No wonder this football club is in trouble

[Essjayess 307]

One of the most Curious topics ive seen in awhile, at least the authors forum name is apt. From its title thru to the OP, its a wonderful advertisment for Swiss cheese.

[Levi Stubbs 0]

WELL SAID CURIOUS CANARY! I wasn''t sure which way to vote but if Delia Smith is in favour of staying in then OUT looks the right way to go!

[PurpleCanary 5,578]

[quote user="ricardo"]I loved this bit about the referendum."First, why is the entire nation being put under this unnecessary

pressure? We already get to vote for a democratic system, where all the

big decisions are meant to be made on our behalf".

Exactly right Delia, a referendum was part of the Conservative manifesto and has duly been delivered. You may not like it but that''s what people voted for, its called democracy.It strikes me that Delia is merely articulating a strain of thought that says that ordinary people shouldn''t be trusted with a vote in case they vote the wrong way. [/quote]No. Her point is that, whatever the Tory manifesto said, and whatever people who voted Tory specifically on the basis of that promise thought would happen, this campaign has effectively turned into an intra-party fight to the death between Cameron and Johnson, in which the real arguments for and against have got swampd. And it is hard to argue with that. She is bemoaning the lack of a proper debate, uninfluenced by personal political ambition (that is a euphemism for Boris''s rampant desire to rule the country)."Frankly, the current state of politics is pants in this debate.

Politics are there to serve the people and not the other way round. So,

why don’t we simply short-circuit the daily threats and angry squabbles,

and from now on engage in some proper grownup, joined-up thinking,

about the real issues?

What each of us is being asked to do is cast a vote that will affect

not just our lives, but the future of generations to come. Each of us

must reflect quietly and independently about this vote."Those are hardly the thoughts of someone who doesn''t want the people to decide this issue.

[Indy 3,310]

And Purple she''s bang on too, it''s become a public scaremongering campaign to the point where both sides now use celebrities to buy votes.......this is potentially a huge disaster or success but us normal people have yet to be given the truth and real facts of what would most likely happen by those who have an actual impartial view who have some insight into the fundamental business of the EU.

[Guest]

Delia''s opinion piece has to be one of the least controversial articles on the EU referendum to date.  She comes across as a fair-minded, passionate advocate of social union and democracy.  You are, of course, free to disagree that this is what the EU represents.Delia''s right about the debate becoming a farce though.  All sides have been making increasingly ridiculous and outlandish predictions.

[norfolkbroadslim 223]

[quote user="Ricky Spanish"]Dead right Indy. The vast majorty haven''t got the slightest clue what effects leaving or staying would have. Too many bigots just see the red mist when they hear a furrin accent.

Put the Daily Mail down guys. The amount of welfare that gets spent on the jobless and particularly jobless immigrants is absolutely tiny. Most of your tax money that goes to welfare goes to supporting single mothers and pensioners.[/quote]So that''s who the people who want out are?  [:|]

[king canary 7,652]

This thread is one of the stupidest things I''ve ever seen. She is entitled to her opinion, she''s not trying to force you to vote one way or the other, just stating her beliefs.

This, combined with the generally unwarranted hostility to anything Balls does is getting pretty tiresome.

[norfolkbroadslim 223]

Now if only there was a sociologist on here who could give their views on a global society.

[ricardo 7,395]

[quote user="PurpleCanary"][quote user="ricardo"]I loved this bit about the referendum."First, why is the entire nation being put under this unnecessary

pressure? We already get to vote for a democratic system, where all the

big decisions are meant to be made on our behalf".

Exactly right Delia, a referendum was part of the Conservative manifesto and has duly been delivered. You may not like it but that''s what people voted for, its called democracy.It strikes me that Delia is merely articulating a strain of thought that says that ordinary people shouldn''t be trusted with a vote in case they vote the wrong way. [/quote]

No. Her point is that, whatever the Tory manifesto said, and whatever people who voted Tory specifically on the basis of that promise thought would happen, this campaign has effectively turned into an intra-party fight to the death between Cameron and Johnson, in which the real arguments for and against have got swampd. And it is hard to argue with that. She is bemoaning the lack of a proper debate, uninfluenced by personal political ambition (that is a euphemism for Boris''s rampant desire to rule the country)."Frankly, the current state of politics is pants in this debate.

Politics are there to serve the people and not the other way round. So,

why don’t we simply short-circuit the daily threats and angry squabbles,

and from now on engage in some proper grownup, joined-up thinking,

about the real issues?

What each of us is being asked to do is cast a vote that will affect

not just our lives, but the future of generations to come. Each of us

must reflect quietly and independently about this vote."Those are hardly the thoughts of someone who doesn''t want the people to decide this issue.[/quote]

I think you''ve read far more into the quote than is actually there. She said.................We already get to vote for a democratic system, where all the

big decisions are meant to be made on our behalf".That sounds very like someone who wished the referendum wasn''t taking place and indeed it wouldn''t be had Ed Milliband been PM. A perfectly valid statement from her point of view but not one that the people endorsed at the last election.As for the daily threats and angry squabbles, they will likely remain when as I fully expect, the people will have voted 60/40 to stay In. The losers will have to accept the verdict of the people just as the Scots had to in the Indy ref. It doesn''t mean that people will have to stop expressing their passionately held views.

[nutty nigel 7,563]

[quote user="Curious Canary"]The chairman has quit, the chief exec has quit.

And we are being run by a bunch of dreamers.

We have Balls and his missus who are presenting themselves as the social conscience of the nation.

And now Delia, who again confirms that she knows as little about politics and logic as she does about football, puts her oar into the EU Referendum debate.

This from her article in today’s Guardian:

“No, I’m not a naive optimist…"

“I believe passionately in the human adventure, and that individual people as well as individual nations will in time, in spite of how long it might take, embrace solidarity and the global society.”

She also says:

“I may well be mocked for my views but again, bring it on!”

So since you asked, here’s a start.

In my view something more serious than mocking is required.

It’s about taking a high profile, politically motivated, totally divisive stand that’s entirely in conflict with the responsibilities of ownership of a community focused football club with a diverse fan base. This shows a complete lack of respect.

Delia you are not fit to run our football club.[/quote]

 

Of course she doesn''t run it, she owns it. Is she fit to own it?

 

45th richest owner in the English leagues. The club has the last six seasons at least 20 places above that. Pound for pound that would make Delia the most successful club custodian in English football over that period.

 

Now I''ve been a bit troubled about the up coming reforendum. I don''t really have a clue what''s best. So in the end i may well canvass the views of people I respect to make my mind up. Delia would certainly be amongst them...

 

 

[curious yellow 184]

Yes, that totally explains our lack of scoring ability.

If only we''d known.

[nutty nigel 7,563]

So if I vote out will we score more goals? For someone who understands so little that could be a deal clincher...

[Van wink 2,994]

She can say what she likes, whether or not you pay any attention to it is up to you. I can tell you this, there are many owners of football clubs that make you cringe with the things that they say, apart from" let''s be avenue " I''ve never felt that about Delia.

[PurpleCanary 5,578]

[quote user="ricardo"][quote user="PurpleCanary"][quote user="ricardo"]I loved this bit about the referendum."First, why is the entire nation being put under this unnecessary

pressure? We already get to vote for a democratic system, where all the

big decisions are meant to be made on our behalf".

Exactly right Delia, a referendum was part of the Conservative manifesto and has duly been delivered. You may not like it but that''s what people voted for, its called democracy.It strikes me that Delia is merely articulating a strain of thought that says that ordinary people shouldn''t be trusted with a vote in case they vote the wrong way. [/quote]

No. Her point is that, whatever the Tory manifesto said, and whatever people who voted Tory specifically on the basis of that promise thought would happen, this campaign has effectively turned into an intra-party fight to the death between Cameron and Johnson, in which the real arguments for and against have got swampd. And it is hard to argue with that. She is bemoaning the lack of a proper debate, uninfluenced by personal political ambition (that is a euphemism for Boris''s rampant desire to rule the country)."Frankly, the current state of politics is pants in this debate.

Politics are there to serve the people and not the other way round. So,

why don’t we simply short-circuit the daily threats and angry squabbles,

and from now on engage in some proper grownup, joined-up thinking,

about the real issues?

What each of us is being asked to do is cast a vote that will affect

not just our lives, but the future of generations to come. Each of us

must reflect quietly and independently about this vote."Those are hardly the thoughts of someone who doesn''t want the people to decide this issue.[/quote]

I think you''ve read far more into the quote than is actually there. She said.................We already get to vote for a democratic system, where all the

big decisions are meant to be made on our behalf".That sounds very like someone who wished the referendum wasn''t taking place and indeed it wouldn''t be had Ed Milliband been PM. A perfectly valid statement from her point of view but not one that the people endorsed at the last election.As for the daily threats and angry squabbles, they will likely remain when as I fully expect, the people will have voted 60/40 to stay In. The losers will have to accept the verdict of the people just as the Scots had to in the Indy ref. It doesn''t mean that people will have to stop expressing their passionately held views.[/quote]No, I am not, because I am looking at the whole quote, in which she makes plain she wants people to decide the issue, but on the basis of an informed and honest debate, which she believes - with good reason - there has so far not been.Mainly, though not entirely, because the de facto leader of the Out campaign is using it not for the supposed good of the country but for his personal ambitions, and is a man whose relationship with the truth is haphazard at best.Your argument is based on using the first line in isolation and ignoring this context which prompted Delia''s comments. And she is far from alone - along the political spectrum - in believing the way the debate has gone so far has hardly helped voters decide.

[daly 507]

5 million more on the way

2 weeks to see a doctor

Jobs going to their cheap labour

Millions spent on the European Parliament

Jobs for the boys

Council Houses given within weeks of arriving to illegal immigrants

London full of Romanian Gypsy''s

In Norwich we know nothing about the problems of the Inner Cities with gangs of different nationalities.

That''s OK let Mr Balls and his cronies put them up

[Katie Borkins 1]

How very BNP you sound.

[A Load of Squit 5,201]

[quote user="daly"]5 million more on the way

2 weeks to see a doctor

Jobs going to their cheap labour

Millions spent on the European Parliament

Jobs for the boys

Council Houses given within weeks of arriving to illegal immigrants

London full of Romanian Gypsy''s

In Norwich we know nothing about the problems of the Inner Cities with gangs of different nationalities.

That''s OK let Mr Balls and his cronies put them up[/quote]

If, as you say, you know nothing then you made that list up.

[nutty nigel 7,563]

I think we should have a Pink Un Question Time Thread It could be pinned to the top of the board with Curious Canary, Paul Moy, Ricardo and daly on the panel. Purple can be our very own David Dimbleby. We can then find out what we need to know to form an opinion on that forthcoming referendum. Bring it on...

[norfolkbroadslim 223]

Purple would be a terrible Dimbleby.Now where''s our sociologist and what are their thoughts on a global society?  [:^)]

[nutty nigel 7,563]

Ok ''slim. The job''s yours and Purple''s on the panel :)

[Curious Canary 0]

PurpleCanary quotes:

"Frankly, the current state of politics is pants in this debate. Politics are there to serve the people and not the other way round. So, why don’t we simply short-circuit the daily threats and angry squabbles, and from now on engage in some proper grownup, joined-up thinking, about the real issues? What each of us is being asked to do is cast a vote that will affect not just our lives, but the future of generations to come. Each of us must reflect quietly and independently about this vote."

Those are hardly the thoughts of someone who doesn''t want the people to decide this issue.

So you say “Delia wants the people to decide”.

The facts say that Delia doesn’t think that there should be a referendum, that the people should not get a vote, that the people should not decide.

Both positions cannot be right.

The truth is that Delia doesn’t really want the people to decide but now that the country has been forced into a referendum, against her will, she wants them to vote in a way which gives the same result as not having a referendum.

Isn’t that precisely the Labour position on the referendum?

I wonder where she got that from, or did she think it up by herself?

It is a great pity that she did not take her own advice and “reflect quietly and independently about this vote”.

[norfolkbroadslim 223]

Oh no, I don''t want it myself Nutty. I was thinking that Parma would make an excellent Dimbleby.

[norfolkbroadslim 223]

........actually he''d be a better Dimbleby, than Dimbleby himself!

[nutty nigel 7,563]

Ok ''slim. Parma is in the chair and Katie can take his place on the panel. Are we settled now? ;) you make me change my plans more than the missus....

[ricardo 7,395]

[quote user="PurpleCanary"]No, I am not, because I am looking at the whole quote, in which she makes plain she wants people to decide the issue, but on the basis of an informed and honest debate, which she believes - with good reason - there has so far not been.Mainly, though not entirely, because the de facto leader of the Out campaign is using it not for the supposed good of the country but for his personal ambitions, and is a man whose relationship with the truth is haphazard at best.Your argument is based on using the first line in isolation and ignoring this context which prompted Delia''s comments. And she is far from alone - along the political spectrum - in believing the way the debate has gone so far has hardly helped voters decide.[/quote]No, I don''t believe it is. The first line sets the context for the rest of the article and as such it quite plainly bemoans the fact that we are having this debate and referendum in the first place. The rest of it goes on to complain at the way those with passionately held views are making exaggerated claims for each side of the argument. Well, whats new, does anybody really believe that if we vote OUT the world will end and every person in Britain will end up in the workhouse? Equally, nobody in the right mind believes that in the case of an IN vote seventy million Turks will come marching up Prince of Wales Rd.The entire article is nothing more than a plea to sit in a circle and sing Kumbaya and as such adds nothing to the debate.

[Curious Canary 0]

Yellowbeagle:

“I fail to see why any of this means our football club is in trouble? We''ve been relegated other than that we are in pretty good shape...”

Within 6 months:

Relegation.

McNally gone.

Bowkett replaced by Balls.

Tom Smith (Delia’s nephew and 35 year old former civil servant) appointed to board (on the merit of having “spent hours sitting around the dinner table or in the stands discussing this club”).

Delia pontificating her pie in the sky ideas of utopia.

No trouble then, clearly a step forward on every front, apart from the relegation.

Just need to appoint the right man/woman as new CEO and promotion back to the PL is assured,

Socialism plus nepotism, what can possibly go wrong?

[PurpleCanary 5,578]

Ricardo, we must agree to differ on our interpretations of Delia''s desire or otherwise for a referendum, and whether her article adds anything to the debate. But it has at least served one admirable purpose, which is to annoy the h*ll out of some posters here.

[Mello Yello 2,298]

Politics?.......Religion?.......I don''t care about either.......I just want us to win football games.......

[Faded Jaded Semi Plastic SOB 1,036]

From my perspective the EU debate can be summed up as:

If you want the UK to stay in the EU you are a Franco/German butt kisser

If you want the UK to leave the EU you are a xenophobic racist

If we leave the EU our lives in the UK will not be worth living

If we stay in the EU we will eventually be taken over by a federal European Army, Police Force etc etc.

The dumbing down in the media and on social media of the biggest decision UK will make is astounding and the whole referendum debate is basically a side show to the battle for the leadership of the Conservative Party and I suspect the Labour Party are more interested in the results/fallout of that battle than they are in the results of the referendum.

The lack of any independent data and information is worry for me, so in terms of the piece written by Delia, I can understand where she is coming from.

Whether we like it or not immigration is going to be main area both the in and out camps are gong to focus on at the expense of the social/economic debate.

[king canary 7,652]

@Curious

So clearly what this all boils down to is that you don''t like their politics.