Unrealistic expectations!!

[Parma Ham's gone mouldy 2,220]

Excellent Lavanche

[Citizen Journalist Foghorn 0]

[quote user="Lavanche"]We play so much more tactical and ambitious game and only thing that is missing is the end result.

[/quote]We score less goals than last season, and concede more.  We have the third worst attack in the league. We are light years away from being an ambitious side.

[LostTheFaith 0]

Snake eyes,

Excellent post.

We may not agree on all matters NCFC but we both have green and yellow in our hearts.

I see a club that is looking long term and has a plan that is long term. Hoots will prove to be a great long term a manager given the chance. Slowly building a squad that can play a tactical game to compete with anybody is where we are going. I agree it is not pretty but I can see where we are going.

We are exactly where I expected, 3 points from tenth.

My glass in half full you see.

[JF 694]

We play so much more tactical and ambitious game and only thing that is missing is the end result.

So the only thing thats missing is the only thing that matters? Glad we have sorted that then!

[snake-eyes 13]

Tactical? Ambitious?

 

Don''t make me laugh! What is so genius and forward thinking about the way we play now that is producing worse results with better players?

 

Ambitious is to try and beat teams. Isn''t it?

 

 

[JF 694]

Slowly building a squad that can play a tactical game to compete with anybody is where we are going.

Judging by the complete lack of competitiveness against any of the top 8 losing every match we have played then I would say slowly is the word here.

[JF 694]

I was quoting Lavanche Snake Eyes.

[snake-eyes 13]

I disagree KTF.

 

The club may be looking long term but Hughton is not the answer.  He has the imagination of an inanimate object, the tactical nous of Baldrick and the ability to enthuse confidence like a GCSE student on University Challenge.

 

I have no confidence in him at all, but as I said I will continue to support our Club and Team!

 

IT may just be too late to get him out.  So no matter what and yes even if we do improve over the rest of the season, I would still want him gone for someone better.  And there are better out there!

[snake-eyes 13]

So was I JF!

 

Lol

[Lavanche 0]

Well if you have played football you know why I think it is ambitious.

It is always easier for players to retreat back and get out of there by long balls like we did under Lambert.

We instead try to play the game with bit slower attacks even against the top sides.

Tactical it is because our players have to stay in formation. There is no free role except for Elmander/Hoolahan for any players. We have very strict and modern way to play the game.

Also we are one win away from the 10th place. In my opinion it is quite good position in mid season. Taking account our major injury problems and that few key players like Bassong and Snoddy haven''t been able to keep their level from previous season.

This season has been poorer than previous season and as I said either this thread or some other I have not been very happy that Hughton has given up for the fans and got out of his own style of game to get better results, but at the end there is nothing wrong in the style we are trying to play this game.

Sometimes we look very dull when everything goes wrong, but normaly we look very decent team and all the barking comes from the mass hysteria of Hughton just being Hughton and reality that it is really hard to improve our status in this league.

[Delias Love Child 0]

[quote user="KeepTheFaith"]Snake eyes,

Excellent post.

We may not agree on all matters NCFC but we both have green and yellow in our hearts.

I see a club that is looking long term and has a plan that is long term. Hoots will prove to be a great long term a manager given the chance. Slowly building a squad that can play a tactical game to compete with anybody is where we are going. I agree it is not pretty but I can see where we are going.

We are exactly where I expected, 3 points from tenth.

My glass in half full you see.[/quote]Bro, it appears your glass is half full with a mix of neat alcohol and vicodin. Are we talking about the same team?

[Citizen Journalist Foghorn 0]

[quote user="Lavanche"]Well if you have played football you know why I think it is ambitious.

It is always easier for players to retreat back and get out of there by long balls like we did under Lambert.

We instead try to play the game with bit slower attacks even against the top sides.

Tactical it is because our players have to stay in formation. There is no free role except for Elmander/Hoolahan for any players. We have very strict and modern way to play the game.

Also we are one win away from the 10th place. In my opinion it is quite good position in mid season. Taking account our major injury problems and that few key players like Bassong and Snoddy haven''t been able to keep their level from previous season.[/quote]Actually this is completely wrong.  Our players stay in their own set role.  Modern football involves players moving to cover for other players taking the ball on.  The midfield should be fluid. Our midfield plays with concrete boots.And lets be perfectly honest, during the 65 minutes before Everton''s 2nd goal, our best chances came from long balls out of defense.  The few times we actually built an attack it came to nothing.One win away from 10th and a defeat away from 20th.  Five points down on this time last season. That is nothing to shout about I can assure you.

[Holtcantshoot 0]

I feel this post is slightly missing the sense of disillusionment that fans are currently feeling. It''s not that I expected Norwich to beat Everton yesterday, I''m not a fool and can see they have better players backed by a better manager and financial structure. It''s just that the team so rarely exceed my rather low expectations of them. I''m losing interest in watching and listening to the team draw and lose. Yesterday was a rather too familiar affair where I absent mindedly checked my phone at about 4 o''clock and, yep, losing 1-0 again. Got in my car to drive to Tesco and in the 5 minute drive RVW missed a good chance again and Everton went 2-0 up after Ruddy let in another shot from outside the box after Bennett again backed away from his man and that was that.Perhaps most poignantly I just had no belief in our team turning the game around and grabbing any sort of result so just turned the radio off and did something else. Everything just seems a little flat, a little pedestrian, a little dull about Norwich right now. I''d like something to happen to inject a bit of excitement back into our team, a new attacking coach to get the best out of expensive misfiring strikeforce or a new player with that something special who can get you on your feet. I admit Hughton will probably keep us just afloat in the league for the foreseeable future, I''m much less certain if I''ll actually feel enthused enough by this to bother turning up to see him do it.

[snake-eyes 13]

Lavanche,

 

your post is very condescending, especialliy when you know absolutely nothing about who I am and my experience. You come across with a bit of a superiority complex. Much like Palma Ham and a couple of others on here.  The default position or statement is: ''If you knew anything about football'' or ''You clearly know nothing about football'' or ''If you had ever played football''.  It is arrogant beyond belief!

 

If you had ever played the game, you would know that the method we are using is predictable, overly rigid and you only have to watch it to see it is ineffective. It is easy to defend against and our system allows our defense to be under excessive pressure.  I am curious as to which games in the last year we have looked like a decent team.  And I mean decent, not ok!

 

What is most annoying is the misconception that we are playing a ''modern'' way of football which is beyond contestation.  Text book soccer? Is this what is being taught now? Not what I was taught or have been involved in (and still involved in).  If this is what you believe, then there are a series of books you could write for every budding coach.  You might know them, they are usually in a Yellow cover and have the subject title followed by ''For'' and a derogitory name.  Football is a fluid evolving constantly changing game where each game is different and each team is different. You can''t play the game with such a rigid concept and expect to get results as such a way of playing takes only a very short period of time to understand and counteract. What is worse is when this does not work, the failure to adapt is not forthcoming! 

 

What makes your view so superior to mine? No don''t worry this is not a p''ing contest, but more a statement that, before you go around putting people down with comments that intimate ''I know more than you'', just be careful.  The person you are attacking might just have more experience, knowledge and insight than you.

 

Snake

[T 190]

So you are saying you are a fully qualified coach at the highest level and therefore know more than CH?

[Christian 0]

[quote user="T"]So you are saying you are a fully qualified coach at the highest level and therefore know more than CH?[/quote]

Can''t we just agree that we are knee deep in danger zone and the man responsible seems to be clueless about the situation.

Hughton out now before it''s too late.

[LostTheFaith 0]

[quote user="Benny Hill"][quote user="T"]So you are saying you are a fully qualified coach at the highest level and therefore know more than CH?[/quote]

Can''t we just agree that we are knee deep in danger zone and the man responsible seems to be clueless about the situation.

Hughton out now before it''s too late.[/quote]

We are not knee deep. We are ten points from tenth in league table. Knee deep is adrift at the bottom.

We are one of ten team fighting to stay in this league. If you expected much more this season then I am afraid that you will be dissapointed . We have a poor midfield and need to get a couple of players in pronto.

[JF 694]

We are not knee deep. We are ten points from tenth in league table. Knee deep is adrift at the bottom.

We have 12 games left to get the points we need to survive, I would say we are certainly ankle deep!

And before you correct me I know we have more than 12 games, but as our manager is happy to write off any chance of points against the better teams in the league then I see no reason not to as well. 12 games to get at least 16 points. Something needs to change.

[LostTheFaith 0]

[quote user="JF"]We are not knee deep. We are ten points from tenth in league table. Knee deep is adrift at the bottom.

We have 12 games left to get the points we need to survive, I would say we are certainly ankle deep!

And before you correct me I know we have more than 12 games, but as our manager is happy to write off any chance of points against the better teams in the league then I see no reason not to as well. 12 games to get at least 16 points. Something needs to change.[/quote]

Players will return from injury and a couple of new players.

Simples.

[snake-eyes 13]

Forgive me T

... for being so presumptuous as to think that I had the right to a well informed educated opinion and philosophy towards a game i love study played coached etc.

I forgot because I don''t manage Man Utd then I must be wrong in everything I say or believe.

Think I''ll just go and flagellate for committing such a sin against such unequivocal doctrine. For I am a heretic!

[Bill 1,788]

We are closer to the bottom than we have ever been at this stage of the season in the last two season. We are NOT fighting to stay in this league as we have a team hamstrung by flawed tactics. Flawed tactics that have been pointed out week after week - as also expressed by Johnson "We had to close them down and we know we can’t let them shoot from the edge of the box."Read the post I put up yesterday before the game about us constantly failing to close down and not marking the opposition outside of the box.Hughton is not building for the future he is wasting the talent the board have provided. We may well see players leave over these failings - likewise if the youth players feel they are going to be constrained by outdated and one dimensional tactics. Where then for us then ?I have to wonder sometimes what games some fans see because it certainly isn''t the one that is seen at Carrow Road or shown on the TV.

[T 190]

Indeed you are perfectly entitled to an opinion - it''s just you not seeing the irony of your post which is rather amusing.

[snake-eyes 13]

Glad i am of amusement to you! I see what you are getting at, but once again like many of your kind on here, misinterpret what is being said. Mainly because it does not fit in with your way of thinking?

It seems many defer to so called experts without questioning their methods or results. Is it fear or simply a case of sheep mentality?

It is so easy to follow established practice as it doesn''t require much thought. Even when that practice is clearly not working.

Surely it is better in the case we are discussing to either, create a system to fit the players you have rather than try to get them to fit a system to which they are not suited?

[mrdi 373]

If I buy quality ingredients, I expect a quality plate of food. If the quality ingredients end up as a bad plate of food, the Chef''s doing it wrong.

[Indy_Bones 441]

[quote user="mrdi"]If I buy quality ingredients, I expect a quality plate of food. If the quality ingredients end up as a bad plate of food, the Chef''s doing it wrong.[/quote]Great analogy, whereas those in support of Hughton would have you believe "The food is actually better than it was before, it''s actually YOUR taste buds that need to adapt...", despite the food tasting (and looking) like garbage!

[Reggie Strayshun 0]

[quote user="Indy_Bones"][quote user="mrdi"]If I buy quality ingredients, I expect a quality plate of food. If the quality ingredients end up as a bad plate of food, the Chef''s doing it wrong.[/quote]Great analogy, whereas those in support of Hughton would have you believe "The food is actually better than it was before, it''s actually YOUR taste buds that need to adapt...", despite the food tasting (and looking) like garbage![/quote]

Or alternatively...what the Hughton supporters would say . "you say that this food looks, smells and tastes disgusting, but believe me, that if you hold your nerve, give it time , do nothing ,and leave it on that plate, it will shortly ,magically, become something akin to what a Michelin starred chef would serve up."

[Tumbleweed 106]

I''m amused by some statements that "Hughton is building for the future" or is "building the squad".

Try as I might I cannot find any evidence to support a view that there is any "building" to be done. It is just another excuse. There is nothing wrong with the squad we have available. Sure it won''t win the title, but is should win enough games against self-imploding opposition to be miles from any relegation fears.

We have more players involved at international level than ever before. We have a guy who has scored against Barcelona in the Champions League. Another forward who before coming to Norwich scored for fun. We have a goalie who has played for England and is regularly called up and before injury very close to becoming a regular. We have a Dutch international in the middle and a strong muscular centre back supposedly shoring things up behind. We have a pacy winger and one of England''s brightest young prospects. We have a guy with a great left foot and is as determined and fiery as they come and a full international. We have a creative midfielder capable of sublime moments and again a full international. And more than that lot we have a youth cup winning team with some genuine talent just waiting in the wings. Yet this lot put in a performance that was described as "grim" yesterday by an impartial national newspaper. To add to many others this season.

Exactly what "building" is required, other than a new coaching team?

[Indy_Bones 441]

[quote user="Tumbleweed"]I''m amused by some statements that "Hughton is building for the future" or is "building the squad".

Try as I might I cannot find any evidence to support a view that there is any "building" to be done. It is just another excuse. There is nothing wrong with the squad we have available. Sure it won''t win the title, but is should win enough games against self-imploding opposition to be miles from any relegation fears.

We have more players involved at international level than ever before. We have a guy who has scored against Barcelona in the Champions League. Another forward who before coming to Norwich scored for fun. We have a goalie who has played for England and is regularly called up and before injury very close to becoming a regular. We have a Dutch international in the middle and a strong muscular centre back supposedly shoring things up behind. We have a pacy winger and one of England''s brightest young prospects. We have a guy with a great left foot and is as determined and fiery as they come and a full international. We have a creative midfielder capable of sublime moments and again a full international. And more than that lot we have a youth cup winning team with some genuine talent just waiting in the wings. Yet this lot put in a performance that was described as "grim" yesterday by an impartial national newspaper. To add to many others this season.

Exactly what "building" is required, other than a new coaching team?[/quote]Brilliant post TW, which echoes exactly how I feel about our squad.Why can''t more posters think like this and see the light instead of defending "Cautious Chris"???

[Reggie Strayshun 0]

Great post TW. Hughton has been here for over 18 months now with unprecedented amounts of cash at his disposal. If he is still, as some would have us believe, in the mid stages of "building", then it''s an absolute disgrace, and should be fired immediately. As you say, hiowever, it''s just another lame excuse.btw, a word of warning...you''ll be taken to task for describing the national newspaper (Telegraph) as ''impartial'' . The apologists on here have rubbished every source as biased, comics, uninformed etc over the last 24 hours. Apparently they are all part of some huge anti-Hughton conspiracy......

[Tumbleweed 106]

I have seen those posts Reggie! CH has had a very easy ride so far in the press. If we had had Holloway or Pulis or Hughes or Poyet or Warnock in charge there''d be a lot more wailing than we have seen so far. But because CH is seen as "nice" (which you can''t disagree with but won''t guarantee success) he has slipped largely under the radar.

There is also probably still a lot of Little Norwich syndrome in there. The thought that we shouldn''t actually have any expectations other than to struggle badly. But the Board have brought stability and allowed CH to invest heavily in the team, we were on an upward curve. There is absolutely no reason why we cannot be a peer of Swansea and Southampton in the upper mid tier of this league and seen as giving whoever we play a jolly good challenge.

Little in size perhaps, but the Board have been big in ambition. CH is failing them.