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Read this, they seem like a lovely outfit with such noble intentions!

Pretty shameful MB is jumping ship to a US company who are openly suffocating the UK's local media outlets.

Money corrupts everyone I guess.

 

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4 hours ago, ron obvious said:

I like Bailey, but I''m not sure I'd want to pay for him.

So It's farewell Michael from me.

 

I like him too, but I don't pay for any news or sports media...

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6 hours ago, Dogbo Daggins said:

I like him too, but I don't pay for any news or sports media...

And that is why we end up with websites full of clickbait, listcles and stuff about Man United.

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12 minutes ago, king canary said:

And that is why we end up with websites full of clickbait, listcles and stuff about Man United.

I'm sorry my decisions make you want to read stuff about Man United. I understand that you can get therapy for that 😝

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34 minutes ago, king canary said:

And that is why we end up with websites full of clickbait, listcles and stuff about Man United.

And also free websites with some very astute & interesting tactical analysis, links to which have been posted by myself & others on here.

 

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I believe it will be £4.99 a month after the preliminary offer ends, so I won't be buying it either.  Now if the Pinkun were to charge a small amount for their coverage, I might pay for that, as it is actually very good, but giving money to huge corporations, especially American based ones with dubious ethics, is something I would avoid if at all possible.

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Posted (edited)

That ‘MO’ sounds rather charming....so local media brings guys in and trains them up, who they then ‘steal’ to suck the locals dry.  Can no one else see anything wrong - morally or otherwise - in this model?

Not for me - I’m not so desperate to read MBs ramblings that I’ll pay separately for them; it is an interesting one to see how it pans out but my feeling/hope is that this Athletic thing doesn’t work out over here.

Edited by Branston Pickle

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7 minutes ago, ron obvious said:

And also free websites with some very astute & interesting tactical analysis, links to which have been posted by myself & others on here.

 

Not many of them and often they are difficult to sustain, especially now people use ad-blockers. 

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9 minutes ago, Branston Pickle said:

That ‘MO’ sounds rather charming....so local media brings guys in and trains them up, who they then ‘steal’ to suck the locals dry.  Can no one else see anything wrong - morally or otherwise - in this model?

Not for me - I’m not so desperate to read MBs ramblings that I’ll pay separately for them; it is an interesting one to see how it pans out but my feeling/hope is that this Athletic thing doesn’t work out over here.

I don’t understand this attitude at all! You hope it doesn’t work out? You hope the standard of football journalism in this country isn’t improved? For me purely as a consumer of quality content, competition in the market can only be a good thing.

As king canary says, competition for advertising dollars solely based on eyeballs has lowered the standard of journalism, not just in football but across news media.

Local journos know if they work hard at their craft there are more lucrative options available to them, theoretically improving the quality of the local paper. At our level, MB leaving has opened an opportunity for a young fresh perspective as well (Conner Southwell of MFW?).

Its not about reading just MB either for me, there is other PL content, sport business, NFL, it goes on. 

And as for the CEOs comments posted above - sensational, controversial comments to grab attention for his growing business.

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42 minutes ago, Bethnal Yellow and Green said:

What did you do before the internet? Steal newspapers?

I can't remember what happened this morning, let alone think back nearly 20 years 😮😉

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30 minutes ago, WD40 said:

I don’t understand this attitude at all! You hope it doesn’t work out? You hope the standard of football journalism in this country isn’t improved? For me purely as a consumer of quality content, competition in the market can only be a good thing.

As king canary says, competition for advertising dollars solely based on eyeballs has lowered the standard of journalism, not just in football but across news media.

Local journos know if they work hard at their craft there are more lucrative options available to them, theoretically improving the quality of the local paper. At our level, MB leaving has opened an opportunity for a young fresh perspective as well (Conner Southwell of MFW?).

Its not about reading just MB either for me, there is other PL content, sport business, NFL, it goes on. 

And as for the CEOs comments posted above - sensational, controversial comments to grab attention for his growing business.

That’s all guff - do you really think killing off local media would be good?

You are either accidentally or deliberately misunderstanding me, which is your loss.

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2 minutes ago, Branston Pickle said:

That’s all guff - do you really think killing off local media would be good?

You are either accidentally or deliberately misunderstanding me, which is your loss.

It appears you are misunderstanding the point, as I’ve said there is a path where this improves local journalism.

The local paper plays a hugely important role in the community, giving coverage to local issues because who else will? But it’s not a protected industry, so must adapt with the times. 

I will continue to read the Pinkun articles of course, but I now have another quality source of material. That’s my choice whether to pay for it or not, and I respect your choice in not supporting it. But there isn’t anything wrong with the model providing choice and competition.

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13 minutes ago, Branston Pickle said:

That’s all guff - do you really think killing off local media would be good?

You are either accidentally or deliberately misunderstanding me, which is your loss.

I'd be interested to know how many on here use this site with an adblocker or actually buy an EDP/Evening News.

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7 minutes ago, king canary said:

I'd be interested to know how many on here use this site with an adblocker or actually buy an EDP/Evening News.

Research consistently finds that people want good local news/sports but aren't prepared to pay for it - this just isn't sustainable. 

As someone who has worked in media most of my life I'm obvious bias, but the free news/sports model that has come in since the dawn of the internet is most likely going to be a blip. The long term future will be back to subscription models. There will always be a few sites that offer everything for free, but they will offer up things of the quality of Read Norwich and not be worth the time it takes to read them. 

I suspect that within 5 years the PinkUn will be behind a paywall -the EDP may remain free to view, but the sports probably won't. Wonder if people will pay to use this message board?

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14 minutes ago, Bethnal Yellow and Green said:

I suspect that within 5 years the PinkUn will be behind a paywall -the EDP may remain free to view, but the sports probably won't. Wonder if people will pay to use this message board?

I would, it is my main source of local stuff set up locally to Norwich that I can't get anywhere else and the pinkun video stuff is excellent.

I would certainly not pay for pseudo coverage from huge corporation set up in the USA who is blatantly buying up the talent to try and ruin smaller more localised media.

It's the same principle as using your local businesses, even if they cost slightly more - use them or lose them.

 

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5 minutes ago, lake district canary said:

I would, it is my main source of local stuff set up locally to Norwich that I can't get anywhere else and the pinkun video stuff is excellent.

I would certainly not pay for pseudo coverage from huge corporation set up in the USA who is blatantly buying up the talent to try and ruin smaller more localised media.

It's the same principle as using your local businesses, even if they cost slightly more - use them or lose them.

 

Many 'Local' papers aren't local anymore though, and our a large parent company who run a bunch of papers from a centralised office. Archant are one of the last 'local' papers.

The future of local papers is probably companies like the Athletic, who employ people all over the country to do the stories, but don't have much of a physical presence in an area - the business models are very hard to make work otherwise. The revenue from advertising in papers has completely fallen through the floor and most people who subscribe for physical papers and pay money for the content are over 60. There is going to be a huge shift as the older generation, who continue to subscribe to papers, start to pass away and no one is regularly paying money. 

For what it is worth, I don't think the Athletic are trying to replace local papers in the UK. The quote was about the US, where local news stuff is in an even worse state than here and reporting is of a shockingly poor quality. There is definitely space for both the Athletic, and MB writing long form more thoughtful pieces, and the PinkUn doing the day-to-day reporting on matches/press conferences etc. 

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1 hour ago, Bethnal Yellow and Green said:

Research consistently finds that people want good local news/sports but aren't prepared to pay for it - this just isn't sustainable. 

As someone who has worked in media most of my life I'm obvious bias, but the free news/sports model that has come in since the dawn of the internet is most likely going to be a blip. The long term future will be back to subscription models. There will always be a few sites that offer everything for free, but they will offer up things of the quality of Read Norwich and not be worth the time it takes to read them. 

I suspect that within 5 years the PinkUn will be behind a paywall -the EDP may remain free to view, but the sports probably won't. Wonder if people will pay to use this message board?

One of the worst effects of the internet has been people seemingly thinking they don't need to pay for things anymore. Music, journalism, movies, sports- why pay for it when you can get it for free? Fine if you'll put up with the adverts- then come the ad blockers, as why should I have to see adverts when reading my free content? Then ad revenues decrease so adverts become more and more invasive and content gets slighter and slighter and clicks become more important so you get reheated transfer gossip and boring lists with no original insight.

All a race to the bottom because people have decided they deserve this stuff for free.

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17 hours ago, Norwich R Us said:

Read this, they seem like a lovely outfit with such noble intentions!

Pretty shameful MB is jumping ship to a US company who are openly suffocating the UK's local media outlets.

Money corrupts everyone I guess.

 

IMG_20190805_220907.jpg

This is a very bombastic approach and quite a harsh thing to say.

But the reality is... It's quite true.

I work in media and publishing too. Print is almost dead, as much as I hate to admit it, and we will see a shift to this kind of thing more and more now. The only print titles that do well for the most part are ones that are subscribed to, such as member's magazines. Things that have beautiful photography, no ads and are more like a book of art or something also sell well on newsstand and in artsy stores. Obviously, they have thought-provoking content too which helps!

Who wants to start an online, subscribed to publishing platform/company with me?!

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My local newsagent told me recently that he used to have over 400 people buy an EDP every day, only a coupe of years ago, now it's only 150 odd.

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6 hours ago, king canary said:

I'd be interested to know how many on here use this site with an adblocker or actually buy an EDP/Evening News.

I deliberately turned mine off as I do realise these places need funding somehow. Yes the adverts can be a pain, jumping all over the place as they load, (I've been in the Announcement section about 1000 times), but if everyone uses ad-blockers these sites will die or go behind a paywall.

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I can understand that it is galling for those that work in the media that there is so much material for free. Nevertheless if they expect people to pay for media, it would have to improve the standard of what is delivered.

I have taken out digital subscriptions in the past but stopped because of the low standard of what is printed. As someone of an "older vintage" pretty clear to me that the standard of what is printed has declined sharply over my lifetime - most newspapers - even broadsheets - are little more that "opinion comics" designed to feed their readers prejudice. In younger days, newspapers used to print the full text of speeches/ parliamentary debates etc and carefully separated fact from opinion. Even the tabloids had investigatory journalists - anyone remember John Pilger and Paul Foot, both writing for the Daily Mirror? 

I will continue to get my news for free - by getting a free newspaper with a small spend from Waitrose. 

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31 minutes ago, Badger said:

I can understand that it is galling for those that work in the media that there is so much material for free. Nevertheless if they expect people to pay for media, it would have to improve the standard of what is delivered.

 

Having subscribed to the Athletic I'd suggest that the standard is much higher than most.

I read an excellent article this morning about the tactical approached of the three promoted teams, a good piece about the Harry Maguire move and a detailed breakdown of the Philadelphia Eagles training camp. Well worth my £2.50 a month.

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Posted (edited)
11 minutes ago, king canary said:

Having subscribed to the Athletic I'd suggest that the standard is much higher than most.

I read an excellent article this morning about the tactical approached of the three promoted teams, a good piece about the Harry Maguire move and a detailed breakdown of the Philadelphia Eagles training camp. Well worth my £2.50 a month.

All very well, but if you just want to read about Norwich stuff, you are paying for a whole lot of extra stuff you don't want.  The best thing about the Pinkun is that it is just about Norwich, with a smattering of stuff about local clubs which is interesting too.  Will Athletic (the name is enough to put me off) have articles on King's Lynn, Gorleston etc?  I doubt it.  MB may have gone somewhere more "exciting", but will it be better for those who are only interested in Norwich?  I doubt that too.

£2.50 for Athletic (what a dull name for an "exciting" project) or £2.50 for the Pinkun? No brainer for me. Pinkun - and if they need to introduce that fee to help them thrive, then bring it on.  Stuff Athletic and it's corporate attempt at world domination. Keep things local.

 

Edited by lake district canary

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43 minutes ago, Badger said:

I can understand that it is galling for those that work in the media that there is so much material for free. Nevertheless if they expect people to pay for media, it would have to improve the standard of what is delivered.

I have taken out digital subscriptions in the past but stopped because of the low standard of what is printed. As someone of an "older vintage" pretty clear to me that the standard of what is printed has declined sharply over my lifetime - most newspapers - even broadsheets - are little more that "opinion comics" designed to feed their readers prejudice. In younger days, newspapers used to print the full text of speeches/ parliamentary debates etc and carefully separated fact from opinion. Even the tabloids had investigatory journalists - anyone remember John Pilger and Paul Foot, both writing for the Daily Mirror? 

I will continue to get my news for free - by getting a free newspaper with a small spend from Waitrose. 

I suppose it is a bit chicken and egg though. Many of the papers behind paywalls had already massively reduced the number of staff they had before establishing those paywalls and never rehired to replace them. 

Papers like the FT which always paywalled have managed to maintain the high quality of its journalism. 

We will never return to the old days of massive newspaper empires with circulations of 3 or 4 million. But news being funded by advertising just isn’t a sustainable model. You can see how it has lead to where we are in the world today with people believing highly unreliable media that is chasing clicks through sensationalism. 

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15 minutes ago, king canary said:

Having subscribed to the Athletic I'd suggest that the standard is much higher than most.

I read an excellent article this morning about the tactical approached of the three promoted teams, a good piece about the Harry Maguire move and a detailed breakdown of the Philadelphia Eagles training camp. Well worth my £2.50 a month.

Well why didn't you copy and paste it on here?    

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28 minutes ago, lake district canary said:

All very well, but if you just want to read about Norwich stuff, you are paying for a whole lot of extra stuff you don't want.  The best thing about the Pinkun is that it is just about Norwich, with a smattering of stuff about local clubs which is interesting too.  Will Athletic (the name is enough to put me off) have articles on King's Lynn, Gorleston etc?  I doubt it.  MB may have gone somewhere more "exciting", but will it be better for those who are only interested in Norwich?  I doubt that too.

£2.50 for Athletic (what a dull name for an "exciting" project) or £2.50 for the Pinkun? No brainer for me. Pinkun - and if they need to introduce that fee to help them thrive, then bring it on.  Stuff Athletic and it's corporate attempt at world domination. Keep things local.

 

Well you don't have to subscribe...

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32 minutes ago, lake district canary said:

All very well, but if you just want to read about Norwich stuff, you are paying for a whole lot of extra stuff you don't want.  The best thing about the Pinkun is that it is just about Norwich, with a smattering of stuff about local clubs which is interesting too.  Will Athletic (the name is enough to put me off) have articles on King's Lynn, Gorleston etc?  I doubt it.  MB may have gone somewhere more "exciting", but will it be better for those who are only interested in Norwich?  I doubt that too.

£2.50 for Athletic (what a dull name for an "exciting" project) or £2.50 for the Pinkun? No brainer for me. Pinkun - and if they need to introduce that fee to help them thrive, then bring it on.  Stuff Athletic and it's corporate attempt at world domination. Keep things local.

 

Let’s be honest. A lot of the Pinkun Norwich content is reheated quotes from the same interview split across 3/4 articles over the week. And I’m sure that’s because they are working to tight deadlines and it’s all they have access to. I like the match reports and I really like their video and podcast stuff, but MB may very well have taken the secret sauce of that with him. 

Sadly I grew up outside of the fine city so don’t have the inclination to follow the likes of Wroxham Town. But I would like to read more quality, in depth pieces about football generally.

You are right about attempt at world domination, that will be their aim, but I hope that there is a groundswell to fight back and local press / other competitors up their game so I pay for them too!

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it looks like a collection of Journos that have been enticed away from some serious papers like Hay from YEP , Amy Lawrence etc who would have enjoyed access because of their national or regional employment . I wonder if MB will enjoy so much access. It’s in NCFC’s interest to have their connection with the local papers , but will the club be so bothered about him now? Presume these guys are all getting paid more? Not sure I can see this model working . Will MB get a scoop the Paddy doesn’t ? Doubt it . 

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