Are Board Demos On For Saints Game? Can smudger Update us?

[wan hanoi 0]

Heard a rumour the board demos are back on for the southampton game.

Do the web team have any info on this?

Did Smudger take over and can he give us details of when and where?

Over to you Smudger and Cluck........

 

[Shack Attack 0]

[quote user="barkertwist"]

Heard a rumour the board demos are back on for the southampton game.

Do the web team have any info on this?

Did Smudger take over and can he give us details of when and where?

Over to you Smudger and Cluck........

[/quote]

Ah, the spritual leader of The Grove Thirty has returned to our humble message board.

Are your numbers still strong sir?

[SuperYellows 0]

Oh dear not again [:|]

[wan hanoi 0]

SHACK ATTACK, Im just back to see if smudger and co have re arranged it as they said they would once we are safe which we now are. Ive no wish to talk to childish fools on this site, merely asking a question to the web team and smudgers army. And yes now we are safe the grove 30 as you call us are ready to demonstrate, think of us what you will, ive no time for people with IQs less than there own age. Could WEB TEAM, SMUDGER, THEOLSTER { or was it a wind up by 1st wizard as suggested? }, OR CLUCK give me any info? Just info though as im not into petty keyboard arguments such as certain individuals on here. Over and out-we await any details.

[mbncfc 1]

[quote user="barkertwist"]

Heard a rumour the board demos are back on for the southampton game.

[/quote]

... or maybe... slightly... started one... sort of...

[Cluck 0]

[quote user="barkertwist"]

Heard a rumour the board demos are back on for the southampton game.

Do the web team have any info on this?

Did Smudger take over and can he give us details of when and where?

Over to you Smudger and Cluck........

 

[/quote]

I''m afraid it will take a sheep purging foot and mouth epidemic to arrange any sort of serious challenge to the board at present.  Too many new age la de das playing "I''m a true fan" to get any sense out of the situation...so it''s either a waiting game until a new "fad" comes along to distract them...or accept that the club as we knew it has died a death.

I''m certain the latter is the most painless way forward...because watching a best pal fade away painfully in front of you is not a pleasant experience. NCFC is as good a case for euthenasia that I''ve seen.       [N]

[mbncfc 1]

[quote user="Cluck "][quote user="barkertwist"]

Heard a rumour the board demos are back on for the southampton game.

Do the web team have any info on this?

Did Smudger take over and can he give us details of when and where?

Over to you Smudger and Cluck........

 

[/quote]

I''m afraid it will take a sheep purging foot and mouth epidemic to arrange any sort of serious challenge to the board at present.  Too many new age la de das playing "I''m a true fan" to get any sense out of the situation...so it''s either a waiting game until a new "fad" comes along to distract them...or accept that the club as we knew it has died a death.

I''m certain the latter is the most painless way forward...because watching a best pal fade away painfully in front of you is not a pleasant experience. NCFC is as good a case for euthenasia that I''ve seen.       [N]

[/quote]

I am assuming barkertwist will be taking offence to your above post Cluck... [;)]

[Freeza 0]

Jesus, Cluck, try and enjoy life a little bit, all you ever do is put a downer on things!

No doubt you''re now going to chuck me in with the ''new age la de das'' but come on mate you''re supposed to get some enjoyment out of football!!!

Nothing wrong with a good moan now and again but we beat Worthy''s new team at the weekend so surely that''s something to be happy about?!

[macdougalls perm 0]

Quick translation of Cluck''s answer to Barkertwist -

"I don''t think so my good man as we appear to be an extremely small group of isolated fruitloops"[:D]

And sorry, Barkertwist, I don''t mean to denigrate the glorious memory of the ''Grove 30'', lol!  

[big dick sanchez 0]

Smudger''s army?  Would never work, would always being questioning the leadership and get nothing done.

[In Dubious Battle 0]

[quote user="Cluck "][quote user="barkertwist"]

Heard a rumour the board demos are back on for the southampton game.

Do the web team have any info on this?

Did Smudger take over and can he give us details of when and where?

Over to you Smudger and Cluck........

 

[/quote]

I''m afraid it will take a sheep purging foot and mouth epidemic to arrange any sort of serious challenge to the board at present.  Too many new age la de das playing "I''m a true fan" to get any sense out of the situation...so it''s either a waiting game until a new "fad" comes along to distract them...or accept that the club as we knew it has died a death.

I''m certain the latter is the most painless way forward...because watching a best pal fade away painfully in front of you is not a pleasant experience. NCFC is as good a case for euthenasia that I''ve seen.       [N]

[/quote]

i don''t know what a new age la de da is???? i''m probably being thick but i''d appreciate an explanation,

also i understand your negativity towards the future of our club but what you must remember is that clubs rise and fall all the time we may end up playing league 1 & 2 football for the next twenty years but one day we will rise again to the very top 10 years ago wimbledon were in the premiership and wigan were in league 2 (Division 4) look where they both are now.

I''m not saying the above would be good in any way, it''s just that i don''t think even with the above scenario you could say the club has died a death! 

[a1canary 0]

[quote user="Cluck "][quote user="barkertwist"]

Heard a rumour the board demos are back on for the southampton game.

Do the web team have any info on this?

Did Smudger take over and can he give us details of when and where?

Over to you Smudger and Cluck........

 

[/quote]

  Too many new age la de das playing "I''m a true fan" to get any sense out of the situation...so it''s either a waiting game until a new "fad" comes along to distract them...or accept that the club as we knew it has died a death.

[N]

[/quote]Funny, i thought "I''m a True Fan" was your favourite game Cluck! Closely followed by "Sack the World" and "Who''s Fault is it Anyway?"But i''m intrigued, would you classify me as a "New Age La De Da" then? Who else?

[nutty nigel 7,534]

[quote user="a1canary"][quote user="Cluck "][quote user="barkertwist"]

Heard a rumour the board demos are back on for the southampton game.

Do the web team have any info on this?

Did Smudger take over and can he give us details of when and where?

Over to you Smudger and Cluck........

 

[/quote]

  Too many new age la de das playing "I''m a true fan" to get any sense out of the situation...so it''s either a waiting game until a new "fad" comes along to distract them...or accept that the club as we knew it has died a death.

[N]

[/quote]

Funny, i thought "I''m a True Fan" was your favourite game Cluck! Closely followed by "Sack the World" and "Who''s Fault is it Anyway?"

But i''m intrigued, would you classify me as a "New Age La De Da" then? Who else?

I''ll be disappointed if I''m not included a1 [;)]

[/quote]

[Cluck 0]

I''ve never said I''m that "true fan" anywhere a1....but I am an experienced one.  Many posters on here who carry the Delia flag so passionately have little more than 10 years under their belt....so know nothing different.  Supporting the club is not just about turning up on matchdays and defending the colours at all costs...it''s about speaking up when things are heading south and daring to question those who currently call the shots. That''s all the likes of me, Smudger and various other regular critics do...we support the club...not the cronies within it.  Personalities and sentiment are not what will revive this club, as it needs a total transformation and a return to it''s roots where football is first and foremost and off the field activities are entirely secondary.

As I''ve said (albeit in my usual Churchillian manner) is that the club is now in the hands of an entirely new mentality to that of our successful years.  Football people led the club and heads rolled if high standards were not adhered to...both at Board and player level. The "la de das" as I call them are those new age folk who will defend the indefencable if it suits their own limited ambitions. That sadly applies to far too many of the 24000 plus fans who habitually swell the coffers of this inept and amateurish administration.

So....do I walk away and simply "hope for the best" (defeatist) ?  Do I battle against the popular limited ambition in order to keep asking searching questions? (apparently negative and anti-club)....or do I hand over to the next generation and do a Pontius Pilate? (defeatist again).

You will ultimately get what you deserve as supporters...and unless you start demanding rather than passively hoping...you''ll get nothing else except more of the same half hearted returns for your money than you''re getting now.

Do we then want everyone to be jolly and accepting on here?...or do we want to blow away the cobwebs of cosiness and bring about change?  That won''t happen if you sit tight with Delia Smith and her chosen management team...and that''s where protest and complaint comes into play.  No one likes it...but sometimes it just has to be done to ensure we can all move on to better things.

[Smudger 0]

[quote user="barkertwist"]SHACK ATTACK, Im just back to see if smudger and co have re arranged it as they said they would once we are safe which we now are. Ive no wish to talk to childish fools on this site, merely asking a question to the web team and smudgers army. And yes now we are safe the grove 30 as you call us are ready to demonstrate, think of us what you will, ive no time for people with IQs less than there own age. Could WEB TEAM, SMUDGER, THEOLSTER { or was it a wind up by 1st wizard as suggested? }, OR CLUCK give me any info? Just info though as im not into petty keyboard arguments such as certain individuals on here. Over and out-we await any details.[/quote]

Did I really say such a thing Barkertwist???

I thought that I stated that "if I was theOlester then I would of not postponed the demo until we were safe and instead I would of made a statement that came down on neither side of the debate by saying that the demo would be postponed but that the situation would be reviewed at the end of March?"

I feel that theolester lost many of the supporters for the demo by coming down SQUARELY with those in the ''we should not protest/we should not protest until we are safe camp''

We have left things far too late now... as Cluck rightly points out... not only this season has been ruined but in all liklihood the la de da''s have ruined next season too (even before it has began).

No point in a demo now and I do not know why you look for me to lead it anyhow???  If you want to demonstrate get out there and do it.... I am only a one man army anyhow... and demonstrated by myself after the Wolves game a couple of months ago!!!

The timing for a demo now would be pointless... we missed the opportunity to demonstrate a month or two ago...

When it becomes apparent to everybody that nothing has changed next season... a time for demonstration will arise again...

Next time will more people show the courage of their convictions however???

Ask me again if I am up for it in October/November and the answer may be yes....  I do not see that demonstrating now wil achieve anything though.

[The Voice of the Thorpe Area 0]

And what exactly would this achieve? Who would replace them? Who would bankroll the club? Who would take over the day-to-day running? I''m no big fan of Delia- but until there''s a viable and reliable solution (ie more investment) then I think it''s ridiculous to start protesting against the board.

[Bigmarkcanary 0]

macdougall''s perm - that post was pure quality mate PMSL! I don''t think I could''ve put it better myself [:D]

[Shack Attack 0]

[quote user="barkertwist"]SHACK ATTACK, Im just back to see if smudger and co have re arranged it as they said they would once we are safe which we now are. Ive no wish to talk to childish fools on this site, merely asking a question to the web team and smudgers army. And yes now we are safe the grove 30 as you call us are ready to demonstrate, think of us what you will, ive no time for people with IQs less than there own age. Could WEB TEAM, SMUDGER, THEOLSTER { or was it a wind up by 1st wizard as suggested? }, OR CLUCK give me any info? Just info though as im not into petty keyboard arguments such as certain individuals on here. Over and out-we await any details.[/quote]

Where do I start?

1) If you''ve no wish to talk to childish fools on this site may I suggest that you don''t post a message on this site. I like to think that childishness is one of my finest qualities!

2) Smudger''s Army? Are you serious? Last time I checked you need significantly more than five people to constitute an army.

3) "The Grove 30 are ready to demonstrate". Oooh, combine your powers with the might of the Pink Un Message Board Five and surely Delia and Co. will have to do the honourable thing and resign.

4) "ive no time for people with IQs less than there own age". Just a quick tip, if you''re going to mock my intelligence it''s best to make sure you get your spelling and punctuation correct. I''m sure the level of debate down at The Grove would be beyond someone with such a low IQ as myself.

Over and out?!?!?!

[Temp the Revelator 0]

[quote user="Cluck "]

I''ve never said I''m that "true fan" anywhere a1....but I am an experienced one.  Many posters on here who carry the Delia flag so passionately have little more than 10 years under their belt....so know nothing different.  Supporting the club is not just about turning up on matchdays and defending the colours at all costs...it''s about speaking up when things are heading south and daring to question those who currently call the shots. That''s all the likes of me, Smudger and various other regular critics do...we support the club...not the cronies within it.  Personalities and sentiment are not what will revive this club, as it needs a total transformation and a return to it''s roots where football is first and foremost and off the field activities are entirely secondary.

As I''ve said (albeit in my usual Churchillian manner) is that the club is now in the hands of an entirely new mentality to that of our successful years.  Football people led the club and heads rolled if high standards were not adhered to...both at Board and player level. The "la de das" as I call them are those new age folk who will defend the indefencable if it suits their own limited ambitions. That sadly applies to far too many of the 24000 plus fans who habitually swell the coffers of this inept and amateurish administration.

So....do I walk away and simply "hope for the best" (defeatist) ?  Do I battle against the popular limited ambition in order to keep asking searching questions? (apparently negative and anti-club)....or do I hand over to the next generation and do a Pontius Pilate? (defeatist again).

You will ultimately get what you deserve as supporters...and unless you start demanding rather than passively hoping...you''ll get nothing else except more of the same half hearted returns for your money than you''re getting now.

Do we then want everyone to be jolly and accepting on here?...or do we want to blow away the cobwebs of cosiness and bring about change?  That won''t happen if you sit tight with Delia Smith and her chosen management team...and that''s where protest and complaint comes into play.  No one likes it...but sometimes it just has to be done to ensure we can all move on to better things.

[/quote]

Nice one cluck - possibly the best post I have ever seen from you - well worded and well argued.  The only thing that lets you down, IMHO, is not the fact that you seek change at the club; rather that you seem to have let things become too personal.  It comes across that yours is merely a crusade against Delia, not a sea change for the better at the club.

[Cluck 0]

[quote user="Temp the Revelator"][quote user="Cluck "]

I''ve never said I''m that "true fan" anywhere a1....but I am an experienced one.  Many posters on here who carry the Delia flag so passionately have little more than 10 years under their belt....so know nothing different.  Supporting the club is not just about turning up on matchdays and defending the colours at all costs...it''s about speaking up when things are heading south and daring to question those who currently call the shots. That''s all the likes of me, Smudger and various other regular critics do...we support the club...not the cronies within it.  Personalities and sentiment are not what will revive this club, as it needs a total transformation and a return to it''s roots where football is first and foremost and off the field activities are entirely secondary.

As I''ve said (albeit in my usual Churchillian manner) is that the club is now in the hands of an entirely new mentality to that of our successful years.  Football people led the club and heads rolled if high standards were not adhered to...both at Board and player level. The "la de das" as I call them are those new age folk who will defend the indefencable if it suits their own limited ambitions. That sadly applies to far too many of the 24000 plus fans who habitually swell the coffers of this inept and amateurish administration.

So....do I walk away and simply "hope for the best" (defeatist) ?  Do I battle against the popular limited ambition in order to keep asking searching questions? (apparently negative and anti-club)....or do I hand over to the next generation and do a Pontius Pilate? (defeatist again).

You will ultimately get what you deserve as supporters...and unless you start demanding rather than passively hoping...you''ll get nothing else except more of the same half hearted returns for your money than you''re getting now.

Do we then want everyone to be jolly and accepting on here?...or do we want to blow away the cobwebs of cosiness and bring about change?  That won''t happen if you sit tight with Delia Smith and her chosen management team...and that''s where protest and complaint comes into play.  No one likes it...but sometimes it just has to be done to ensure we can all move on to better things.

[/quote]

Nice one cluck - possibly the best post I have ever seen from you - well worded and well argued.  The only thing that lets you down, IMHO, is not the fact that you seek change at the club; rather that you seem to have let things become too personal.  It comes across that yours is merely a crusade against Delia, not a sea change for the better at the club.

[/quote]

On the contrary Temp...it is the "new age" fan who has made it too personal at Carrow Road.  As far as I''m concerned, the administrators at a club/business should be entirely anonymous...not the focal point.  Instead the spotlight should be placed purely on the players on the pitch/workers and the head of production/Grant. They are the ones who decide whether we win or lose...not a celebrity "fan".

My gripe is that Delia Smith should not be taking the limelight away from the club, which is what has been going on for 10+ years.  If DS disappeared from the club tomorrow it wouldn''t concern me one little bit...but for a large swathe of City fans it would spell pending disaster. That''s the big difference between us and only after many years of support can you truly appreciate that DS is not the be all and end all of Norwich City. Until we get back to the CLUB being bigger than any one person....we will remain drifting in the doldrums.

Your final sentence misses entirely the fact that it is not "the person" that I take issue with, but the whole "scenario" and by assuming my complaints are a direct attack on DS you are missing the point. Her celebrity would not be an issue if she kept a low profile....but in 2007 she "is the club" to all intents and purposes and that is a deep concern. This may not trouble those of you who do not go back further than when she charismatically "saved" NCFC on a wave of emotion...but for those of us who have lived through much better times pre DS, we can see right through the PR spin.  Many of us know the "saving" of the club was a propaganda coup that even Iran would be proud of....and so having become folklore DS/her Board are free to manipulate the club and fans in which ever way it pleases.

If this is the long term predicament...then the club is dead as I know it and the "new age" supporter has won the day. I can happily live with it...but I can''t in any way support it. What goes around comes around however and when NCFC finally returns to it''s city foundations we may just get back to being a plausible force to be reckoned with.

[Shack Attack 0]

[quote user="Cluck "]

If DS disappeared from the club tomorrow it wouldn''t concern me one little bit...but for a large swathe of City fans it would spell pending disaster.

[/quote]

Go on then, I should know better and I''m probably wasting my time, where''s your evidence for this one.

You see I don''t know one fan (regardless of age, length of support, number of games attended) who would think it a "disaster" if Delia Smith stepped aside tomorrow for a suitable replacement.

But then I don''t recognise the "new age" supporters you speak about. Sure there were people who suddenly became ''Norwich fans'' when we got promoted to The Premiership and bought season tickets (I work with a couple of them) but if you think that they''re still hanging around waiting for us to rise again then you''re sorely mistaken.

Or by "new age" do you mean a different type of fan. The make up of a football crowd has changed enourmously since I was a kid, and clearly even more since your younger days, but surely this is nothing to do with Delia Smith. Surely it''s more to do with the introduction of all seater stadia and increase in ticket prices amongst other things. Sadly this has led to a decline in atmosphere at many grounds but on the flip side this has also led to the decline of some of the more unsavoury aspects of crowd behaviour from the past (e.g. Hooliganism and racist chanting in football grounds.)?

I''m in favour of the return of terraced areas to encourage the return of fans who feel that they have been priced out of going to football and that the game has somehow become a lot more ''middle class'' (for want of a better phrase?). I''d love to see the Barclay returned to the swaying mass that it was when I was a teenager but unfortunately it''s not going happen and, as much as you''d like to argue otherwise, the fault for that does not lie with Delia Smith.

[Temp the Revelator 0]

Cluck - nice to have a proper exchange of views with you.  OK, I accept pretty much all of what you say.  All I was saying in my earlier post was that it appears to be a personal campaign.  I think you have very eloquently explained your position in your response, however.

For my own opinion, exiled here in Cheshire, I''m not sure that Delia IS the club.  Most people I talk to about football, on hearing I am a Norwich fan, respond with ''How''s Huckerby playing these days?''.  But, I take your point.  I also tend to agree about the myth of Delia being our ''saviour'' - this truly is spin, and a good example of histroy being re-written to suit those telling the tale.  Chase almost ruined us, but it was Geoffrey Watling who was the true saviour - him and Gordon Bennett, who restructured the clubs in the turmoil following Chase''s departure.  Delia and MWJ came on the scene a little later on.

I am also in agreement with your opening paragraph - the best run football clubs are usually those where the chairman and board are low profile in comparison to the team.

[blahblahblah 2]

[quote]Interesting argument cluck, but how does any of that make any impact at all on performances on the pitch ?[/quote]

[Bob M 0]

the new age fans as you call them who latched onto the club during the promotion season and to a lesser extent the play off season are still there. I work with manc, spurs and liverpool so called fans who brought season tickets that year and are still keeping them as they think we will be back in the prem soon.

smudger: im sure when i 1st joined this site you said you were ready to take over lee olivers campaign. im sorry if thats incorrect,maybe the pinkun team or someone else could confirm this. no offence mate.

although im not in favour of demos, i do think if we found the right people a new board is would be a positive thing and the idea of milan mandaric would have had my approval for what its worth as the fellas clearly ambitious.

[Cluck 0]

[quote user="Temp the Revelator"]

Cluck - nice to have a proper exchange of views with you.  OK, I accept pretty much all of what you say.  All I was saying in my earlier post was that it appears to be a personal campaign.  I think you have very eloquently explained your position in your response, however.

For my own opinion, exiled here in Cheshire, I''m not sure that Delia IS the club.  Most people I talk to about football, on hearing I am a Norwich fan, respond with ''How''s Huckerby playing these days?''.  But, I take your point.  I also tend to agree about the myth of Delia being our ''saviour'' - this truly is spin, and a good example of histroy being re-written to suit those telling the tale.  Chase almost ruined us, but it was Geoffrey Watling who was the true saviour - him and Gordon Bennett, who restructured the clubs in the turmoil following Chase''s departure.  Delia and MWJ came on the scene a little later on.

I am also in agreement with your opening paragraph - the best run football clubs are usually those where the chairman and board are low profile in comparison to the team.

[/quote]

It is equally pleasant for me to exchange views with you without the by now "customary" discord. [:)]  I think you will already know that I am often deliberately "over the top" in order to propagate argument....and whereas sometimes it stays as harmless banter.... now and again it boils over into a good verbal punch up among friends which can surprisingly often lead to understanding.

I do entirely agree that Geoffrey Watling was the man who threw the lifeline to NCFC...but no-one in truth actually "saved" it from total ruin.  There are always investors out there (good and bad) looking for a challenge and if DS and co. hadn''t come along when they did, I''m certain someone else would. For me DS/MWJ have shown a very small mentality from the outset, much more akin to a publishing house or similar and this is simply not the right approach when 24000 paying fans hang on those over cautious decisions made.

DS and Co. are not ogres...but they do not fit the bill as football club directors and that''s the rub.  Rather than hang on possessively to their dream...they should see and accept their limitations and move aside. No preconditions for sale as are currently in place....as it is then highly unlikely a buyer will be found (I suspect this is the whole idea)....just someone with deep pockets and a passion for the game.  Legally bound such a buyer could do no harm whatsoever...but could do a great deal of good for the club....and all of us.

A total transformation is needed....and that stretches from top to bottom. For me it just happens to be Delia Smith in the firing line because she is there...but I would feel just the same if it was Fat Bob the Baker or any other person willfully blocking the progress of the club...because it''s the club that matters, not one individual''s sensitivities.

 

[AP16 0]

Hi Cluck,I have to disagree with your comment that MWJ and DS are not fit as football club directors at this particular moment in time, due to the fact that they appointed Worthington who in turn lead us to a play-off final, and eventually promotion. I can''t say that I like the pair either, because I don''t, but in my opinion you can only be judged upon your results. Yes there does come a time where past results count for very little (a la worthy) and something has to be done to guarantee the safety of your future, but the club is in a state of transition at the moment. If we don''t come out the other side looking better and stronger than we are at the moment, I will be as unhappy as you are.....but at this precise moment in time I will not be asking for their removal.There are signs that Grant has got what it takes, take recent performances such as Leicester and Birmingham for example - and I must admit, I am a fan of his ruthlessness....if we''re crap, he''ll say we''re crap....none of this ''there were positives'' bullshit. However, there are also signs that the board aren''t willing to support him with the funds he needs to give us a serious chance of promotion next season - If we aren''t there or thereabouts in terms of play-offs towards the end of next season I''m sure many people, myself included, will share the opinion of your own at this moment in time that they are in fact limiting the club, and should step aside. The transfer window this summer is vital to their own futures as board directors, and more importantly the future of Norwich City FC.

[Smudger 0]

[quote user="Cluck "][quote user="Temp the Revelator"]

Cluck - nice to have a proper exchange of views with you.  OK, I accept pretty much all of what you say.  All I was saying in my earlier post was that it appears to be a personal campaign.  I think you have very eloquently explained your position in your response, however.

For my own opinion, exiled here in Cheshire, I''m not sure that Delia IS the club.  Most people I talk to about football, on hearing I am a Norwich fan, respond with ''How''s Huckerby playing these days?''.  But, I take your point.  I also tend to agree about the myth of Delia being our ''saviour'' - this truly is spin, and a good example of histroy being re-written to suit those telling the tale.  Chase almost ruined us, but it was Geoffrey Watling who was the true saviour - him and Gordon Bennett, who restructured the clubs in the turmoil following Chase''s departure.  Delia and MWJ came on the scene a little later on.

I am also in agreement with your opening paragraph - the best run football clubs are usually those where the chairman and board are low profile in comparison to the team.

[/quote]

It is equally pleasant for me to exchange views with you without the by now "customary" discord. [:)]  I think you will already know that I am often deliberately "over the top" in order to propagate argument....and whereas sometimes it stays as harmless banter.... now and again it boils over into a good verbal punch up among friends which can surprisingly often lead to understanding.

I do entirely agree that Geoffrey Watling was the man who threw the lifeline to NCFC...but no-one in truth actually "saved" it from total ruin.  There are always investors out there (good and bad) looking for a challenge and if DS and co. hadn''t come along when they did, I''m certain someone else would. For me DS/MWJ have shown a very small mentality from the outset, much more akin to a publishing house or similar and this is simply not the right approach when 24000 paying fans hang on those over cautious decisions made.

DS and Co. are not ogres...but they do not fit the bill as football club directors and that''s the rub.  Rather than hang on possessively to their dream...they should see and accept their limitations and move aside. No preconditions for sale as are currently in place....as it is then highly unlikely a buyer will be found (I suspect this is the whole idea)....just someone with deep pockets and a passion for the game.  Legally bound such a buyer could do no harm whatsoever...but could do a great deal of good for the club....and all of us.

A total transformation is needed....and that stretches from top to bottom. For me it just happens to be Delia Smith in the firing line because she is there...but I would feel just the same if it was Fat Bob the Baker or any other person willfully blocking the progress of the club...because it''s the club that matters, not one individual''s sensitivities.

 

[/quote]

I love the post''s that youy have put on this thread today Cluck (and you know that they sum up exactly the way that I feel also).

I think that the highlighted section must show once and for all to those that keep raising the personal battle flag that this quite clearly is not the case!!!

Keep up the good work fella  [Y] 

[Smudger 0]

[quote user="Safri15"]Hi Cluck,

I have to disagree with your comment that MWJ and DS are not fit as football club directors at this particular moment in time, due to the fact that they appointed Worthington who in turn lead us to a play-off final, and eventually promotion. I can''t say that I like the pair either, because I don''t, but in my opinion you can only be judged upon your results. Yes there does come a time where past results count for very little (a la worthy) and something has to be done to guarantee the safety of your future, but the club is in a state of transition at the moment. If we don''t come out the other side looking better and stronger than we are at the moment, I will be as unhappy as you are.....but at this precise moment in time I will not be asking for their removal.

There are signs that Grant has got what it takes, take recent performances such as Leicester and Birmingham for example - and I must admit, I am a fan of his ruthlessness....if we''re crap, he''ll say we''re crap....none of this ''there were positives'' bullshit. However, there are also signs that the board aren''t willing to support him with the funds he needs to give us a serious chance of promotion next season - If we aren''t there or thereabouts in terms of play-offs towards the end of next season I''m sure many people, myself included, will share the opinion of your own at this moment in time that they are in fact limiting the club, and should step aside. The transfer window this summer is vital to their own futures as board directors, and more importantly the future of Norwich City FC.














[/quote]

I have the utmost respect for this post Safri... the best that I have probably seen from yourself!!!  [Y]

I especially like the fact that you expect us to challenge for the play-off''s next season without any of the excuses of why we aren''t in contention for them that we have heard constantly for the last 2 seasons.

Does this mean that we can expect you to join protests by early 2008 when it has become apparent that we are stuck firmly in mid-table yet again then???

[Smudger 0]

[quote user="Bob M"]

the new age fans as you call them who latched onto the club during the promotion season and to a lesser extent the play off season are still there. I work with manc, spurs and liverpool so called fans who brought season tickets that year and are still keeping them as they think we will be back in the prem soon.

smudger: im sure when i 1st joined this site you said you were ready to take over lee olivers campaign. im sorry if thats incorrect,maybe the pinkun team or someone else could confirm this. no offence mate.

although im not in favour of demos, i do think if we found the right people a new board is would be a positive thing and the idea of milan mandaric would have had my approval for what its worth as the fellas clearly ambitious.

[/quote]

I said something like this Bob M.... (excerpt from original thread including typo''s)....

http://new.pinkun.com/cs/forums/2/894588/ShowPost.aspx#894588

"I think to say that it is a poor decision is a little bit harsh SUSSEX.

While I agree that it may make Lee look a little hypocritical or fickle to his backers for the demo, I also believe that it was not an easy decision to make (and like I said he has my support in whatever decision he makes at this moment in time).

I think if I was making the decision however I would not of promised at this stage whether the demo will be put off until City are mathamatically safe from Relegation (as we may not still be safe untill the last day of the season...  thus letting the board of the hook and having a free reign to ruin another season next year potentially).

I think that the best solution for Lee to of kept people on both sides of the debate happy at this moment in time would of been to of made a statement which read something like this...  "In view of the battling performance on Tuesday evening (Luton), plus the concerns of many City fans regarding the demonstration having an affect on team morale and having a negative impact upon our chances of beting the drop.  We are prepared to postpone the proposed demonstration on 6th March until the end of the month when the situation will once again be REVIEWED).

I feel that we must protest for at least 3 home games this season...  in light of last Tuesday''s result hopefully we will be safe from the drop by then.  If not however I would like to see the situation resolved as I for one would not be happy to sit back any longer.

Like I said you have my support for now LEE".

What is the point of demo''s this season now?

This season is OVER!!!

If we were going to demonstrate then we needed to demonstrate at the West Brom game at the very latest in imo.

That would of given us 3 home games to turn up the heat on the board.... There is no point in demonstrating for one match.

Like I stated in the original thread also...

"By not giving many fans the chance to voice their opinions...  this could well rear it''s ugly head again early next season"...

For those who are still not happy with the current board let''s all just give them one more FINAL chance....  they have us up there challenging in or around the top 6 from October onwards or we will start to campaign for demo''s to happen again.... only this time we will not be put off.

Bakertwist I would be prepared to meet up early next season if things are not going well to discuss....  please feel free to get in touch then....  I will PM my e:mail address to you!!!

[chicken 0]

[quote user="Cluck "][quote user="Temp the Revelator"][quote user="Cluck "]

I''ve never said I''m that "true fan" anywhere a1....but I am an experienced one.  Many posters on here who carry the Delia flag so passionately have little more than 10 years under their belt....so know nothing different.  Supporting the club is not just about turning up on matchdays and defending the colours at all costs...it''s about speaking up when things are heading south and daring to question those who currently call the shots. That''s all the likes of me, Smudger and various other regular critics do...we support the club...not the cronies within it.  Personalities and sentiment are not what will revive this club, as it needs a total transformation and a return to it''s roots where football is first and foremost and off the field activities are entirely secondary.

As I''ve said (albeit in my usual Churchillian manner) is that the club is now in the hands of an entirely new mentality to that of our successful years.  Football people led the club and heads rolled if high standards were not adhered to...both at Board and player level. The "la de das" as I call them are those new age folk who will defend the indefencable if it suits their own limited ambitions. That sadly applies to far too many of the 24000 plus fans who habitually swell the coffers of this inept and amateurish administration.

So....do I walk away and simply "hope for the best" (defeatist) ?  Do I battle against the popular limited ambition in order to keep asking searching questions? (apparently negative and anti-club)....or do I hand over to the next generation and do a Pontius Pilate? (defeatist again).

You will ultimately get what you deserve as supporters...and unless you start demanding rather than passively hoping...you''ll get nothing else except more of the same half hearted returns for your money than you''re getting now.

Do we then want everyone to be jolly and accepting on here?...or do we want to blow away the cobwebs of cosiness and bring about change?  That won''t happen if you sit tight with Delia Smith and her chosen management team...and that''s where protest and complaint comes into play.  No one likes it...but sometimes it just has to be done to ensure we can all move on to better things.

[/quote]

Nice one cluck - possibly the best post I have ever seen from you - well worded and well argued.  The only thing that lets you down, IMHO, is not the fact that you seek change at the club; rather that you seem to have let things become too personal.  It comes across that yours is merely a crusade against Delia, not a sea change for the better at the club.

[/quote]

On the contrary Temp...it is the "new age" fan who has made it too personal at Carrow Road.  As far as I''m concerned, the administrators at a club/business should be entirely anonymous...not the focal point.  Instead the spotlight should be placed purely on the players on the pitch/workers and the head of production/Grant. They are the ones who decide whether we win or lose...not a celebrity "fan".

My gripe is that Delia Smith should not be taking the limelight away from the club, which is what has been going on for 10+ years.  If DS disappeared from the club tomorrow it wouldn''t concern me one little bit...but for a large swathe of City fans it would spell pending disaster. That''s the big difference between us and only after many years of support can you truly appreciate that DS is not the be all and end all of Norwich City. Until we get back to the CLUB being bigger than any one person....we will remain drifting in the doldrums.

Your final sentence misses entirely the fact that it is not "the person" that I take issue with, but the whole "scenario" and by assuming my complaints are a direct attack on DS you are missing the point. Her celebrity would not be an issue if she kept a low profile....but in 2007 she "is the club" to all intents and purposes and that is a deep concern. This may not trouble those of you who do not go back further than when she charismatically "saved" NCFC on a wave of emotion...but for those of us who have lived through much better times pre DS, we can see right through the PR spin.  Many of us know the "saving" of the club was a propaganda coup that even Iran would be proud of....and so having become folklore DS/her Board are free to manipulate the club and fans in which ever way it pleases.

If this is the long term predicament...then the club is dead as I know it and the "new age" supporter has won the day. I can happily live with it...but I can''t in any way support it. What goes around comes around however and when NCFC finally returns to it''s city foundations we may just get back to being a plausible force to be reckoned with.

[/quote]

"Her celebrity would not be an issue if she kept a low profile"

Since here screaching a couple of seasons ago I think you will find that she has kept a low profile in regards to Norwich City. And this is where I think your argument falls apart. As someone else mentions you make it sound like a personal vendetta which is harsh on the woman.

Infact other than her obligations to the club in regards to appearences when was the last time she made one? Her and MWJ have even had others read statements out to the press.

Maybe thats a question for the Web Team - when was the last time a press conference or the like was called for Delia to grab some "limelight"? I am not fussed either way its just my memory doesnt recall her surfacing much recently.

There is no "spin" over Delia - just confusion. Delia did save us in the sence that at that point in time the club needed investment as the current board members were stretched to breaking, we did not face immediate bankrupcy but we did face Division Two Football which in turn could have led to financial difficulty or even collapse. So no she did not save Norwich from Chase but she did save the future of Norwich City FC by preventing them from falling down another league.