Tyrese Omotoye

[TeemuVanBasten 3,327]

13 hours ago, Icecream Snow said:

They did ok.

Jacob Murphy (Newcastle), Josh Murphy (Cardiff), Carlton Morris, Cameron McGeehan, Harry Toffolo (Huddersfield), Cameron Norman(Walsall) and Bray Wyatt

Bray Wyatt the WWE wrestler?

Or Ben Wyatt who hasn't really done that well because he's playing for Sutton United?

[Fr. Chewy Louie 137]

It's pretty normal for a good proportion of kids who are bright prospects to fall away isn't it? I imagine some of that Chelsea team aren't pulling up trees either.

Anyway, we must have made at least £20m on the Murphy's alone, so not sure what the problem is.

[TeemuVanBasten 3,327]

47 minutes ago, Fr. Chewy Louie said:

It's pretty normal for a good proportion of kids who are bright prospects to fall away isn't it?

Yep, will get even worse in this financial climate.

To be fair though, some players just have other things going for them. Somebody I went to school with got dropped at 19 and used his UCAS points to study at LSE and now earns probably as much as a League One footballer. 

If you get dropped at 19 and the choice is between going into non-league and trying to work your way back up into league football, or persuing other interests, then it may be the case that other options are just a better idea! 

Isn't the average wage in League Two about £60k a year? I mean, if you have got the A levels to go and study dentristy or something then that's probably more sensible than playing non-league trying to get picked up by a League Two team.

Bit different for a Tyre fitter from Carlisle (Holt) or a factory worker from Sheffield (Vardy). Gone are the days when footballers are all rough and ready lads from a council estate, come from all walks of life now.

I do wonder what Tom Adeyemi is up to these days, wasn't he a straight A student? Seems to have milked Ipswich for a couple of years and then abandoned football at 27.

Edited October 9, 2020 by TeemuVanBasten

[Fr. Chewy Louie 137]

2 minutes ago, TeemuVanBasten said:

 

Bit different for a Tyre fitter from Carlisle. Gone are the days when footballers are all rough and ready lads from a council estate, come from all walks of life now. 

Given wage inflation, I suppose people from more traditionally affluent backgrounds are more attracted now, but I would expect the majority of British footballers still to be from a working class background.

[TeemuVanBasten 3,327]

8 minutes ago, Fr. Chewy Louie said:

Given wage inflation, I suppose people from more traditionally affluent backgrounds are more attracted now, but I would expect the majority of British footballers still to be from a working class background.

I saw some figures once and you'd be surprised.

But I think it was inflated by children of footballers. Oxlade-Chamberlain for example.

Don't loads of kids of Norwich players go to Langley School? Therefore, if any of them follow their parents into football they'd be counted as privately educated. 

Paul Dalglish for example, every single member of his family will have a working class background, but I'd assume he was privately educated. 

The children of most Premier League and Championship footballers will be privately educated.

I think there is more to it than that though, Rugby and Cricket always had loads of posh kids in it (particularly cricket). But hasn't football always been better paid? So I'd assume the socio-economic background of people watching football has changed a lot too, and therefore a broader range of people participating.

If you remember how much stick Graham Le Saux got far daring to read a broadsheet instead of just looking at boobs on page 3 of The Sun, you can see why your typical private school student may have decided football wasn't for them. Its a lot different now isn't it, footballers all expected to take sports science and data seriously. 

You've also got clubs poaching teenagers, moving their families and then paying for their private education. 

Edited October 9, 2020 by TeemuVanBasten

[CDMullins 436]

1 hour ago, Mr.Carrow said:

"Prospects" is the key word. We all saw last season they were naive at times. Gibson and Quintilla have been there and done it in the two best leagues in Europe.

Lol,

"Been there and done it in the two best leagues in Europe"

Ben Gibson as played 9 more Premier Legaue games than Godfrey.

Jamal Lewis has played 8 more top flight league games than Quintilla.

So not only have we lost two of our top performers, we've replaced them with players who are at 27 and 24 just as experienced as the players we've lost, who both are 22.

 

[CDMullins 436]

3 hours ago, Thirsty Lizard said:

Gibson has come from a Premier League club and Quintilla has come from La Liga............ they most definitely won't be cheap!!!!!!

A Premier League club he played one league game for.

A player who was allowed to train with another club prior to any transfer talks taking place.

[Nuff Said 5,142]

1 hour ago, TeemuVanBasten said:

I do wonder what Tom Adeyemi is up to these days, wasn't he a straight A student? Seems to have milked Ipswich for a couple of years and then abandoned football at 27.

To be fair that has to be enough to put anyone off football.

[chicken 2,627]

1 hour ago, TeemuVanBasten said:

Don't loads of kids of Norwich players go to Langley School? Therefore, if any of them follow their parents into football they'd be counted as privately educated. 

Not sure if it's "loads" but possibly some. I know people who have taught the kids of some of the Norwich players over the years including more recent history, in state schools etc.

The Langley School is connected to the club though and I think some of the Academy Players are sent there by the club. They also sponsor the youth teams.

[TeemuVanBasten 3,327]

1 minute ago, chicken said:

The Langley School is connected to the club though and I think some of the Academy Players are sent there by the club. They also sponsor the youth teams.

Maybe get discounted tuition in return for making their footy team stronger, that's how it seems to work in America to an extent! 

[sgncfc 1,228]

40 minutes ago, CDMullins said:

Lol,

"Been there and done it in the two best leagues in Europe"

Ben Gibson as played 9 more Premier Legaue games than Godfrey.

Jamal Lewis has played 8 more top flight league games than Quintilla.

So not only have we lost two of our top performers, we've replaced them with players who are at 27 and 24 just as experienced as the players we've lost, who both are 22.

 

Maybe - but so far they both look better than the players they have replaced.

[chicken 2,627]

1 minute ago, TeemuVanBasten said:

Maybe get discounted tuition in return for making their footy team stronger, that's how it seems to work in America to an extent! 

Possibly. I also wonder if it is linked to the Academy in terms of status etc. I know there are more expectations around clubs to ensure they don't just prepare their youngsters to be footballers and nothing else anymore. Hence the likes of Adeyemi who could yet seek a career as a doctor, which I believe he was looking at before.

Even in the US, I think scholarships are still reliant upon grades and not just sporting excellence. 

[CDMullins 436]

27 minutes ago, sgncfc said:

Maybe - but so far they both look better than the players they have replaced.

Oh come on,

You cant actually be suggesting that Ben Gibson in 90 minutes as looked better than Ben Godfrey has in two years?

What nonesense.

[Thirsty Lizard 3,165]

2 hours ago, CDMullins said:

A Premier League club he played one league game for.

A player who was allowed to train with another club prior to any transfer talks taking place.

What's that got to do with the price of fish??? He was on a Premier League contract with Burnley (you'll probably be talking about £40 grand a week). And we'll be picking up either all or most of that - and quite possibly a chunky loan fee as well. 

[CDMullins 436]

1 hour ago, Thirsty Lizard said:

What's that got to do with the price of fish??? He was on a Premier League contract with Burnley (you'll probably be talking about £40 grand a week). And we'll be picking up either all or most of that - and quite possibly a chunky loan fee as well. 

Are you on a wind up?

Its relevant because a players value is determined by how much he is wanted by his current club.

The fact that hes played 1 league game for Burnley and that they'd allowed him to train at M'boro, tells you he isn't wanted so he's no longer worth anywhere near the £15 Million they paid two years ago.

So I highly doubt there was a chunky loan fee, nor will the wages be astronomical, if we're paying half his wage we're paying probably the same amount as we paid Timm Klose.

So yes, this is, considering all the sales we've made, a 'cheap option'

 

[paul moy 235]

21 hours ago, Number9 said:

Nothing at all if that's your business plan. 

The post I had replied to however, seemed to be hoping that the academy would provide many first team players.

That's a different matter entirely, a tiny fraction of players from the academy make regular first team starts.

Martin & Idah don't. 

If you compare our academy success with other clubs I would guess we fare extremely favourably. Too early to judge those two on few appearances although Idah does stand out imo, and Godfrey and Cantwell have done pretty well in a very short space of time.

[sgncfc 1,228]

7 hours ago, CDMullins said:

Oh come on,

You cant actually be suggesting that Ben Gibson in 90 minutes as looked better than Ben Godfrey has in two years?

What nonesense.

As a centre back he already looks a better fit than Godfrey, but I concede that Godfrey has a superior all round game and ability. The defence will be much stronger with Gibson in it. Godfrey never convinced me - far too many avoidable errors. I'm sure he will develop into a fantastic player, he just isn't a very good centre back at the moment.

[CDMullins 436]

6 hours ago, sgncfc said:

As a centre back he already looks a better fit than Godfrey, but I concede that Godfrey has a superior all round game and ability. The defence will be much stronger with Gibson in it. Godfrey never convinced me - far too many avoidable errors. I'm sure he will develop into a fantastic player, he just isn't a very good centre back at the moment.

Cool, 

What does Carlo Ancelotti know eh? 

[Jim Smith 2,319]

On 08/10/2020 at 19:28, Number9 said:

That's 5 players, out of hundreds. 

It would be perhaps more accurate to recognize the academy as a player loan business, where players are purchased and developed to send out on loan, generating an income for the club.

Even then, in recent times, more players are bought in to do this and not developed through the academy from a young age.

 

 

I suppose if the academy can wash its own face through loan fees and more modest sales of those who don’t quite make it and then deliver a couple of first team candidates each season and the occasional big sale then it’s more than doing its job. 
 

i must say I was a bit concerned at the downturn in some of the results for the junior sides over the last couple of seasons. I know they gave said it’s not about results at that level and we have loads out on loan so it distorts things but it’s still good to see the younger sides doing well and this season they seem to be a decent unit both at U23s and U18s level. 

[PurpleCanary 5,562]

8 minutes ago, Jim Smith said:

I suppose if the academy can wash its own face through loan fees and more modest sales of those who don’t quite make it and then deliver a couple of first team candidates each season and the occasional big sale then it’s more than doing its job. 
 

i must say I was a bit concerned at the downturn in some of the results for the junior sides over the last couple of seasons. I know they gave said it’s not about results at that level and we have loads out on loan so it distorts things but it’s still good to see the younger sides doing well and this season they seem to be a decent unit both at U23s and U18s level. 

The other point about having an academy, which I don't think has been made so far, is that if you don't have one, or if it is not well regarded in the game, then these players, some of whom will turn out to be worthwhile, will go to the academies of rival clubs. I have seen some off the wall arguments on this message-board but questioning the overall wisdom and the actual results of our youth policy is one I hadn't expected to see.

[BroadstairsR 2,173]

"I suppose if the academy can wash its own face through loan fees and more modest sales of those who don’t quite make it and then deliver a couple of first team candidates each season and the occasional big sale then it’s more than doing its job."

Exactly, a quiet revolution has taken place  at the club over the past few seasons. Firmed up by the bond issue, the ensuing improvements facilitated by this, the appointment of a loans mananger and the obvious upturn in aquiring promising youngsters from here, there and everywhere; to the extent that even the most fervent follower must lose track, it is my  considered opinion that, along with our tremendous support, the NCFC Youth Policy is our proudest boost.

We rank among the elite twenty or so clubs with Academy 1 status:

 

 

[BroadstairsR 2,173]

20th. in the productivity rankings @ 2017/18  .... and rising.

 

 

https://trainingground.guru/articles/academy-productivity-rankings-2017/18

Edited October 10, 2020 by BroadstairsR

[Doomcaster 10]

Tyrese Omotoye - I hope will be a fantastic striker for our 1st 11 in the future (or even near future - who knows)

Youth system is clearly a lot better now - to support our 'self funding' Club , with £15 million + players off to support our never ending poor & low coffers is good to see 

However - we are not now in the Prem - the cash for our players will be much harder to achieve (I assume that's why Webber will be off to pastures new)

The 3 or 4 year plan of Webber / Farke is not working atm - we look like 'rabbits caught in the headlights' with the so called 'noise' around Cantwell & Buendia (pretty pathetic excuse in my opinion)

I assumed Webber & Farke had enough about them them - to understands that would happed, & should have planned with all the cash available - not distract them from PROMOTION

Bourmouth look like they done their homework ok ...

 

[TheGunnShow 5,940]

Such good money wasn't that hard to achieve with two defenders who came through our youth team and were relegated with us in the Premiership. We scored eight figures on the Murphys despite being in the Championship. We got a club record for Maddison (until Godfrey was sold) who hadn't even played a minute in the Premiership when we sold him. Just because we're in the Championship doesn't mean we can't get big fees.

(Besides, look at what Brentford scored for Ollie Watkins).

Even when we won the Championship we were near the bottom after six games, scraped a couple of 1-0s (one against Middlesborough started it IIRC). If Pukki's standing leg hadn't slipped against Derby, we'd have won that on the counter, be on 7 from 12 and generally be looking up early on.

As others have said, Farke's excellence lies in judging when youngsters are ready. He is strong enough to play them and let them make mistakes in their footballing education without undue panic. Also, another week on the training ground to fine-tune things should help with so many new players. That was one thing he did very well in our last Championship win - come out of international breaks.

[CDMullins 436]

11 minutes ago, TheGunnShow said:

Such good money wasn't that hard to achieve with two defenders who came through our youth team and were relegated with us in the Premiership. We scored eight figures on the Murphys despite being in the Championship. We got a club record for Maddison (until Godfrey was sold) who hadn't even played a minute in the Premiership when we sold him. Just because we're in the Championship doesn't mean we can't get big fees.

(Besides, look at what Brentford scored for Ollie Watkins).

Even when we won the Championship we were near the bottom after six games, scraped a couple of 1-0s (one against Middlesborough started it IIRC). If Pukki's standing leg hadn't slipped against Derby, we'd have won that on the counter, be on 7 from 12 and generally be looking up early on.

As others have said, Farke's excellence lies in judging when youngsters are ready. He is strong enough to play them and let them make mistakes in their footballing education without undue panic. Also, another week on the training ground to fine-tune things should help with so many new players. That was one thing he did very well in our last Championship win - come out of international breaks.

If Richard Stearman had'nt played a rediculously short backpass

And Declan Rudd hadn't dropped one in his own net,

We'd be on 1 from 12.

[PurpleCanary 5,562]

1 minute ago, CDMullins said:

If Richard Stearman had'nt played a rediculously short backpass

And Declan Rudd hadn't dropped one in his own net,

We'd be on 1 from 12.

Absolutely, because none of the other goals scored in the Championship this season have come from defensive mistakes by the opposition. Only ours...

[TheGunnShow 5,940]

2 minutes ago, PurpleCanary said:

Absolutely, because none of the other goals scored in the Championship this season have come from defensive mistakes by the opposition. Only ours...

Exactly. Apples and oranges. Stearman/Rudd are errors, a standing leg slipping is just bloody unlucky.

Plenty of goals are scored from errors - in fact you could argue most are scored from errors in some way. Some are just more blatant, like the Stearman/Rudd cases.

[CDMullins 436]

28 minutes ago, TheGunnShow said:

Exactly. Apples and oranges. Stearman/Rudd are errors, a standing leg slipping is just bloody unlucky.

Plenty of goals are scored from errors - in fact you could argue most are scored from errors in some way. Some are just more blatant, like the Stearman/Rudd cases.

If its apples and oranges then my point counts just as much as yours,

We could easily be on 1, we could also be on 7.

Both points are fair.

[CDMullins 436]

37 minutes ago, PurpleCanary said:

Absolutely, because none of the other goals scored in the Championship this season have come from defensive mistakes by the opposition. Only ours...

Ok, so none of the other misses have come from players slipping/misisng, only ours?

[Number9 272]

1 hour ago, Jim Smith said:

I suppose if the academy can wash its own face through loan fees and more modest sales of those who don’t quite make it and then deliver a couple of first team candidates each season and the occasional big sale then it’s more than doing its job. 
 

i must say I was a bit concerned at the downturn in some of the results for the junior sides over the last couple of seasons. I know they gave said it’s not about results at that level and we have loads out on loan so it distorts things but it’s still good to see the younger sides doing well and this season they seem to be a decent unit both at U23s and U18s level. 

The games are age grouped so if the best players go out on loan, a younger player steps up.

This can distort the actual game results enormously.