The Positive Brexit Thread

[Yellow Fever 3,821]

Actually I never bought into this metropolitan elite nonsense. As others note that is quintessentially Johnson, Farage etc.

What I do sense and feel personally was an anti-London rebellion in the regions -  many fed-up with everything being (and still is) so London centric. CrossRail (1 and 2) , HS2, new runway at LHR and so on. The regions being short changed on investment and opportunity - the 'Northern link' or or more locally the A47/A17 dualing. Still waiting.

Sadly this knee jerk anti-London/establishment surge as expressed in Brexit was very self destructive to the regional cause.

Johnson's 'levelling up' tries to tap into this but so far in reality and with the economic consequences of Brexit and Covid are just largely hollow words as usual.  

Move the Treasury including No. 11 and all those overpaid London civil servants (with London waiting) to Leeds say and I might start to believe it.

[Bill 1,788]

Or be honest and explain that the reasons those areas grew and prospered no longer exists. Heavy industries such as ship building mining and steelworks have gone - they are not coming.

I auspect if those redwall voters were to trace their ancestry back to the late 19th century they would find that huge number originall came from places like Norfolk.

 Cetain Mill towns around Bacup had dozens of Norfolk folk from the same village - much as with parts of Rotherham.  People moved to where the work was.

Unfortunately with an economy heavily reliant upon personal debt, we are left with millions who can no longer move however much they want to.  Try selling your three bedroom house in 'the north' and see what you can buy south of Watford Gap. Try moving from a council house in 'the north' to one south of the Watford gap.... no chance.

So much of the work which could be taken by UK born workers goes to a more flexible and less demanding EU labour force. . The standard of housing is often a step up, whereas it is a step down for UK workers.

The past year has shown this starkly. Despite a huge number of EU workers leaving the UK it has not resulted in a corresponding fall in UK workers being out of work - for the reasons stated above.

In a bizarre twist we have the same media crowing about how house prices are consistently rising, ignoring the blindingly obvious consequence that more and more UK workers are shut out from taking up employment. Those rising house rices have merely increased personal debt, where money is spent on imported consumer goods - rather than as in much of northern Europe debt is owed on investment on infrastructure and business development. Any wonder that the EU exports far more to the UK than it imports. Any wonder that so much of UK utility companies are owned by EU companies. That much of the privatised UK rail companies are owned by state owned EU companies, leeching huge subsidies from the UK government seems of no consequence., to those who endless bleat about how they have been left behind

Any wonder that there is a huge skill shortage among UK workers.The short termism that has seen a decline in investment has seen schools  turned into 'on the cheap' free schools, nursing bursaries removed as medical staff from abroad are cheaper in the short term, and vital utility companies driven by bonused executives squeezing out every last drop of profit (dividends) at the expense of long term planning.

When this is put over, it is met with howls of outrage. We want pipe dreams they demand. We want politicians who will lie through their arz, as long as they promise us the earth.

And thats what they have now got.

[BigFish 1,988]

16 hours ago, PurpleCanary said:

As with social policy, on the NHS for example, there was (after a while) broad agreement between the two main parties on this. Allied to this concord was a generally liberal (in the non-party sense) approach to morality, spurred on by the beneficial and wise influence of that most justly celebrated generation – the baby boomers.*

*Yes, this was inserted to annoy the h*ll out of BF…

It worked, @PurpleCanary my friend, it worked 😀. Agree with pretty much everything in the post though.

16 hours ago, Barbe bleu said:

Im not talking about the labour party. They are guilty only of being absent. The fact that Johnson, who is metropolitan privilege personified, feels he can play the metropolitan elite card should, however, make you think.

And who said that anyone should appeal to a racist, xenophobic or sextist identity?! Certainly not me, I want the labour party (or anyone for that matter) to create snd sell a positive, realistic and broad vision to replace these things

I'll leave it there though.   Bill wants his fight and whilst I feel that this could be an area for interesting discussion I'm simply not willing to feed that pathetic character anymore.

@Barbe bleu, just click the ignore button on Bill. He is one of only two posters I do this for, although it does lead to pages of "You have chosen to ignore posts by this poster" messages, but that is probably an improvement. My key point is we already have a hard won positive, realistic and broad vision as can be seen by the England team, Rashford in particular, the Olympics and in many of our young people's engagement with politics. However, right wing popularists are attempting to undermine this with a completly false narrative of a "white working class" being oppressed, demonised or neglected. The emphasis is always on the the first word, not the last for two reasons. Firstly, they abhore a multicultural working class that has more in common with each other than divides them. Secondly, it is successive Conservative governments, 80s Thatcherism and neo-liberal economics that is at the root of this alienation.

[Bill 1,788]

So the delays at the ports are now expected to be permanent *

"Emergency powers to handle post-Brexit queues of lorries heading for France are being made permanent, signalling the government expects further cross-Channel disruption."

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2021/aug/10/emergency-brexit-powers-for-lorry-queues-to-be-made-permanent

 

* in fairness there aren't any costly delays at UK fishing ports, as there aren't any fish to land 🙄

[keelansgrandad 6,679]

3 hours ago, Bill said:

So the delays at the ports are now expected to be permanent *

"Emergency powers to handle post-Brexit queues of lorries heading for France are being made permanent, signalling the government expects further cross-Channel disruption."

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2021/aug/10/emergency-brexit-powers-for-lorry-queues-to-be-made-permanent

 

* in fairness there aren't any costly delays at UK fishing ports, as there aren't any fish to land 🙄

If you can get a taxi or Big Mac for having a jab then I cannot see why we can't make it law that if you want a continental holiday, you have to take a cram of fish abroad with you to sell.🐟🏖

[Bill 1,788]

4 minutes ago, keelansgrandad said:

If you can get a taxi or Big Mac for having a jab then I cannot see why we can't make it law that if you want a continental holiday, you have to take a cram of fish abroad with you to sell.🐟🏖

where would these fish come from  ?

thanks to brexit English boats are tied up

how easily the stupid were conned

[Herman 9,820]

Brexit forces garden centre to give away £100,000 worth of plants for free.

https://www.plymouthherald.co.uk/whats-on/whats-on-news/brexit-forces-garden-centre-give-5766274?utm_source=twitter.com&utm_medium=social&utm_campaign=sharebar

[keelansgrandad 6,679]

8 hours ago, Herman said:

Brexit forces garden centre to give away £100,000 worth of plants for free.

https://www.plymouthherald.co.uk/whats-on/whats-on-news/brexit-forces-garden-centre-give-5766274?utm_source=twitter.com&utm_medium=social&utm_campaign=sharebar

Saw this on our West Country news. Cornwall just hasn't enough staff for much anymore. Hospitals closing for three months, restaurants only able to open for certain days, shelves not being restacked etc.

And its beggar all to do with Covid.

[Herman 9,820]

2 hours ago, keelansgrandad said:

Saw this on our West Country news. Cornwall just hasn't enough staff for much anymore. Hospitals closing for three months, restaurants only able to open for certain days, shelves not being restacked etc.

And its beggar all to do with Covid.

We've got away with it this year. We seemed to have tapped into the local kids who have returned from uni/waiting to leave for uni. They also have a decent work ethic and we haven't had to go through agencies which saves a fair whack of money too.

[Herman 9,820]

As reported yesterday.

Operation Brock: Brexit lorry controls 'could stay'.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-kent-58170463

 

[Bill 1,788]

On 10/08/2021 at 17:49, Bill said:

So the delays at the ports are now expected to be permanent *

"Emergency powers to handle post-Brexit queues of lorries heading for France are being made permanent, signalling the government expects further cross-Channel disruption."

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2021/aug/10/emergency-brexit-powers-for-lorry-queues-to-be-made-permanent

 

* in fairness there aren't any costly delays at UK fishing ports, as there aren't any fish to land 🙄

or as above

[sonyc 5,541]

 

 

[horsefly 4,310]

[horsefly 4,310]

https://nation.cymru/news/traders-abandon-holyhead-port-post-brexit-says-irish-gov-agency-report/

[BroadstairsR 2,202]

On 12/08/2021 at 09:04, sonyc said:

 

 

Well! If it means less of those giant polluting++ juggernauts clogging up our roads, then I'm not complaining. 

[sonyc 5,541]

34 minutes ago, BroadstairsR said:

Well! If it means less of those giant polluting++ juggernauts clogging up our roads, then I'm not complaining. 

Barnier suggested that we should use the period post 2016 vote wisely. The UK prevaricated, argued with itself, played chicken right up to the final weeks before a deal was rushed into being. And then it was deficient.

I'm not unduly playing politics here or making a joke out of this (the tweet was a sober one) just stating what happened.

Ireland certainly used those 4 to 5 years to get their trade arrangements properly embedded. I suppose doing what is needed in a practical way is to be applauded. After all the ramifications for not doing so are something you'd want to avoid. Too many livelihoods at stake. But our government hasn't and didn't plan anything like adequately. 

Edited August 13, 2021 by sonyc

[Yellow Fever 3,821]

3 hours ago, horsefly said:

https://nation.cymru/news/traders-abandon-holyhead-port-post-brexit-says-irish-gov-agency-report/

It's quite a shocking indictment of how inept our Brexity government is and the lack of planning or forethought (I think that's actually a good definition of Brexit actually)  - and the rather dismal consequences for Brexit UK. Bypassed.

Seems like the Irish are enjoying their British jokes  - How many Brexiteers does it take to organize a ferry or customs terminal etc ?

Edited August 13, 2021 by Yellow Fever

[Herman 9,820]

In a nutshell the Europeans took brexit seriously. The British didn't. 

[keelansgrandad 6,679]

35 minutes ago, Herman said:

In a nutshell the Europeans took brexit seriously. The British didn't. 

I still believe to this day that they never expected to win the vote so never had any real plans should they win.

Just like leaving Afghanistan. How can we ever leave after what we did? We can't leave the Falklands either. There are no exit plans.

Edited August 13, 2021 by keelansgrandad

[Herman 9,820]

A covid/brexit update and a perfectly sensible thing for the government to do.

 

[horsefly 4,310]

22 minutes ago, Herman said:

A covid/brexit update and a perfectly sensible thing for the government to do.

 

Well I suppose the money for all those vastly over-paid PPE deals for Tory chums has to come from somewhere.

[Herman 9,820]

Well there's a surprise.

 

[horsefly 4,310]

3 minutes ago, Herman said:

Well there's a surprise.

 

Surely you're not suggesting that Johnson lied to achieve power???? Do you have any evidence that he has consistently lied throughout his various careers in order to pursue his personal ambitions (The evidence of all his past employers and colleagues is, of course, strictly prohibited, as are Johnson's own words (when they are comprehensible)).

[horsefly 4,310]

How many times have the Express reprinted the same article simply substituting a different EU country's name in the title. p*ss-poor journalism for bigoted brexiteers into their "watersports":

https://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/world/eu-on-brink-sweden-tipped-for-heartbreaking-divorce-from-bloc-to-follow-uk-s-brexit/ar-AANjLOF?ocid=msedgntp

 

I'm reminded of Daniel Dennet's and Douglas Hofstadter's (The Minds "I") anaology of the sphex wasp:

"The Sphex story is an anecdote about a female digger wasp that at first sight seems to act quite intelligently, but subsequently is shown to be a mere automaton that can be made to repeat herself endlessly"

 https://www.researchgate.net/publication/235420412_The_Sphex_story_How_the_cognitive_sciences_kept_repeating_an_old_and_questionable_anecdote

Edited August 15, 2021 by horsefly

[Herman 9,820]

The Express is a sham of a paper.

 

[keelansgrandad 6,679]

1 hour ago, Herman said:

The Express is a sham of a paper.

 

Yes, but we have our sovereignty back. 🤔

Who can put a value on that?😂😂😂

[A Load of Squit 5,215]

On 15/07/2021 at 11:27, SwindonCanary said:

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2021/aug/17/poland-backs-down-in-row-with-eu-over-disciplining-judges

Poland backs down in row with EU over disciplining judges

Warsaw says it will shut down supreme court chamber that Brussels says is a breach of EU law

 

[How I Wrote Elastic Man 1,192]

Brexit beginning to pay off 😀

Looking good for British company Tate and Lyle

🇬🇧🇬🇧🇬🇧

[keelansgrandad 6,679]

1 hour ago, How I Wrote Elastic Man said:

Brexit beginning to pay off 😀

Looking good for British company Tate and Lyle

🇬🇧🇬🇧🇬🇧

Ah but the Government wants us to cut down on sugar😂

[PurpleCanary 5,580]

18 hours ago, How I Wrote Elastic Man said:

Brexit beginning to pay off 😀

Looking good for British company Tate and Lyle

🇬🇧🇬🇧🇬🇧

A Partridge reporting on a Norfolk story...😜