First Wizard 0 Posted November 7, 2010 In January, otherwise whats the damn point? Blackpool did it, and even if relegated, £40 million shareout will soften the blow for them. Hell, one season alone would wipe our debts out, plus, Lambert might start to question and doubt the Stowmarket pairs true ambition for City.........then what? PL needs to add strength to his squad, vague promises and daft appointments won''t cut it no more, you cannot run a club these days on love alone, and if they cannot put up the cash, they should step aside. And nor do I except that the effort has already been made, or that there''s no buyers out there.Too many other similar clubs in this league say otherwise! [url=http://www.thescubasite.com][img]http://forum.thescubasite.com/scared/scared0016.gif[/img][/url] Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Cantiaci Canary 557 Posted November 7, 2010 It is tempting to think that we could be two or three signings away from cementing a play off place. I think automatic promotion is impossible without spending a huge amount. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Davo 0 Posted November 7, 2010 And please tell me Mr Wizard, where exactly is this money supposed to come from?I have no knowledge of how much cash our directors have in their bank accounts, do you?Davo Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jack Barak 46 Posted November 7, 2010 Step aside for who though? At the moment who wants to throw loads of money at a club just to make it solvent again, let alone to allow investment in the team or infrastructure. We haven''t seen the accounts for the L1 year yet but McNally has already stated that they do not make good reading, so I think we can assume the club will have £30m debt as it stands. So any incoming owner is going to need to put £40m+ in, unless you are advocating a Liverpool / Man U type leveraged buyout....so my question again is, who is able / willing to pump that kind of money into Norwich?I am not claiming that Delia and MWJ are perfect or that they haven''t made mistakes but they are the only people willing to keep throwing their money into the bottomless pit that is a modern football club. Unless you were lucky enough to scoop that Euro millions the other week and you are planning a First Wiz hostile takeover???? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Joanna Grey 0 Posted November 7, 2010 Same old retarded shite from wiz. It''s like Groundhog day for idiots.... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
First Wizard 0 Posted November 7, 2010 [quote user="Kent Canary"]Step aside for who though? At the moment who wants to throw loads of money at a club just to make it solvent again, let alone to allow investment in the team or infrastructure. We haven''t seen the accounts for the L1 year yet but McNally has already stated that they do not make good reading, so I think we can assume the club will have £30m debt as it stands. So any incoming owner is going to need to put £40m+ in, unless you are advocating a Liverpool / Man U type leveraged buyout....so my question again is, who is able / willing to pump that kind of money into Norwich?I am not claiming that Delia and MWJ are perfect or that they haven''t made mistakes but they are the only people willing to keep throwing their money into the bottomless pit that is a modern football club. Unless you were lucky enough to scoop that Euro millions the other week and you are planning a First Wiz hostile takeover????[/quote] I believe Porstmouth, Leciester and Scum fans thought the same as you KC. All had bigger debts than us I think, except their owners really WANTED to sell. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PurpleCanary 5,558 Posted November 7, 2010 [quote user="First Wizard"][quote user="Kent Canary"]Step aside for who though? At the moment who wants to throw loads of money at a club just to make it solvent again, let alone to allow investment in the team or infrastructure. We haven''t seen the accounts for the L1 year yet but McNally has already stated that they do not make good reading, so I think we can assume the club will have £30m debt as it stands. So any incoming owner is going to need to put £40m+ in, unless you are advocating a Liverpool / Man U type leveraged buyout....so my question again is, who is able / willing to pump that kind of money into Norwich?I am not claiming that Delia and MWJ are perfect or that they haven''t made mistakes but they are the only people willing to keep throwing their money into the bottomless pit that is a modern football club. Unless you were lucky enough to scoop that Euro millions the other week and you are planning a First Wiz hostile takeover????[/quote] I believe Porstmouth, Leciester and Scum fans thought the same as you KC. All had bigger debts than us I think, except their owners really WANTED to sell.[/quote] And the common factor with those club is not having owners willing to sell but - wait for it - administration! Who''d have thought it?![;)] Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
smooth 114 Posted November 7, 2010 yep unfortunately staying up is the aim this year, yes we have goals and if we can get into the play offs then great, but I think we don''t have to add too much to our squad.We will not have the money we have no assett who is going to bring 4 million or so - that I saw the PNE Sean St Ledger (being rumoured) to be valued - in our squad.We are a selling club but at the moment not in a way that can bring us two or three quality signings, lets just enjoy what our squad is doing now.Staying in business is still priority and therefore staying up and becoming established in this league where there is money that we can''t compete with is the priority.Also if we get into the play offs this year the expectations for next year will be for the same again and guess what no more money and with three teams coming down with more parachute payments we would be down the pecking order once more, proving those expectations wil be false.We may get playoffs this year which will be incredible, but mid table will be a great achievement. As I have said before there are a number of teams that I would say have individual players/ backers that have moved on since we have been in this two-three year demise of nearly being relegated or being relegated to league 1, Doncaster and Billy Sharp being one example.So good luck with the cash. I think if we could extend barnetts loan and loan in a tall striker in case holt gets injured that is all we need this year. Can''t see us selling anyone for the cash we may need, may be some players to reduce the wage bill, but apart from them no real movers to help lambert in the push, that you wiz and others may want. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jack Barak 46 Posted November 7, 2010 [quote user="First Wizard"] I believe Porstmouth, Leciester and Scum fans thought the same as you KC All had bigger debts than us I think, except their owners really WANTED to sell.[/quote]And look at them, Portsmouth - still with heavy debts and had to go into a protracted administration to force a takeover.Leciester - hardly setting the world alight are they, also, no one knows the intentions of the new owners...I somehow doubt they intend to pup money in with no return.Scum - see above, an arms dealing unaccountable owner.I really would not swap our owners for any of these. But let''s look at modern takeovers in general.Man Utd - leveraged buyout producing losses to service the resulting debt, are the days of big purchases behind them now?Liverpool - I do''t need to say a lot about this.Portsmouth - see comments above.West Ham - going well!The takeovers that seem to work are those where the buyer has a plan to create a stable self supporting club and this seems to be the case where the owner has an interest in the well being of the club (other than a pure financial interest). Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Yorkshire Canary 118 Posted November 7, 2010 Lambert is doing well on a tight budget. Barnett may stay although being out of favour ant WBA and out of contract in the summer i would not expect him to cost too mutch. I reckon that will be about it. We do not have the cash to sign a good quality championship centre forward which would need 2 to 3 Million. Yes we could dip down the divisions again and it may come off or again we may have another league 1 forward to go with the others we have Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PurpleCanary 5,558 Posted November 7, 2010 [quote user="Kent Canary"][quote user="First Wizard"] I believe Porstmouth, Leciester and Scum fans thought the same as you KC All had bigger debts than us I think, except their owners really WANTED to sell.[/quote]Leciester - hardly setting the world alight are they, also, no one knows the intentions of the new owners...I somehow doubt they intend to pup money in with no return.[/quote] --- KC, it''s not even known WHO the new investor-owners are apart from the figurehead! There is this priceless interview with Mandaric from a couple of weeks ago:"Today is a great day for Leicester City. Our owners are fantastic people with incredible ambition for the future. They have great character and integrity and they will strive for success for Leicester City."But when pressed on the actual identity of the new investors, Mandaric remained tight-lipped. "The supporters will be the first to know who is on the board," he told BBC Radio Leicester. "At the moment I don''t want to say." I would say you couldn''t make it up, but actually... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jack Barak 46 Posted November 7, 2010 Good quote Purple.Great isn''t it, not dissimilar to Leeds...owned through a series of trusts and nominees. Is that what we want???I think we have to stick with McNally and co and let him build a sustainable club. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Mello Yello 2,293 Posted November 7, 2010 Will we have to sell - before we buy? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
First Wizard 0 Posted November 7, 2010 If you aim for mediocracy thats what you''ll get. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
First Wizard 0 Posted November 7, 2010 [quote user="Raymond Getärd"]Same old retarded shite from wiz. It''s like Groundhog day for idiots....[/quote] And sadly, its still relevent! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Mister Chops 7 Posted November 7, 2010 [quote user="First Wizard"]you cannot run a club these days on love alone, and if they cannot put up the cash, they should step aside.[/quote]That makes perfect sense. So instead of carrying on trucking along nicely with an outside chance of the playoffs, if we can''t invest big in January then the majority shareholders should stand aside, reclaim the money they are owed by the club and tip us into administration.McNally said he has a 5 year plan, I suggest McNally knows more about football and financing then you do, and I trust him more than you. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
YankeeCanary 0 Posted November 7, 2010 [quote user="Mister Chops"][quote user="First Wizard"]you cannot run a club these days on love alone, and if they cannot put up the cash, they should step aside.[/quote]That makes perfect sense. So instead of carrying on trucking along nicely with an outside chance of the playoffs, if we can''t invest big in January then the majority shareholders should stand aside, reclaim the money they are owed by the club and tip us into administration.McNally said he has a 5 year plan, I suggest McNally knows more about football and financing then you do, and I trust him more than you.[/quote]I agree with Mister Chops. Also, I have to add Wizard, as recently as November 1st you were admonishing a doubter as you continued to express your belief that we would achieve automatic promotion this season. You made no mention of any spending required to do so at that point. I wonder if, in the space of a few days, you are questioning your own earlier judgement? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
First Wizard 0 Posted November 7, 2010 [quote user="Mister Chops"][quote user="First Wizard"]you cannot run a club these days on love alone, and if they cannot put up the cash, they should step aside.[/quote]That makes perfect sense. So instead of carrying on trucking along nicely with an outside chance of the playoffs, if we can''t invest big in January then the majority shareholders should stand aside, reclaim the money they are owed by the club and tip us into administration.McNally said he has a 5 year plan, I suggest McNally knows more about football and financing then you do, and I trust him more than you.[/quote] But if they''re selling to the new owner your point becomes null and ruddy well void. [url=http://www.mysmiley.net][img]http://serve.mysmiley.net/tongue/tongue0011.gif[/img][/url] Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
First Wizard 0 Posted November 7, 2010 [quote user="YankeeCanary"][quote user="Mister Chops"][quote user="First Wizard"]you cannot run a club these days on love alone, and if they cannot put up the cash, they should step aside.[/quote]That makes perfect sense. So instead of carrying on trucking along nicely with an outside chance of the playoffs, if we can''t invest big in January then the majority shareholders should stand aside, reclaim the money they are owed by the club and tip us into administration.McNally said he has a 5 year plan, I suggest McNally knows more about football and financing then you do, and I trust him more than you.[/quote]I agree with Mister Chops. Also, I have to add Wizard, as recently as November 1st you were admonishing a doubter as you continued to express your belief that we would achieve automatic promotion this season. You made no mention of any spending required to do so at that point. I wonder if, in the space of a few days, you are questioning your own earlier judgement?[/quote] No YC, just playing devils advocate. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Mister Chops 7 Posted November 7, 2010 [quote user="First Wizard"][quote user="Mister Chops"][quote user="First Wizard"]you cannot run a club these days on love alone, and if they cannot put up the cash, they should step aside.[/quote]That makes perfect sense. So instead of carrying on trucking along nicely with an outside chance of the playoffs, if we can''t invest big in January then the majority shareholders should stand aside, reclaim the money they are owed by the club and tip us into administration.McNally said he has a 5 year plan, I suggest McNally knows more about football and financing then you do, and I trust him more than you.[/quote] But if they''re selling to the new owner your point becomes null and ruddy well void. [url=http://www.mysmiley.net][img]http://serve.mysmiley.net/tongue/tongue0011.gif[/img][/url][/quote]Only when there''s a new owner standing by with millions of pounds to put in. I know Christmas is coming soon, Wiz, but you do realise Santa is mythical? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Lambert is King 0 Posted November 7, 2010 All well and good as long as everyone is prepared to accept administration and likely relegation next year should your gamble not come off.There is no money and or fan basehave made it quite clear that they are not prepared to pay via their seat prices for additional budget let alone further cost for success. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Katie Borkins 1 Posted November 7, 2010 [quote user="First Wizard"]If you aim for mediocracy thats what you''ll get.[/quote]I''m sure Rupert Murdoch would agree with you. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Herman 9,764 Posted November 7, 2010 [quote user="Ed Miliband"][quote user="First Wizard"]If you aim for mediocracy thats what you''ll get.[/quote]I''m sure Rupert Murdoch would agree with you. [/quote][:D] Very good. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jack Barak 46 Posted November 7, 2010 [quote user="First Wizard"]If you aim for mediocracy thats what you''ll get.[/quote]Were you aiming for that with this post? I love the idea that there are loads of millions all lining up in their Ferrari''s just waiting for the opportunity to piss their wealth up the wall of our club. ''Damn you Delia / MWJ why won''t you just go and stop putting what money you can afford (millions of pounds) into the club with no hope of a return...'' *shakes fist in air* Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Bill 1,788 Posted November 7, 2010 "I believe Porstmouth, Leciester and Scum fans thought the same as you KC.All had bigger debts than us I think, except their owners really WANTED to sell."I think you are confusing the words desire and oblige, Wiz.The paupers had to hand over their club, They had no other choice, other than imminent administration. Perrhaps Wiz, you could remind us of how much they received - less than £4m..... less than four far ken million.The accounts show money being spent to pay off big player contracts. Recent player activity show 20 players having to be shipped out with the chief executive openly stating that money from the sale of Walters being used to balance the books. Almost all the other players left on the books are out of contract next June (as is the manager).The accounts certainly don''t balance with the squeaks by the paupers about the millions upon millions supposedly spent on players. What they do show is the club being around £15m MORE in debt than when they had to hand the club over. It should be noted that this is the debt on interest bearing debt only - is there more that doesn''t fit into that category ?So who else has pursued this Wiz style ''ambition'' ? Why step forward, Preston, Palace, Hull, Southampton and dear old Bristol City to name a few.But then, I doubt that Wiz is so dumb that he doesn''t know this ..... and most of aren''t so dumb either as to not know that he is back to his attention seeking best.A sad way to shuffle off into your twighlight, I''m afraid. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Mister Chops 7 Posted November 7, 2010 To be fair, Leeds United had a good go at living the dream. I mean, we ended up in League One anyway but at least they got a Champions League semi-final out of it. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Clever Farke 64 Posted November 7, 2010 We actually have a team we can be proud of, with great work-rate, team spirit and ethic, playing well in a highly competitive league, a talented manager and so on. Above all, we have a sustainable business model, a shrewd CEO and 1 year ahead on financial planning. Let''s just wreck everything in January for a tilt at the jackpot! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Bill 1,788 Posted November 7, 2010 " I mean, we ended up in League One anyway but at least they got a Champions League semi-final out of it"And how many seasons did they spend in the third tier ?Who actually owns them ... somebody who for many reasons does not want to admit who he is...... perhaps for northern monkeys that is a dream, sounds like a nightmare to me Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Old Shuck 183 Posted November 8, 2010 The club''s "plan" for this season would have been first, second and third=survive. Rightly or wrongly.Achievable and what they would have budgeted for. Then, next Summer, push onwards and upwards a little bit more.Cardiff, QPR, Derby, Forest-all have taken time to get their squads and chances to where they are, even Swansea took last season to find their feet. Derby are an excellent example, they''ve had two, three fairly mediocre seasons, but, slowly,are getting a decent side together. Same with Coventry, and both teams that can get gates as good as, or better than, ours. Of course, if we do get promoted, or even find ourselves in the mix, then the pressure will be there to borrow money to increase the chances, but what then if it still doesn''t happen?Forest had a good go last year, have stuttered a bit this season, but the infrastructure is there, as is, am sure, the funds.As for promotion wiping all of the debts out in one stroke, well, I''m sure I''m not the only one who thought the last promotion would have done that, but, despite the money we would have got from that, and the parachute payments, we ended up that one recent Prem season in more debt than we had before we got promoted!I do wonder if some fans will consider this season to have been a failure if we don''t make the top 6 by the end of it? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Shaun Tilly Lace 0 Posted November 8, 2010 [quote user="Ed Miliband"][quote user="First Wizard"]If you aim for mediocracy thats what you''ll get.[/quote]I''m sure Rupert Murdoch would agree with you. [/quote]I won''t hear a bad word said about my old mate Rupes. Apart from being a an ugly, fascist, septuagenarian foreigner, with far too much control over the UK news media, and sticking his nose in where it don''t belong - he ain''t a bad old codger. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites