We still need 6 new players

[tom cavendish 0]

[quote user="Indy_Bones"]It''s not about people being ''able'' to play in a position, it''s about excelling in that position. [/quote]Yes, this is what I keep saying. We have a lot of players that are ''master of none''. Next season will be a lot harder so we need more players that excel in a position rather than just being OK on a good day.The best players last season were:RuddyTierney BennettHowsonPilkingtonHoltThat leaves us needing about 5 new first-team players who excel in a position.

[Lets be aving you! 0]

"That leaves us needing about 5 new first-team players who excel in a position."

 

The "6 new players" in your title seems to have fallen since last night.

 

I would be very surprised if we bring in more than another 2-3 players this window. "5 new players who excel in a position" of Premier League quality would exceed what our budget can bear.

[Jim Smith 2,365]

[quote user="tom cavendish"][quote user="Indy_Bones"]It''s not about people being ''able'' to play in a position, it''s about excelling in that position. [/quote]Yes, this is what I keep saying. We have a lot of players that are ''master of none''. Next season will be a lot harder so we need more players that excel in a position rather than just being OK on a good day.The best players last season were:RuddyTierney BennettHowsonPilkingtonHoltThat leaves us needing about 5 new first-team players who excel in a position.

[/quote]

 

Ayala, Hoolahan, The other Bennett (not sure which one you are referring to above), Morison?

Plus all the others showed they are good enough if called upon.

 

[shefcanary 2,504]

My conclusion on another thread is that we shouldn''t be surprised that by the end of August we will have 5 new arrivals and 3 departures.  Although I conclude with most on here who have mentioned potential sales, I couldn''t even start to imagine where Hughton''s plans are for the new players.  But I think he has £15 million net (£17 million gross) burning a hole at the moment given Bowkett''s statement on playing budget a month ago. 

[GMF 757]

[quote user="Chelmsford Canary"]

It''s very good looking at what we need, we also need to look at what is going.

25 man squad needs to be thought about, not sure how many places are left.

Like the comments by BBB!

[/quote]

 

We currently have 28 contracted players, 5 of whom are classified as Under 21, so that''s 23 towards the 25 limit before any further arrivals or departures 

[tom cavendish 0]

 [quote] Let''s be ''aving you! "That leaves us needing about 5 new first-team players who excel in a position."

 

The "6 new players" in your title seems to have fallen since last night.

 [/quote]

No because I said that one of the 6 should be a winger (who would obviously cover E.Bennett and Pilks). Therefore we need 5 new players to excel in a position in the first team, but 6 new players in total for the squad.

[The Goal Threat 0]

TBH, I cant see Whittaker as anything more than a backup full back...

[The Goal Threat 0]

Lappin might very well be a too limited player for PL standards, but he''s perfect for our playing style! He is incredibly hard working, he rarely makes errors and I think he''s one of the best crossers in the team.

[GJP 79]

[quote user="NCNOR"]TBH, I cant see Whittaker as anything more than a backup full back...[/quote]

Doubt he''s moved all this way to warm the bench.

[norfolkbroadslim 223]

Hughton''s comments on the pink un homepage didn''t fill me with much confidence and I can''t say that I agreed with them with regards to competition for places and no increase in quality needed[:(]

[tom cavendish 0]

[quote user="Jim Smith"]

[quote user="tom cavendish"][quote user="Indy_Bones"]It''s not about people being ''able'' to play in a position, it''s about excelling in that position. [/quote]Yes, this is what I keep saying. We have a lot of players that are ''master of none''. Next season will be a lot harder so we need more players that excel in a position rather than just being OK on a good day.The best players last season were:RuddyTierney E.BennettHowsonPilkingtonHoltThat leaves us needing about 5 new first-team players who excel in a position.

[/quote]

 

Ayala, Hoolahan, The other Bennett (not sure which one you are referring to above), Morison?

Plus all the others showed they are good enough if called upon.

 

[/quote]I see Morison as competition for Holt, Ayala was good on the ball but a bit dodgy defending, Hoolahan is a bit part player, Ryan Bennett was dodgy last season and should really be a sub or go on-loan to help gain some more experience.

 

[Jim Smith 2,365]

[quote user="tom cavendish"][quote user="Jim Smith"]

[quote user="tom cavendish"][quote user="Indy_Bones"]It''s not about people being ''able'' to play in a position, it''s about excelling in that position. [/quote]Yes, this is what I keep saying. We have a lot of players that are ''master of none''. Next season will be a lot harder so we need more players that excel in a position rather than just being OK on a good day.The best players last season were:RuddyTierney E.BennettHowsonPilkingtonHoltThat leaves us needing about 5 new first-team players who excel in a position.

[/quote]

 

Ayala, Hoolahan, The other Bennett (not sure which one you are referring to above), Morison?

Plus all the others showed they are good enough if called upon.

 

[/quote]I see Morison as competition for Holt, Ayala was good on the ball but a bit dodgy defending, Hoolahan is a bit part player, Ryan Bennett was dodgy last season and should really be a sub or go on-loan to help gain some more experience.

 [/quote]

 

I''m all for ambition and positive thinking but you appear to have very unrealistic expectations as well as very harsh views on a few of our players. I thought Ayala looked class when he played. R Bennett had an iffy game v Man City buit otherwise did very well after being thrown in at the deep end. As for calling Hoolahan a bit part player......

There are probably only 2 or 3 teams in the prem who can afford players who "excel" in every position. The rest of us have a few eshining lights and then need to find others who prove themselves to be good enough. Thats what our players did last season and they will do it agai9n this season.

[York Canary 29]

Thinking about it more I reckon we may actually need a more experienced or established centre-back to play alongside Bennett or Ayala to give them confidence and guidance if things are going badly or pressure is high i.e when sh*t hits the fan we want a voice at the back and I think Zak led by example and seemed quite calm against most teams when he played, but now he''s gone obviously. Both Ward and Barnett have the habit of making a crucial mistake or being caught out and then the pressure would increase on their partner at the back if it was Bennett or Ayala. I think Martin is probably the best partner for either Bennett or Ayala because he seems quite calm and a good leader, but I still worry about his aerial ability and man-marking/strength sometimes. However, he was very good from I saw last season and I''d still want him to start with Bennett or Ayala, but if he got injured then I''d start worrying a bit.

[RvWs 4 year contract 0]

[quote user="norfolkbroadslim"]

Hughton''s comments on the pink un homepage didn''t fill me with much confidence and I can''t say that I agreed with them with regards to competition for places and no increase in quality needed[:(]

[/quote]Because we did so poorly last season?In my humble opinion we need a left back and a striker and anything else is a bonus.We''re fine in midfield in my opinion - although a winger is nice, but not an imperative.

[tom cavendish 0]

[quote user="Grant Holts 3 year contract"][quote user="norfolkbroadslim"]

Hughton''s comments on the pink un homepage didn''t fill me with much confidence and I can''t say that I agreed with them with regards to competition for places and no increase in quality needed[:(]

[/quote]Because we did so poorly last season?In my humble opinion we need a left back and a striker and anything else is a bonus.We''re fine in midfield in my opinion - although a winger is nice, but not an imperative.[/quote]Don''t forget that Naughton, Whitbread and Drury have all gone. Plus last season we lacked a defensive midfielder, a quick striker that can create his own chances and is a good finisher, and a winger to compete with E.Bennett and Pilks. That''s why I think we still need 6 new players.

[Lets be aving you! 0]

"Don''t forget that Naughton, Whitbread and Drury have all gone. Plus last season we lacked a defensive midfielder, a quick striker that can create his own chances and is a good finisher, and a winger to compete with E.Bennett and Pilks"

 

Whittaker has arguably replaced Naughton, a CB (Ryan Bennett) was brought in in Jan so that merely balances up Whitbread''s departure. We didn''t lack a defensive midfielder because we had Johnson.

 

Whittaker, R. Bennett & Johnson may not be the absolutele top-notch quality the OP seeks, but we almost certainly cannot afford such upgrades if at the same time we are to plug the gaping hole at left back and buy another striker.

 

There is no imperative need to have more than 2 wingers if, as is the case, we have a surfeit of midfielders, allowing us to play a slightly different formation with one winger or none.

 

We also need to bear in mind that Hughton will probably be looking to save some of the budget for January, to allow for injury contingencies.

[tom cavendish 0]

"Whittaker has arguably replaced Naughton"He isn''t as good as Naughtona CB (Ryan Bennett) was brought in in Jan so that merely balances up Whitbread''s departure. He isn''t as good as Whitbread."We didn''t lack a defensive midfielder because we had Johnson."He works hard but he isn''t very strong. We need one with a greater physical presence.

[Legend Iwan 30]

Good to see our new singings aren''t been written off before most people have watched them for a few games.

[Mahogany 0]

How do you know Whittaker isn''t as good as Naughton? Sure he was good, but hardly faultless. As for Bennett we paid up to 5m with addons, I don''t think he was bought in to warm the bench

[ricardo 7,447]

[quote user="Mahogany"]How do you know Whittaker isn''t as good as Naughton? Sure he was good, but hardly faultless. As for Bennett we paid up to 5m with addons, I don''t think he was bought in to warm the bench[/quote]I thought it was £3m

[Yellowbeagle 0]

Cant see how anyone would think we need 6 new signings. It must be nearly nailed on that we are going to look for a LB but apart from that i wouldnt expect much more than another two or three at the most, if the right players become avaliable.

[Mahogany 0]

As it was undisclosed I suppose we won''t know exactly how much Bennett cost, but this article says 3.5m + 2m in add ons:

http://www.peterboroughtoday.co.uk/sport/football/peterborough-united/ferguson-bennett-will-be-a-hit-at-norwich-1-3486470

[smooth 114]

Hughton said that Whittaker can play in every position along the back four, hence great cover. He is not going to be a starter. Simple as that, he has played some great games for Rangers but he is here for experience to bring to the back four and versatility in those last few minutes to close out a game.We need a centre half, a central midfielder, a striker and a winger. Full back will need to come in, in January.This division is so much harder that last year that if we have two injuries and a suspension we will be playing a very weak player, it is that simple. There is no question it was our teams cohesion that was our strongest element in keeping us up. We need a helping hand in our first 11. If you think 2-3 more players will be enough to keep us in this division you are mistaken.We need the spine of the team sorted with three starters and that wide threat... it seems like our midfield is built around not playing a traditional 4-4-2 but there is no question we lack pace, premiership pace... as SJ and EB are not premiership pace.I have no doubt that we will sign players this summer and alongside the two newbies I would think another 4.All this stupid talk that we have 2-3 spots available with the the 25 man squad is ridiculous, as a number of the players are so young they don''t count or they will be sent back out on loan. In fact it would not surprise me if more senior player may go out on loan to get game time, as the 25 man squad can be looked at once more in January.We cannot be complacent or put our eggs in one or two baskets, if Howson, Holt or Ruddy got injured our odds on staying up would broaden out very quickly. We need to bring in players and I am sure Hughton will.

[Lets be aving you! 0]

"If you think 2-3 more players will be enough to keep us in this division you are mistaken."


"I have no doubt that we will sign players this summer and alongside the two newbies I would think another 4."

 

Not trying to be facetious, but are you seriously suggesting in one post that 3 more players spells relegation, but 4 more spells safety?

 

That aside, everyone would love shedloads of money spent on shiny new players, and most on here are realistic enough to realise that a lot of our players are not top-notch Premier League class (Ward, C. Martin, Crofts, Barnett, etc.). Some may indeed go out on loan and save some wages.

 

But it''s an entirely matter to then get in replacements who will improve on what we have. These would be very expensive. Witness Rodriguez (7 million), Naughton (4 million + impossible wages), Gunter (Forest reportedly wanted 4 million), Snodgrass (about 7 million supposedly quoted), etc.

 

Personally, I would prefer the budget spent on 2, max. 3 more players, of good quality, rather than more of lesser quality. The bulk of our squad has already shown it is good enough, and does not need wholesale overhaul.

 

Perhaps those wanting 4+ new players could give some concrete examples of players they would like in and the likely prices, and how they would fit in with the budget (which by common consent seems to be 15-25 million, presumably then less wages/agents fees/signing-on fees, less Hughton compensation, less January budget, leaving something presumably at the very low end of that range ).

 

Otherwise isn''t it all a bit like politicking: promise the electorate more and more "investment" when want is meant is needless/reckless spending?

[Yellowbeagle 0]

[quote user="smooth"]Hughton said that Whittaker can play in every position along the back four, hence great cover. He is not going to be a starter. Simple as that, he has played some great games for Rangers but he is here for experience to bring to the back four and versatility in those last few minutes to close out a game.

We need a centre half, a central midfielder, a striker and a winger. Full back will need to come in, in January.

This division is so much harder that last year that if we have two injuries and a suspension we will be playing a very weak player, it is that simple. There is no question it was our teams cohesion that was our strongest element in keeping us up. We need a helping hand in our first 11. If you think 2-3 more players will be enough to keep us in this division you are mistaken.

We need the spine of the team sorted with three starters and that wide threat... it seems like our midfield is built around not playing a traditional 4-4-2 but there is no question we lack pace, premiership pace... as SJ and EB are not premiership pace.

I have no doubt that we will sign players this summer and alongside the two newbies I would think another 4.

All this stupid talk that we have 2-3 spots available with the the 25 man squad is ridiculous, as a number of the players are so young they don''t count or they will be sent back out on loan. In fact it would not surprise me if more senior player may go out on loan to get game time, as the 25 man squad can be looked at once more in January.

We cannot be complacent or put our eggs in one or two baskets, if Howson, Holt or Ruddy got injured our odds on staying up would broaden out very quickly. We need to bring in players and I am sure Hughton will.
[/quote]

So your worried about cover, yet would go into a season with Tierney as the only recognised left back, after the injury he''s just had? i dont mind Lappin filling in there for a game or even two, but without Drury last season we''d have been stuffed. We are much better covered in the other positions you mention and teams our size (Fulhams, West Broms) dont have 25 man squads all with premiership qaulity depth it''s just not financially viable and premiership standard players at clubs the size of ours expect to play matches not be in Norwich reserves. 

 

As for being mistaken on believing 2 or 3 more good signings would keep us up, yes i think thats very possible if they are good enough and improve us. I do agree we could do with abit more pace, but that is very very difficult although not impossible to find when you combine that with premiership ability, i''ll keep my fingers crossed on that one, that Hughton can pull a rabbit out of the hat.

[priceyrice 124]

Have to agree with you on this Tom:Positions defiantly need:LBCBWingerStrikerOther positions probably needRBDMmaybe another CBPlayers to leave:CroftsBarnettMaybe WesMaybe LappinC Martin

[Hog 0]

I can see just two more players coming in, prob a leftback and a striker

[priceyrice 124]

[quote user="Hog"]I can see just two more players coming in, prob a leftback and a striker[/quote]I sincerely hope not!! Would be very worried if that was the case, defence is a major problem and we have lost our two best defenders from last season while bringing in one player. Barnett and Ward have shown they are not up to this level, while ayala is still a very unknown quanitity. If we were to make one more definsive signing only then i would consider us favorites for relegation by quite a large margin.

[tom cavendish 0]

[quote user="Hog"]I can see just two more players coming in, prob a leftback and a striker[/quote]We have lost 3 first choice defenders in Naughton, Whitbread, and Drury. We have to replace them.

[Lets be aving you! 0]

"We have lost 3 first choice defenders in Naughton, Whitbread, and Drury. We have to replace them."

 

Any suggestions, Tom, and likely prices?