There's three main problems at Norwich City

[Drazen Muzinic 1,445]

12 hours ago, ricardo said:

Very quiet when I went through Bin Town today.

Spending a lot of time over the border recently Ricky. Missionary work?

[king canary 7,606]

It seems to me the best spells under this ownership have been when the owners have stepped back, appointed people with strong football knowledge and let them get on with it- McNally initially and now Webber. The worst have come when they've got too involved/attached and sentimentality has taken over.

I was highly skeptical at the start of this season (and remain somewhat unsure of what the next couple of seasons could look like under this ownership if we don't gain promotion this season) but all credit to the ownership who took a gamble on this new structure and have let it play out.

[lappinitup 629]

2 minutes ago, king canary said:

It seems to me the best spells under this ownership have been when the owners have stepped back, appointed people with strong football knowledge and let them get on with it- McNally initially and now Webber. The worst have come when they've got too involved/attached and sentimentality has taken over.

In other words, any success we've had has been down to others - but they alone are responsible for any failures?

[king canary 7,606]

16 minutes ago, lappinitup said:

In other words, any success we've had has been down to others - but they alone are responsible for any failures?

No and I truly believe you can only interpret my post in that way if you're looking for an argument.

As I put in the final sentence of my post 'all credit to the owners' for making the right appointments.

[lappinitup 629]

23 minutes ago, king canary said:

No and I truly believe you can only interpret my post in that way if you're looking for an argument.

As I put in the final sentence of my post 'all credit to the owners' for making the right appointments.

Disagreeing with you is not the same as "looking for an argument".

The bit where I disagree with you is when you stated......

"the best spells under this ownership have been when the owners have stepped back"

"The worst have come when they've got too involved/attached and sentimentality has taken over."

I really can't believe their involvement in the club changes depending on whoever the chief excecutive is and that so just an assumption on your part. I believe their involvement would have been constant throughout their tenure.

Just like the opening poster, it's easy to blame them when things go wrong but give others the credit in good times.

[ricardo 7,395]

3 hours ago, Drazen Muzinic said:

Spending a lot of time over the border recently Ricky. Missionary work?

Mrs R is fond of the Suffolk coast.👍😎

It gives me the opportunity to covertly watch the Binners and read those deluded reports in the E.A.D.T.

[king canary 7,606]

53 minutes ago, lappinitup said:

Disagreeing with you is not the same as "looking for an argument".

The bit where I disagree with you is when you stated......

"the best spells under this ownership have been when the owners have stepped back"

"The worst have come when they've got too involved/attached and sentimentality has taken over."

I really can't believe their involvement in the club changes depending on whoever the chief excecutive is and that so just an assumption on your part. I believe their involvement would have been constant throughout their tenure.

Just like the opening poster, it's easy to blame them when things go wrong but give others the credit in good times.

Disagreeing is fine- but claiming I'm saying something I'm quite clearly not (as you did in your first reply) isn't disagreeing.

I'm not 'blaming them when things go wrong and giving credit to others when it goes right.'

I specifically said they deserve credit for seeing where we were going wrong, making the changes and bringing in this new system. Similarly they deserve credit for doing the same thing after the league one relegation.

Sometimes good leadership is just getting the right people in the right jobs and letting them do their thing. 

[keelansgrandad 6,679]

Any club owner has to take a punt on how they run the club. We are sensibly using the Sporting Director and Head Coach system.

But, as an example, should either or both get lured away, would our next target want to work the same way. That would narrow the hunt down to those who would but maybe aren't up to the job. But you have to get someone.

Our owners have shown humility and admitted that they were wrong previously and using the current model. That is proper ownership.

[king canary 7,606]

3 minutes ago, keelansgrandad said:

But, as an example, should either or both get lured away, would our next target want to work the same way. That would narrow the hunt down to those who would but maybe aren't up to the job. But you have to get someone.

The general trend in English football is towards this model so I think the days of managers only taking a job if they get full control are numbered- the younger up and coming managers will be happy to work under a Sporting Director.

Edited February 26, 2019 by king canary
typo

[PurpleCanary 5,562]

30 minutes ago, king canary said:

Disagreeing is fine- but claiming I'm saying something I'm quite clearly not (as you did in your first reply) isn't disagreeing.

I'm not 'blaming them when things go wrong and giving credit to others when it goes right.'

I specifically said they deserve credit for seeing where we were going wrong, making the changes and bringing in this new system. Similarly they deserve credit for doing the same thing after the league one relegation.

Sometimes good leadership is just getting the right people in the right jobs and letting them do their thing. 

That is just what you are doing:

"The best spells under this ownership have been when the owners have stepped back, appointed people with strong football knowledge and let them get on with it- McNally initially and now Webber. The worst have come when they've got too involved/attached and sentimentality has taken over..."

You are saying it goes wrong when they get too hands on. But as Lapps says, there is no evidence that the level of their involvement in actually running the club varies. I will happily be corrected but as far as I can see that level has stayed the same, no matter who the CEO has been.

Of course, if the CEO fails to do their job properly then they will step in and if need be sack one and choose another. But that is not the same as your claim that they sometimes get too involved in running the club, which is a frequent complaint but one that never seems to be backed up with evidence.

Apart from some bad decisions - which all owners make, and overall I think Smith and Jones;' record is pretty good - their obvious failing, which I grant you and have highlighted myself, is occasionally getting too sentimentally attached. As with (sorry nutty!!!) Worthington. So tough decisions are put off. But the upside of that is that CEOs and managers are given time to get it right.

Unfortunately they didn't do that this season but panicked early on - I suspect this OP may have prompted them to act - and sacked Farke. I honestly believe if he had been given just a bit more time he would have turned results round and we could even have been challenging for a play-off place. Perhaps I am being blindly optimistic there, though. Sad that we will never know what might have been.

[king canary 7,606]

2 minutes ago, PurpleCanary said:

That is just what you are doing:
 

No it isn't. It really isn't tough.

I'm giving them credit when things go right. And I'll happilly say they weren't at fault when we got relegated under Alex Neil, nor were they to blame for the fiasco under Grant etc etc....

[Thirsty Lizard 3,165]

8 hours ago, PurpleCanary said:

Unfortunately they didn't do that this season but panicked early on - I suspect this OP may have prompted them to act - and sacked Farke. I honestly believe if he had been given just a bit more time he would have turned results round and we could even have been challenging for a play-off place. Perhaps I am being blindly optimistic there, though. Sad that we will never know what might have been.

I agree Purple - I think Farke should have been given more time. I was even more blindly optimistic than you. I thought that he would have moulded a team who played superb incisive passing football allied to a never say attitude that would have seen them surge to the top of the division. I think the coaching skills of Farke and his team would have turned players who were average last season into world beaters this season and in addition that they would have brought through a clutch of brilliant young players from our academy who would have taken the division by storm. Furthermore Farke would have forged a fantastic spirit of togetherness and shared purpose between the team and fans........................................................I realise that my optimism was wildly over the top, but you have to dream don't you?

Edited February 26, 2019 by Thirsty Lizard

[PurpleCanary 5,562]

14 minutes ago, Thirsty Lizard said:

I agree Purple - I think Farke should have been given more time. I was even more blindly optimistic than you. I thought that he would have moulded a team who played superb incisive passing football allied to a never say attitude that would have seen them surge to the top of the division. I think the coaching skills of Farke and his team would have turned players who were average last season into world beaters this season and in addition that they would have brought through a clutch of brilliant young players from our academy who would have taken the division by storm. Furthermore Farke would have forged a fantastic spirit of togetherness and shared purpose between the team and fans........................................................I realise that my optimism was blindly optimistic, but you have to dream don't you?

You do have to dream, Thirsty. You'll think this silly, but  have a dream that one day, one day, we will be so good we will be able to afford to miss penalty after penalty and still be top of the league...

[nutty nigel 7,535]

That's typical view of the yellow and green tinted glasses wearing Deliarites. Those of us of us with proper shltty rust coloured glasses knew it was time for him to go. 

Hell in a handcart with these owners. You mark my words. We won't be able to live with the binners and their investor. If only our board had had Sheepshanks' ambition when Marcus was available...

[lappinitup 629]

2 hours ago, PurpleCanary said:

Unfortunately they didn't do that this season but panicked early on - I suspect this OP may have prompted them to act - and sacked Farke. I honestly believe if he had been given just a bit more time he would have turned results round and we could even have been challenging for a play-off place. Perhaps I am being blindly optimistic there, though. Sad that we will never know what might have been.

Yep, if they hadn't been so hasty, we might have got Lambert back before he went to the binners......

[splendidrush 700]

34 minutes ago, lappinitup said:

Yep, if they hadn't been so hasty, we might have got Lambert back before he went to the binners......

Now I'm going to have trouble sleeping. 

[Bill 1,788]

3 hours ago, nutty nigel said:

That's typical view of the yellow and green tinted glasses wearing Deliarites. Those of us of us with proper shltty rust coloured glasses knew it was time for him to go. 

Hell in a handcart with these owners. You mark my words. We won't be able to live with the binners and their investor. If only our board had had Sheepshanks' ambition when Marcus was available...

"Get up in the morning, shaving for breakfast
So that me mouth can be fed
More tea, Deliarites 🎶 "

[wcorkcanary 4,334]

The 3 main problems at Norwich City that I see are....

 

1.The sun shining over the river end at this time of year.

2.  The supporting pillars that give a ' partially obstructed view' of the pitch.

3. Lack of statues.

Otherwise we are in pretty good shape. 

[Daz Sparks 1,154]

20 minutes ago, wcorkcanary said:

The 3 main problems at Norwich City that I see are....

 

1.The sun shining over the river end at this time of year.

2.  The supporting pillars that give a ' partially obstructed view' of the pitch.

3. Lack of statues.

Otherwise we are in pretty good shape. 

Damn that sun, we need a third tier on the River End!

[ricardo 7,395]

2 minutes ago, Daz Sparks said:

Damn that sun, we need a third tier on the River End!

You just need to kick the right way😎

[Daz Sparks 1,154]

Just now, ricardo said:

You just need to kick the right way😎

You mean be in the right stand, alternatively , give us a lend of those sunglasses please Ricardo.

[ricardo 7,395]

2 minutes ago, Daz Sparks said:

You mean be in the right stand, alternatively , give us a lend of those sunglasses please Ricardo.

The sun has always been in the same place this time of year since I've been going😀

I remember my dear old dad telling me that before City bought the ground it belonged to Colman's and there were two pitches that were at right angles to the present orientation.

before my time though😉

[Daz Sparks 1,154]

2 minutes ago, ricardo said:

The sun has always been in the same place this time of year since I've been going😀

I remember my dear old dad telling me that before City bought the ground it belonged to Colman's and there were two pitches that were at right angles to the present orientation.

before my time though😉

I guess someone has to get dazzled Ricardo, although TBH, I've been dazzled at Carrow Road when it's been cloudy this season! 😏

[Kathy 733]

Farke can move the sun.

[Drazen Muzinic 1,445]

4 hours ago, wcorkcanary said:

The 3 main problems at Norwich City that I see are....

 

1.The sun shining over the river end at this time of year.

2.  The supporting pillars that give a ' partially obstructed view' of the pitch.

3. Lack of statues.

Otherwise we are in pretty good shape. 

You forgot the scampi issue...

[keelansgrandad 6,679]

So now we've got supporters called pillars?

Can he say that?

[Thirsty Lizard 3,165]

33 minutes ago, keelansgrandad said:

So now we've got supporters called pillars?

Can he say that?

Pillars of the community (at least that what I think he meant)..........

[ron obvious 1,502]

6 hours ago, lappinitup said:

Yep, if they hadn't been so hasty, we might have got Lambert back before he went to the binners......

Praise be to the Messiah, the chosen one on whom the sun always shines, may he lead us out of the Land of Delia, yea even unto the third generation ..

What DID happen to Waveney??

 

[wcorkcanary 4,334]

7 hours ago, ron obvious said:

Praise be to the Messiah, the chosen one on whom the sun always shines, may he lead us out of the Land of Delia, yea even unto the third generation ..

What DID happen to Waveney??

 

Scampi overdose.

[Badger 2,405]

On 25/02/2019 at 19:40, ricardo said:

After having a read through all I have to say is how nice it is to be only one and a half positions away from our average of the last fifty years. Wonderful consistency😀

Regression to the mean...