why oh why people so negative

[Sim086 0]

I have just come home from work and I honestly cant believe what I am reading on here. We have just made are first signing this season and people already writing him off. this is not acceptable. how many of you would of signed russell martin, david fox or andrew crofts?? did everyone slate them? YES. Have they been good enough? DAMN RIGHT THEY HAVE! Funnily enough lambert does not get many signings wrong, i can think of possibly only 1 or 2. this guy has taken us from league one to the prem, i dont think ANYONE here is qualified to judge or question him.

IN LAMBERT I TRUST, AND SO SHOULD THE BLOOMING REST OF YOU!!!

[Bill 1,788]

"Funnily enough lambert does not get many signings wrong"

"i dont think ANYONE here is qualified to judge or question him."

other than you, it would appear (wink)

[Jack Barak 46]

Agree with the OP totally; give him a chance, he''s young and had some injury problems (not unlike Whitbread) but if Lambert thinks he is goo enough we should back that...I''m sure Lambert mentioned the trust of the fans in the press conference recently, I think he has earned our trust personally.

[jed exodous 0]

I''m just concerned by Vaughans goal scoring record.  Players who we''ve discussed on here before, Long, Graham, Maynard, Marrison, CMS, they''ve all scored plenty of goals in recent seasons, in fact most have scored more in the last year than Vaughan has in his career.  Vaughan has potential, but the figures being banded about for this deal seem very high.

 

We''re gonna need to score goals next season.  Realistically, we need 3 players to get probably 8 or more goals to give us a decent chance of staying up.  Do i think Vaughan could get 8 goals next season?  No.  I dont wanna write him off before hes even kicked a ball for us, Lambert has shown us we should give players a chance and i will, i''m just underwhelmed by this signing.  People on here talking about who they were hoping to sign in the last 3 weeks, Vaughan was not mentioned once that i saw, so for us to spend 2.5 million or whatever it will be, when we''ve been talking about those sort of figures for CMS or Morrison or maybe Graham, its a bit of a surprise. 

 

Good luck to the lad, i hope hes a success, still plenty of time for us to get some more quality in...

[Mr Brownstone 0]

Everton fans here

http://www.grandoldteam.com/forum/threads/35716-Vaughan-Very-Close-to-joining-Norwich-City-...

all speak very highly of him. Looking forward to seeing what he can do.

[Jack Barak 46]

[quote user="jed exodous"]

I''m just concerned by Vaughans goal scoring record.  Players who we''ve discussed on here before, Long, Graham, Maynard, Marrison, CMS, they''ve all scored plenty of goals in recent seasons, in fact most have scored more in the last year than Vaughan has in his career.  Vaughan has potential, but the figures being banded about for this deal seem very high.

 

We''re gonna need to score goals next season.  Realistically, we need 3 players to get probably 8 or more goals to give us a decent chance of staying up.  Do i think Vaughan could get 8 goals next season?  No.  I don''t wanna write him off before hes even kicked a ball for us, Lambert has shown us we should give players a chance and i will, I''m just underwhelmed by this signing.  People on here talking about who they were hoping to sign in the last 3 weeks, Vaughan was not mentioned once that i saw, so for us to spend 2.5 million or whatever it will be, when we''ve been talking about those sort of figures for CMS or Morrison or maybe Graham, its a bit of a surprise. 

 

Good luck to the lad, i hope hes a success, still plenty of time for us to get some more quality in...

[/quote]Don''t get me wrong, I am not suggesting he is going to get 20 next year and be the best thing ever, but let''s at least give him a chance - which I accept you are. He looked lively in the Palace game and was a threat to us, he''s been in a dreadful team all year that is now managed by Dougie Freedman...let''s see how he does with some real competition and a proper manager and coaching team.Also, looking at those who made a ''splash'' last year Andy Carroll only had a six month period of looking good before he moved for £35m, his goal ratio was not great before that and had the Geordies stayed in the Prem I don''t think he would have been given a chance.

[Year of the tiger 54]

[quote user="jed exodous"]

I''m just concerned by Vaughans goal scoring record.  Players who we''ve discussed on here before, Long, Graham, Maynard, Marrison, CMS, they''ve all scored plenty of goals in recent seasons, in fact most have scored more in the last year than Vaughan has in his career.  Vaughan has potential, but the figures being banded about for this deal seem very high.

 

Can''t believe you think we''re paying £2.5 mill up front. It will be considerably less with add ons. IF we pay up the add ons, he will probably have done well so no problem.

We''re gonna need to score goals next season.  Realistically, we need 3 players to get probably 8 or more goals to give us a decent chance of staying up.  Do i think Vaughan could get 8 goals next season?  No.  I dont wanna write him off before hes even kicked a ball for us, Lambert has shown us we should give players a chance and i will, i''m just underwhelmed by this signing.  People on here talking about who they were hoping to sign in the last 3 weeks, Vaughan was not mentioned once that i saw, so for us to spend 2.5 million or whatever it will be, when we''ve been talking about those sort of figures for CMS or Morrison or maybe Graham, its a bit of a surprise. 

 

Good luck to the lad, i hope hes a success, still plenty of time for us to get some more quality in...

[/quote]

[Year of the tiger 54]

Oops try again

Can''t believe you think we''re paying £2.5 mill up front. It will be considerably less with add ons. IF we pay up the add ons, he will probably have done well so no problem.

[jed exodous 0]

I know we aint paying that up front, but i''ll bet we''re paying over half up front.  Transfers with add-ons are not as common these days as they used to be and the add ons are not made as public as they used to be.  Take Russell Martin, not many knew we''d have to pay £200k upon promotion to the prem.  I fully expect we''ve spent the best part of 1.25-1.5 on him up front, that seems a lot to me.

 

O/T but it was mentioned above.  Andy Carroll scored 11 in 19 league games for Newcastle before his move, and 17 in 39 the season before.  Carrolls fee was ridiculous, and although hes only performed for 5 months, anyone can see the potential he has, the problems he causes defenders and pressence he has.  Target men like that are few and far between these days, especially those that could have 7-10 years still to play at the top.  Carroll will get 15 league goals next season quite comfortably in that team.

[Mahogany 0]

The Guardian says 1.5 rising to 2.5 on appearances. He''s no sure thing but if he can come through on some of his early promise he could be an absolute bargain, if not 1.5 isn''t a huge gamble considering how much strikers go for these days.

[Jack Barak 46]

[quote user="jed exodous"]

I know we aint paying that up front, but i''ll bet we''re paying over half up front.  Transfers with add-ons are not as common these days as they used to be and the add ons are not made as public as they used to be.  Take Russell Martin, not many knew we''d have to pay £200k upon promotion to the prem.  I fully expect we''ve spent the best part of 1.25-1.5 on him up front, that seems a lot to me.

 

O/T but it was mentioned above.  Andy Carroll scored 11 in 19 league games for Newcastle before his move, and 17 in 39 the season before.  Carrolls fee was ridiculous, and although hes only performed for 5 months, anyone can see the potential he has, the problems he causes defenders and pressence he has.  Target men like that are few and far between these days, especially those that could have 7-10 years still to play at the top.  Carroll will get 15 league goals next season quite comfortably in that team.

[/quote]Andy Carroll is, in my humble opinion, overrated - not just because of the crazy fee but because I have not seen enough from him to make me think he will be one of the ''greats''. 17 in 39 in a team that absolutely destroyed that league is nothing to write home about, what would Holt have got with the chances he was given? I think I have dragged this off point somewhat but what I am trying to say is this, JV''s goal tally has not been spectacular but sometimes people surprise...he looked good last year in a very poor team so let''s get behind him and see what he can do. Also, I am not sure that the negative comments that went Simeon''s way assisted his development, let''s learn from that.

[CJ 0]

We all know Lambert is a genius but that does not mean fans can not debate / discuss the merits or otherwise of new signings and many fans have simply pointed out that our latest signing has been injury prone and did not exactly set the Championship alive last season and could not get into Everton team.

BUT that does not mean he will not make it with us and I like all fans I am sure will back him when he comes on.

I suspect the real shock was the 2.5 million which if true is way beyond the price estimated for Mackail Smith and Bennett bids we put in.

Personnally I just hope Fraser Forster is on Lamberts list

[Downloads 35]

[quote user="jed exodous"]

I''m just concerned by Vaughans goal scoring record.  Players who we''ve discussed on here before, Long, Graham, Maynard, Marrison, CMS, they''ve all scored plenty of goals in recent seasons, in fact most have scored more in the last year than Vaughan has in his career.  Vaughan has potential, but the figures being banded about for this deal seem very high.

 

We''re gonna need to score goals next season.  Realistically, we need 3 players to get probably 8 or more goals to give us a decent chance of staying up.  Do i think Vaughan could get 8 goals next season?  No.  I dont wanna write him off before hes even kicked a ball for us, Lambert has shown us we should give players a chance and i will, i''m just underwhelmed by this signing.  People on here talking about who they were hoping to sign in the last 3 weeks, Vaughan was not mentioned once that i saw, so for us to spend 2.5 million or whatever it will be, when we''ve been talking about those sort of figures for CMS or Morrison or maybe Graham, its a bit of a surprise. 

 

Good luck to the lad, i hope hes a success, still plenty of time for us to get some more quality in...

[/quote]

Have a look and see how many teams had 3 players with 8 or more, goals are much harder to come by in the Prem, I wouldn''t set your sights too high.

 

If he scores half a dozen i''ll be happy.

[Jack Barak 46]

[quote user="CJ"]We all know Lambert is a genius but that does not mean fans can not debate / discuss the merits or otherwise of new signings and many fans have simply pointed out that our latest signing has been injury prone and did not exactly set the Championship alive last season and could not get into Everton team.

BUT that does not mean he will not make it with us and I like all fans I am sure will back him when he comes on.

I suspect the real shock was the 2.5 million which if true is way beyond the price estimated for Mackail Smith and Bennett bids we put in.

Personnally I just hope Fraser Forster is on Lamberts list[/quote]I am not suggesting otherwise it is just the negativity that I find hard to accept, he is a new signing, 22, and he came through the ranks at a Premiership club...that is no guarantee that he will make it but please can we at least give him a chance it seems a lot of people have written him before he even signs.

[jed exodous 0]

[quote user="Downloads"][quote user="jed exodous"]

I''m just concerned by Vaughans goal scoring record.  Players who we''ve discussed on here before, Long, Graham, Maynard, Marrison, CMS, they''ve all scored plenty of goals in recent seasons, in fact most have scored more in the last year than Vaughan has in his career.  Vaughan has potential, but the figures being banded about for this deal seem very high.

 

We''re gonna need to score goals next season.  Realistically, we need 3 players to get probably 8 or more goals to give us a decent chance of staying up.  Do i think Vaughan could get 8 goals next season?  No.  I dont wanna write him off before hes even kicked a ball for us, Lambert has shown us we should give players a chance and i will, i''m just underwhelmed by this signing.  People on here talking about who they were hoping to sign in the last 3 weeks, Vaughan was not mentioned once that i saw, so for us to spend 2.5 million or whatever it will be, when we''ve been talking about those sort of figures for CMS or Morrison or maybe Graham, its a bit of a surprise. 

 

Good luck to the lad, i hope hes a success, still plenty of time for us to get some more quality in...

[/quote]

Have a look and see how many teams had 3 players with 8 or more, goals are much harder to come by in the Prem, I wouldn''t set your sights too high.

 

If he scores half a dozen i''ll be happy.

[/quote]

mmm, fair enough i suppose, perhaps i''m being a tad optomistic.

[militantcanary 0]

I think that what is underwelming a lot of people, me included is the package of Vaughan and Morrison together.

in my book its ok to spend 1.5M rising to 2.5M on one of these but no way both, if that bid has been turned down by Millwall that should be the absolute end of matters. I assume that if we get Morrison this will be the end of our striker purchases.

I think we have to consider what we are left with if these two deals go through

.With all due respect is Holt, Jackson, Vaughan, Morrison, Martin the strikeforce of a Championship or Premiership team?? We don''t want to deepen the squad we want players who will improve the team immediately. These two players will not obviously do that.

And to the misguided people who are saying don''t worry we still have another £35M to spend, get a grip. The £40M budget includes all player wages and transfer fees spent. We will not spend more than 13M, no way no how.

For the last striker we need to look abroad for value for money, no name springs to mind in the striker dept i must admit but we have loads of Bosmans at home to look at in other positions

Reo Coker, T Cohen, Gabbidon, Larson etc would all really improve us

[yellow jonny 0]

Think the clue to a few was in you''re title! League 1 to premier league in 2 seasons. A board who bleed the club. A management team who want to be the best with a team who believe in them...... and a bunch of fans who???? ........ shouldn''t well all be buzzing that we''ve just made our first premier league signing for way too long?????

In the words of our most famous son... we''ve bounced back. Start to enjoy it if you can.....

[whoareyou? 0]

why oh why people so negative...............cos some people just like to maon. Had we signed ,say, Michael Owe, they would have complained his best days are gone and he was only coming for the money.

Some people will never understand that what Lambert has built is a team and squad with a wonderful ethic to go out and and win games for each other. If you think back Mike Walker''s great side was not dissimilar. There were no big names in that side til we started getting noticed and suddenly Fox and Sutton became worth a fortune.

If we do well next season there will be a few of our players making a big name for themselves again.

[ZLF 274]

He has experience in the prem; has played for a team which has had trouble scoring for years playing one up front but he has still been able to score while learning his craft as a youngster. He has pace and is fearless in the tackle.

He has talent, experience against better defenders than our squad has faced and clearly has the hunger to prove himself otherwise PL would not have been interested. I think he will fit in; it may not work out - but £2.5m in the prem is a good deal - we are not championship now - we will have to spend to avoid galling out of teh trap door first time - and investing in some youth means we may be able to sell on a recoup if the expected happens.

Get a grip - or you are all likely to have a very disappointing season.

[jed exodous 0]

Its not a case of moaning mate.  The message board is open to sensible debate, which is what i''ve tried to put accross.  I haven''t written anyone off, i just expressed that i feel like we''ve paid over the odds for a player.  In our first season back in the prem, i felt we''d need a bit more experience in the team, not someone whos still developing and doesn''t have much of a proven track record. 

 

Come on guys, as i mentioned earlier, this is one thats come out of nowhere (as i guess a lot of Lambo''s signings do).  When we were promoted 3 1/2 weeks ago, Mr Vaughan was not anyones wish list, now, to probably about half the posters on here, hes a great signing.  I just rather we''re spending 1 - 1.5 million or whatever it is up front (lets face it, nobody on here will know what it is) on a striker with a better goalscoring record.  I''d rather we spent more to get someone in like Morrison, CMS or maybe Graham and then gone after someone on a free like either Earnshaw or maybe Nugent.  Just my humble opinon.

[Chelmsford Canary 0]

Who are the bad signings?

Steven smith is only one, and it''s not really PL fault!

Oli Johnson done the job in L1

Who else?

[The Walking Man 13]

Just as a curious matter of interest, what do people reckon Danni Pacheco is worth?

[CanaryOne 0]

With Pacheco you are talking massive potential , i doubt Liverpool would sell for under £5 million.

[Old Shuck 183]

The thing to remember about Andy Carrol is that he made his debut for Newcastle in 2006/07, so was making the odd appearance for thm now and again over that and the following couple of seasons, as well as having a loan spell at Preston. He was spoken of as having potential but, at one point, didn''t seem as if it would be with them, and we were linked with him ourselves at one point, much to the chagrin of many a poster on here as I recall...quite possibly for the same reasons as those doubts that are now being expressed about Vaughan.

Newcastle persisted with him and he really started to come to the fore with them in in 09/10, four years after he had made his debut. He needed time to develop as a player, and was given it, he (and Newcastle) finally reaped the rewards-then and this season, ditto Liverpool and now England. He would never have been thought of as a player who went onto to achieve what he has so far, even two years ago,

If it sounds like I am attempting to compare him to Vaughan as a player-I am, but in terms of how their careers have developed and that Vaughan''s might have a similar outcome, not that they are similar players-and of course, they are not. There are never any guarantees with any signing and for us to sign a player who would have any reasonable chance of scoring 15-20 goals next season could mean spending in excess of £10-£15 million-and it would still be a gamble.

Better to gamble up to £2 million or so than five times that amount when the end result, either way, might be the same.

I do think his arrival pretty much means we won''t be going for, nor are interested in, CMS anymore; also think it might mean the end of Chris Martin''s time here, especially with rumours linking him with Cardiff.

[Sim086 0]

[quote user="Chelmsford Canary"]Who are the bad signings? Steven smith is only one, and it''s not really PL fault! Oli Johnson done the job in L1 Who else?[/quote]

macnamee for me