Pissing money up a wall

[Thirsty Lizard 3,187]

"Sargent has scored TWO Premier League goals this season. If you don’t think another player could have beaten that at a snippet of the price then I completely disagree. Even someone like Lewis Grabban would have been more of a threat, and at a lower cost. Southampton paid that for Armstrong because they thought he would score the goals. It hasn’t worked. I think there are players in that league that are better than some of ours that wouldn’t have cost the earth."

 

Thank you for the evasive waffle Mr Johnson.

Go on then - don't keep us all in suspense - name them.

Obviously your suggestion of the 34 year old Lewis Grabban was a joke - you'll be aware I'm sure that in his career to date Grabban has played 24 Premier League games with a return of precisely 1 goal. 

Edited April 24, 2022 by Thirsty Lizard

[(Hoola)Han Solo 324]

12 minutes ago, Thirsty Lizard said:

"Sargent has scored TWO Premier League goals this season. If you don’t think another player could have beaten that at a snippet of the price then I completely disagree. Even someone like Lewis Grabban would have been more of a threat, and at a lower cost. Southampton paid that for Armstrong because they thought he would score the goals. It hasn’t worked. I think there are players in that league that are better than some of ours that wouldn’t have cost the earth."

 

Thank you for the evasive waffle Mr Johnson.

Go on then - don't keep us all in suspense - name them.

Obviously your suggestion of the 34 year old Lewis Grabban was a joke - you'll be aware I'm sure that in his career to date Grabban has played 24 Premier League games with a return of precisely 1 goal. 

Are you too thick to use the quote function? 

Piroe at Swansea, Adebayo at Luton and Weimann at Bristol City to name but three.

My argument is I think we could’ve bought a player from the Championship for less than we did Sargent who could have scored more than two league goals this season. However, I’m not sure you’re the brightest individual 😢

 

 

[Thirsty Lizard 3,187]

4 minutes ago, (Hoola)Han Solo said:

Are you too thick to use the quote function? 

Piroe at Swansea, Adebayo at Luton and Weimann at Bristol City to name but three.

My argument is I think we could’ve bought a player from the Championship for less than we did Sargent who could have scored more than two league goals this season. However, I’m not sure you’re the brightest individual 😢

 

 

😂😂

Oh dear oh dear, getting all abusive now we're losing the argument are we.

Look - if you can show me the post you made before this season started advocating buying one of Piroe, Adebayo or Weimann instead of Sargent I might take you seriously. Otherwise you're just speaking with total hindsight.

The first two that you mention might be credible options for the Championship next season, but there was absolutely nothing to suggest at the beginning of this season that they would be of any use to us whatsoever in the Premier League.

 

[(Hoola)Han Solo 324]

22 minutes ago, Thirsty Lizard said:

😂😂

Oh dear oh dear, getting all abusive now we're losing the argument are we.

Look - if you can show me the post you made before this season started advocating buying one of Piroe, Adebayo or Weimann instead of Sargent I might take you seriously. Otherwise you're just speaking with total hindsight.

The first two that you mention might be credible options for the Championship next season, but there was absolutely nothing to suggest at the beginning of this season that they would be of any use to us whatsoever in the Premier League.

 

There was no suggestion Josh Sargent would he any use in the Premier League either, but I see you glossing over that.

Btw, glad to see you worked out the quote thing mate 👍🏻

Edited April 24, 2022 by (Hoola)Han Solo

[Disco Dales Jockstrap 1,899]

24 minutes ago, Thirsty Lizard said:

😂😂

Oh dear oh dear, getting all abusive now we're losing the argument are we.

Look - if you can show me the post you made before this season started advocating buying one of Piroe, Adebayo or Weimann instead of Sargent I might take you seriously. Otherwise you're just speaking with total hindsight.

The first two that you mention might be credible options for the Championship next season, but there was absolutely nothing to suggest at the beginning of this season that they would be of any use to us whatsoever in the Premier League.

 

Interesting.

• You abuse him first, then have a go at him for abusing you.
• You ask him to name some players, he names Lewis G (probably as a joke), who you then mock for 1 goal in 24 appearances (874 minutes played)...compared to Josh's mighty 2 in 25 (1564 minutes played).
• You ask him to name more players, which he does, then you move the goal posts.

If you actually think the money we spent on Josh was good value, then I've got a bridge I'd like to sell you.

You're quite a shouty individual on here at the mo; you seem very angry about life. Maybe a change of career would help? Have you considered a life in the Church?

Anyway, I'm going to try and cheer you up a bit. Do you like spot the ball competitions? Thought you would. Try the one below:

I'll give you a clue -  IT'S NOT IN THE BL00DY GOAL.

OTBC

Edited April 24, 2022 by Disco Dales Jockstrap

[(Hoola)Han Solo 324]

11 minutes ago, Disco Dales Jockstrap said:

Interesting.

• You abuse him first, then have a go at him for abusing you.
• You ask him to name some players, he names Lewis G (probably as a joke), who you then mock for 1 goal in 24 appearances (874 minutes played)...compared to Josh's mighty 2 in 25 (1564 minutes played).
• You ask him to name more players, which he does, then you move the goal posts.

If you actually think the money we spent on Josh was good value, then I've got a bridge I'd like to sell you.

You're quite a shouty individual on here at the mo; you seem very angry about life. Maybe a change of career would help? Have you considered a life in the Church?

Anyway, I'm going to try and cheer you up a bit. Do you like spot the ball competitions? Thought you would. Try the one below:

I'll give you a clue -  IT'S NOT IN THE BL00DY GOAL.

OTBC

The Lewis Grabban one was half joking, but I’m convinced he’d have put that one away above. And it wouldn’t have cost us ten million quid for the privilege.

Unfortunately Lizard is getting all hurty and lashing out because I don’t rate Josh Sargent. I don’t. I think the money could have been better spent. If Thirsty thinks Joshua has been a worthwhile signing so far then I’m thinking he knows eff all about football.

Edited April 24, 2022 by (Hoola)Han Solo

[(Hoola)Han Solo 324]

32 minutes ago, Thirsty Lizard said:

😂😂

Oh dear oh dear, getting all abusive now we're losing the argument are we.

Look - if you can show me the post you made before this season started advocating buying one of Piroe, Adebayo or Weimann instead of Sargent I might take you seriously. Otherwise you're just speaking with total hindsight.

The first two that you mention might be credible options for the Championship next season, but there was absolutely nothing to suggest at the beginning of this season that they would be of any use to us whatsoever in the Premier League.

 

Btw, would you have suggested we sign Sargent in the summer before it emerged we were in for him? Honest answer please. Hindsight innit.

[glory.win or die. 270]

On 23/04/2022 at 18:15, Thirsty Lizard said:

So just like every other club we've had some transfers which have worked out and some that haven't.

In spite of your 'those at the top must be held to account' strictures Webber is still massively in credit on his overall transfer dealings.

Signing Pukki on a free was absolute genius.

Signing Krul on a free was absolute genius.

Signing Buendia for a total fee of £5 million was absolute genius.

I'm sorry if that doesn't fit in with the lynch mob's agenda on an evening where we've lost, but it's true anyway. 

We are a self funding club and part if our remit is to buy young players to sell on

Buendia is the only players out of an estimated 30 or 40 he signed, that worked out in that respect.

He was quick to criticise the previous regime but they signed Lewis,maddison,Godfrey, who were all sold for good money, the murphys were here from the previous regime sold for big money, aarons and cantwell are the only sellable players we currently have, both here before Webber.

 

[Indy 3,352]

Hmmm I wonder what might be said should Sargent scores near 20 goals in the champion ship next season?

Just remember young Pukki struggled to get going, now look at him, find the right club and system and you’re away.

Dowell Rowe and Tzolis will be important next year, can’t see Rashica staying!

[yellowrider120 806]

8 hours ago, Thirsty Lizard said:

Well lets think. Southampton are a well run club right?

They signed Adam Armstrong from Blackburn at the beginning of this season for a reported fee of £15 million. He scored 28 goals for Blackburn in the Championship last season.

So far this season he's made a total of 26 appearances for Saints (21 in the Premier League) and scored a grand total of 2 goals. 

Meanwhile Sargent (who cost 6 million less than Armstrong) has made a total of 28 appearances for us (25 in the Premier League) and scored a total of 4 goals. 

Armstrong is playing for a better team than Sargent, and one that could be expected to create more chances. So looking at actual real world evidence so far the only logical conclusion to draw is that signing Sargent was a better option than going for a proven Championship goal scorer like Armstrong. 

 

Two of which were against Bournemouth reserves pretty much. Sure the boy Armstrong has been (so far) a right flop for £15M but your inference must surely be that Sargent is likely to bag something like 28 goals for us next season? If that is your belief then if you make contact with me via private message I will be very willing to wager a significant sum (for your chosen charity) that he will not do so. The chances of Sargent getting anywhere near 28 goals in a Championship season is about as likely as the sun not rising in the morning!!  

[Badger 2,418]

With regards the 2019 signings - from the statutory accounts 18-19 Page 38:

"POST BALANCE SHEET EVENTS

Transfer of players’ registrations Subsequent to the year end the Group has acquired the registrations of players J Drmic, S Byram and R Bushiri, along with P Roberts, R Fährmann and I Amadou on season-long loans.

The Group is committed to payments of £6.2m in respect of these transactions with further payments due of £4.7m dependent on Club and/or player performance." 

The loans of Roberts, Fahrmann and Amadou + the purchase of Byram (reported at £750,000) cost us 6.2 million which suggests some pretty big loan payments. Wages were no doubt paid on top. I saw rumours that Fahrmann was on £80,000 a week but have no idea if this is true.

[Badger 2,418]

With regards the 2021 signings - from the statutory accounts 19-20 Page 44:

 

If we spent £14 million on Kabak's loan fee and Sargent it means we paid about £38 million for Giannoulis, Gibson, Gunn, PLM and Tzolis + the loan fees for Gilmour, Williams and Normann.

[Badger 2,418]

4 hours ago, (Hoola)Han Solo said:

Piroe at Swansea, Adebayo at Luton and Weimann at Bristol City to name but three

Weimann scored 17 goals in 113 appearances in the Premier League the last of which was 7 years ago. 

Adebayo has done ok - 16 goals for Luton this year and "looks a handful," but definitely not a Farke-type player.

Piroe is probably the type of player that best fitted our profile at the start of the season and has looked very good when I have seen him on TV. However, he only scored 2 goals in 18 appearances in the Eredivisie last season, which is a lower level that the Bundesliga. I think a move to the Premier league this year would have been too soon and he would probably have fallen into the Tzolis category (although not as highly rated as him at the time hence the £1 million fee).

It is incredibly hard to look at successful strikers in the Championship and identify whether they will be successful in the Premier League. Mitrovic* has torn the Championship apart this year (40 goals) but scored 3 goals in 27 appearances last time Fulham were in the Premier league and he is an out-and-out striker unlike Sargent. 

In total, he has scored only 28 goals in 128 Premier League appearances.

[Badger 2,418]

By way of comparison - Sheffield Utd have spent £50 million recruiting strikers for the Premier League - McBurnie, Mousset, Brewster. They have scored 8 goals in the championship this year between them!

Their top scorer is 36 year-old Billy Sharp who they paid £600,000 for in 2015.

[Mullet 293]

On 23/04/2022 at 18:15, Thirsty Lizard said:

So just like every other club we've had some transfers which have worked out and some that haven't.

In spite of your 'those at the top must be held to account' strictures Webber is still massively in credit on his overall transfer dealings.

Signing Pukki on a free was absolute genius.

Signing Krul on a free was absolute genius.

Signing Buendia for a total fee of £5 million was absolute genius.

I'm sorry if that doesn't fit in with the lynch mob's agenda on an evening where we've lost, but it's true anyway. 

I like you thirsty, but your argument is flawed. Since Pukki, Krul and Buendia pretty much all other transfers have been a fcuking disaster. By logic those 3 genius signings have proven to be absolute luck. 

Webber has splunked the money from 2 premier league campaigns and parachute payments and made us progressively worse.

So regards the 3 good signings he has made, the rest are sh1t. Webber is an incompetent tool who got lucky on a couple of occasions.

[Move Klose 303]

1 minute ago, Mullet said:

I like you thirsty, but your argument is flawed. Since Pukki, Krul and Buendia pretty much all other transfers have been a fcuking disaster. By logic those 3 genius signings have proven to be absolute luck. 

Webber has splunked the money from 2 premier league campaigns and parachute payments and made us progressively worse.

So regards the 3 good signings he has made, the rest are sh1t. Webber is an incompetent tool who got lucky on a couple of occasions.

Excellent - Krul, Buendia, Pukki

Good - Hanley, Skipp

There was a few who did a job like Mario, Stiepermann, Trybull etc.

Rubbish - Husband, Watkins, Marshall, Heise, Fahrmann, Roberts, Drmic.... this list goes on and on

[Mullet 293]

6 minutes ago, Move Klose said:

Excellent - Krul, Buendia, Pukki

Good - Hanley, Skipp

There was a few who did a job like Mario, Stiepermann, Trybull etc.

Rubbish - Husband, Watkins, Marshall, Heise, Fahrmann, Roberts, Drmic.... this list goes on and on

I dread to think how many poor signings Webber has made. When you repeatedly blow your recruitment budget on crap you end up sinking. The only PL club a bigger joke than ours is Everton. Webber has done some good things for the club but he has worsened our squad of players beyond belief. 

[Move Klose 303]

11 minutes ago, Mullet said:

I dread to think how many poor signings Webber has made. When you repeatedly blow your recruitment budget on crap you end up sinking. The only PL club a bigger joke than ours is Everton. Webber has done some good things for the club but he has worsened our squad of players beyond belief. 

This has probably been said a million times on here but imagine spending £10+ million on 'one for the future in Tzolis. Not really in a position to be spending that money on someone who might be good in a year or 2.

And Sargent 13 goals in 74 games.

 

[king canary 7,718]

Colour me skeptical in that Kabak number. There were rumours Schalke were going to terminate his contract to get his wages off the books after relegation so I doubt they had the leverage to be demanding £5m loan fee, unless we're paying none of his wages.

[hertfordyellow 460]

On 23/04/2022 at 18:09, cambridgeshire canary said:

Best part about Sargent is that according to quite a few insiders we were warned by many to not buy him but Webber ignored it and did so anyways 

Source?

[Thirsty Lizard 3,187]

1 hour ago, Move Klose said:

Excellent - Krul, Buendia, Pukki

Good - Hanley, Skipp

There was a few who did a job like Mario, Stiepermann, Trybull etc.

Rubbish - Husband, Watkins, Marshall, Heise, Fahrmann, Roberts, Drmic.... this list goes on and on

🙂 🙂 The job they did was get us promoted to the Premier League in a season when nobody gave us a hope in hell. But congratulations on your determined attempts to talk down their achievements. 

[Thirsty Lizard 3,187]

6 hours ago, (Hoola)Han Solo said:

The Lewis Grabban one was half joking, but I’m convinced he’d have put that one away above. And it wouldn’t have cost us ten million quid for the privilege.

Unfortunately Lizard is getting all hurty and lashing out because I don’t rate Josh Sargent. I don’t. I think the money could have been better spent. If Thirsty thinks Joshua has been a worthwhile signing so far then I’m thinking he knows eff all about football.

If you'd ever watched Grabban play you'd understand that he would never have been in position to put that one away.  The reason being that that chance only occurred in the first place because Sargent ran his legs off chasing a lost cause to put the Brighton defender and goalie under pressure.

Grabban was a good player for us at Championship level and a decent finisher, but running hard, chasing lost causes and closing down the opposition defence certainly weren't strong points of his. (unlike Sargent - for all his other deficiencies at Premier League level). 

Edited April 24, 2022 by Thirsty Lizard

[Thirsty Lizard 3,187]

6 hours ago, (Hoola)Han Solo said:

There was no suggestion Josh Sargent would he any use in the Premier League either, but I see you glossing over that.

Btw, glad to see you worked out the quote thing mate 👍🏻

You have a staggering ability to miss the point. I'm not claiming Sargent has been anything other than a big disappointment this season - it's just your blithe assertion that it would have been an easy job to find a better alternative from the Championship that I'm taking issue with. 

(And no - I wouldn't have recommended signing Sargent before the season began - the reason being that I'd never heard of him at that point). 

[Ian 1,141]

Way more to come from Sargeant.

[Mengo 826]

2 hours ago, Mullet said:

I like you thirsty, but your argument is flawed. Since Pukki, Krul and Buendia pretty much all other transfers have been a fcuking disaster. By logic those 3 genius signings have proven to be absolute luck. 

Webber has splunked the money from 2 premier league campaigns and parachute payments and made us progressively worse.

So regards the 3 good signings he has made, the rest are sh1t. Webber is an incompetent tool who got lucky on a couple of occasions.

Webber has splunked the money from 2 premier league campaigns and parachute payments and made us progressively worse.

So regards the 3 good signings he has made, the rest are sh1t. Webber is an incompetent tool who got lucky on a couple of occasions.

Perfect description  + fraud.🤣. Chancer comes to mind as well.

Edited April 24, 2022 by Mengo

[Move Klose 303]

25 minutes ago, Thirsty Lizard said:

🙂 🙂 The job they did was get us promoted to the Premier League in a season when nobody gave us a hope in hell. But congratulations on your determined attempts to talk down their achievements. 

Isn't what I meant. Yer they did well at championship level. They did their job for a season like Stiepermann and Trybull then were massively out of their depth in the premier league then barely used in the next championship season.

[Badger 2,418]

1 hour ago, Thirsty Lizard said:

blithe

I long time since I have heard this word used. 

👍

[Badger 2,418]

52 minutes ago, Mengo said:

Webber has splunked the money from 2 premier league campaigns and parachute payments and made us progressively worse.

So regards the 3 good signings he has made, the rest are sh1t. Webber is an incompetent tool who got lucky on a couple of occasions.

Perfect description  + fraud.🤣. Chancer comes to mind as well.

So even though we have the worst owners in the world and we are uniquely poor, the person responsible for football operations, who has got us promoted twice is useless.

Does this mean that our completely useless owners could have kept is up with a competent sporting director. Or:

Our incompetent sporting director could have kept us up if we had adequate owners.

[sgncfc 1,265]

I don't understand all this revisionism. At the time we all thought we had a chance that these players were good enough, including Sargent. They're not. We know that now. They're just not good enough for the EPL. We don't yet know if they're good enough for the Championship, but it is logical to think that they have more chance of being able to compete in that league. Even if they do and we come up again, we would need a whole new team to have a chance of staying.

I actually have more of a problem with our coaching staff thinking that players like Maclean and Gibson would be good enough when they hadn't done it in that league previously. Not just them either - Hanley has done OK, but there was no reason to think he would.

Only Pukki has performed to expectation, maybe Byram. Every other player, including Krul, Aarons, Dimi, Cantwell etc have failed dismally. These were players we expected to step up - they haven't. It isn't all down to the recruitment.

There are lots of players who need to move on now.

[SwearyCanary 1,179]

1 minute ago, sgncfc said:

I don't understand all this revisionism. At the time we all thought we had a chance that these players were good enough, including Sargent. They're not. We know that now. They're just not good enough for the EPL. We don't yet know if they're good enough for the Championship, but it is logical to think that they have more chance of being able to compete in that league. Even if they do and we come up again, we would need a whole new team to have a chance of staying.

I actually have more of a problem with our coaching staff thinking that players like Maclean and Gibson would be good enough when they hadn't done it in that league previously. Not just them either - Hanley has done OK, but there was no reason to think he would.

Only Pukki has performed to expectation, maybe Byram. Every other player, including Krul, Aarons, Dimi, Cantwell etc have failed dismally. These were players we expected to step up - they haven't. It isn't all down to the recruitment.

There are lots of players who need to move on now.

Sorry, gave a clanger away on sat but I’m not having Krul on this list surely? Who in earth is better that’s available? He’s been picked for the Dutch squad multiple times this season