A fourth season of the 'Pukki problem'

birchfest · December 2, 2021

Having a little look at some of the other threads concerning our overall transfer business, I can see many are holding reservations over players in certain positions who arrived in the summer, Rashica and Normann being the two so far that seem to have shown they are Premier league quality here and now. A few touched on the point I wish to get to, but I personally think it perhaps deserves a thread of its own, that being the lack of an heir apparent for Temmu.

Watching on Tuesday night, what struck me most after Pukki's goal was once again that fear of what would befall us should he be injured. Sargent works hard and Idah has a reputation.. yet so far neither has done anything to suggest they would be able to fill the huge void and responsibilities of Pukki, if the worst was to happen. The frustrating for me though is that this is now effectively the fourth season we find ourselves in this position, we've tried Drmic, Hugill, Srbenny, Idah and now Sargent (with only Rhodes looking a strong alternative) and all so far haven't looked anywhere close to dislodging him or providing an effective understudy.

It of course is such a difficulty position to fill without the ability to drop 20-30 million, yet at the same time we have the looming threat of what would happen if Pukki dropped out of the side through injury, we saw what happened in the second half of our last top flight season. I'm hoping that if we are still in the mix in January, any and all remaining funds might be diverted to the pursuit of someone else who can truly share the burden and be a threat from the bench. I know it would still likely be in the form of a bit of a punt on someone, but surely there has to be someone out there who's main strength is just banging them in, ugly and all.. I feel we have enough willing runners and workers, we need a poacher and someone who could be a viable threat from the bench, something I still feel Idah hasn't managed to become (though I dare say not having a loan hasn't helped him in this).

Edited December 2, 2021 by birchfest

cambridgeshire canary · December 2, 2021

You see the problem is we dont' have money. Our record fee is 10 million, a good Prem proven top divison striker costs a hell of a lot more than that.

birchfest · December 2, 2021

1 minute ago, cambridgeshire canary said:

You see the problem is we dont' have money. Our record fee is 10 million, a good Prem proven top divison striker costs a hell of a lot more than that.

Indeed, I'm just thinking back to an 'Ashton' or a 'Holt'... perhaps a continental version, where someone who is unproven at top flight but tearing it up and in good form from a lower or lesser league. Surely for 8-10 million we could tempt one here, especially if we found a club who could desperately need that sort of money after covid.

PurpleCanary · December 2, 2021

4 minutes ago, cambridgeshire canary said:

You see the problem is we dont' have money. Our record fee is 10 million, a good Prem proven top divison striker costs a hell of a lot more than that.

Not really or at least not entirely. The problem is as much that since we tend to play only with one genuine striker it is hard to convince someone good to join us when they are likely to be on the bench most of the time. This is why we looked seriously at Josh King, who can play out wide as well, and ended up with Sargent.

sgncfc · December 2, 2021

Daryl Dike on his way in January? Loan with a view to permanent.

cambridgeshire canary · December 2, 2021

2 minutes ago, sgncfc said:

Daryl Dike on his way in January? Loan with a view to permanent.

How many goals has he scored in the Prem? Just, you know, curious.

TeemuVanBasten · December 2, 2021

10 minutes ago, cambridgeshire canary said:

You see the problem is we dont' have money. Our record fee is 10 million, a good Prem proven top divison striker costs a hell of a lot more than that.

Who said it has to be a proven Prem striker.

Was Toney a proven Prem striker when he signed for Brentford, and was Pukki a proven Prem striker when he signed for us?

TeemuVanBasten · December 2, 2021

3 minutes ago, cambridgeshire canary said:

How many goals has he scored in the Prem? Just, you know, curious.

How many had Holt and Morison scored in the Prem before helping us to 12th in the Premier League?

Stupid rhetorical question from the fingers of a man with a mid double digit IQ.

Hank shoots Skyler · December 2, 2021

4 minutes ago, birchfest said:

Indeed, I'm just thinking back to an 'Ashton' or a 'Holt'... perhaps a continental version, where someone who is unproven at top flight but tearing it up and in good form from a lower or lesser league. Surely for 8-10 million we could tempt one here, especially if we found a club who could desperately need that sort of money after covid.

Feels like Sargent was meant to be that player... albeit with a poor goalscoring record.

I don’t disagree with anything you’ve said, but surely we need to focus on improving the first 11 in January, and an upgrade on Pukki would be close to bottom of my list (unless he gets injured of course).

It looks to me like we need a more reliable option on the right wing and also another centre mid in the mould of Skipp so we can push Normann forwards and make him into more of goal threat which he appears to be more suited to. I’d rather we bought in one of these areas or both and hoped Pukki stayed fit but used Idah / Sargent when we had to, if I had to choose!

Hank shoots Skyler · December 2, 2021

1 minute ago, TeemuVanBasten said:

Stupid rhetorical question from the fingers of a man with a mid double digit IQ.

My god was that unnecessary 🤣

hepphep · December 2, 2021

This is a real risk for sure. On the other hand, getting experienced player who could likely compete with Pukki would likely cost more than 25M€ and their salaries requests are likely higher that what we pay for Pukki. Getting that kind of player with that sum and convincing them to join us to be primarily used as backup for Pukki would seem a hard thing to achieve, both to get agreement from player and justify pouring so much money for backup player.

The other option is to get non-proven players there and hope that they break through. However, for younger guys this is pretty bad situation as they likely would not get much minutes there. That is sort of happening for Idah (in addition to his injuries and sickness that really ruined his last season).

Likely due to that we have resorted to third option earlier, which is getting championship level journeymen (like Hugill or Drmic) in hope that they can come and fill in if the worst happens.

What we likely should do is to have player who can play multiple positions, like mostly winger or attacking midfielder but can also cover as forward. That is actually what we are likely trying to do at the moment having players like Sargent, Rashica and Tzolis. If I'm correct all of those also have experienced playing as CF. But once again, getting such player who can play multiple positions and provide and is proven to compete near the same level as Pukki in CF position would be extremely expensive. Liverpool is apparently looking for one promising guy that could play in such role from Porto with 80m€ release clause.

Therefore I think that reality is that we just have to keep praying that Pukki does not get injured and if the worst happen, some of our wingers can succeed in central position.

Temefan · December 2, 2021

New chance for Drmic?

birchfest · December 2, 2021

7 minutes ago, Temefan said:

New chance for Drmic?

No chance, I think even if there was a will (which I doubt there is from both parties) he is locked into a season long loan and then a free agent in the summer.

In my blood · December 2, 2021

I think the problem/challenge would be less acute if goals came from other sources. Once Rachica is up to speed and others start chipping in, even Cantwell, the pressure to get another Pukki would be less of a problem. ( Cue Pukki getting injured in training this week!!!)

Ekoku: The Ambassador Of The People · December 2, 2021

Seen Eddie Nketiah has refused his latest contract and is out of contract in the Summer. A cheeky bid in January as with a run of games could be the natural succesor to Pukki.

Canary dwarf · December 2, 2021

I still think we should have really pushed the boat out to sign Adam Armstrong , we really wanted him but was outbid , I know he hasn't been amazing for Southampton yet , but still miles better than idah or sargent , I don't know what will do I can't see there will be much in the transfer kitty , all our loans our taken , is there someone good enough to step up from the under 23s ? 😄

mannings bandy legs · December 2, 2021

1 hour ago, TeemuVanBasten said:

Who said it has to be a proven Prem striker.

Was Toney a proven Prem striker when he signed for Brentford, and was Pukki a proven Prem striker when he signed for us?

Toney only mainly scores from that spot 12 yds out,so he's hardly proven.

mannings bandy legs · December 2, 2021

1 hour ago, birchfest said:

Having a little look at some of the other threads concerning our overall transfer business, I can see many are holding reservations over players in certain positions who arrived in the summer, Rashica and Normann being the two so far that seem to have shown they are Premier league quality here and now. A few touched on the point I wish to get to, but I personally think it perhaps deserves a thread of its own, that being the lack of an heir apparent for Temmu.

Watching on Tuesday night, what struck me most after Pukki's goal was once again that fear of what would befall us should he be injured. Sargent works hard and Idah has a reputation.. yet so far neither has done anything to suggest they would be able to fill the huge void and responsibilities of Pukki, if the worst was to happen. The frustrating for me though is that this is now effectively the fourth season we find ourselves in this position, we've tried Drmic, Hugill, Srbenny, Idah and now Sargent (with only Rhodes looking a strong alternative) and all so far haven't looked anywhere close to dislodging him or providing an effective understudy.

It of course is such a difficulty position to fill without the ability to drop 20-30 million, yet at the same time we have the looming threat of what would happen if Pukki dropped out of the side through injury, we saw what happened in the second half of our last top flight season. I'm hoping that if we are still in the mix in January, any and all remaining funds might be diverted to the pursuit of someone else who can truly share the burden and be a threat from the bench. I know it would still likely be in the form of a bit of a punt on someone, but surely there has to be someone out there who's main strength is just banging them in, ugly and all.. I feel we have enough willing runners and workers, we need a poacher and someone who could be a viable threat from the bench, something I still feel Idah hasn't managed to become (though I dare say not having a loan hasn't helped him in this).

Idah has a reputation? For what? Maybe scoring three goals in fifty-one senior appearances. ( City and R of Ire.)

birchfest · December 2, 2021

8 minutes ago, mannings bandy legs said:

Idah has a reputation? For what? Maybe scoring three goals in fifty-one senior appearances. ( City and R of Ire.)

A reputation within the club, the people that matter. He was/is highly thought of and it doesn't take much digging to find quotes to back it up. His reputation is meant to be the next big thing from the academy.. but so far it hasn't worked out like that.

Dr Greenthumb · December 2, 2021

1 hour ago, cambridgeshire canary said:

You see the problem is we dont' have money. Our record fee is 10 million, a good Prem proven top divison striker costs a hell of a lot more than that.

Ours was free 😃

Dr Greenthumb · December 2, 2021

1 hour ago, TeemuVanBasten said:

How many had Holt and Morison scored in the Prem before helping us to 12th in the Premier League?

Stupid rhetorical question from the fingers of a man with a mid double digit IQ.

Can you not take part in a discussion without throwing insults at people?

TeemuVanBasten · December 2, 2021

25 minutes ago, Dr Greenthumb said:

Can you not take part in a discussion without throwing insults at people?

Are you disputing any part of it?

TeemuVanBasten · December 2, 2021

59 minutes ago, mannings bandy legs said:

Idah has a reputation? For what? Maybe scoring three goals in fifty-one senior appearances. ( City and R of Ire.)

Bit weird that you'd count his Ireland caps but wouldn't count the FA Cup which would double his goal tally to 6,

6 in 67 is still a poor statistic, but a fairer one and better than you are representing.

If you can count the Luxembourg national team as credible opposition then Preston putting out their first team also counts.

Edited December 2, 2021 by TeemuVanBasten

The Real Buh · December 2, 2021

After watching the Newcastle I’m convinced it’s not a Pukki problem but a Pukki supply problem

hes so underfed I’m thinking of starting a concert for him. The guy gets nothing. He’s still capable of so much but he can’t deliver when he gets nothing from down the line

cambridgeshire canary · December 2, 2021

59 minutes ago, Dr Greenthumb said:

Can you not take part in a discussion without throwing insults at people?

Freedom of speech means everyone has a right to call me stupid, including me!

sgncfc · December 2, 2021

4 hours ago, cambridgeshire canary said:

How many goals has he scored in the Prem? Just, you know, curious.

You've already pointed out that we can't afford a proven PL striker so not sure what you've got to be curious about......

He has though scored several in the Championship, which is more than can be said for any other striker currently on our books.

sgncfc · December 2, 2021

3 hours ago, Canary dwarf said:

I still think we should have really pushed the boat out to sign Adam Armstrong , we really wanted him but was outbid , I know he hasn't been amazing for Southampton yet , but still miles better than idah or sargent , I don't know what will do I can't see there will be much in the transfer kitty , all our loans our taken , is there someone good enough to step up from the under 23s ? 😄

I genuinely don't think Armstrong is any better than what we have. Personally I think Idah deserves a proper run in the team in place of Sargent. Although he doesn't score, he does usually create some space for others when he comes on.

pete · December 2, 2021

Need to find a gem lower down the pyramid and develop him. Time running out for Pukki. May need to develop in Championship a la Grant Holt. Kamara starting to develop don't see him first team material for 2-3 years. Omotoye seems to have disappeard, Adahme not given much of a run at Pompey. Smith at Rotherham scoring for fun perhaps a punt.

Whatever we need to take a gamble to look for another Pukki.