The Positive Brexit Thread

[keelansgrandad 6,679]

12 hours ago, Hook's-Walk-Canary said:

Brexit, 'though not fully implemented, hasn't been a disaster.

Still the UK is growing faster than Germany and investment in UK economy hitting record levels since Referendum.. 

So now its time to isolate Germany rather than the Eurozone because it suits your point. The US is having a disaster at the moment so I am surprised you didn't add them as well. Even though they aren't in Europe it would help your argument.

What will you cling to when the straws end up damp.

 

[A Load of Squit 5,232]

Even more sh!t show.

 

[SwindonCanary 455]

It's great to see this tread still going The Positive Brexit Thread

[Yellow Fever 3,848]

https://www.statista.com/statistics/987347/brexit-opinion-poll/

In hindsight, do you think Britain was right or wrong to vote to leave the European Union?(January 2020 to April 2023)

Edited May 18, 2023 by Yellow Fever
A dying breed.

[littleyellowbirdie 2,613]

1 hour ago, Yellow Fever said:

https://www.statista.com/statistics/987347/brexit-opinion-poll/

In hindsight, do you think Britain was right or wrong to vote to leave the European Union?(January 2020 to April 2023)

Hindsight is a wonderful thing.

https://www.varsity.co.uk/features/19033

Edited May 18, 2023 by littleyellowbirdie
Totally irrelevant article as far as Brexit is concerned, but the philosophy behind it entertained me.

[keelansgrandad 6,679]

1 hour ago, littleyellowbirdie said:

Hindsight is a wonderful thing.

https://www.varsity.co.uk/features/19033

Surely you of all people agree, its important to be proved right.

[Hook's-Walk-Canary 213]

On 29/04/2023 at 10:02, Barbe bleu said:

 a massively phyrric victory given she will have to pay costs and damages!

60% of Arron Banks’ legal fees to the tune of £1,242,634...

Was it worth Banks paying the 40%? Of course, because it will make the loony left think twice before promoting fantasies and lies as the truth.

I should take some of you Remainiacs on here to court 😉 I'd make a bleedin' fortune 😀

Edited May 18, 2023 by Hook's-Walk-Canary

[Barbe bleu 837]

11 minutes ago, Hook's-Walk-Canary said:

60% of Arron Banks’ legal fees to the tune of £1,242,634...

Was it worth Banks paying the 40%? Of course, because it will make the loony left think twice before promoting fantasys and lies as the truth.

I should take some of you Remainiacs on here to court 😉 I'd make a bleedin' fortune 😀

Wow, that's quite the penalty!

It's hard not to feel sorry for her. She is clearly a zealot who had let her own prejudices and suspicions get the better of her but strip away all her bluster and nonsense and, to me at least, there appears to be  very well meaning woman whose heart is clearly in the right place even if it doesn't always speak to her brain. 

Hopefully some good samaritan will help her out before the stress destroys her.

[Herman 9,854]

If you side with Jools and Arron Banks then you're probably a bit of a wrong 'un.

Anyway here's a report about it.

https://rsf.org/en/uk-allocation-costs-banks-v-cadwalladr-sets-chilling-precedent-public-interest-journalism

[Barbe bleu 837]

58 minutes ago, Herman said:

If you side with Jools and Arron Banks then you're probably a bit of a wrong 'un.

Anyway here's a report about it.

https://rsf.org/en/uk-allocation-costs-banks-v-cadwalladr-sets-chilling-precedent-public-interest-journalism

 

The basic fact is that she lost her case because she made a claim she couldnt substantiate, her heart ruled her head.

I feel sorry for her for a number of reasons but that basic fact is inescapable. Its got nothing to do with agreeing with jools , or hooky,  Aaron Banks, gandalf the grey or even shergar

I am rather inclined to agree with the report you sent, it does seem a bit harsh for her to get a bill but there is a lesson for all journalists in this.   Don't say things you cannot evidence, no matter how much you believe or hope them to be true.

Frankly I don't actually know what the original case was about and have no interest  in whether the claim she made was true or not, but that's not really the point under discussion - it's about good journalistic practices, thinking before you publish and strategic lawsuits designed to achieve political purposes.

I almost didn't read the report on the basis that, once again, the word "chilling" had made an appearance

[Well b back 3,308]

9 hours ago, SwindonCanary said:

It's great to see this tread still going The Positive Brexit Thread

See your previous comments about the car industry in the U.K. is going well.

[A Load of Squit 5,232]

 

 

[Herman 9,854]

On 17/05/2023 at 18:48, How I Wrote Elastic Man said:

Got one! It's a good 'un too 😃

Cheap Beer as a result of Brexit

I was back in the uk a few days ago, and had time for a few drinks in Norwich and Cambridge. I was paying around £5.50 to £6.30 or so a pint, which doesn't seem particularly cheap, but without Brexit who knows what it might have cost

Cheap sanitary products as well, according  to the report 🙂

Shocking news but it turns out that Sunak was talking utter bollox.😫

"Also chiming in, Adnams production director, Fergus Fitzgerald pointed out that, in truth, it is not Brexit that has saved the day here because “the only significant reduction in alcohol duty is on 3.4% ABV beer which could have been done whilst in the EU” and said: “Even here, it will have no impact at the bar as it’s dwarfed by all the other costs pubs and breweries have taken”."

 

[How I Wrote Elastic Man 1,199]

4 hours ago, Herman said:

Shocking news but it turns out that Sunak was talking utter bollox.😫

"Also chiming in, Adnams production director, Fergus Fitzgerald pointed out that, in truth, it is not Brexit that has saved the day here because “the only significant reduction in alcohol duty is on 3.4% ABV beer which could have been done whilst in the EU” and said: “Even here, it will have no impact at the bar as it’s dwarfed by all the other costs pubs and breweries have taken”."

 

Oh 😧

Well at least I tried to enter into the spirit of the thread. I'm sure something positive will turn up at some point. Maybe 🤞

[canarydan23 4,120]

On 18/05/2023 at 17:57, keelansgrandad said:

Surely you of all people agree, its important to be proved right.

It's not a subject he has any experience in.

[sonyc 5,541]

Another article here linking the Nat Con conference to Brexit (searching for someone to blame for the ongoing emerging disaster of Brexit).  Friedland also points a finger at both Tories and Labour for not fronting the issue fully.

Rather concerning is the emergence of the Nat Cons. I suppose the ERG is all but defunct and some Tory members need a home for their views....splitting further right.

The comments section could also be this thread!

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2023/may/19/brexit-failed-blame-remoaner-elite-refugees?

........

Article below on the Nat C's (including this one for balance. Unherd tends to have more response from those right of centre and the Comments section is just as educative)

https://unherd.com/2023/05/will-national-conservatism-trust-the-people/

Edited May 20, 2023 by sonyc

[keelansgrandad 6,679]

46 minutes ago, sonyc said:

Another article here linking the Nat Con conference to Brexit (searching for someone to blame for the ongoing emerging disaster of Brexit).  Friedland also points a finger at both Tories and Labour for not fronting the issue fully.

Rather concerning is the emergence of the Nat Cons. I suppose the ERG is all but defunct and some Tory members need a home for their views....splitting further right.

The comments section could also be this thread!

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2023/may/19/brexit-failed-blame-remoaner-elite-refugees?

 

Ian Hislop came up with a cracker last night. He calls them the NatCs.

[Yellow Fever 3,848]

56 minutes ago, sonyc said:

Another article here linking the Nat Con conference to Brexit (searching for someone to blame for the ongoing emerging disaster of Brexit).  Friedland also points a finger at both Tories and Labour for not fronting the issue fully.

Rather concerning is the emergence of the Nat Cons. I suppose the ERG is all but defunct and some Tory members need a home for their views....splitting further right.

The comments section could also be this thread!

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2023/may/19/brexit-failed-blame-remoaner-elite-refugees?

 

Yes - unfortunately Brexit has become a cult among the Brexit rump - immune to rational discourse. 

That said, I can agree with one aspect of Brexit. The right wing needed Brexit in order to be able to implement their true agenda - the removal of the welfare state and turn us into a more American system (yes I've said this before). Brexit without this 'phase two' implemented  - privatization of the NHS (yes pay £200 to see your GP, remove or severely decrease any and all of the state benefits (pensions etc) is doomed to failure - stuck in a no-mans economic model land. However I don't think this phase two is a vote winner 😉

Anyway, chickens coming home to roost and of course rational voices are now edging us back towards the economic safe harbour of the EU. 

Edited May 20, 2023 by Yellow Fever

[A Load of Squit 5,232]

2 hours ago, keelansgrandad said:

Ian Hislop came up with a cracker last night. He calls them the NatCs.

"Don't be stupid, be a smarty"

"Come and join the Nat C party".

"Spring time for Rish and the ERG"

Edited May 20, 2023 by A Load of Squit

[littleyellowbirdie 2,613]

On 20/05/2023 at 11:30, Yellow Fever said:

Yes - unfortunately Brexit has become a cult among the Brexit rump - immune to rational discourse. 

That said, I can agree with one aspect of Brexit. The right wing needed Brexit in order to be able to implement their true agenda - the removal of the welfare state and turn us into a more American system (yes I've said this before). Brexit without this 'phase two' implemented  - privatization of the NHS (yes pay £200 to see your GP, remove or severely decrease any and all of the state benefits (pensions etc) is doomed to failure - stuck in a no-mans economic model land. However I don't think this phase two is a vote winner 😉

Anyway, chickens coming home to roost and of course rational voices are now edging us back towards the economic safe harbour of the EU. 

'Rational voices ' know full well that getting back to the 'safe harbour' of the EU is never going to happen. You are the cult, comforting yourself with the delusion of something politically highly implausible.

Edited May 21, 2023 by littleyellowbirdie

[Yellow Fever 3,848]

14 minutes ago, littleyellowbirdie said:

'Rational voices ' know full well that getting back to the 'safe harbour' of the EU is never going to happen. You are the cult, comforting yourself with the delusion of something politically highly implausible.

I know nuances escape you but we are indeed rowing back towards the EU everyday from the 'hard' Brexit - trying to 'make Brexit work', rebuilding links & moving inexorably towards a softer form of Brexit.

What do you think all the pressure from the car industry (and many other sectors) is all about ?  

[littleyellowbirdie 2,613]

43 minutes ago, Yellow Fever said:

I know nuances escape you but we are indeed rowing back towards the EU everyday from the 'hard' Brexit - trying to 'make Brexit work', rebuilding links & moving inexorably towards a softer form of Brexit.

What do you think all the pressure from the car industry (and many other sectors) is all about ?  

'Hard Brexit' is another term that seems to have been quietly redefined somewhere along the line, just as 'Brexit' has been redefined as all UK history subsequent to the decision to leave . Originally, that meant leaving without any trade agreement and defaulting to WTO terms. What we have is not a 'hard Brexit'; we have simply left the EU with a mutually agreed trading relationship.

Again, you still ignore that the landscape has completely changed and there are now pressures on us that make it impossible to rejoin.

There's similar pressure in the EU to facilitate automotive trade with the UK. The narrative that the UK's only option will eventually be to fall at the feet of the EU sobbing and pleading to be accepted back on any terms is a false one.

Edited May 21, 2023 by littleyellowbirdie

[Yellow Fever 3,848]

 

2 hours ago, littleyellowbirdie said:

Again, you still ignore that the landscape has completely changed and there are now pressures on us that make it impossible to rejoin.

This is what I find so amusing about the uber Brexiteers. They are simply terrified that Brexit will be undone that they tell themselves all sorts of porkies - or have little 'pep' talks as in the Sunday Express comic today "Brexit will be a roaring success". Bless them. Even Farage know's it's failed as does the majority of the population. Sold on a lie. If it was working well there wouldn't be a need to have such 'pep' talks or morale boosting tripe (jam tomorrow) let alone the 'burnt bridges' nonsense you revert too. 

Of course we can undo much of the damage should we wish - we can certainly leave CPTTP and renter talks in due course about the SM or CU. That's politics. 

However, nobody as yet is talking about formally rejoining the EU - my comment was simply edging closer again. As before, with the current lunatics extinguished at the next election more rational heads will prevail without the Brexit cult looking for practical solutions (NI come to mind as per Telegraph - rejoin SM solves the problem) for practical problems.

Or to put it more simply the freak Brexit tide is going out rapidly leaving stranded the flotsam and jetsam of the Tory / Brexiteer party.

Anyway, back to the day job - those large Japanese PLCs that old Sunak is trying to persuade we weren't totally out of our minds.

[Herman 9,854]

A thread with some interesting stats and graphs.

 

[littleyellowbirdie 2,613]

12 hours ago, Yellow Fever said:

 

This is what I find so amusing about the uber Brexiteers. They are simply terrified that Brexit will be undone that they tell themselves all sorts of porkies - or have little 'pep' talks as in the Sunday Express comic today "Brexit will be a roaring success". Bless them. Even Farage know's it's failed as does the majority of the population. Sold on a lie. If it was working well there wouldn't be a need to have such 'pep' talks or morale boosting tripe (jam tomorrow) let alone the 'burnt bridges' nonsense you revert too. 

Of course we can undo much of the damage should we wish - we can certainly leave CPTTP and renter talks in due course about the SM or CU. That's politics. 

However, nobody as yet is talking about formally rejoining the EU - my comment was simply edging closer again. As before, with the current lunatics extinguished at the next election more rational heads will prevail without the Brexit cult looking for practical solutions (NI come to mind as per Telegraph - rejoin SM solves the problem) for practical problems.

Or to put it more simply the freak Brexit tide is going out rapidly leaving stranded the flotsam and jetsam of the Tory / Brexiteer party.

Anyway, back to the day job - those large Japanese PLCs that old Sunak is trying to persuade we weren't totally out of our minds.

This is exactly what I mean about you being blithely oblivious to the realities. We can’t do that without punching Japan in the nuts. Japan is a lynch pin of EU relations in Asia; us abandoning that so quickly after being the first new entry would be a disaster for Japan. We definitely won’t ever do it with any public assurances or encouragement from the EU.

You don’t ‘edge closer’ to EU membership. You’re either in or out after a formal admission process. I don’t know about any Uber brexiteers being frightened about your suggestion ; any normal person would laugh at your wishful thinking.

It’d be interesting to know what your friends in the Japanese PLCs think about your idea of the UK ditching CPTPP to rejoin the EU. I wouldn’t mind betting they’d laugh as much as I did, even if it is behind your back.

Edited May 22, 2023 by littleyellowbirdie

[Yellow Fever 3,848]

3 hours ago, littleyellowbirdie said:

This is exactly what I mean about you being blithely oblivious to the realities. We can’t do that without punching Japan in the nuts. Japan is a lynch pin of EU relations in Asia; us abandoning that so quickly after being the first new entry would be a disaster for Japan. We definitely won’t ever do it with any public assurances or encouragement from the EU.

You don’t ‘edge closer’ to EU membership. You’re either in or out after a formal admission process. I don’t know about any Uber brexiteers being frightened about your suggestion ; any normal person would laugh at your wishful thinking.

It’d be interesting to know what your friends in the Japanese PLCs think about your idea of the UK ditching CPTPP to rejoin the EU. I wouldn’t mind betting they’d laugh as much as I did, even if it is behind your back.

Japanese PLCs don't play geopolitics, they play business. We've already kicked them in the nuts in your parlance by leaving the EU SM - all that investment as 'gateway to Europe' put at risk. Some have abandoned ship already and others require ever greater sweeteners.  It is this they remember. The UK's reputation for stabilty and pragmatism trashed. 

However, rather amused by your worry about doing what is right for Japan as opposed to what is right by the UK.  Odd argument.

You are drunk upon the CPTPP drip feed from Tory HQ. It's an embryonic and weak arrangement more to do with constraining China than any economic benefit to the UK (was it 0.1% GDP). It's the wooden spoon of trade deals as compared to the SM (4% GDP) and clearly an afterthought.

I can assure you it's not me they are laughing at.

Edited May 22, 2023 by Yellow Fever

[littleyellowbirdie 2,613]

1 hour ago, Yellow Fever said:

Japanese PLCs don't play geopolitics, they play business. We've already kicked them in the nuts in your parlance by leaving the EU SM - all that investment as 'gateway to Europe' put at risk. Some have abandoned ship already and others require ever greater sweeteners.  It is this they remember. The UK's reputation for stabilty and pragmatism trashed. 

However, rather amused by your worry about doing what is right for Japan as opposed to what is right by the UK.  Odd argument.

You are drunk upon the CPTPP drip feed from Tory HQ. It's an embryonic and weak arrangement more to do with constraining China than any economic benefit to the UK (was it 0.1% GDP). It's the wooden spoon of trade deals as compared to the SM (4% GDP) and clearly an afterthought.

I can assure you it's not me they are laughing at.

Why should that amuse you? My rationale for favouring remain while we were still in the EU was entirely based on stability and business as someone who's naturally risk averse.

Japan's a strong ally in rebuilding that relationship with the EU, but they won't be doing it on a basis of us undermining their objectives.

The thing is, it's now you who's the agitator for creating yet more uncertainty and instability instead of allowing things to heal as they are, mending and balancing older and newer relationships. You're no longer the rational pragmatic pro-business camp, as much as you won't accept that; you're a europhile ideologue.

Edited May 22, 2023 by littleyellowbirdie

[keelansgrandad 6,679]

57 minutes ago, littleyellowbirdie said:

Why should that amuse you? My rationale for favouring remain while we were still in the EU was entirely based on stability and business as someone who's naturally risk averse.

Japan's a strong ally in rebuilding that relationship with the EU, but they won't be doing it on a basis of us undermining their objectives.

The thing is, it's now you who's the agitator for creating yet more uncertainty and instability instead of allowing things to heal as they are, mending and balancing older and newer relationships. You're no longer the rational pragmatic pro-business camp, as much as you won't accept that; you're a europhile ideologue.

Its time to check out the direction Japan is heading in. The Liberal attitudes seem to be changing. They are re-arming. Their economy is dipping and China has killed much of their electronics industry.

[Hook's-Walk-Canary 213]

Straight up article by Matt Goodwin:  https://www.express.co.uk/comment/expresscomment/1772953/brexit-myths-economy-Matthew-Goodwin

[keelansgrandad 6,679]

1 hour ago, Hook's-Walk-Canary said:

Straight up article by Matt Goodwin:  https://www.express.co.uk/comment/expresscomment/1772953/brexit-myths-economy-Matthew-Goodwin

What he fails to say is that despite other countries having problems, we are being told we have the right people to put things right. 

Yep. Johnson, Truss and now Sunak. And things are getting worse not better.

Inflation is at 10% but in reality, the percentage of food inflation is much higher. Its only because house prices are dropping that it isn't higher.