Worse than Hughton.

[lake district canary 4,779]

The reaction on here to the transfer window dealings, is worse than the reaction to Hughton. The negativity is utterly ridiculous given that we have plenty of quality through the squad.  We''ve brought in several new players and improved across the squad - lost Johnson (who would not have featured much anyway) and sent one or two on loan to get match play.

If we are not careful, this over reaction will affect the players and undermine the manager (they are not blind to social media and fans reactions) and contribute to another dire premier league season with dissent from fans and an undercurrent of negativity that will be similar - or worse than the second season under Hughton. 

Think this is wrong?  Mark my words, some of you are so bound up by hype and fear about being in this league, that it is affecting your judgement.   I know some of you don''t like being criticised by someone like me, but unless you get over yourselves, this season will go sour.  AN is a great young manager - and he needs positivity from everyone, fans included.  

The transfer window is an artificially created mechanism which puts incredible pressure on players and clubs. Get over it. We''ve got Mulumbu, Dorrans, Wisdom, Mbokani, Brady and Jarvis. All of which could be in the first team. Any more, and the first team would risk lose some of it''s continuity.   Bournemouth have bought more, but already people are saying they have bought too many.  

I''m shocked at the reaction on here, by even some more sensible posters.  I''ll get slammed for this thread, but the reality is that the fact that we didn''t get one or two possible targets is not the end of the world.  We are still minnows in terms of finances in this league so cannot attract the players we would ideally like.   

Where is your positivity gone from last season? I hope some of you will calm down enough over the next few days and realise that our first 11 when all fit will likely be -                       RuddyWisdom Martin Bassong OlssonRedmond Mulumbu Dorrans Brady                      Hoolahan                      MbokaniBehind that is a squad with very good proven players as back up.

On top of that, there is another transfer window in January - and we aren''t the only club who has struggled to bring players in this time.  Look at the attacking possibilities of the team above.  It''s exciting going forwards. Many of you complained about Hughton being too defensive, so focus on that attacking force, not the defence.  We will let in goals, bound to - but as in the last season - it is goals we want to see - and the team and manager will be focused on this. 

Get real. The premier league is a challenge. Rise to it. 

[Carra Rud 17]

Are you a bot?

[Wacky Waving Inflatable Arm Flailing Tube Man 4,529]

When you say ''worse than Hughton'', I''m guessing you''re referring to the negativity from fans rather than the transfer dealings. The atmosphere during Hughton''s last days was toxic and there''s no doubt it affected the players, but I''m sure we''ll have calmed down about the transfer fiasco by the time Bournemouth come to town. If we ship a few goals that day though, then I can see some discontent building.

It does seem though that the transfer business, in particularly the lack of defensive reinforcements, has killed the positivity we had though. I think we are well within our rights to be asking questions as to why we haven''t signed a centre back, and your reasoning of: ''we are still minnows in terms of finances in this league so cannot attract the players we would ideally like'' doesn''t really wash. It isn''t the fact we have missed out on top targets, it is that we haven''t signed ANY targets.

I do agree though that we need to stay as positive as possible. I know I''ve been whinging like there''s no tomorrow for last 12/14 hours, but as I said before, we''ll get it out of our system in a few days. Hopefully.

[Stowcanary 0]

Johnson may not have featured as much this season, as shown by the games so far this season, but he was a versitile player. Not only this but he had a real passion for playing for Norwich city and you need players like this in the squad. Its fine just putting a fully fit 11 down on paper, but injuries and suspensions are inevitable, you can''t tell me you''re happy with just Ryan Bennett (who is injury prone himself) as Cb backup?! We have a half decent squad but they needed a few quality additions to cope with the rigures of the Premier league, and for whatever reason the club have failed to get these in.

[Van wink 2,994]

You totally misjudged the situation with Hughton LDC and you are doing the same now.

[Hairy Canary 737]

Not often I agree with you LDC but I certainly do on this occasion. Well said. Every word.

[thedarkside 0]

Sensible approach to the issues and I agree totally. I imagine that a number of the ''lower'' PL clubs probably feel the same way.

[Grant Holts Moustache 108]

A very sensible and well reasoned post. We were one centre back away from a very good window. It happens. You would think the club had sat on their hands all window when the evidence is clearly to the contrary.

[Chippy Minton 10]

Agree with OP.

The sooner we get back to concentrating on football the better.

Apart from cover in defence I think we did what we could to get players in. If they dont want to come what more can we do.

As for bidding in increments, that''s the way it works. Spurs for Berahino, Real Madrid for De Gea, Chelsea for Stones all did the same.

We now have a (arguably better) squad for AN to work with until January at least. Let''s get behind them.

[Guest]

I don''t think anyone disagrees that we''ve brought some good players, but the fact is that key areas were not strengthened.

For example, if Hooper and Grabban are wantaway, that leaves us with two strikers doesn''t it? Neither of whom are prolific goalscorers or poachers. With just one or two injuries/suspensions in defence (which is quite likely over a 4/5 month period), do we have the squad depth to cover them?

In addition, by effectively getting rid of Johnson when the "price was right", a large character and player/fan favourite has been taken out of the squad. Couple this with the obvious lack of signing in certain areas, and what effect is that going to have on the dressing room?

How many people are going to be peeved and upset that last seasons POTS (and a player who advertised the new kit, presumably his name on a lot of new shirts) has been shown the door so unceremoniously? It might seem a minor thing, but the one thing we did have was a happy and unified fan base which can count for a lot (12th man and all that). Do we still have it?

Let''s not pretend this was a highly successful transfer window. We did okay, but there is still a major lack of depth in certain squad areas and I think it''s perfectly understandable if people want to point that out rather than pretend everything is wonderful.

[lake district canary 4,779]

[quote user="Vanwink"]You totally misjudged the situation with Hughton LDC and you are doing the same now.[/quote]It is and will always be my opinion that with the advent of social media, bandwagons quickly grow from small concerns to massive  over reraction. Players look at social mediua too and see fans'' reactions on it too.  Whatever happened with Hughton,  happened imo because the whole atmosphere around the place got too negative, social media was poisonous, the players didn''t appear unified - and Hughton wasn''t strong enough to turn it round. 

If we are not careful the same thing will happen. The big difference this time, however, is that AN appears to be a stronger manager than Hughton. I do hope so, because he has to keep the players unified in spite of all the background noise that is going on.   The players have a responsibility too, to keep unified and not let their egos get the better of them, nor think that the nonsense on social media is a reflection of the real situation. The real situation is that there is a job to do and they will need to get on with oit largely ignoring the media/social media noise and nonsense.  It''s hard for them, I know, because the noise is very loud and obtrusive, but they have to be strong and block it out.  Under Hughton, I think that noise did get to them, but I think AN will get them to rise above it.  He has to get them to do that, get them focused and perform at their best on the pitch.  That is the only way to silence the background noise and turn it into positivity.

[Van wink 2,994]

I disagree LDC . Social media has had massive implications for

society, the Arab spring, information transfer without reliance on state controlled media etc. But you know as well as I that when we get to Carrow Road we will all be behind the team ( most of us anyway) and that is the cauldron in which the players perform. What''s written on here is an abstract world probably populated by far less people than we might think 😄

[Wacky Waving Inflatable Arm Flailing Tube Man 4,529]

[quote user="Dead Canary"]A very sensible and well reasoned post. We were one centre back away from a very good window. It happens. You would think the club had sat on their hands all window when the evidence is clearly to the contrary.[/quote]

The club had three months to sign a centre back and they didn''t. They seemingly sat on their hands for two-and-a-half of those, holding out for a cheap deal when fees tend to rise as the window drags on.

It is hard to find any excuse for not signing a centre back. Even a cheap journeyman would''ve sufficed. Not releasing Miquel would''ve even made things slightly better.

[lharman7 39]

lake district canary wrote the following post at 02/09/2015 4:25 PM:

Vanwink wrote:

You totally misjudged the situation with Hughton LDC and you are doing the same now.

It is and will always be my opinion that with the advent of social media, bandwagons quickly grow from small concerns to massive over reraction. Players look at social mediua too and see fans'' reactions on it too. Whatever happened with Hughton, happened imo because the whole atmosphere around the place got too negative, social media was poisonous, the players didn''t appear unified - and Hughton wasn''t strong enough to turn it round.

If we are not careful the same thing will happen. The big difference this time, however, is that AN appears to be a stronger manager than Hughton. I do hope so, because he has to keep the players unified in spite of all the background noise that is going on. The players have a responsibility too, to keep unified and not let their egos get the better of them, nor think that the nonsense on social media is a reflection of the real situation. The real situation is that there is a job to do and they will need to get on with oit largely ignoring the media/social media noise and nonsense. It''s hard for them, I know, because the noise is very loud and obtrusive, but they have to be strong and block it out. Under Hughton, I think that noise did get to them, but I think AN will get them to rise above it. He has to get them to do that, get them focused and perform at their best on the pitch. That is the only way to silence the background noise and turn it into positivity.

All I''m reading from this is everyone should just happy clap and we''ll be ok.

We have highly paid professionals who if they can''t take a little hassle from fans on social media really should look else where for another career!

There are many reasons that has led to fans becoming disgruntled ldc and if you do not like reading negative posts then i suggest you take a break from this forum!

[lake district canary 4,779]

Winky and lharman,  I think you underestimate the power that social media has. It''s divisive, panders to extreme views and gets in people''s heads - and that includes players. It takes a strong will to ignore it - but that is what players have to do. 

[Wacky Waving Inflatable Arm Flailing Tube Man 4,529]

[quote user="lake district canary"]Winky and lharman,  I think you underestimate the power that social media has. It''s divisive, panders to extreme views and gets in people''s heads - and that includes players. It takes a strong will to ignore it - but that is what players have to do. 

[/quote]

I do agree with this. The Hughton out bandwagon really caught steam courtesy of social media and developed into something far bigger than it ever should''ve, and far bigger than it would''ve without social media.

However, discontent over transfer business can/will never escalate to that level. On social media, you couldn''t move without ''Hughton out'' being mentioned and ''but we have no centre backs'' doesn''t have the same effect.

But if Martin or Bassong pick up an injury in September, then a lot of fans will be up in arms, and rightly so. Bennett hasn''t played much football in the last year or so and he is now our only backup.

[TIL 1010 5,159]

[quote user="lake district canary"]

 I know some of you don''t like being criticised by someone like me  [/quote]I thought you went to great lengths on all your threads trying to tell us that this was not the case ?

[lake district canary 4,779]

[quote user="Wacky Waving Inflatable Arm Flailing Tube Man"][quote user="lake district canary"]Winky and lharman,  I think you underestimate the power that social media has. It''s divisive, panders to extreme views and gets in people''s heads - and that includes players. It takes a strong will to ignore it - but that is what players have to do. 

[/quote]

I do agree with this. The Hughton out bandwagon really caught steam courtesy of social media and developed into something far bigger than it ever should''ve, and far bigger than it would''ve without social media.

However, discontent over transfer business can/will never escalate to that level. On social media, you couldn''t move without ''Hughton out'' being mentioned and ''but we have no centre backs'' doesn''t have the same effect.

But if Martin or Bassong pick up an injury in September, then a lot of fans will be up in arms, and rightly so. Bennett hasn''t played much football in the last year or so and he is now our only backup.[/quote]

Wisdom can play CB.  Whittaker can play LB. Martin can play RB. Ryan Bennett is no mug either. Eliot Bennett could be used at RB. Brady can be used at LB.  Toffolo is in the reckoning too.  All not ideal, but injuries/sauspensions never are.  We have enough cover to cope across the back  until at least January imo.

[Wacky Waving Inflatable Arm Flailing Tube Man 4,529]

[quote user="lake district canary"][quote user="Wacky Waving Inflatable Arm Flailing Tube Man"][quote user="lake district canary"]Winky and lharman,  I think you underestimate the power that social media has. It''s divisive, panders to extreme views and gets in people''s heads - and that includes players. It takes a strong will to ignore it - but that is what players have to do. 

[/quote]

I do agree with this. The Hughton out bandwagon really caught steam courtesy of social media and developed into something far bigger than it ever should''ve, and far bigger than it would''ve without social media.

However, discontent over transfer business can/will never escalate to that level. On social media, you couldn''t move without ''Hughton out'' being mentioned and ''but we have no centre backs'' doesn''t have the same effect.

But if Martin or Bassong pick up an injury in September, then a lot of fans will be up in arms, and rightly so. Bennett hasn''t played much football in the last year or so and he is now our only backup.[/quote]

Wisdom can play CB.  Whittaker can play LB. Martin can play RB. Ryan Bennett is no mug either. Eliot Bennett could be used at RB. Brady can be used at LB.  Toffolo is in the reckoning too.  All not ideal, but injuries/sauspensions never are.  We have enough cover to cope across the back  until at least January imo.

[/quote]

So we can just play a load of round pegs in square holes. Far better option than signing a specialist.

We have three specialist centre backs, and one of them is undercooked in terms of recent competitive matches, and ideally would be having a one-month loan to get some games under his belt.

[lake district canary 4,779]

[quote user="Wacky Waving Inflatable Arm Flailing Tube Man"][quote user="lake district canary"][quote user="Wacky Waving Inflatable Arm Flailing Tube Man"][quote user="lake district canary"]Winky and lharman,  I think you underestimate the power that social media has. It''s divisive, panders to extreme views and gets in people''s heads - and that includes players. It takes a strong will to ignore it - but that is what players have to do. 

[/quote]

I do agree with this. The Hughton out bandwagon really caught steam courtesy of social media and developed into something far bigger than it ever should''ve, and far bigger than it would''ve without social media.

However, discontent over transfer business can/will never escalate to that level. On social media, you couldn''t move without ''Hughton out'' being mentioned and ''but we have no centre backs'' doesn''t have the same effect.

But if Martin or Bassong pick up an injury in September, then a lot of fans will be up in arms, and rightly so. Bennett hasn''t played much football in the last year or so and he is now our only backup.[/quote]Wisdom can play CB.  Whittaker can play LB. Martin can play RB. Ryan Bennett is no mug either. Eliot Bennett could be used at RB. Brady can be used at LB.  Toffolo is in the reckoning too.  All not ideal, but injuries/sauspensions never are.  We have enough cover to cope across the back  until at least January imo. [/quote]

So we can just play a load of round pegs in square holes. Far better option than signing a specialist.

We have three specialist centre backs, and one of them is undercooked in terms of recent competitive matches, and ideally would be having a one-month loan to get some games under his belt.[/quote]

Agreed would like to see R. Bennett get some game time somewhere.  Always the cup games, I suppose. 

[Highland Canary 78]

Not sure of the relevance of the Hughton comparison. Of course, had the board acted at Christmas in Hughton''s last season we would have retained our premier league status if that''s the point you''re making!? How any Norwich manager can be expected to avoid relegation after a window like this is totally beyond me.

[hogesar 10,536]

Well bringing up Hughton yet again is a refreshing change.

However I agree with the sentiment of the post, believe it or not. However, i''m already missing Bradley Johnson and I make no apologies to my fellow season ticket holders in the Lower Barclay for me angrily pointing out every time I wished he was on the pitch. Which will be most games.

[lake district canary 4,779]

[quote user="Highland Canary"]Not sure of the relevance of the Hughton comparison. Of course, had the board acted at Christmas in Hughton''s last season we would have retained our premier league status if that''s the point you''re making!? How any Norwich manager can be expected to avoid relegation after a window like this is totally beyond me.[/quote]

It''s more about the reaction of fans than it is about Hughton.  Lambert got a backlash of negativity when he put out a weak team against Leicester in the cup.  There is always a place for criticism, but some types leap on that and push it to the Nth degree.  That is what social media is suscepible to. It pushes things beyond what is reasonable - and some people love that.

[Van wink 2,994]

If the opinions expressed on this board had the sort of destructive influence you suggest LDC then I would be surprised that you are still around to be honest.

Most people with any sense just accept it for what it is, and move on.

[lharman7 39]

Re: Worse than Hughton.

lake district canary wrote:

Winky and lharman, I think you underestimate the power that social media has. It''s divisive, panders to extreme views and gets in people''s heads - and that includes players. It takes a strong will to ignore it - but that is what players have to do.

I do agree with this. The Hughton out bandwagon really caught steam courtesy of social media and developed into something far bigger than it ever should''ve, and far bigger than it would''ve without social media.

However, discontent over transfer business can/will never escalate to that level. On social media, you couldn''t move without ''Hughton out'' being mentioned and ''but we have no centre backs'' doesn''t have the same effect.

But if Martin or Bassong pick up an injury in September, then a lot of fans will be up in arms, and rightly so. Bennett hasn''t played much football in the last year or so and he is now our only backup.

People really do forget very quickly. There was a huge reason as to why the ''Hughton Out'' saga blew up all over social media and it was very justified. It would however never of happened if our board didn''t bottle it and get rid of him at xmas.

Social media is here to stay and has now been around for an age. You can not keep blaming social media for the way players or managers conduct themselves in there profession.

If players/managers/chief exec etc, have a problem with or are suffering from any ill effects social media is causing them then all they have to do is switch off. Its that simple!

[nutty nigel 7,870]

All that this social media hysteria says to me is that those responsible don''t have the stomach for the Premier League. Let''s hope our players do.

[Canary001 0]

Well the people running the club most certainly do not have the stomach for the Premier League they have proved that time and time again . If AN cannot work miracles up until January I expect the anger will be turned on Her Majesty and everybody beneath her ,

[nutty nigel 7,870]

That''s why we''ve spent four of the last five seasons in the premier league. Or did I dream it?

[Essjayess 307]

Our CEO said after the wembley win we are back in the Prem and that is where we will stay. Highly unlikely. One simple reason why i think this, we failed to add to our defence. We have known for 2 or 3 years how our defence plays. Alex has already said on more than occasion to the start of our season "we let in sloppy goals". No amount of motivation, no amount of hard work, will stop these sloppy goals. With our defence its inherent and has been for 3 seasons.A strong attack is built on a solid defence, that has never changed in football. Guys like Martin and Whittaker have done wonders for City, and ive never wanted to see them go., but they needed adding to with 1 or 2 quality additions. Its this simple reason that makes the difference from surviving in the Prem. and going down.I made a post  day or 2 ago about my worries should E Benno leave our defence would be even weaker, first reply to that was "good thing hes not a defender then". That is low situation we are at, relying on guys who are not specialist defenders filling the gaps. Same for Brady, he needs to be further up field.City did well with the guys they brought in, except Matt Jarvis, that mystifies me as to why we got him in. But they left it way to late in trying to add to the defence. I applaud them for trying to get Nkoulou or Koulibaly, but they did this in the last week or two before deadline when first priority after the Wembley win should have been to get in new adds to the defence. We will score goals, im happy with Alexs attacking style and im happy with our midfield. But my sincere opinion that we will concede many more than we score. As for the Hughton thing, fans have the right to air their opinions on forums and social media, but they will still get behind their team on matchday. If  players allow themselves to be affected by such things its neither here or there. Players themselves use the media even for their own ends, just look at Berahino.End of the day its not about doom or gloom or even  trying to make comparisons to the Hughton era, its just fans freely expressing what they feel. For me , my opinion is City failed to strengthen the defence, and likely will be a hard lesson to be learned, but nearly every other aspect im happy with. OTBC.

[Feedthewolf 5,756]

Well said LDC. As I have said elsewhere, I can fully understand most of the criticism that''s been flying around, but once the dust settles people will realise that we still have a squad full of talented players, and an absolutely fantastic young manager. Let''s get it out the system during the international break, and save the ''I told you so'' bleating until such time as we are marooned in the bottom three.Until our underwhelming deadline week, this board was full of posts singing the praises of Alex Neil and his fantastic ability to motivate, handle the media and galvanise people. It''s fair to say we could/should have signed another centre back, we might have kept hold of BJ, and we have a challenging situation with Grabban. Barring a defensive injury crisis, though, I back Neil to manage all three of these scenarios and steer us through to January with at least an acceptable points haul – the next game really can''t come quickly enough.