invading, there will be a massive backlash which will effect all of Europe.

    Lets pray for peace but get ready for some pain.

  6. Sheva

    Ukraine Protests

    Ukrainians can tough it out as you say, they have done that for many many years and have suffered millions of deaths, lets round it up to 20 million last century and not argue about a million either side . The population is around 45 mill so that’s not a bad % hit wouldn’t you say?.

    Don’t condescend my compatriots..

    It seems I’m only talking to the 1, so not really worth my while, as you are obviously an anti American , left leaning person , who has never been able to personally get anywhere near the truth but relies on internet searches, which in all honestly will always give you the answer you want.

    As for hoping to migrate to the west if Russia invades Eastern Ukraine!, don’t worry about that, I quite enjoy the warm English winters and could settle there at any time if I wished, maybe living in ‘Ham St, Windham or such place!

    I don’t want to sound rude, but you really annoy and insult me and my family with your ignorance of our situation, maybe you are known for this and it’s the reason that you have to answer your own posts on other threads?

    Still if you have at least learnt to call our country by its correct name then my time hasn’t been lost, but even that doesn’t look possible. ‘Ukraine’, drop the ‘ THE’………………..god help us!

  7. Sheva

    Ukraine Protests

    Your post is confusing and disjointed, if I might say so.

    I appreciate that you can only read and listen to others who have most certainly never even set foot in Ukraine, never mind lived and work there and understand its history and culture, however I try to give you some insight how things really are. I live in the part of Ukraine which is called Eastern, my family is what you might call ‘Russian’, they are also what might be called, middle class intellectuals, but also old style USSR citizens. Also I should add, we are part Jewish, so please don’t try and give any advice or lectures about Fascists!.. We were occupied by the Germans and my older generation had to hide, that’s why I reject any suggestions that our Government , which was voted for by the majority of Rada, [all parties, including the ‘tory party of regions’] that it is run or controlled by fascists……….Wrong.

    Logic will tell you this;

    We have been peacefully demonstrating against what was a mafia lead Government, totally corrupt, but ultimately allowed to flourish by Russia because it suited their greater plan. No one is even disputing that the Ex President was a total tosp*t and had to be removed, not to wait for the next Presidential Elections, the situation was beyond serious. He fled with his gang and money and now awaits jail, for the 3rd time in his life.

    OK’ …… For months and years, anti Government protesters demonstrated on ‘Maidan’, central Kiev, its allowed, they never moved away for years. We have all been there, hundreds of thousands at a time. 50,000 is just a small meeting!. So the protest movement totals millons and a true cross section of Ukrainians WHO just want some BASIC JUSTICE, FREEDOM, DIGNITY, WESTERN VALUES, all what you take for granted.

    The game changer was when the peaceful protesters were attacked by the riot police and beaten and tortured. You don’t know half of what they did. This was the turning point and the stronger men and women fought back hard, they had witnessed enough. They laid down their lives to make the change.

    We have heard so much made of the fact that some of these fighters were ‘right wing’, yes they were, they were also gay boys, Jewish, left wing, you name it they were there!!!

    Check the dead and you will see what a cross section of hero’s died.

    I won’t talk about Crimea, just to say that the events there now make this a Global crisis.

    I don’t want war, no one I know has fired a gun, but the mood is of impending conflict and unless the West is prepared to stand up to Putin, then it will spread through and past Ukraine.

    You seem very sure that the US and its allies won’t use the military option, but will they stand back and see thousands killed by Russian troops when they gave legal assurances that they would never allow Ukraine to be invaded?........

    Russians like strong people, they have no respect for weakness and will fully take advantage, if nothing else, understand this point!

  8. Sheva

    Ukraine Protests

    The Crimean vote has passed today, boycotted by the Ukrainian and tatars population of Crimea. Of course it was a farce and rigged by the invading Russian forces. You can vote for going with Russia now or you can vote to go with them later!! Not only that it was done without any campaigning or notice. It is not recognised by the world.

    The truth is, we are not that worried by losing Krim, it holds back Ukraine in many ways in short a liability. I feel for the Tatars, given 15 minutes by Stalin to leave and now history is repeating itself! Where there was peace is very likely to become a dangerous area. They have been mistreated by the Russians.

    The problem for Crimea now is that it can’t work, it relies on Ukraine for water and all services, so therefore Russia needs to invade at least Eastern Ukraine and there starts the Hell on Earth. Ukraine, UK USA and the Western world will not allow this to happen , that its set in stone . Ukraine had the 3rd biggest arsenal of nuclear weapons in the early nineties, they also made them, but agreed to give them up so long as the UK , USA & Russia guaranteed their borders from invasion physically or economically. Ukraine now asks for that to be proven. It will start as a civil war and soon become and major international war. Putin knows this , he is just trying to see at what point the west says No More and see what he can hang onto. Very dangerous game.

    Of course we take out money from the banks, it is ‘micky mouse ‘ money and all Russian/Ukrainians know it will at some point will be stolen by the government , we are still owed from the USSR period.

    Its not a worry for Ukraine any more, we know and except what’s coming. Many of my family and friends will have to fight in the army having done their national service and still being under 60 others will be part of the civil defence.

    The problem now passes to the whole of Europe, at some point soon, military will have to be offered, Putin will brush off the sanctions, unless they are super strong .

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    We all know about Iraq and WMD, Bush boy did a good job on Bliar, massaging his ego to go into war looking for weapons that could kill the Brits in 30 minutes!............ It was Oil, it was Exon and Chevron wanting to get hold of them lovely big oil fields in Kurdistan. Did Blair ever apologise for the thousands of deaths he helped cause, no didn’t think so, to busy fllo8ncing around the world filling his boots.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=COCEauuQrb0

  9. Sheva

    Ukraine Protests

    Our Tatars,

    our friends but see how the Russians treated them and now they repeat this history.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cqzwWqSAR1U

  10. Sheva

    Ukraine Protests

    In the last 3 days, its highly noticeable that people in our town in Eastern Ukraine have a much changed mood. They fully expect to be entering a war sooner or later and its going to be big. Its very hard to know that you are going to be fighting fellow ‘Russians’, the Ukrainians are known as ‘White Russians’.

    What’s also hard to except for Ukrainians here is this. ‘We built the rockets in this town to go to space , we built the nuclear missiles and enough to attack anyone if needed and we gave them up, with the written promise in International Law that our borders would be forever protected and we have been let down. Europe has shown no strength against the aggressor and we have been humiliated in Crimea by Russian troops who are now about to attack further into Ukraine.

    Russia/Putin has planned this for years and he hasn’t even made that a secret. Russians only understand and respect strength. They feared and respected the UK and the USA when they were lead by Thatcher and Regan, they would never never have tried what they are trying now when they were alive, I tell you this 100%, Putin would never have pushed against Great Britain under Margaret Thatcher. Now Putin sees that the West is weak and over dependent on Russian money. He sees this as the best possible time to regain parts of the former USSR.

    People in Ukraine keep asking me when the UK will support them against the invasion. I can only say, ‘when its to late’. A firm stance now or a week ago would have put Putin firmly at the ‘negotiating table’, now the West does little or nothing , hoping that the problem will go away. It wont. Ukrainians have stood still, empting their guns , while the Russian Special Forces have run riot, O yes Russia admits they are Russian soldiers now! 1 of the famous 10 lies admitted.

    What about the [Muslim] Tatars ? Do you think that they are going to let history repeat itself, given 15 minutes to leave their houses and carted off in trucks to the frozen wastelands of Russia. Already their houses are getting the mark. Turkey which is very close has promised to support their fight, all Muslims will. Up until Putin kicked this off, everyone was cool, now we have splits inside families, provocateurs cross from Russia to start fights. Serbs are in Crimea as are Russia Cossacks. Even Putins infamous gang of Wolves ]Hells Angels] have been into Ukraine , with his blessing. Does it sound like a man wanting peace?....... The famous Ukrainian Cossacks haven’t taken up arms yet!

    I touched on one point before and its significant. Our former President, the 2 times jailed crock, soon to be 3, Yanukovich signed many bad deals, which of course allowed him and the ‘Family’ to cream off billions of $. What hasn’t been mentioned yet are the deals he did with China. He gave them the rights of massive amounts of the agricultural land of Ukraine. In fact 1/6 of the total farming land on very long leases, 50 years or something like. This they take as their own to grow for their own people, also I I understand he did deals in Crimea for commercial port, in which he was half partner. I understand that China supports Ukraine, the above might help explain that.

    Peace.

  11. Sheva

    Ukraine Protests

    OK this is my final post, its already Monday here.

    It seems in the last hour that Russia wants to ‘back off’.

    Let me tell you that there is a very important power on the side lines and its not the US.

    They have interests in Crimea, but more importantly they now have rights to farm in Ukraine for many many years. This area is the size of Belgium, the very best farming land in the world and they need it to grow crops and raise animals for meat on a vast scale, Their population is over 1 Billion and getting very hungry.

    China supports Ukraine and wants their interests in Ukraine protected.

  12. Sheva

    Ukraine Protests

    Vasili Arkhipov,.

    try that!

  13. Sheva

    Ukraine Protests

    Shrimper; ''''The USA did not put up with Russia having missiles on their doorstep in Cuba and had them removed under the threat of WW3. The Russians are just looking at it the same way as I see it''''.

    In fact, it came down to an Ukrainian Naval officer to make the final call and he said ‘Net’, otherwise you and I wouldn’t be talking today.

  14. Sheva

    Ukraine Protests

    Nevermind the danger, hey!

    I have warned you not to cut and paste my posts into other forums, without my permission also don’t misquote me as you have done today.

    Your knowledge of Ukraine and its Ukraine not ‘The Ukraine’, is very very limited and second/third hand information.

    You can’t get over yourself; your judgement is just to clouded. We are of millions, who have stood for many years on Maidan protesting, we are no right wing rabble and fully understand what’s happening to the great nation of Ukraine.

    We shall defend it to the last, we know who the enemy is. There are many things which haven’t come out yet and I would never disclose them here. You are going to be shocked if this goes much further.

    герої не вмирають, до побачення

  15. Sheva

    Ukraine Protests

    Millions of Ukrainians live in Russia, They are protesting against the actions of Putin and his Government and being arrested now. Should Ukraine invade Russia to save its citizens?

    Another point of consideration. It suits Putin and Russia to destroyed Crimea as an tourist destination for millions of Russians. Where might they go then, you guessed it, Sochi !!

    Whos pet project was that and how much was siphoned off from its budget. ?

    Putin has taken Billions from the Russian people, 70-100 .

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