How far into the season????

[Jim Smith 2,365]

No win in the next 4 and I think Hoots position comes under serious threat.

Similarly if at Christmas we have not picked up at least 15 points I would say the same.

[First Wizard 0]

[quote user="rondy"][quote user="First Wizard"]

[quote user="baldyboy"]3 more games max, if we havent won by then he needs to go!
[/quote]

 

Huzzah! [Y]

[/quote]

I see you been outed on Villa talk for the troll that you are.. embarrassing or what! The saddest thing is that if we manage a point vs Arsenal and/or Villa you''ll be on here praising Hughton from the rafters..

http://www.villatalk.com/index.php/topic/7312-lamberts-row-with-norwich/
[/quote]

 

I''m outed everywhere rondy, its what I do...........do you think after 9 years I care about that?

 

And sniff, I won''t.

[hogesar 9,817]

It''s all very well saying "after ''x'' amount of games he should be gone" - there has to be a suitable replacement. There''s no point doing a Wolves, sacking your manager and THEN realising there''s no one that will actually take the position.I do not personally believe there is anyone better available at the moment. Maybe there will be further down the line but at the moment i do not think so.

[Cantiaci Canary 566]

[quote user="kellybrook"]If we finish 17th he has done his job and as much as anyone can expect with a lower league squad bought for peanuts.
[/quote]

 

I''ll take 17th right now thank you very much!

[Row D Seat 7 0]

@Shack Attack - we should be desperate to win every game, but have shown so far that we are not. However you may think it''s just another game and publicly Hughton and players will say that too, but it isn''t just another game. Not by any stretch.

[marvin the martian 0]

A lesson from here on the West Coast, another team that plays in yellow and green, and joint lowest payroll - so no established stars on this team. Way out of contention to win their division half way thru the season, and then lost key players to injury - so all doom and gloom eh? Nope, won more games than any other team in the second half of the season, win their division, and now this evening just came back from 3-1 down in the final inning of their playoff game to win 4-3... Surfer, how far do you think the A''s can go ?

[Smudger 0]

[quote user="hogesar"]It''s all very well saying "after ''x'' amount of games he should be gone" - there has to be a suitable replacement. There''s no point doing a Wolves, sacking your manager and THEN realising there''s no one that will actually take the position.I do not personally believe there is anyone better available at the moment. Maybe there will be further down the line but at the moment i do not think so.[/quote]Of course there are better managers available to us and there always

were.  Hughton was a poor choice and for me the only question is when he

will get the push, not if. Some would keep Hughton as manager

even if we are relegated, but I believe that would be the biggest

mistake that the board could make.I think that Jim Smith has the

most sensible post on here so far, with his "No win in the next 4 and I

think Hoots position comes under serious threat. Similarly if at Christmas we have not picked up at least 15 points I would say the same."I would also say that we need a minimum of 15 points by Christmas, but that the board should have several meetings to re-evaluate the managerial position prior to then.  The first of those meetings should come after the Reading match, with another meeting to be planned after either the Southampton or Sunderland games.  We need to look to have at least one win in the bag after the Reading game and have minimum of at least 10 points by the time we have played Southampton/Sunderland in order to give Hughton more time.It is going to be tough, but we need to start winning games now if Hughton is to last until Christmas, let alone see te season out at Carrow Road.

[Stowmarket Canary (not Delia) 0]

I personally would''ve preferred Malky after lambert! I think the leadership qualities he has and his standing with the fans would''ve stood him in good stead! Lambert was such a legend for what he did in his tenure, we needed a big character to replace him.

[PurpleCanary 5,603]

[quote user="Smudger"]


Of course there are better managers available to us and there always were.



[/quote]

 

Who specifically? Name names. Of managers clearly better AND who were available in the summer AND would have come here. Three names will do.

[lake district canary 0]

[quote user="Smudger"][quote user="hogesar"]It''s all very well saying "after ''x'' amount of games he should be gone" - there has to be a suitable replacement. There''s no point doing a Wolves, sacking your manager and THEN realising there''s no one that will actually take the position.  I do not personally believe there is anyone better available at the moment. Maybe there will be further down the line but at the moment i do not think so.[/quote]Of course there are better managers available to us and there always

were.  Hughton was a poor choice and for me the only question is when he

will get the push, not if.  Some would keep Hughton as manager

even if we are relegated, but I believe that would be the biggest

mistake that the board could make.  I think that Jim Smith has the

most sensible post on here so far, with his "No win in the next 4 and I

think Hoots position comes under serious threat. Similarly if at Christmas we have not picked up at least 15 points I would say the same."  I would also say that we need a minimum of 15 points by Christmas, but that the board should have several meetings to re-evaluate the managerial position prior to then.  The first of those meetings should come after the Reading match, with another meeting to be planned after either the Southampton or Sunderland games.  We need to look to have at least one win in the bag after the Reading game and have minimum of at least 10 points by the time we have played Southampton/Sunderland in order to give Hughton more time.  It is going to be tough, but we need to start winning games now if Hughton is to last until Christmas, let alone see te season out at Carrow Road.

[/quote]

What a load of  bilious making tosh  (Smudger, not hogesar).     What on earth point would there be in replacing a manager half way through a season?    If we are that short of points by Christmas, we''ll be down anyway.      Time and time again you get this in football.   Sometimes, you know, you just have to take the rough with the smooth.    Hughton needs time.    The squad has improved - but so has every other squad in the division - most who have more money available than us.   He needs time to get his players working how he wants them to.     He is not a Grant or a Roeder or a Rioch or a hamilton for that matter.   He has the pedigree to do the job.   Have you named a credible alternative??   The only name I have seen bandied about is Holloway - which is where those that are suggesting him should spend their holidays.............

Hopefully, Hughton can improve things over the next few weeks - whatever -  but reviewing his position or getting rid of him at any stage this season would be completely and utterly ridiculous..........imo.

  

[ZLF 282]

IF you are going to change manager mid season then it has to be with a replacement in mind and before Dec so the new man can assess the squad and has a chance to improving. No wins by Dec would be a disaster!

[Smudger 0]

[quote user="ZippersLeftFoot"]IF you are going to change manager mid season then it has to be with a replacement in mind and before Dec so the new man can assess the squad and has a chance to improving. No wins by Dec would be a disaster![/quote]100% correct Zip, I am sure that McNally and Bowkett are monitoring the situation despite what is said in public.

[norfolkbroadslim 223]

Aren''t you using an avatar this time round Smudge? [IMG]data:image/jpeg;base64,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[/IMG][:^)]

[PurpleCanary 5,603]

[quote user="PurpleCanary"]

[quote user="Smudger"]


Of course there are better managers available to us and there always were.



[/quote]

 

Who specifically? Name names. Of managers clearly better AND who were available in the summer AND would have come here. Three names will do.

[/quote]

 

Bumped for the benefit of Smudger, who seems - quite unaccountably - not to have noticed it.

[Gingerpele 0]

[quote user="kellybrook"]If we finish 17th he has done his job and as much as anyone can expect with a lower league squad bought for peanuts.[/quote]

Were you in a coma for the last year?

Our ''lower league'' squad finished 12th. We signed two Premiership defenders. We have a premiership squad. The players haven''t forgotten how to play football.

[norfolkbroadslim 223]

We''re languishing at the bottom of the league at Christmas, it''s your decision, do you -

 

1. Keep Hughton and let him sign a decent striker?

 

2. Sack Hughton and spend the striker budget on the cost of installing a new management team?

 

[Smudger 0]

[quote user="norfolkbroadslim"]

We''re languishing at the bottom of the league at Christmas, it''s your decision, do you -

 

1. Keep Hughton and let him sign a decent striker?

 

2. Sack Hughton and spend the striker budget on the cost of installing a new management team?

 

[/quote]Tough decision when put like that.

[nutty nigel 7,667]

[quote user="Smudger"][quote user="norfolkbroadslim"]

We''re languishing at the bottom of the league at Christmas, it''s your decision, do you -

 

1. Keep Hughton and let him sign a decent striker?

 

2. Sack Hughton and spend the striker budget on the cost of installing a new management team?

 

[/quote]

Tough decision when put like that.


[/quote]

 

Or reserve the right to complain later about whichever option happened...

 

 

[Row D Seat 7 0]

I would take option 2 if the management team was Harry Redknapp, Kevin Bond and Joe Jordan. Stranger things have happened.

[Smudger 0]

[quote user="Row D Seat 7"]I would take option 2 if the management team was Harry Redknapp, Kevin Bond and Joe Jordan. Stranger things have happened.[/quote]It has to be option 2, as we don''t have the money to sign the striker that lot''s of people appear to think will make all the difference to our fortunes.It will cost less money for us to change the manager than it will to buy that kind of striker.My fear of signing a striker would be does the current management team have the ability to get the best out that striker once you have given them the money to spend on him?  The squad we have is surely stronger than last seasons squad, but it appears to be performing far worse than last seasons squad.Logic would suggest that the reason why we are not currently performing to the same standards that were set last season are that the ability of our management team does not match what we had at Carrow Road last season.

[Bill 1,788]

" if the management team was Harry Redknapp ....... "

 

there mght just be a teeny weeny reason why the ''ever onest harry'' was mysteriously given the heave ho from Spurs, was avoided like th plague by England and is still ''under a cloud''

 

maybe he would be better teaming up with Michael Chopra down the A140 - link minded souls I suspect

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[RvWs 4 year contract 0]

We''re comfortably mid table at christmas, what do you do?1. Apologise for being so bloody negative        OR2. Stop posting anti Hughton bile on here and recognise that he had never really been given a proper chance....

[DC36 0]

Think Hughton should get more time but if he is sacked... How about Alan Curbishley?

Did a great job at Charlton, made them into an established Premier league side. Look at what happened to them after he left!

And he kept West Ham up from what looked like an impossible position, then left the season after, on principle after the board sold two players without his permission.

And is currently not working so wouldn''t cost anything in terms of compo!!

[ZLF 282]

[quote user="norfolkbroadslim"]

We''re languishing at the bottom of the league at Christmas, it''s your decision, do you -

 

1. Keep Hughton and let him sign a decent striker?

 

2. Sack Hughton and spend the striker budget on the cost of installing a new management team?

 

[/quote]

Right now we have a squad of players that is better than last years. Lets get this very clear, IF we are bottom at xmas it is NOT simply because we are short of one striker.

its because the manager has either failed to get the best from the good resources available to him either through not getting those players to perform, not picking (or identifying) the best team, picking the best team but tactically failing to maximise them or simple pure unadulterated back luck.

ie bottom because he is either an unlucky manager or incompetent - would you really want to keep either of those? In that scenario I would change manager - every time, assuming I am a competent exec team and have a good replacement lined up.

And before I am "outed" as a binner the above does NOT mean that I expect us to be in that position in 2 months time.

[ZLF 282]

GH 3 yr contract - the original post is a decent question and not anti CH bile but a reasonable opportunity to discuss one of several possible outcomes.

If we are mid table by then we will all have a very merry christmas but still be anxious that we dont start a slide that moves us back down the table near the relegation spaces... and nowt wrong with that either..

[Indy_Bones 442]

[quote user="ZippersLeftFoot"]IF we are bottom at xmas it is NOT simply because we are short of one striker,.its because the manager has either failed to get the best from the good resources available to him, either through not getting those players to perform, not picking (or identifying) the best team, picking the best team but tactically failing to maximise them or simple pure unadulterated back luck.

ie bottom because he is either an unlucky manager or incompetent - would you really want to keep either of those? In that scenario I would change manager - every time, assuming I am a competent exec team and have a good replacement lined up.

And before I am "outed" as a binner the above does NOT mean that I expect us to be in that position in 2 months time.[/quote]Absolutely spot on ZLF.Any talk of dismissing CH at this stage is ludicrous, but I fully agree with your above statement.What worries me is that if this IS the case at Xmas - who the hell would we bring in that''s suited to us?

[Indy 3,344]

LDC, can I aske where you get the Pedigree from regarding Hughton? you said

 

 " He is not a Grant or a Roeder or a Rioch or a hamilton for that matter.   He has the pedigree to do the job.  "

 

Well on past history he has little experience in management never mind premeriship management. As for his coaching staff even when they played I believe only Calderwood has premeirship football under his belt with Spurs for a couple seasons and a few games for Villa.

 

I know he took a good Newcastle side got them promoted, but was sacked from that and even though he did OK at Birmingham most of their fans were expecting promotion not to miss out given theor budget and players! So although he did do a good job there it wasn''t up to expectations given their relegation the previous season.

 

So now we go onto my real point, some people go on about no one out there any better, but Hughton isn''t that good yet! We have a better team on paper than last year, we have conceded more goals and scored less, less points and there are questions from player regarding the training! Confidence is at a low with little sign of changing in the next game.

 

How do we know that even Mark Robins wouldn''t get more out of this team then Hughton? Sometimes good managers do not fit the teams ABV at Chelsea as an example, maybe Hughton just isn''t right for our club, maybe he see''s us as "Little Norwich punching above our weight" this isn''t what is needed to instill confidence in the players.

 

Having listened to Hughtons post match and other interviews, he really doesn''t talk well of Norwich, almost as if we are lucky to be in the Premiership, I was one for giving Hughton all season but I am fast approaching want a change after the Reading game if we fail to get a win before then.

 

We need a manager who will push the players, drive them into thinking they are the best in the world, get them fitter then other teams and play for 90 minutes, we need a manager with love for the club, a true legend, we need Malky! I want Malky (If he would leave Cardiff)

[Highland Canary 76]

I thought Hughton was an excellent appointment. He was my first choice.

Listening to Bowkett and McNally at the fans'' forum, in my opinion, Hughton will still be our manager even if we are bottom at Christmas and finish 20th. That being the case Hughton should invest in a striker with pace as many of us warned/discussed before the start of the season. Personally, I think it will be too late.

I don''t think our current situation is entirely Hughton''s fault: under Lambert our results dropped towards the end of last season as teams found us out; our rapid rise from league one implied we had the weakest squads of the three promoted teams last year; we''ve invested in a large group of players over the close season, but Bassong excepted, there is not a step change in improvement in quality as compared to what was already here; the PL is stronger this season albeit I expect Southampton and Reading to struggle this season etc .

What I''ve found difficult to understand at points this season are some of the tactics, team selections, substitutions, loans out and signings we''ve made.

So where does it leave us? In my opinion, the similarities to 2005 are considerable - not being able to buy a win - investing in a new striker in 2005 in January but it being too late (not sure how many Ashtons are around today) but in a better financial position as we attempt to regroup under Hughton in the championship.

[lake district canary 0]

[quote user="Indy"]

LDC, can I aske where you get the Pedigree from regarding Hughton? you said   " He is not a Grant or a Roeder or a Rioch or a hamilton for that matter.   He has the pedigree to do the job.  "    Well on past history he has little experience in management never mind premeriship management. As for his coaching staff even when they played I believe only Calderwood has premeirship football under his belt with Spurs for a couple seasons and a few games for Villa.   I know he took a good Newcastle side got them promoted, but was sacked from that and even though he did OK at Birmingham most of their fans were expecting promotion not to miss out given theor budget and players! So although he did do a good job there it wasn''t up to expectations given their relegation the previous season.   So now we go onto my real point, some people go on about no one out there any better, but Hughton isn''t that good yet! We have a better team on paper than last year, we have conceded more goals and scored less, less points and there are questions from player regarding the training! Confidence is at a low with little sign of changing in the next game.    How do we know that even Mark Robins wouldn''t get more out of this team then Hughton? Sometimes good managers do not fit the teams ABV at Chelsea as an example, maybe Hughton just isn''t right for our club, maybe he see''s us as "Little Norwich punching above our weight" this isn''t what is needed to instill confidence in the players.  Having listened to Hughtons post match and other interviews, he really doesn''t talk well of Norwich, almost as if we are lucky to be in the Premiership, I was one for giving Hughton all season but I am fast approaching want a change after the Reading game if we fail to get a win before then.   We need a manager who will push the players, drive them into thinking they are the best in the world, get them fitter then other teams and play for 90 minutes, we need a manager with love for the club, a true legend, we need Malky! I want Malky (If he would leave Cardiff)

[/quote]

I just don''t think it is that easy to choose someone like a Robins, or a Malky.    The idea was presumably to have a manager who had some success as a premiership manager.    There aren''t many out there.    Curbishley - but he''s been away too long.    If we hadn''t gone for hughton it would have been a lottery as to who we would pick.   There is no guarantee  of success from any manager.    Hughton  looked the best choice to a lot of us.  He may still prove that, but I understand the concerns, of course I do, but  there is no one out there who you could say  would have done any better.    You may be right - the best manager for a club like ours may be  one who makes the players feel like they are "the best in the world"  - but how many managers can do that - and is it a sustainable approach?   

The jury is going to be out on Hughton until we start getting results.    I still think he was the best candidate.   Getting a successful manager is not easy.  But whoever comes in has to be given time.  CH may or may not turn it round, but I do know that it would be folly to sack him during this season.  The stall has been set out. He is here.  We sink or swim with Hughton.  The only sensible course open to us as fans is to support him.   Changing manager half way through a season wouldn''t make any difference to the prospects of survival.     The only sensible way open is to trust that he will prove to have a successful approach.   If ultimately we go down this season - and the team shows no signs of improving - then it would be time for thinking about a change.   You have to give him this season, at least.

[Indy 3,344]

I had the same thinking LDC, give Hughton the rest of the season, but to be honest this is the biggest season in the clubs history financially and how long do you give a failing manager?

 

I know it''s only 7 games in but questions are going to be asked and after 11 games a lot of answers will be there to see! I''m one who agreed with the Hughton appointment but after the summer and now into the season, the players don''t appear to be too happy, comments in the press about the coaching and training, on the ptich frustrations are there to see and you have to question Hughton''s ability to get the best out of players.

 

Hughton hasn''t really got a lot of management credentials, he''s a decent bloke who calls it as it is, but we don''t need a TV pundit managing out club we need a leader and I dont''t see that in him, maybe I''m wrong, but his press confrences are always pointing to us being a little club and doing our best! You don''t see other managers of the same size clubs doing that!

 

I can''t see how he can carry on if we don''t get a win in the next three and I don''t see Bowkett and MacNally sitting around giving him the full season if it''s not working, I don''t think they are that type of board.

 

Time will tell & I hope h can turn things around it would be lovely to beat Arsenal.