Who's going to be left out?

[Hank shoots Skyler 2,094]

After the completion of Snodgrass signing for us we now have a lot of midfielders, which means that surely one or two of the regulars from last year will have a lot less playing time.

I can''t imagine players like Surman, Fox and Johnson getting anywhere near as much game time, and also Hoolahan now has a lot of competition in his position with Butterfield and Howson both capable of playing in his spot, who do you think we''ll be seeing a lot less of next season?

It''s definitely going to be difficult for Hughton to keep everyone happy maybe offloading one or two of them could help things a little, but who? Crofts? Surman?

[Nexus_Canary 1,027]

Crofts it the obvious choice as he played a cameo at best last year.Surman, Fox and Johnson all have parts to play imho. Snodgrass will put pressure on Beano and Pilks which is healthy in all honesty. I think the big shock will be Wes tbh, I stated earlier that I expect him to move on by January. Hes not getting any younger and we need to stop rellying on him, players like Howson , Butterfield and Snodgrass suggest this is the plan.Id like to see another Striker come in. Holt can''t run the show, Jacko is fantastic impact, Vaughan is injury prone and lets be polite and just say I dont rate Morro. Unless Chrissy Martin has come leaps and bounds ( although again reports suggest hes playing more as a Attacking Mid / Support man than an out and out striker ) we really want to look at another Targetman type striker with a bit of pace.... ho hum bastard Saints, coulda done with Jay Rod !

[Salopian 1]

I certainly think that Crofts, Johnson, Korey, and Adeyemi will figure very little, and one or two may be leaving soon. I hope that Surs and Wes do get games. In their different ways they both contribute. I do not know what to make of Fox''s chances, - he has only one real tune, - the accurate long ball, but how far shall we need this?

 

I think it likely that Pilks and Bennet may alternate, as Snoddy could be preferred, or they could appear late in the game as impact subs, pulling tiring defences apart. I expect Jackson to do much the same.

 

Much depends on injuries, especially if there are one or two long term cases - like Pilks before he came to us, or Howson, or Butterfield. It may be very fortunate that we have such cover. Much also depends on whether CH will introduce some rotation, especially when the games come thick and fast.

[ROBFLECK 132]

Salopian, I agree with most of what you say. But at the moment everybody''s got a chance to impress. If Korey does well he''ll be part of the squad, same for Crofts... I''ve put question marks next to Fox''role too. He''s a good player, but how will he feature? Surman and Wes are far too good players to be left out imo, they''re both going to be important imo.

[Canaries Utd 0]

Sorry all you Fox lovers, he will spend a majority of this season on the bench/reserves.

I think we may see one or two surprise departures before the window closes.

[Old Shuck 188]

I fancy a 4-3-3.

 

Johnson-Howson-Snodgrass in the middle (no problem them getting an understanding) with Pilkington-Holt-E Bennett in attack.

 

Like with all the line ups we are playing about with at the moment, it means leaving players out-Wes, Surman to start with here-but injuries, suspensions, loss of form, players and formations for matches etc etc. Would think it fair to say Ruddy is the only nailed on starter for the season and after him ending it on 35 plus, the next clutch will all be on 25-30.

[Legend Iwan 30]

Canaries United, do you actually know that information about Fox or are you just trying to portray your opinion as fact?

[priceyrice 123]

It''s a tough one in the middle of the park. Firstly, i agree with Nexus about Wes, i think we could see him feature less and less and i would personally try and cash in on him, although he has been a big player for us over the years and deserves a lot of credit for what we have achieved.

I expect Johnson will be a huge player for us this season, he was brilliant at the start of last season and startied hitting that form again towards the end playing alongside Howson. He covers the pitch exceptionally when he plays and i imagine being back with Howson and Snodgrass will do wonders for his game. However, we need cover for Johnson and i expect we could see Korey Smith stay for that (if he''s under the 21 age limit) with Crofts moved on.

I think we could see less of Fox this season and perhaps Surman with Hughton preferring to play direct wingers, however if we are looking to play a 5 man midfield i think Fox could be effective.

It''s a really tough one really, we have a lot of quality in the middle of the park, i still think we are lacking another prem quality DM but our attacking midfielders are some of the best i have ever seen at NCFC. 

I think the only midfielder i would sell this summer would be Crofts, oh and Lappin so long as another LB is bought in, with Adeyami going out on loan.

[tom cavendish 0]

MIDFIELDERS:Elliott Bennett (RM)Robert Snodgrass (RM)Jacob Butterfield (FM)Wes Hoolahan (FM)Jonathan Howson (CM)David Fox (CM)Bradley Johnson (DM)* Need another defensive midfielderAnthony Pilkington (LM)Andrew Surman (LM)

[ricardo 7,402]

I expect it will be a lot like last year with plenty of squad rotation in the midfield area.Look at last years stats. Nobody was overused. Fortunately with have many options and the numbers to combat all situations.

[tom cavendish 0]

[quote user="ricardo"]I expect it will be a lot like last year with plenty of squad rotation in the midfield area.Look at last years stats. Nobody was overused. Fortunately with have many options and the numbers to combat all situations.[/quote]We need a new defensive central midfielder.

[Bethnal Yellow and Green 1,613]

[quote user="tom cavendish"][quote user="ricardo"]I expect it will be a lot like last year with plenty of squad rotation in the midfield area.

Look at last years stats. Nobody was overused. Fortunately with have many options and the numbers to combat all situations.
[/quote]

We need a new defensive central midfielder.
[/quote]

I think Howson will take that role, like he did against Celtic - defensive midfielders don''t have to be 6ft something and super powerful - it''s mainly about being in the right place at the right time.

[Canaries Utd 0]

[quote user="Legend Iwan"]Canaries United, do you actually know that information about Fox or are you just trying to portray your opinion as fact?[/quote]Calm down, its a message board which is 99% opinion based, you do the maths.

[Browno 36]

Well none will end up in the reserves as they''ve pulled out and replaced with an U21''s side, does Korey fit in for the U21''s?

[lake district canary 0]

[quote user="tom cavendish"][quote user="ricardo"]I expect it will be a lot like last year with plenty of squad rotation in the midfield area.

Look at last years stats. Nobody was overused. Fortunately with have many options and the numbers to combat all situations.
[/quote]

We need a new defensive central midfielder.
[/quote]

 

 

We don''t need any more midfielders!!

 

 

 

 

[Lets be aving you! 0]

"I think Howson will take that role, like he did against Celtic - defensive midfielders don''t have to be 6ft something and super powerful - it''s mainly about being in the right place at the right time."

 

This. Scott Parker-style.

[tom cavendish 0]

[quote user="Bethnal Yellow and Green"]

[quote user="tom cavendish"][quote user="ricardo"]I expect it will be a lot like last year with plenty of squad rotation in the midfield area.Look at last years stats. Nobody was overused. Fortunately with have many options and the numbers to combat all situations.[/quote]We need a new defensive central midfielder.[/quote]

I think Howson will take that role, like he did against Celtic - defensive midfielders don''t have to be 6ft something and super powerful - it''s mainly about being in the right place at the right time.

[/quote]We need Howson as the all-rounder covering a lot of ground and driving the team forward. We need a new defensive midfielder with a presence to make the team more difficult to break-down and to protect the defenders. The sort of player that could be brought on as a sub to see out a game in which NC are winning.

[Lets be aving you! 0]

Tom, you''re right Howson is an all-rounder. For me, he''s the midfielder with the best all-round game that we have.

 

I think it likely he''ll play a lot of the season in the DM role, with Johnson filling in occasionally. Short of a lot of injuries, I really can''t see Fox playing too many games this season, though no doubt I''ll be shot down for thinking such a thing.

[Monty13 2,252]

I think bethnal has it spot on. I think howson is the perfect player to take the ball off the back four and drive the play forward rather than in the more advanced role that Wes plays. I actually enjoyed watching the two play together against Celtic, and think they could very much play in the same team together, in fact I think having both on the pitch would be part of our strongest midfield. I think butterfield is the long term replacement/competition for Wes, but hes got plenty left in him in my opinion.

I feel sorry for crofts as he never really got a run in the team last year, but if space needed to be freed up he is probably the obvious choice. Korey again had no chance to prove his worth and could still be a good player for us. Surman has just signed a new contract so seems unlikely he would be leaving. I like fox but at some point I can see him being replaced with a player of better quality and again I see Howson as the number one candidate for his role.

If we are going to play five in midfield I would like to see Howson central, Snodgrass right, Pilkington left, Wes just behind strikers then either Johnson to be more solid or Surman/Butterfiled for greater attacking/creativity. Hard on Bennet but i think Snodgrass just became first choice right wing.

[Lavanche 0]

tom cavendish:

At the moment with Turner probably comming in we have no room for any players, if they are not under 21.

I cant see too many players heading out either.

5 Strikers: Holt, Morison, Vaughan, Jackson and Martin.

From these I can see only Martin going loan if he doesnt contribute more in next few pre-season games. Vaughan has been too good and Morison is safe because of his performance previous year, not to mention Holt''s status.

4 wingers: Snodgrass, Pilkington, E.Bennet, Surman.

None of these four are going anywhere

9 middlefielders: Hoolahan, Howson, Butterfield, Johnson, Fox,

Crofts, Lappin, Adeyemi, Smith.

Adeyemi and Smith could go for loan, but we cant count on it and there is lot of speculation about Crofts, but no real rumours. Dont see Lappin going if we dont get new LB. Rest are quite much untouchable.

4 fullbacks: Whittaker, Martin, Tierney, Francomb

Francomb loan is possible, but as stated earlier we cant count on it.

2 goalkeepers: Ruddy, Rudd (Steer is still underaged)

Dont see Rudd going loan.

With quick calculation it makes 24 players + Turner or other CB. So at this point we must see someone going out before we can get new players.

And bit more related to this topic I would guess Howson and Snodgrass play most of the games. Hoolahan, Surman, Pilkington and E.Bennet will have major role and Butterfield, Johnson and Fox will play when needed for tactical reasons. Butterfield can have major role if he can find a form without full preseason. Crofts, Adeyemi and Smith probably have their chances if not sent elsewhere.

If we really play with 5 middlefielders then I see no problem for Fox having major role, but as Howson have played in both training games deeper role, I cant see that there wouldn''t be a bit more offensive middlefielder with him (Snodgrass, Hoolahan, Butterfield) in 4-4-2.

Anyway hard to guess these things before preseason is over. Still I dont see our numerous middlefield as an issue. If it is a problem, it is positive problem.

[tom cavendish 0]

This would give a squad of 21 senior players that are already at the club (and give space for 4 more senior players).GOALKEEPERS: 3John Ruddy (G)Declan Rudd (G)Jed Steer (G) U21-------------------------------------DEFENDERS: 10Steven Whittaker (RB)* Need another right-backDaniel Sanchez Ayala (CD)Leon Barnett (CD)Ryan Bennett (CD)Elliott Ward (CD)Russell Martin (CD)* Need another central defenderMarc Tierney (LB)* Need another new left-back-------------------------------------MIDFIELDERS: 10Elliott Bennett (RM)Robert Snodgrass (RM)Jacob Butterfield (FM)Wes Hoolahan (FM)Jonathan Howson (CM)David Fox (CM)Bradley Johnson (DM)* Need another defensive midfielderAnthony Pilkington (LM)Andrew Surman (LM)-------------------------------------STRIKERS: 4Grant Holt (F)Steve Morison (F)Simeon Jackson (F)* Need another striker

[lincoln canary (& Golden Coppel) 0]

[quote user="Nexus_Canary"]Crofts it the obvious choice as he played a cameo at best last year.
Surman, Fox and Johnson all have parts to play imho. Snodgrass will put pressure on Beano and Pilks which is healthy in all honesty.
I think the big shock will be Wes tbh, I stated earlier that I expect him to move on by January. Hes not getting any younger and we need to stop rellying on him, players like Howson , Butterfield and Snodgrass suggest this is the plan.
Id like to see another Striker come in. Holt can''t run the show, Jacko is fantastic impact, Vaughan is injury prone and lets be polite and just say I dont rate Morro. Unless Chrissy Martin has come leaps and bounds ( although again reports suggest hes playing more as a Attacking Mid / Support man than an out and out striker ) we really want to look at another Targetman type striker with a bit of pace.... ho hum bastard Saints, coulda done with Jay Rod !
[/quote]

 

Poor old Wes! The most under appreciated player we''ve ever had! Judging by his display at Celtic he''s far from finished and if we moved him on we''d be losing a massive asset. Wes Hoolahan is a big player for us, to simply suggest Butterfield and Snodgrass will come in and just replace him is wrong and disrespecttful to a great servant. I get the impression Wes is happy to finish his career here, and I for one hope this happens. The good thing with Wes is that he doesn''t rely on pace and has never had any bad injuries, so age isn''t really going to effect him that dramatically.

[star_manic 0]

once butterfield is fit and up to speed i would expect wes to get few starts, mainly to be used as impact sub.crofts to be sold and korey loaned/sold from the plethora of midfielders. i am actually surprised that there seemingly have been no enquiries for our fringe players so far.

[lincoln canary (& Golden Coppel) 0]

[quote user="star_manic"]once butterfield is fit and up to speed i would expect wes to get few starts, mainly to be used as impact sub.crofts to be sold and korey loaned/sold from the plethora of midfielders. i am actually surprised that there seemingly have been no enquiries for our fringe players so far.
[/quote]

 

Really? A young un proven rookie to walk in ahead of one of our best players? Who also happens to still be in his prime. Doesn''t seem logical to me like.

[mrs miggins 0]

[quote user="Canaries Utd"]Sorry all you Fox lovers, he will spend a majority of this season on the bench/reserves. I think we may see one or two surprise departures before the window closes.[/quote]

 

where are you getting this inside information?

 

 

[tom cavendish 0]

Updated.GOALKEEPERS: 3John Ruddy (G)Declan Rudd (G)Jed Steer (G) U21-------------------------------------DEFENDERS: 10Steven Whittaker (RB)* Need another right-backDaniel Sanchez Ayala (CD)Leon Barnett (CD)Ryan Bennett (CD)Elliott Ward (CD)Russell Martin (CD)Michael Turner (CD)Marc Tierney (LB)* Need another left-back-------------------------------------MIDFIELDERS: 10Elliott Bennett (RM)Robert Snodgrass (RM)Jacob Butterfield (FM)Wes Hoolahan (FM)Jonathan Howson (CM)David Fox (CM)Bradley Johnson (DM)* Need another defensive midfielderAnthony Pilkington (LM)Andrew Surman (LM)-------------------------------------STRIKERS: 4Grant Holt (F)Steve Morison (F)Simeon Jackson (F)* Need another striker

[smooth 114]

Well we certainly have choice, but maybe not stand out players in regard to premiership quality and experience yet.But if I had to put down four players.Personally Howson is our best midfielder and hence for me will be that regular starter, I also would add the Snodgrass is our best wide player so both these two would start.Pilky was exceptional last season but his season ended with cameo''s so I wonder if his fitness levels can go for a full season. But there is no question he can perform in this league.Personally I would like to see a more defensive player come in to that midfield. So I still think we can look. Adeyemi can be that player in a few years but not right now.Surman, Fox, Hoolahan, EB, Butterfield and Crofts are fighting over places on the bench.I also agree with T.Cavendish a new striker is still needed and a full back over the course of this season.I too expect the odd player to leave on a fee, nothing amazing as few have set the world alight who I think would need to go. But we now have some very capable players in Snodgrass, Pilky and Howson (whatever we do don''t waste their talents by playing them out of position).

[peter-plastic 0]

 "An Under 21 player is defined as one who is under the age of 21 on 1st January in the year in which the season commences. For the 2012/13 campaign Under 21 players will have been born on or after 1st January 1991."

so under 21 on 1st Jan 2012. Actually Declan Rudd was born on 16th Jan 1991 and Kory on 31st so to my surprise they are still underage, which is an advantage. 2 players, Ayala and Ryan Bennett, who last season were "underage" are no longer, and now count to the oldies quota.

According to posts in this threads, most people have missed that Rudd won''t need to be included in the 25 man squad. Correct me if I''m wrong. I know this has been discussed before. Just no idea when.  

[peter-plastic 0]

just to add to my post above (Rudd is still under age) -  Based on a quick count up, I make it that, including the recent acquisitions, we now have exactly 25 oldies on the books. Based on the assumption that a couple of the current 25 may not make the final cut, there''s still some room for further ''over-21'' additions