Corona Virus main thread

[Yellow Fever 3,844]

18 hours ago, ricardo said:

National

2439 - 3

meanwhile back on planet earth numbers continue to bump along the bottom with declining deaths and hospitalisations.

Local

 

The problem as ever with all of this is that its all 'rear view mirror'. The virus is a super tanker;  difficult to steer and awkward to stop once its got going - and got going it appears to be doing in several areas (I noted even Thorpe St. Andrew school yesterday had a cluster of several cases - I guess that's now with the parents and siblings too).

Positive tests lag perhaps a week to 10 days from infection (even if tested).

Hospitalizations perhaps another week or two later.

Deaths perhaps another fortnight.

Herman's link above give some scary numbers in Bolton with even deaths starting to spike. 

https://www.manchestereveningnews.co.uk/news/government-advises-against-travel-out-20667478

Edited May 25, 2021 by Yellow Fever

[sonyc 5,541]

1 hour ago, Yellow Fever said:

The problem as ever with all of this is that its all 'rear view mirror'. The virus is a super tanker;  difficult to steer and awkward to stop once its got going - and got going it appears to be doing in several areas (I noted even Thorpe St. Andrew school yesterday had a cluster of several cases - I guess that's now with the parents and siblings too).

Positive tests lag perhaps a week to 10 days from infection (even if tested).

Hospitalizations perhaps another week or two later.

Deaths perhaps another fortnight.

Herman's link above give some scary numbers in Bolton with even deaths starting to spike. 

https://www.manchestereveningnews.co.uk/news/government-advises-against-travel-out-20667478

Yes, that's why I have posted numbers in my district...I'm worried about local restrictions again. Local neighbourhoods have shown 700% increases here (obviously from very low levels). I keep expecting to hear we are an area of interest but I hope not.

Data nationally is always lagging so I remain a sceptic. I sense we are at a pivot point now. It could suddenly soar if those 8 areas become 20 for example.

Interesting to see what the make up of hospitalisations is about....the percentage not vaccinated and ages. 

[Essjayess 307]

Data and stats are starting to come thru from the Bolton and GM area now and it seems that vaccination really has and is having an impact on curbing the worst excesses of the India variant. Older age people, residents in care homes etc are showing only very small rises in new cases, hospital admissions show small rises but nothing on the scale of earlier in the year, majority who have been infected not having such severe symptoms as previous waves. All this is good news and while i appreciate there is always a certain lag period concerning Covid, fact is that the 7 or 8 areas that shown these marked increases of Covid due to the India variant are the same areas as a week or more ago.

Things can and do change rapidly as we know, but so far things in general still look pretty good.

[Canary Wundaboy 1,360]

I know that Boris is getting plenty of stick for pinning the June 21st date, but the feeling I get is that so many people have now been vaccinated and coverage of the older and more vulnerable is so high that any attempt to walk back the date or failure to commit to one would simply have led to the general population ignoring the rules anyway.

[keelansgrandad 6,679]

53 minutes ago, Canary Wundaboy said:

I know that Boris is getting plenty of stick for pinning the June 21st date, but the feeling I get is that so many people have now been vaccinated and coverage of the older and more vulnerable is so high that any attempt to walk back the date or failure to commit to one would simply have led to the general population ignoring the rules anyway.

Maybe but that shouldn't be a factor. The science is all that matters. What people may or may not do is irrelevant.

[ricardo 7,416]

National

2493 - 15

Local

All steady as she goes.

[Tetteys Jig 830]

49 minutes ago, keelansgrandad said:

Maybe but that shouldn't be a factor. The science is all that matters. What people may or may not do is irrelevant.

hmm if the science was "all that matters" then the whole world would be in complete lockdown until there was zero cases... back in the real world we know it's far more complicated than that.

[It's Character Forming 1,167]

What people do (or don’t do) will determine how this goes. 

[keelansgrandad 6,679]

29 minutes ago, Tetteys Jig said:

hmm if the science was "all that matters" then the whole world would be in complete lockdown until there was zero cases... back in the real world we know it's far more complicated than that.

But the science cannot be defined by whether people will obey the governments rules and protocols.

[Well b back 3,285]

3 hours ago, Essjayess said:

Data and stats are starting to come thru from the Bolton and GM area now and it seems that vaccination really has and is having an impact on curbing the worst excesses of the India variant. Older age people, residents in care homes etc are showing only very small rises in new cases, hospital admissions show small rises but nothing on the scale of earlier in the year, majority who have been infected not having such severe symptoms as previous waves. All this is good news and while i appreciate there is always a certain lag period concerning Covid, fact is that the 7 or 8 areas that shown these marked increases of Covid due to the India variant are the same areas as a week or more ago.

Things can and do change rapidly as we know, but so far things in general still look pretty good.

Hopefully this is a one off couple of days for the Royal Bolton Hospital

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-manchester-57242368

[Tetteys Jig 830]

https://mobile.twitter.com/SkyNews/status/1397456786639233026

Hancock didn't seem too keen to discuss today's "revelations" 😆

Edited May 26, 2021 by Tetteys Jig

[Well b back 3,285]

Just now, Tetteys Jig said:

https://mobile.twitter.com/SkyNews/status/1397456786639233026

Hancock didn't seem too keen to discuss today's "revalations" 😆

Hi TJ

Listening live, he has evidence for everything he is alledging Hancock did and said. 

[Indy 3,323]

Just now, Well b back said:

Hi TJ

Listening live, he has evidence for everything he is alledging Hancock did and said. 

Wasn’t Cummins a key member of the advisory committee on Brexit and Covid, before he broke all the rules? I wouldn’t trust a word that twisted individual says.

[TheGunnShow 6,029]

Meanwhile, in Bolton (where I live), we've been told to stay out of A&E again unless it's something dreadfully serious. The good thing is that we are getting vaccinated at a fair old pace and surge testing is taking place in the worst-affected areas. At the same time, the left hand of local MPs doesn't seem to know what the right hand of national government is doing, hence BOTH Chris Green and Yasmin Qureshi launching searing attacks at the government.

[Well b back 3,285]

1 minute ago, Indy said:

Wasn’t Cummins a key member of the advisory committee on Brexit and Covid, before he broke all the rules? I wouldn’t trust a word that twisted individual says.

I would have agreed but he has what’s app groups, emails, minutes of meetings. 

[Indy 3,323]

Just now, Well b back said:

I would have agreed but he has what’s app groups, emails, minutes of meetings. 

Yes but I bet he was part of the team in agreement! If he was against it then that’s different but all he’s doing is incriminating himself too as he was a key member as a senior adviser. Horrid little man, I’m no lover of our government WBB as you know so they’re all culpable for any events needing investigation. I thought there was going to be an independent investigation into the government soon anyhow? I could be wrong.

[Tetteys Jig 830]

There doesn't actually seem very much that is really anything we didn't already know. It was so clear that we were ****ed by early March and they shat the bed... Probably could have avoided most of the **** we've had to deal with last year.

Sadly these lot are Teflon and the public won't really care. Just hope we can focus on how we end this. Clearly 2020 set such a low bar but 2021 (after the weird day back at school the kids had on 4th Jan) has been much better. Some big challenges ahead for all countries, including the likes of NZ and Taiwan.

Edited May 26, 2021 by Tetteys Jig

[Creative Midfielder 2,003]

20 minutes ago, Indy said:

Wasn’t Cummins a key member of the advisory committee on Brexit and Covid, before he broke all the rules? I wouldn’t trust a word that twisted individual says.

Completely agree about Cummings being twisted but the fact of the matter is that much of what he is saying corresponds with what many other people (without his level of inside knowledge) were also saying at the time and in some cases what we already know happened.

It may also very well be that he is not being entirely truthful about his own part in it in order to look better than he deserves amongst the almighty shambles of last year but I think the key point is that he was an adviser, albeit a very powerful one (another huge blunder by Johnson), but he was nevertheless he was an adviser not the ultimate decision maker.

The actual decision makers were primarily Johnson and to a lesser extent the Cabinet (even Tory MPs had no real say in any of this) and it is their responsibilty alone for the shambles and the corruption that characterised the pandemic response in the UK and led to tens of thousands of unnecessary deaths.

I loathe Cummings as much as the next man, and probably more than most, but he isn't the guilty party here, apart from testing his eyesight and in even in that, as in pretty much everything else, Johnson took completely the wrong decision and lied on his behalf instead of sacking him.

 

[Well b back 3,285]

11 minutes ago, Creative Midfielder said:

Completely agree about Cummings being twisted but the fact of the matter is that much of what he is saying corresponds with what many other people (without his level of inside knowledge) were also saying at the time and in some cases what we already know happened.

It may also very well be that he is not being entirely truthful about his own part in it in order to look better than he deserves amongst the almighty shambles of last year but I think the key point is that he was an adviser, albeit a very powerful one (another huge blunder by Johnson), but he was nevertheless he was an adviser not the ultimate decision maker.

The actual decision makers were primarily Johnson and to a lesser extent the Cabinet (even Tory MPs had no real say in any of this) and it is their responsibilty alone for the shambles and the corruption that characterised the pandemic response in the UK and led to tens of thousands of unnecessary deaths.

I loathe Cummings as much as the next man, and probably more than most, but he isn't the guilty party here, apart from testing his eyesight and in even in that, as in pretty much everything else, Johnson took completely the wrong decision and lied on his behalf instead of sacking him.

 

Hancock was 'interfering' in testing to hit 100,000 tests a day target

The government "kind of collapsed when the prime minister got ill himself," Cummings tells MPs. 

He says pledging to do 100,000 tests a day by the end of April "was an incredibly stupid thing to do" because he says the government had started ramping down testing capacity again.

He says "Hancock was interfering" with things in government to make sure he hit the target "when the PM was on his death bed".

Cummings says he and Sir Patrick Vallance had to start calling around government officials and saying "do not do what Hancock says," he says Hancock was instructing officials to hold tests back so he could hit his 100,000 target by the end of April.

[Indy 3,323]

13 minutes ago, Well b back said:

Hancock was 'interfering' in testing to hit 100,000 tests a day target

The government "kind of collapsed when the prime minister got ill himself," Cummings tells MPs. 

He says pledging to do 100,000 tests a day by the end of April "was an incredibly stupid thing to do" because he says the government had started ramping down testing capacity again.

He says "Hancock was interfering" with things in government to make sure he hit the target "when the PM was on his death bed".

Cummings says he and Sir Patrick Vallance had to start calling around government officials and saying "do not do what Hancock says," he says Hancock was instructing officials to hold tests back so he could hit his 100,000 target by the end of April.

But Brexit should teach us that this entire government and its advisers are not to be trusted! Now Covid backs this up, so surely they should all stand down and start a process for new government!

[Well b back 3,285]

Was going to go on live tv and inject himself with COVID so we all realised that it was harmless, whilst on the day there was an urgent meeting ( 12/3 ) about COVID strategy being wrong, Trump had asked us to bomb Iraq that night, the argument about the way Carrie’s dog was being portrayed as the most important thing for the press briefing shew where his priorities laid.

[ricardo 7,416]

Carrie Antoinette 

Let them eat dog food🐩

[How I Wrote Elastic Man 1,198]

Grant Shapps told the bbc This morning that there was " no textbook — no manual — to deal with a pandemic."

but the government does have A plan for dealing with a pandemic flu. Surely this would have been checked

there was also a paper published as an annexe to the PHE national incident and emergency response plan that deals with flu that we have no immunity to 

politicians lie through their teeth 😔

[Van wink 2,994]

Politicians lie through their teeth, there sadly is a very good summary of UK politics, and from my experience politics in general. Having been inside government in a senior position, at a local level rather than national, any number of individuals closely involved at the top level could make an expose like this, the only people that will be shocked are those that don't know much about how government works. That's in no way trying to defend it, but it's the reality. The fact that he continues to blatently lie about his eyesight trip has lessened the impact even further.

[It's Character Forming 1,167]

So I had my 2nd AZ jab yesterday, 10 days ahead of the original schedule, same smooth process as the first time, took 20 minutes from walking through the door. Same minor side effects as the first time i.e. feeling a bit crap for just over 24 hours, now feeling fine again.

 

Only difference was the first was at Pride Park (music venue next to the stadium), the 2nd was at a Boots chemist in Nottingham.  On balance the large space available at Pride Park meant it was easier for them to make it socially distanced, the space around in the Boots was less simply due to it being in a shop that was open.  In the even it was fine but given the choice I'd go for a stadium -type venue.

[ricardo 7,416]

More good news

https://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/newslondon/more-than-three-quarters-of-adults-have-covid-antibodies/ar-AAKoQdC?ocid=uxbndlbing

[Van wink 2,994]

10 minutes ago, It's Character Forming said:

So I had my 2nd AZ jab yesterday, 10 days ahead of the original schedule, same smooth process as the first time, took 20 minutes from walking through the door. Same minor side effects as the first time i.e. feeling a bit crap for just over 24 hours, now feeling fine again.

 

Only difference was the first was at Pride Park (music venue next to the stadium), the 2nd was at a Boots chemist in Nottingham.  On balance the large space available at Pride Park meant it was easier for them to make it socially distanced, the space around in the Boots was less simply due to it being in a shop that was open.  In the even it was fine but given the choice I'd go for a stadium -type venue.

Good stuff, in light of the new variant the second jab is more important than it was, I had no reaction to the second one, just a few flu like symptoms after the first.

[sonyc 5,541]

2 hours ago, Creative Midfielder said:

Completely agree about Cummings being twisted but the fact of the matter is that much of what he is saying corresponds with what many other people (without his level of inside knowledge) were also saying at the time and in some cases what we already know happened.

And moreover, the debate with all views, was well aired on this very thread. It's not 'news' as such because we knew we had been lied to, that actions and even behaviours by ministers were far below what most on here would expect. Communication in those first 3 months was chaotic. PPE, care homes policy, lockdown strategies (circuit breakers), ludicrous targets on testing and manipulation of figures, not to mention some appalling performances by Hancock in those press conferences.

Agree with @Tetteys Jig that 2021 has been better (and not just vaccinations). 

The one person coming out of this with some integrity is Sunak. Thank goodness there is someone (whatever our politics!).

We have been so, so unfortunate in having about the worst politicians in power running the country in our lifetimes at the time of such a crisis.

[Van wink 2,994]

23 minutes ago, sonyc said:

And moreover, the debate with all views, was well aired on this very thread. It's not 'news' as such because we knew we had been lied to, that actions and even behaviours by ministers were far below what most on here would expect. Communication in those first 3 months was chaotic. PPE, care homes policy, lockdown strategies (circuit breakers), ludicrous targets on testing and manipulation of figures, not to mention some appalling performances by Hancock in those press conferences.

Agree with @Tetteys Jig that 2021 has been better (and not just vaccinations). 

The one person coming out of this with some integrity is Sunak. Thank goodness there is someone (whatever our politics!).

We have been so, so unfortunate in having about the worst politicians in power running the country in our lifetimes at the time of such a crisis.

I tend to agree but suspect that an insider spilling the beans would have been explosive for any government, those from the past as well as the modern era. Politics is a dirty business, maybe I'm just an old cynic.

[Indy 3,323]

I have an issue with the way Cummins was happy to take his huge salary, massive pay off and did as much damage as the rest of the government! He should be as accountable as the rest of the government. Sure had he stood up at the time and blew the whistle then fine but to actually sit through this last year, break the rules and get that huge pay off, there should be condemnation aimed at him too!