Ricardo's Report v Watford

[Mister Chops 7]

As for Ruddy in goal the best that can be said is that

he is no Fraser Forster and I would take evens on him not being able to

stop a pig in a passage.[:D] Depends if the pig has been greased or not, but I wouldn''t take that bet.Don''t agree that the ref had a massive influence on the game, I think we were outpaced, out-thought and out-passed by a young and promising Watford side who showed Malky''s still got a lot to say in the dressing room.  Don''t think a draw would have been particularly fair either.  Your report didn''t mention Elliott Ward, I thought you might have had a view on his performance?

[Largey 0]

No penalty in my book - Grant fell over between two defenders who were just shielding him away from the ball. Had we got that our luck would be out for the season.

[dylanisabaddog 4,921]

[quote user="Smudger"][quote user="portmanking"]Draw a fair reflection?!

You were diabolical, second to every ball, one-paced, square at the back, lightweight on the deck and in the air... need I go on?

A severe reality check for you boys.
[/quote]

Spot on... [Y]

Our midfield did not win a tackle all night.  Missed Russell and Korey badly!
[/quote]

Thank God.  I was beginning to think I had been at a different game to everyone else.

The reason that we got away with 2 very average centre halves last season was that Russell was in front of them.  He wasn''t there last night and they were exposed as a result. 

Most people on here seem to be raving about Crofts, and although he scored a good goal he was outplayed by an average Watford midfield and his mistake led to the first goal.  Bring back Korey Smith as soon as possible.

I can''t help but think that last year''s starting eleven would have done better.

[morty 0]

Could Crofts work at the base of the diamond I wonder?

[Gingerpele 0]

[quote user="morty"]Could Crofts work at the base of the diamond I wonder?[/quote]Yes, he plays a lot more like Russel than Fox does....

[morty 0]

[quote user="Gingerpele"][quote user="morty"]Could Crofts work at the base of the diamond I wonder?[/quote]Yes, he plays a lot more like Russel than Fox does....[/quote]Perhaps when Korey is fit, he could play on the right, with Crofts at the base. Can''t recall if we have played Korey at the base before.

[Jack Flash 13]

Re Smudger''s remarks -- "Our midfield did not win a tackle all night. Missed Russell and Korey badly!" -- I also feel we really missed the Doc. The two CH''s allowed Watford too much space, and that has to be resolved asap!!

[dylanisabaddog 4,921]

[quote user="Jack Flash"]Re Smudger''s remarks -- "Our midfield did not win a tackle all night. Missed Russell and Korey badly!" -- I also feel we really missed the Doc. The two CH''s allowed Watford too much space, and that has to be resolved asap!![/quote]

We didn''t miss Doc.  He would have been just as exposed as Ward and Nelson, probably even worse..  What we missed was the player sitting in front of them. 

I hate to start the Docherty argument again, but during the summer, 23 Championship managers had the opportunity to sign him.  None of them did. 

[Graham Paddons Beard 2,431]

The stats make interesting reading. We had 7 shots on target, so did Watford. Watford however had two crucial deflections and we didn''t. We had more corners, same amount of shots off target and possession was virtually the same.

So it was the "moments" that cost us. the moments were, the deflections, the two ref decisions (a possible penalty and the push on Crofts) and the mistake by Ruddy that was missed in the second half.

My contention is that in this league many games will be played against quite equal teams and it will be the moments that determine the match.

Put it this way. Watford have two deflections that take the ball past the post and not in, the ref awards us a free kick and and we end up winning 2 nil.

Easy. I feel much better now.

[Bury Yellow 2]

Morning GPB. Just built up the courage to view the board.

Agreed with your post totally. You will know that I can be very simplistic at times but no one has mentioned that without Holt (or a similar backup) we lose shape, organisation and leadership.

Martin and Jackson will not, cannot, work together. Yes we were poor at times defending but when you have El Torro constantly moving across the line into space and making a general nuisance to their back line the whole of the game takes on a different perspective.

Get an experienced back up for Holty or we will be in the muck big time.

Off for a pint with a binner now!! - I thank you

[ca 1]

Didn''t come on here last night as I knew all the doom mongers would be out in full force.

My view of the game is that Nelson/Ward/Ruddy were our weakest links and I''m not sure that any of them will be good enough in the Championship. Thought R Martin was ok in parts but still think Spillane could have done better.

Also thought we missed Rusty in the holding role, he used to shield the defence to an extent and Foxy doesn''t look strong enough to do that imo.

Its only one game and we have Askou who looked good before he got injured and Whitbread to come back eventually, hopefully Ruddy will get btter as his confidence grows.

Thought Crofts looked good and a great goal from him too.

Hopefully Lambert will experiment a bit tomorrow night.

[ca 1]

P.S. Didn''t agree we deserved a draw Ricardo, thought Watford were much the better team.

[ricardo 7,395]

[quote user="Mister Chops"]As for Ruddy in goal the best that can be said is that

he is no Fraser Forster and I would take evens on him not being able to

stop a pig in a passage.[:D] Depends if the pig has been greased or not, but I wouldn''t take that bet.Don''t agree that the ref had a massive influence on the game, I think we were outpaced, out-thought and out-passed by a young and promising Watford side who showed Malky''s still got a lot to say in the dressing room.  Don''t think a draw would have been particularly fair either.  Your report didn''t mention Elliott Ward, I thought you might have had a view on his performance?[/quote]Fair comment Mr Chops, I don''t expect everyone to agree with my thoughts on the game. After all, with 24k present I expect there are at least 23.9k who see things differently. I don''t pretend to have the definitive view but its just my view based on my 56 seasons experiences and you can take it or leave it as you please. Apart from that one decision I would agree that the ref had a decent game. Its just unfortunate that with goals at such a premium these days, any mistake that leads to a goal tends to be very decisive in the result. My feelings were that a draw would have been very likely had the incident I described been properly penalised.I take nothing away from Watford who played very well on the night but I can''t agree with some of the comments that put us second best in all departments. I think those who express those sentiments  have had their views coloured more by disappointment than by the realities on the pitch. Thankfully I never got caught up in the hype and I still maintain a top half finish is the very best we can expect.Too early to say much about Elliot Ward. He comes with a fairly good reputation and after a shaky start he improved in the second half. It''s Nelson that worries me more. I applaud his whole hearted attitude by I still think his class is ultimately League 1 at best.

[nutty nigel 7,534]

[quote user="dylanisabaddog"]

[quote user="Jack Flash"]Re Smudger''s remarks -- "Our midfield did not win a tackle all night. Missed Russell and Korey badly!" -- I also feel we really missed the Doc. The two CH''s allowed Watford too much space, and that has to be resolved asap!![/quote]

We didn''t miss Doc.  He would have been just as exposed as Ward and Nelson, probably even worse..  What we missed was the player sitting in front of them. 

I hate to start the Docherty argument again, but during the summer, 23 Championship managers had the opportunity to sign him.  None of them did. 

[/quote]

Just because Doc went to Charlton it doesn''t mean no Championship club was interested. That''s just an assumption. To my knowledge no Championship club has ever shown any interest in Nelly but to say they haven''t would also be an assumption.

But the big difference had nothing to do with Russell or the Doc. It was the quality of opposition compared to the opposition Russell and Doc had so many good games against last season. It''s true to say we got relegated with Russell and the Doc. So given that we know the Doc is a better player than Nelly criticisms of the defence are understandable. We have to hope that Ward will improve and Whitbread will be a fit and able partner for him. Both these players were signed by Lambert to play in the Championship.

The big question is do we see the potential to do better than our relegation season? I would say in midfield we do. Let''s hope so anyway. And let''s hope Ward and Whitbread repay Lamberts confidence in them. It''s the centrebacks that worry me most at this time so if Whitbread doesn''t get fit, or Ward doesn''t settle in, the player we miss most probably will be the Doc.

 

 

[Bill 1,788]

Be away with youTop half will be much of a certainty, how far up depends on how quick Lambert can get things sorted. From my viewing it was frustrating to see Watford break and attack in numbers unlike us where I sense that our lot have been given certain instructions are are sticking to them rigidly. As in get it to Hooli at all costs, he will do a bit of fancy work then slot it throw to Martin or Jackson to put home. Time and time again in the first half the ball could and should have been pushed wide to the right, but no we were ''entertained'' to the old soft shoe shuffle with the rest of the midfield BEHIND him. Only in the second half did we see a five or ten minute flurry where the team attacked en masse. Second to the ball too many times and ball watching too many times. I think Lmbert might stick with this lot on Tuesday before deciding any changes against Scunny. The idea being was it just Watford or the players.So more bite, more urgency and a bit more self believe and we''ll be up there come May.

[Smudger 0]

[quote user="Superflash"][quote user="Legend Iwan"]

[quote user="Superflash"]Another excellent report Ricardo. Here''s some thoughts I''d like to add-I thought that apart from his back heel (and even then, the chances of that ever setting up a goal again are miniscule), Jackson looked completely out of his depth tonight. Taylor, who I thought was excellent 90% of the time, had Jacko in his back pocket virtually the whole time, save for a side netting effort. I still feel Jackson will come good, but on this showing I think he''s going to struggle against bigger and stronger defenders in this division. [/quote]

Well that''s strange because from watching it on Sky - and being noted by their presenters - the whole of the first half CM was up against Taylor. Sky mentioning how wouldn''t it be a better idea to put Jackson on Taylor because of the speed difference. Obviously they switched at points in the 2nd half but your statement is no really accurate is it.

[/quote]Jackson? Speed? What speed? He couldn''t get past the backline at all, or even hold the ball up for starters, nevermind bomb forward. Martin was up against Taylor and didn''t fare too well either, but Taylor and Jackson definatley had some real battles and hey, seeing as you watched the game from the comfort of your armchair as opposed to in-person, front row, you tell me how our new signing fared. Taylor read Jackson''s every move and was always a yard ahead of him. As I said before, Jackson looks to be playing catch up fitness wise, something he has actually come out and said himself. I wonder if the kind gentlemen at Sky took that into account with their oh so brilliant analysis. I''d say I was pretty accurate with my statement. Taylor was an absolute beast, reminiscent of Malky during his spell with us. Actually, if you put Malky in place of Ward tonight I''m convinced he''d have done a better job. How''s THAT for an accurate statement? Tell the Sky guys to put that in their pipes and smoke it. [/quote]Jackson did set up our first goal though and was also called ofside when he was clean through when apparently he was a yard or so on later in the match.

[Mister Chops 7]

[quote user="ricardo"][quote user="Mister Chops"]As for Ruddy in goal the best that can be said is that

he is no Fraser Forster and I would take evens on him not being able to

stop a pig in a passage.[:D] Depends if the pig has been greased or not, but I wouldn''t take that bet.Don''t agree that the ref had a massive influence on the game, I think we were outpaced, out-thought and out-passed by a young and promising Watford side who showed Malky''s still got a lot to say in the dressing room.  Don''t think a draw would have been particularly fair either.  Your report didn''t mention Elliott Ward, I thought you might have had a view on his performance?[/quote]Fair comment Mr Chops, I don''t expect everyone to agree with my thoughts on the game. After all, with 24k present I expect there are at least 23.9k who see things differently. I don''t pretend to have the definitive view but its just my view based on my 56 seasons experiences and you can take it or leave it as you please. Apart from that one decision I would agree that the ref had a decent game. Its just unfortunate that with goals at such a premium these days, any mistake that leads to a goal tends to be very decisive in the result. My feelings were that a draw would have been very likely had the incident I described been properly penalised.I take nothing away from Watford who played very well on the night but I can''t agree with some of the comments that put us second best in all departments. I think those who express those sentiments  have had their views coloured more by disappointment than by the realities on the pitch. Thankfully I never got caught up in the hype and I still maintain a top half finish is the very best we can expect.Too early to say much about Elliot Ward. He comes with a fairly good reputation and after a shaky start he improved in the second half. It''s Nelson that worries me more. I applaud his whole hearted attitude by I still think his class is ultimately League 1 at best.[/quote]I enjoy your reports Ricardo, and I had to base my opinion on Sky Sports last night so who''s to say, you may well have called it right as you usually do.  I just thought Watford shaded it and their counter attacking made us look very vulnerable.  Agree on Nelson but I have always said he''s Premiership for effort but League One for ability - he''s the sort of blood & thunder, 100% commitment player that the fans love, and the kind of player who proves we''ll never win anything as a nation when this is the kind of footballer we produce.

[Smudger 0]

[quote user="dylanisabaddog"]

[quote user="Jack Flash"]Re Smudger''s remarks -- "Our midfield did not win a tackle all night. Missed Russell and Korey badly!" -- I also feel we really missed the Doc. The two CH''s allowed Watford too much space, and that has to be resolved asap!![/quote]

We didn''t miss Doc.  He would have been just as exposed as Ward and Nelson, probably even worse..  What we missed was the player sitting in front of them. 

I hate to start the Docherty argument again, but during the summer, 23 Championship managers had the opportunity to sign him.  None of them did. 

[/quote]Very well said Dylan... [Y]Anybody who could not see that we did not have one ball winner in our 4 man midfield last night was obviously painfully lacking in football tactics.I don''t know if Korey was too unfit to play even 20 mins or so from the bench?  But for me that has to raise the question of why he was on the bench in the first place?  Very poor tatics from Lambert last night for me and there will be many more defeats to poor sides this season unless he adds a ball winner or two to his diamond midfield.I said it was a mistake letting both Russell and Spillane go during the same week without replacing them and stand by that view after last night''s display!

[Mister Chops 7]

[quote user="Smudger"][quote user="dylanisabaddog"]

[quote user="Jack Flash"]Re Smudger''s remarks -- "Our midfield did not win a tackle all night. Missed Russell and Korey badly!" -- I also feel we really missed the Doc. The two CH''s allowed Watford too much space, and that has to be resolved asap!![/quote]

We didn''t miss Doc.  He would have been just as exposed as Ward and Nelson, probably even worse..  What we missed was the player sitting in front of them. 

I hate to start the Docherty argument again, but during the summer, 23 Championship managers had the opportunity to sign him.  None of them did. 

[/quote]Very well said Dylan... [Y]Anybody who could not see that we did not have one ball winner in our 4 man midfield last night was obviously painfully lacking in football tactics.I don''t know if Korey was too unfit to play even 20 mins or so from the bench?  But for me that has to raise the question of why he was on the bench in the first place?  Very poor tatics from Lambert last night for me and there will be many more defeats to poor sides this season unless he adds a ball winner or two to his diamond midfield.I said it was a mistake letting both Russell and Spillane go during the same week without replacing them and stand by that view after last night''s display![/quote]Crofts and Fox are both supposed to be ball winners, they just didn''t do their job last night.  Agree we appeared to miss Russell, though he''s hardly set the Championship on fire previously, but quite how you think Spillane would have made any difference last night is beyond me.

[Smudger 0]

[quote user="nutty nigel"][quote user="dylanisabaddog"]

[quote user="Jack Flash"]Re Smudger''s remarks -- "Our midfield did not win a tackle all night. Missed Russell and Korey badly!" -- I also feel we really missed the Doc. The two CH''s allowed Watford too much space, and that has to be resolved asap!![/quote]

We didn''t miss Doc.  He would have been just as exposed as Ward and Nelson, probably even worse..  What we missed was the player sitting in front of them. 

I hate to start the Docherty argument again, but during the summer, 23 Championship managers had the opportunity to sign him.  None of them did. 

[/quote]

Just because Doc went to Charlton it doesn''t mean no Championship club was interested. That''s just an assumption. To my knowledge no Championship club has ever shown any interest in Nelly but to say they haven''t would also be an assumption.

But the big difference had nothing to do with Russell or the Doc. It was the quality of opposition compared to the opposition Russell and Doc had so many good games against last season. It''s true to say we got relegated with Russell and the Doc. So given that we know the Doc is a better player than Nelly criticisms of the defence are understandable. We have to hope that Ward will improve and Whitbread will be a fit and able partner for him. Both these players were signed by Lambert to play in the Championship.

The big question is do we see the potential to do better than our relegation season? I would say in midfield we do. Let''s hope so anyway. And let''s hope Ward and Whitbread repay Lamberts confidence in them. It''s the centrebacks that worry me most at this time so if Whitbread doesn''t get fit, or Ward doesn''t settle in, the player we miss most probably will be the Doc.

 

 

[/quote]Well I think it was our inability to compete in midfield last night meant that it was pretty much one way traffic for Watford.  Apart from the brief 15 minute or so spell after half time and the opening 5 mins or so we were 2nd best throughout until the game was won on the 81st minute.

[Smudger 0]

[quote user="Mister Chops"][quote user="Smudger"][quote user="dylanisabaddog"]

[quote user="Jack Flash"]Re Smudger''s remarks -- "Our midfield did not win a tackle all night. Missed Russell and Korey badly!" -- I also feel we really missed the Doc. The two CH''s allowed Watford too much space, and that has to be resolved asap!![/quote]

We didn''t miss Doc.  He would have been just as exposed as Ward and Nelson, probably even worse..  What we missed was the player sitting in front of them. 

I hate to start the Docherty argument again, but during the summer, 23 Championship managers had the opportunity to sign him.  None of them did. 

[/quote]Very well said Dylan... [Y]Anybody who could not see that we did not have one ball winner in our 4 man midfield last night was obviously painfully lacking in football tactics.I don''t know if Korey was too unfit to play even 20 mins or so from the bench?  But for me that has to raise the question of why he was on the bench in the first place?  Very poor tatics from Lambert last night for me and there will be many more defeats to poor sides this season unless he adds a ball winner or two to his diamond midfield.I said it was a mistake letting both Russell and Spillane go during the same week without replacing them and stand by that view after last night''s display![/quote]Crofts and Fox are both supposed to be ball winners, they just didn''t do their job last night.  Agree we appeared to miss Russell, though he''s hardly set the Championship on fire previously, but quite how you think Spillane would have made any difference last night is beyond me.[/quote]Well I would''ve preferred to have seen Spillane in the side either in midfield than 4 players who could not win a tackle between them, or alternatively at Right Back instead of Russell Martin.Spillane might not be the most technical player, but I am pretty sure that our midfield/defence would have looked less like sieve if we had of had one more player on the pitch who is not frightened to put their foot in!

[Tangible Fixed Assets anyone? 0]

[quote user="morty"]Could Crofts work at the base of the diamond I wonder?
[/quote]

I was thinking that too.

Korey on the right side of the diamond?

[Superflash 0]

[quote user="Smudger"][quote user="Superflash"][quote user="Legend Iwan"]

[quote user="Superflash"]Another excellent report Ricardo. Here''s some thoughts I''d like to add-I thought that apart from his back heel (and even then, the chances of that ever setting up a goal again are miniscule), Jackson looked completely out of his depth tonight. Taylor, who I thought was excellent 90% of the time, had Jacko in his back pocket virtually the whole time, save for a side netting effort. I still feel Jackson will come good, but on this showing I think he''s going to struggle against bigger and stronger defenders in this division. [/quote]

Well that''s strange because from watching it on Sky - and being noted by their presenters - the whole of the first half CM was up against Taylor. Sky mentioning how wouldn''t it be a better idea to put Jackson on Taylor because of the speed difference. Obviously they switched at points in the 2nd half but your statement is no really accurate is it.

[/quote]Jackson? Speed? What speed? He couldn''t get past the backline at all, or even hold the ball up for starters, nevermind bomb forward. Martin was up against Taylor and didn''t fare too well either, but Taylor and Jackson definatley had some real battles and hey, seeing as you watched the game from the comfort of your armchair as opposed to in-person, front row, you tell me how our new signing fared. Taylor read Jackson''s every move and was always a yard ahead of him. As I said before, Jackson looks to be playing catch up fitness wise, something he has actually come out and said himself. I wonder if the kind gentlemen at Sky took that into account with their oh so brilliant analysis. I''d say I was pretty accurate with my statement. Taylor was an absolute beast, reminiscent of Malky during his spell with us. Actually, if you put Malky in place of Ward tonight I''m convinced he''d have done a better job. How''s THAT for an accurate statement? Tell the Sky guys to put that in their pipes and smoke it. [/quote]Jackson did set up our first goal though and was also called ofside when he was clean through when apparently he was a yard or so on later in the match.[/quote]If that backheel would''ve gone wrong, which 9 times out of ten it does, then we''d have been calling for his head. It was more the resourcefulness of Crofts in my opinion. Fair enough, it provided the goal, but you can''t deny the element of sheer luck behind it.People think I want Jackson to fail, but I honestly don''t. I just think he was exposed last night against a team many are tipping to struggle. Holt''s presence almost immediately gave us another dimension up front in contrast.

[Thecanaryfan 0]

Good read. Wouldnt want to blame the result on a jinx though. We just came out second best. I take my hat off to Malky and Watford.

I cant help wonder what the result would have been had FF been in our sticks. Oh well Im sure Ruddy will make a save one day.

[Robert N. LiM 4,346]

My view:Ward and Nelson looked totally off the pace, especially when they were turned by the Watford strikers. You simply can''t be as shaky at the back as we were in the first half.The midfield four are probably the best quartet of passers I can remember at the club. Some of Fox''s passing was outstanding, with Wes and Surman not far behind. It would be great to think that they could prosper in the Championship, but I suspect that the terrible truth is that we almost certainly need more muscle there. Whether Fox and Crofts can get stuck in a bit more I''m not sure, whether Korey can make the step up to playing at the base of the diamond a league up I''m also not sure. My hunch is that League One made Russell look much better than he actually is - I''m not sure he would have made a difference.But some of our movement of the ball was great, encapsuated by Crofts'' goal, which was superb. If you''re going to the play the diamond, your full-backs just have to get forward, and neither Drury or Martin do this well enough. A Bertrand-like loan signing from a Premier League club urgently needed if we are going to retain the diamond.I thought Chris Martin worked really hard and looked far more physically imposing than last season. I have a feeling he will have a good season. Not sure about Jackson = am going to reserve comment on him except to say that the imagination and unselfishness of his backheel was really impressive for a centre forward yet to score for his new club. Overall a very poor performance but enough good signs to suggest that we should have a decent season if we can tweak a few areas.And boy, did we all underrate Watford. Great to see the ovation Malky got at the end. One of those things that reminds you what great fans we have: acknowledging both his contribution to our club and the fact that he got the better of Lambert.